Germany most certainly has. Just to be sure I checked Wikipedia, and I remain correct. (yes, with the exception of hate speech. I don't consider that "no free speech", though).
Massive ongoing protest in Chicago makes Trump "postpone" his event
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Germany most certainly has. Just to be sure I checked Wikipedia, and I remain correct. (yes, with the exception of hate speech. I don't consider that "no free speech", though).
What did he mean by this?
Member
Trump could have rolled up in a Popemobile with snipers on every rooftop. But he cancelled the event willingly, he was not dragged out. His free speech was not violated.
Chicago just proving itself the GOAT city
Might have to move there :wow:
Chicago just proving itself the GOAT city
Might have to move there :wow:
What are you talking about?
Counter-protests are routinely located either along the way or directly in the way of right-wing meetings. The responsible authorities often go along with it or directly encourage that, since they don't want the brown scum to have a big platform in their town. And I'm also talking about this from a "german point of view".
Hell, this happened yesterday in Nürnberg. So get over yourself and stop trying to tell people how to conduct protests. It's embarrassing.
Reading through the thread from when i went to sleep, there really is one of these guys an hour isn't there?
Sho_Nuff82
Member
What is the point of a protest that no one has to pay attention to?
I'm having trouble getting behind your passion for a "free speech" that outright bans selective hate speech and yet still entertains a healthy neo-Nazi political party.
Well, damn.
You're becoming more violent than the protests last night lol
SyenceLabb
Member
I think this was all planned by Trump. Do a rally at a venue that had "bad idea" written all over it and cancel at the last minute. The folks that are voting for him already feel like their voices are being drowned out.
Crimson_Fate
Member
This had nothing to do with sending a message, its was about denying others the opportunity to hear what Trump had to Say.
my name is ed
Banned
Not only do you seem unaware of history but it seems you also dont know what free speech means.
Seriously, Drumpf could be banned from all private venues, shouted down at all public events, kicked off twitter, fb, any social media, and have his tv time greatly reduced and none of that would mean his free speech right was violated. You understand that, right?
Germany has insult, blasphemy and a bunch of other laws that restrict free speech beyond hate speech.
No one stopped Trump from speaking. He has had plenty of protests at his Klan rallies in the pasts, this one shouldn't have any different.
Gordon Shumway
Banned
Sounds like Trump..guess you'll disagree with German law. Then again, it's not his fault..
Liu Kang Baking A Pie
Member
So. What.
Anyone can stop anyone from saying something. It happens every day right in front of you. Why do you care about this now?
Aww, denying people hearing the same garbage he's been saying for months now, how will they go on?
SyenceLabb
Member
I think his point was that if he actually let the rally continue then he would also be blamed for any violence that occurred at his rally.
Messofanego
Banned
Uh, why would counter-rallies happen in some other location and not right next to or opposite the rally? That seems mighty ineffective.
He's talking out of his ass.
This is completely legal.
Sho_Nuff82
Member
Now you're mixing up the two talking points.
The Trump thing in Chicago? That was a protest.
A violent riot was something I said could not be ignored.
Even with that distinction, the protesters sent the message that they were passionate about their disagreement with Trump's racist platform. Trump sent the message that he was a coward. I think lots of people heard both, it's all over Twitter and Facebook.
When you have the habit of telling your fans to beat up counter protestors it's eventually going to blow up in your face when the "anti" group is bigger than yours. Trump and his supporters have been rightly blamed for all the violence at his rallies, because he encourages it. Now when the stakes are raised he ducks out rather than call for his followers to be peaceful.
How is he going to handle the general, with the entire Democratic party and half the GOP aligned against him? Cancel every rally because he's afraid of looking weak?
You had people last night in this thread saying stuff like, "yeah, there wasn't that much violence but riots COULD have happen."
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Those are the people whose opinions do not matter.
