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[AmFreak]

-you don't have to fork over more money!
-your existing ps4 will still be the base for ps4 games!
-this is not a new gen, they have 30m+ userbase on existing ps4 consoles!
-there are only some issues if you're jealous!

The current ps4 theoretically already can do games in 4k, but ofc not in the quality of current AAA games.
So the question is will it be able to play AAA games that currently run in 1080p on the ps4 in 4k?

 

[LoveCake]

There is enough trouble getting games 60fps at 1080p so lets get this sorted out first before trying to do 4K.

 

[gaugebozo]

I'm going to assume that eventually PS4 owners will be playing at different framerates.

In addition, developers now have twice the amount of versions to develop and test.

 

[Gono]

PS4.5 ??? WTF!

PS: I'm ok with a Ps4 Slim with a few tweaks here and there. I'd even buy a new PS4 if they release a slim version. But don't get me talking about console upgrades not even 3 years after its launch.

 

[SenkiDala]

I'm going to assume that eventually PS4 owners will be playing at different framerates.

That sounds impossible. Espacially since Sony is pushing eSport on PS4. How do you want to push esport on a console which has 2 versions: a 60fps Driveclub 2 and a 30fps Driveclub 2?

Some people would answer "but it's same on PC!", no, on PC if you play cometitivly, you'll use lower settings with your game's graphics until the game run at 60fps, everybody needs to play at the same framerate. And on PS4 it would be impossible to change the settings of your game to make it runs at 60 fps...

 

[Ninja Sharingan]

I feel like it would be prohibitively expensive to create a console capable of rendering high-end games at 4k. Right now, even the most powerful consumer graphics cards on the market, are just BARELY able to reach that mark at solid frame-rates with more demanding games.

this is how I feel. Maybe medium settings at 30 fps for 4k? if this thing launches at the end of next year?

maybe it renders at 2k and upscales? I cant see 4k native for all games.

 

[DiscoDave]

I don't see the problem here. What difference it makes if Im playing at 1080p and ps4.5 owners are playing at 4k?

Guys, do you seriously own the latest model of your phone, pc, tv at home? Im just fine with the cost effective previous revisions...

Depends what you care about as newer phones really don't do much difference to last year's model for the very reason that it's only a year older. I have last year's model phine because I don't care that much about a phone as it does what I need it to. If there is a option for me to upgrade something I do care about every couple of years I will get it. Though if it was yearly then screw that but once every few years makes sense as the tech is advancing quite quick at the moment.

 

[Netherscourge]

Smartphones cost more than consoles, when you add in the carrier contracts or just by them outright.

People buy new phones every 3 to 4 years. Many people upgrade every single year.

The PS4 is due for a hardware upgrade.

 

[Dinky Dino]

That sounds impossible. Espacially since Sony is pushing eSport on PS4. How do you want to push esport on a console which has 2 versions: a 60fps Driveclub 2 and a 30fps Driveclub 2?

Some people would answer "but it's same on PC!", no, on PC if you play cometitivly, you'll use lower settings with your game's graphics until the game run at 60fps, everybody needs to play at the same framerate. And on PS4 it would be impossible to change the settings of your game to make it runs at 60 fps...

People will just tell you to upgrade and that's that. In time as more people get the newer model you will be snuffed out with those claims.

 

[Hermii]

Smartphones cost more than consoles, when you add in the carrier contracts or just by them outright.

People buy new phones every 3 to 4 years. Many people upgrade every single year.

The PS4 is due for a hardware upgrade.

A smartphone is something you use all the time, everyday.

 

[SenkiDala]

People will just tell you to upgrade and that's that. In time as more people get the newer model you will be snuffed out with those claims.

Well, that or multiplayer games will be made to run perfectly on the older PS4s. The success of a competitive game depends on the user base. a 30M+ PS4 user base seem more solid than just waiting that people buy the new "PS4K". ^^

We'll see anyway.

 

[120v]

I don't see the problem here. What difference it makes if Im playing at 1080p and ps4.5 owners are playing at 4k?