Gordon Shumway
Banned
Who exactly inspired these folks to go protest? What was it that made them angry? Has anything been happening at his rallies to make people angry? Has he said anything to make so many people angry? This gets pinned to one person, and one person alone..
I mean, unless you're a fan of his take no shit attitude. His bluntness. His bullshit. Then, yeah..it's actually Obama's fault..or something.
Brawly Likes to Brawl
Member
The core of the issue is seeing people (incorrectly) cite the 1st amendment to defend a presidential candidate that has applauded and encouraged violence against protesters that appear at his rallies, because he personally choose to cancel his latest rally now that there are too many protesters for him to just sick his follwers on in an attempt to silence.
It's infuriating to see people try and bend one of the hallmark rukes of our constitution to defend someone that shows such blatant and violent disrespect for one of the most long standing and crucial applications of Free Speech.
It's infuriating to see people try and bend one of the hallmark rukes of our constitution to defend someone that shows such blatant and violent disrespect for one of the most long standing and crucial applications of Free Speech.
Father_Brain
Banned
Awful response that fetishizes civility above all else (as though no successful movement in history has ever utilized anger or disruptive tactics) and implies both sides are to blame.
What did he mean by this?
Member
Trump denied them the opportunity when he cancelled the event.
He was origanlly bitching that Trump's freedom of speech was violated because he knew dick all about American free speech.
When that didn't go over he pivoted to violence, violence that would be Trump's fault based on everything he's been spouting to his sycophants.
Gordon Shumway
Banned
But the police TOLD him to canc..oh, wait. Another Trump lie..
Kai Dracon
Writing a dinosaur space opera symphony
So-called moderates who are swayed to support an extreme demagogue by the inevitable blowback the demagogue produces were never moderates to begin with. They were people looking for an excuse to feel good about their sympathy towards something they know is ugly.
It has always been this way when things reach the point that protests and civil disobedience begin to happen.
It has always been this way when things reach the point that protests and civil disobedience begin to happen.
oh fuck! LOLOLOL!
The same man that incites violence at his other rally's. What in the world??!!!!
Trumps freedom of speech was not shut down last night. In fact it was increased from a local venue to a national broadcast on multiple news shows for hours. And will continue to be talked about for days afterwards.
Good on the Chicago protesters. Bad on the media for giving Trump so much mic time.
Good on the Chicago protesters. Bad on the media for giving Trump so much mic time.
Shake Appeal
Member
I actually like hate speech laws and wish America had them, but they represent a significant curb on "free speech" as Americans understand it.
Big Green Anus
Member
Not a huge fan of this response
No, I'm not. Maybe it was differently in Nürnberg (although even there the police was present and erected barriers to divide protesters from counter-protesters), but usually political rallies are legitimized by state, as are counter-rallies/protests. The whole inner city of Munich was shut-down by the police several times so Pegida-supporters (right wing) could have their rally.
But I only could watch it from the window of my living room, Siegcram. Talking out of my ass, indeed. sigh
Now imagine what would have happend without police and without both protests being divided from each other.
Shake Appeal
Member
Nor should you be. It's awful.Not a huge fan of this response
Messofanego
Banned
Didn't this happen in Germany? That's where Cologne is, right?
600 Anti-islam/anti-immigrant PEGIDA rally vs 10,000 counter rally
"In the afternoon police fired water cannon on a group of far-left activists throwing stones and fireworks, to prevent them from attacking HoGeSa protestors. Several leftists were arrested in the incident, and a police officer was lightly cut after leftists threw stones at his patrol car. Five hooligans were also injured in a scuffle near the train station, police said.
Police had tried to have the HoGeSa demonstration banned, citing last year's violence on October 26, in which at least 44 police officers were injured. But a court on Wednesday ruled against prohibiting the rally, stipulating only that it had to take place at a fixed location rather than include a march through the streets."
Oh wait, it's not so peaceful in Germany, too! And yet the counter-protests are effective.
http://www.dw.com/en/anti-islam-rally-in-cologne-outnumbered-by-counter-protest/a-18804985
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/w...ht-group-and-counter-protesters-a6708646.html
They seem right against each other like in any other protest.
600 Anti-islam/anti-immigrant PEGIDA rally vs 10,000 counter rally
"In the afternoon police fired water cannon on a group of far-left activists throwing stones and fireworks, to prevent them from attacking HoGeSa protestors. Several leftists were arrested in the incident, and a police officer was lightly cut after leftists threw stones at his patrol car. Five hooligans were also injured in a scuffle near the train station, police said.
Police had tried to have the HoGeSa demonstration banned, citing last year's violence on October 26, in which at least 44 police officers were injured. But a court on Wednesday ruled against prohibiting the rally, stipulating only that it had to take place at a fixed location rather than include a march through the streets."
Oh wait, it's not so peaceful in Germany, too! And yet the counter-protests are effective.
http://www.dw.com/en/anti-islam-rally-in-cologne-outnumbered-by-counter-protest/a-18804985
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/w...ht-group-and-counter-protesters-a6708646.html
They seem right against each other like in any other protest.
Gordon Shumway
Banned
Nothing more frightening than the hypothetical..
freeofgreed
Member
You mean the Germany that outright bans extreme political parties? It's funny how you're using "free speech in Germany" to defend Trump having his rally when it probably wouldn't have even been allowed in your country in the first place...
Bernie supporters vs Trump supporters last night. Clash of the Titans!
That's what I've been saying. In Germany, somebody like Trump is an impossible thing to happen.
I always try to imagine Merkel meeting with president Trump ... and I can't.
As the article you link says, it was an organized protest, held in check by the police. That's what I've been repeatedly saying. You seem to imply I'm saying German people don't protest. That is all in your head.
And I couldn't partake in the protest for personal reasons that I won't talk about here. But keep insulting others from your high horse. Which, btw. is the kind of attitude that helps people like Trump or Petry.
The same rally in January that got disrupted with boos, whistles and sit-ins by counter-protesters? The protest where the route got blocked at the Brienner Strasse? And an equal number of people got arrested as in Chicago? Yeah, truly a massive difference. And I would know, I was there.
Like I said talking out of your ass. And it's pretty telling you were watching from the window, instead of getting fucking involved when it's happening at your front door.
Messofanego
Banned
44 police officers were injured in the previous year (October 26th) of that type of rally. So much for police curbing violence once and for all!
That's what I've been saying. In Germany, somebody like Trump is an impossible thing to happen.
I always try to imagine Merkel meeting with president Trump ... and I can't.
There is no way for the German people to change their laws and allow a fascist party?
I haven't seen any of his other tweets, but judging by that one I don't think that is what he is saying. Its definitely not what I'm saying. Of course they are 100% within their rights to protest without fear of arrest.
The protesters are 100% within their right to protest, its part of the first amendment and all that, right to assembly etc. What I was saying though is often time we see various side call for the silencing of those who disagree with them. I see it come from the left in discussion about climate change, women's rights and racism. Often times being a knee jerk reaction, labeling the person as "dangerous" and calling for their opinions to be silenced. I see it come from the right on many social issues, such as abortion, gay marriage, etc; calling for draconian levels of censorship when it comes to media & self expression.
The sad part is these people are morons. The really sad part is how many of them there are. Our education system needs an overhaul.
SolarPowered
Member
Just about what you'd expect from a moderate.
reggieandTFE
Member
Well didn't you hear? He Wikipedia'd something and read about it on the Internet. Shut ins who have never taken a meaningful step to stand for something in their lives tend to be really proscriptive about how those protesting the dominant social paradigm should act.
DrForester
Kills Photobucket
I think a big difference here is that Donal Trump incites his followers to violence at his rallies. That is NOT protected free speech and it's disingenuous to make it out as such.
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