Guys, do you seriously own the latest model of your phone, pc, tv at home? Im just fine with the cost effective previous revisions...

i think the main contention is the 4.5 may have exclusives. i don't think many are upset about 4.5 owners having a graphical edge

personally i don't like this because i go to PC for high end experiences, consoles for exclusives, comfy couch ect. but i understnd a majority of gamers are console only, and with VR and this gen being gimped as it is there's kind of no way around it

 

[Keihart]

What both Microsoft and Sony are trying to do is give buyers a reason to invest late in a gen or repurchase late in a gen. But lol to all the people saying they don't support multiple hardware, so they are going to build a pc instead

As is , console are a smart investment to gain acces the new games library, they asure you good enough performance and exclusive tailored games to the platform.

There is a very big difference in convinience between console and PC with short cycles, PC becomes the better option because the upgrades are done as you see fit in your budget and performance, and is also an investment. Console loses all their advantages because they stop being investments and become money holes before the consumer can get value out of it.

The perceived value of the consoles will plumet and PCs will become the smart looking option.

In a market driven by word of mouth and "smart" consumers, almost always wins the smart looking option..
This is no cellphone or Tv market were people don't even look twice at specs before buying.

 

[The God]

That sounds impossible. Espacially since Sony is pushing eSport on PS4. How do you want to push esport on a console which has 2 versions: a 60fps Driveclub 2 and a 30fps Driveclub 2?

Some people would answer "but it's same on PC!", no, on PC if you play cometitivly, you'll use lower settings with your game's graphics until the game run at 60fps, everybody needs to play at the same framerate. And on PS4 it would be impossible to change the settings of your game to make it runs at 60 fps...

I don't see why it's impossible. You wouldn't be changing the settings, the devs would.

 

[onQ123]

I feel like it would be prohibitively expensive to create a console capable of rendering high-end games at 4k. Right now, even the most powerful consumer graphics cards on the market, are just BARELY able to reach that mark at solid frame-rates with more demanding games.

I think this is an whole different ball game. I think it's dedicated hardware for rendering PS4 games in 4K.

 

[Deleted member 125677]

I wouldn't be shocked to see this happening since MS are already flirting with the idea, and given the upcoming release of PSVR which will demand a lot of the existing hardware. I'd guess PSVR is a more important reason for Sony to upgrade their hardware than pushing regular games at 4K.

 

[TGO]

Smartphones cost more than consoles, when you add in the carrier contracts or just by them outright.

People buy new phones every 3 to 4 years. Many people upgrade every single year.

The PS4 is due for a hardware upgrade.

Your right, I've had a new phone and tablet in the same month, but Consoles aren't phones and the market and the why people purchase them are very different, I couldn't afford 2 consoles in one month despite my mobile devices each being worth twice as much.
Apples and oranges.

 

[Dinky Dino]

Well, that or multiplayer games will be made to run perfectly on the older PS4s. The success of a competitive game depends on the user base. a 30M+ PS4 user base seem more solid than just waiting that people buy the new "PS4K". ^^

We'll see anyway.

Gotta give it enough time. We all saw it took a while for devs to move on from the ps3 and that had a much larger userbase. If the rumors are true, you'll have a portion of that og ps4 userbase upgrading because they can afford it and new people coming in as well. I guess the question is how fast it happens. Sony might also have an interest in advertising the power of their new ps4 at the forefront and push devs in that direction as well for vr purposes.

 

[Myspcr_Shadow]

i think the main contention is the 4.5 may have exclusives. i don't think many are upset about 4.5 owners having a graphical edge

I realize the 3ds is a handheld market but are there people upset that there are exclusive new3ds games?

It's going to be a gamble for Sony if they decide to go with this.

 

[Man]

I'd guess PSVR is a more important reason for Sony to upgrade their hardware than pushing regular games at 4K.

It's a device which can be pushed much harder given you have the hardware.
Instead of 60fps reprojected, go for 120fps native.
Instead of 1920x1080, downsample from a higher resolution.
etc.

It's nice to have peripheral cycles separated from console cycles.

 

[Dirtyshubb]

I am really conflicted on this news, my initial thoughts are that in theory it works well but otherwise could have long lasting repercussions for the industry.

While the idea of giving people more options is nice, and the idea of most games being backwards compatible is nice I worry what will actually happen?

Will games be held back to make sure they work across as many versions as possible and just increase the resolution and framerate on higher end models instead of pushing games fully? Will earlier consoles get gimped versions like shadow of mordor on ps360?

As for the console release, I worry that the idea of following a mobile industry like model might not work for consoles and could hurt their perception. I already know people who get a console and then complain when a new version is announced after 5-6 year as they see it as being too soon. Could speeding up that time frame cause more distrust or Apathy amongst certain parts of the gaming audience?

I guess ideally Sony and Microsoft will just have as many, if not more owners just spread out amongst more devices and the software sales will more than make up for it but I'm not so sure things will work out that way.

I just worry the potential negatives could do more damage than the potential good could. Hopefully I'm wrong and it works out well, I know I will no doubt get a ps4.5 as cost isn't an issue for me and upgrading would be nice but I'm not sure how people would agree with me.

 

[Auctopus]

Every time I see this thread on GAF, I hate that idea a little bit more.

 

[Stampy]

How is this good for the consumer? Person X buys the PS4 at launch but then further down the line has to play the inferior version of a game and will have a disadvantage in multiplayer games as Person Y who bought the newer model can run the game at a higher res/framerate.

I don't see a problem.

Consoles are a consumer product, and as such the point is that businesses earn money on them as much as they can, and not to garner some false ideas about equality.

Person x buys a three times cheaper car than person y, lo and behold, person y can drive the car on higher speeds, can have better comfort while driving, etc…no one is complaining. Or take sports: person x does not have much money and buys a cheaper racquet, person y is rich and buys an expensive racquet that performs better. Person x and y can play tennis together and compete. No one is crying about it.

That same principle applies to all the consumer products, I don't see why console market should be different. Maybe you all guys should start questioning higher ideologies of our times, and not one small consumer segment of the market.

 

[FLAguy954]

Honestly the only problem I see with this being a thing is how the hell they are going to market it.

You saw the disater that was the 3DS and now the New 3DS. Sony is going to have to figure out a way to educate the masses that one PS4 is the new one and how the "upgrade system" will work. Which may be hard to do.

Really this is something that I believe is going to happen. Since this way hardware won't be in the way anymore when it comes to consoles. It will just be a focus of software and services which has already been evident this generation. Now the "generational leaps" will be far less and more comparable to a new mobile phone launch.

The New 3DS was not a disaster at all and it gave the 3DS a good boost in global sales. It was a move that ultimately worked; Sony and Microsoft are just trying to get ahead with this new business model (well, new for the video game industry anyways).

 

[gaugebozo]

Gotta give it enough time. We all saw it took a while for devs to move on from the ps3 and that had a much larger userbase. If the rumors are true, you'll have a portion of that og ps4 userbase upgrading because they can afford it and new people coming in as well. I guess the question is how fast it happens. Sony might also have an interest in advertising the power of their new ps4 at the forefront and push devs in that direction as well for vr purposes.

The largest selling point of new systems is new games you can only get on that system.

If they limit games to the new systems, people will be pissed. "I just got this and you're not going to support it!"

If they don't, it only really appeals to enthusiasts, and not the majority of the market. It's a 3D TV sort of idea.

 

[EvB]

Honestly the only problem I see with this being a thing is how the hell they are going to market it.

You saw the disater that was the 3DS and now the New 3DS

I don't think Microsoft and Sony have the same issue as Nintendo.

 

[Asd202]

Smartphones cost more than consoles, when you add in the carrier contracts or just by them outright.

People buy new phones every 3 to 4 years. Many people upgrade every single year.

The PS4 is due for a hardware upgrade.

You don't buy $60 per game on phones.

 

[gamz]

The New 3DS was not a disaster at all and it gave the 3DS a good boost in global sales. It was a move that ultimately worked; Sony and Microsoft are just trying to get ahead with this new business model (well, new for the video game industry anyways).

Let's be honest for everyone against it. When MS and Sony releases a new and more powerful console it will sell out immediately. If they can sell a 150 dollar controller, they can sell a premium more powerful console. Hell, they are selling a 500 dollar VR add on. The damn thing is more expensive then the console itself.

 

[GamerMax73]

The evolution of the console market has to follow the iPad model at some point. It only makes sense and I seen no reason why it would harm existing users. Why can't a game check which version of the console is in use and setup the assets, resolution, frame rate, effects, etc accordingly? Isn't this what already happens for games released to the Android, IOS and PC markets already?

Games have a minimum spec that's probably a generation or two behind cutting edge. You choose where on the upgrade cycle you jump in (every model, every other, every third) and backwards compatibility is ensured.

The problems only occur if Sony allow games to be released that are only compatible with the latest cutting edge version before the earlier version hasn't reached it's natural end of life yet.

 

[jeffram]

If it's implemented right this theoretically doesn't hurt anyone. Die hard ps fans and gaming enthusiast jump in at launch. Nobody asks them for more money for 7 years. Why not give that fanbase something they can get excited about and happily engage with? Meanwhile you can lengthen the generation for the more casual consumers.

 

[blastprocessor]

How is this good for the consumer? Person X buys the PS4 at launch but then further down the line has to play the inferior version of a game and will have a disadvantage in multiplayer games as Person Y who bought the newer model can run the game at a higher res/framerate.

How is that different to PC gamers of today? At least as a consumer you can continue to play newer games if said publishers supports PS4 as well as PS4K.

Given the core PC architecture Sony have got a platform that's much easier to upgrade earlier. A 6 year long product cycle is hard to understand given how quickly technology progresses.

 

[120v]

I realize the 3ds is a handheld market but are there people upset that there are exclusive new3ds games?

It's going to be a gamble for Sony if they decide to go with this.

well there's only one N3DS exclusive lol

if this were a "normal" gen i'd say it's a gamble but with VR and console games already spurring out at 900p it's probably the best alternative. as much as i don't really like it (just bought a ps4 myself)

 

[gamz]

You don't buy $60 per game on phones.

It's not like anyone is forcing you to buy a 60 dollar game either. Just wait a couple of months for the price drop if you so choose.

 

[WillyFive]

The evolution of the console market has to follow the iPad model at some point. It only makes sense and I seen no reason why it would harm existing users. Why can't a game check which version of the console is in use and setup the assets, resolution, frame rate, effects, etc accordingly? Isn't this what already happens for games released to the Android, IOS and PC markets already?

Games have a minimum spec that's probably a generation or two behind cutting edge. You choose where on the upgrade cycle you jump in (every model, every other, every third) and backwards compatibility is ensured.

The problems only occur if Sony allow games to be released that are only compatible with the latest cutting edge version before the earlier version hasn't reached it's natural end of life yet.

Well, this is more like correcting back to the normal 5 year generational cycle rather than adapting an iPad model.

 

[Captain Tuttle]

This is inevitable and I'll likely buy one

 

[labx]

Smartphones cost more than consoles, when you add in the carrier contracts or just by them outright.

People buy new phones every 3 to 4 years. Many people upgrade every single year.

The PS4 is due for a hardware upgrade.

Smartphones don't have 60 - 90 dollars applications

 

[Asd202]

It's not like anyone is forcing you to buy a 60 dollar game either. Just wait a couple of months for the price drop if you so choose.

And? The thing is you have to invest more money into a console on top of entry price something which isn't true with phones. Also who the hell will buy an upgraded console but wait for sale on games when in that time the console will devalue much faster than in the past due to 3 year upgrade cycle.

 

[STEaMkb]

The only way this story makes sense, is if Sony is planning another general-purpose media device similar to the PSX. Something that, incidentally, outputs your existing PS4 games in a higher resolution.

Kind of neat but not worth the fuss generated.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PSX_(video_game_console)

 

[gaugebozo]

Why can't a game check which version of the console is in use and setup the assets, resolution, frame rate, effects, etc accordingly?

Because Blu-ray doesn't support 4k resolution.

 

[Zedox]

Let's be honest for everyone against it. When MS and Sony releases a new and more powerful console it will sell out immediately. If they can sell a 150 dollar controller, they can sell a premium more powerful console. Hell, they are selling a 500 dollar VR add on. The damn thing is more expensive then the console itself.

Xbox One Pro. It's going to be a thing. I will make it a thing. LOL! (or Xbox One Elite...whatevs). I'm really surprised how much talk has been going on in this thread.

 

[Stranya]

Really don't care about 4K atm, especially since I don't have a 4K TV.

Would much rather the additional power was used for improved framerate, physics, draw distance, effects, AI, and so on. (I'm not a techie, tho, maybe that's not how it works).

 

[Rizific]

PS4.5 ??? WTF!




PS: I'm ok with a Ps4 Slim with a few tweaks here and there. I'd even buy a new PS4 if they release a slim version. But don't get me talking about console upgrades not even 3 years after its launch.

incredible. so youd be willing to shell out more dough for a redesigned and/or slimmed down ps4 with the SAME performance, but not for one that will offer you BETTER performance? its like as soon as you say the words "upgrade" or "performance" console owners loose their damn minds. i dont know why so many are closed off to the idea of better performing games.

 

[mugurumakensei]

But what differentiate PS5 from PS4.5 ? If PS5 is only more power, and PS4.5 is only more power, why is it called PS5 ?

Combination of things, like PS VR 2nd headset will probably be exclusive to PS5 branch, new DualShock features, improved camera, new room scale solution for VR based off of Lighthouse. Any number of things beyond power would differentiate itself. I'd also see it as games can be exclusively targeted to major branch numbers. However minor branches must work on whatever major branch the system is currently on. With that said, if a developer is so inclined, they can release a PS5 game that's PS4.5 compatible.


I'll also say .5 branches will allow for some antialiasing for VR games that target the base major branch. Like PS4.5 can render the game at 1440p then downscale to 1080p to give games some extra antialiasing in addition to whatever temporal antialiasing solution they are using.

 

[gamz]

And? The thing is you have to invest more money into a console on top of entry price something which isn't true with phones. Also who the hell will buy an upgraded console but wait for sale on games when in that time the console will devalue much faster than in the past due to 3 year upgrade cycle.

How much to you spend monthly on your phone?

 

[mrklaw]

Wow. I've been out of the loop. I can't imagine that they would push out upgraded hardware just for 4K. There are probably not enough 4K tvs out there to make it worth while. It must be cause developers want the beefier hardware or because of vr.

I totally expected them to produce a revision that supported 4K for the OS and apps like Netflix, but not for games. I'm still finding that hard to believe and I'm sure there are some twists in the story still to come

 

[sems4arsenal]

Polyphony am cry.

GTS release date in 2017 confirmed

 

[Sidewinder]

If it's implemented right this theoretically doesn't hurt anyone. Die hard ps fans and gaming enthusiast jump in at launch. Nobody asks them for more money for 7 years. Why not give that fanbase something they can get excited about and happily engage with? Meanwhile you can lengthen the generation for the more casual consumers.

In an ideal world yes, but we have day 1 patches for broken games, we have games that never really get fixed, we have games with poor performance on a fixed spec plattform, just imagine how much better it'll become with new console upgrades every 3 years.

 

[wapplew]

I don't understand, what's so wrong about traditional console generation? Why IPad model have to be the only way to go?
Sure, every generation will start from zero install base, but developer could always do cross gen port if they feel the need as usual.

 

[Blackleg-sanji1]

103 pages in...and i still dont get the smartphone comparisons,or TV's for that matter

 

[mrklaw]

How is this good for the consumer? Person X buys the PS4 at launch but then further down the line has to play the inferior version of a game and will have a disadvantage in multiplayer games as Person Y who bought the newer model can run the game at a higher res/framerate.

How is that different from PS3 owners having the inferior version of eg Fifa when ps4 comes out? There are millions of people that bought a PS3 the year that PS4 came out. Do you think they are pissed at playing inferior games? No - they bought the PS3 late in the generation at a price that suited them. They wouldn't have been in the market for a Ps4 for a few more years anyway

What you're suggesting is removing choice - to prevent a few people from feeling upset, let's just force everyone to be held back