The reviews say he's wooden.
I hear some praise for Affleck, but next to nothing for Cavil.
Batman v Superman Spoiler Thread: Don't believe everything you read, Son
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The reviews say he's wooden.
I hear some praise for Affleck, but next to nothing for Cavil.
Father_Brain
Banned
To each his own, but I thought he was pretty wooden in MoS and doesn't look to have improved here.
He should be steel. He'll get there with one more shot.
I think it's time to change the mythos. Him not killing people was stupid anyway, true to the roots but stupid. Batman iq is something like 234 and he keeps sending those beyond ruthless criminals to jail where they escape every friday, like seriousely ? Keep it real, it's gotham, just get rid of them once and for all.
If he could get rid of the cape too, that would be good.
I can't tell if you are being sarcastic or not, but just in case. If you are going that far to change the core of the character just make a new character.
Batman isn't the Punisher.
RepairmanJack
Member
Glad you don't make these decisions.
And there is kind of a reason Punisher isn't all that popular anymore. Aside from him being a villain for DD.
BronsonLee
Member
Razgriz-Specter
Member
2 strikes.
To me Superman is a character that you should just automatically love almost instantly(unless you are just a fan of villain)
Its like his only trait. Not liking him because he is too likeable is also part of the character.
Dean Cain Superman for me is the best(only 7 episodes into that series atm), instantly likeable yet isn't a complete goof like other versions.
I honestly don't think Cavil could turn it around at this point, and his Superman definitely isn't worthy of MoS2.
He was better for me than the last dude. *shrug*
I don't get the need to instantly love any character. I certainly never did with any previous Superman. He's no Reeve, but he's fine. Superman always seems to be this character a little out of touch with humanity.
I think the movie did a pretty good job handling "murderer" Batman.
The only people he did kill directly attempted to kill him and ended up killing themselves.
The car guy knew what he was getting into, the grenade launcher guy was sent the grenade right back and that's his fault in the first place.(that looked like a burton scene)
As for killing to save "Martha", it's him doing the right thing, just like he should have saved Jason.
Batman was fine in this movie.
As for Cavill, he doesn't stand out but he is entirely okay, not too bad.
The only people he did kill directly attempted to kill him and ended up killing themselves.
The car guy knew what he was getting into, the grenade launcher guy was sent the grenade right back and that's his fault in the first place.(that looked like a burton scene)
As for killing to save "Martha", it's him doing the right thing, just like he should have saved Jason.
Batman was fine in this movie.
As for Cavill, he doesn't stand out but he is entirely okay, not too bad.
One too many !
And he kills that person out of PTSD determination to not let Martha die. Like dude would have done anything to save her
BronsonLee
Member
It's either that guy or Superman's mother burns to death
You pick!
This too. Bruce is shook BAD by the end of his fight with Clark. Fuck, the end of that fight was leagues above anything else in this movie
The whole point of Batman is that ONE kill will always be one kill to many.
But to hell with it. Batman killing people sounds like the least of this movies problems.
Exactly, like in "Under the Red Hood" when he explains why he will never kill the Joker....
The Joker should be dead in the DCCU then ...
BronsonLee
Member
He was going to straight up murder Superman with zero regrets, he's got no time for bullshit anymore
Yup, all the Suicide Squad characters should already be dead.
BronsonLee
Member
At this point you guys should just watch the movie.
I find it strange how The Dark Knight Returns has a 100% on RT where both versions of Batman are equally violent here, yet one it's a strength or goes unmentioned and the other a weakness. Does the extreme violence get a pass in TDKR because it's an animated flick?
Hey, sorry, I haven't read any part of the thread. I just want to make this post for posterity purposes.
One of the main reasons I disliked Batman and Superman fighting already is that the fight is so damn predictable, because even in the comics where they are more flexible, the fight generally goes Superman until Batman whips out the Kryptonite and then starts beating on Superman. What would have been one major benefit from placing this film later in the continuity would have been that they'd allow themselves to set up more ways in which Batman could counter Superman, because believe it or not, you can get more creative than "Apply Kryptonite, ???, Profit"
I'll be seeing the movie Friday. I'm hoping that it will prove me wrong, but this is my bet, and I just wanted to officially place it before I see it.
One of the main reasons I disliked Batman and Superman fighting already is that the fight is so damn predictable, because even in the comics where they are more flexible, the fight generally goes Superman until Batman whips out the Kryptonite and then starts beating on Superman. What would have been one major benefit from placing this film later in the continuity would have been that they'd allow themselves to set up more ways in which Batman could counter Superman, because believe it or not, you can get more creative than "Apply Kryptonite, ???, Profit"
I'll be seeing the movie Friday. I'm hoping that it will prove me wrong, but this is my bet, and I just wanted to officially place it before I see it.
RepairmanJack
Member
Speaking of the killing and violence in the movie I really hated just how PG-13 it was. I can now understand why the DVD will be rated R because there was so many times where it just felt weird and took me out of the movie when the camera angle just shifts or how it purposely crops out violence. Like Superman at the end stabbing Doomsday and pulling himself further on his spike so he can stab him more. It just felt weird with that stuff cropped. I couldn't help but think about it every time it happened because it was so obvious.
This was my issue before even seeing the movie. Because they hadn't even introduced Kryptonite yet so they would have to introduce it in this movie and no matter how they did it it would always feel cheap.
This was my issue before even seeing the movie. Because they hadn't even introduced Kryptonite yet so they would have to introduce it in this movie and no matter how they did it it would always feel cheap.
Inferno313
Banned
From what I've been reading, most of the criticism on Rottentomatoes doesn't have to do with Batman being too violent, but has more to do with the movie itself being depressing, dull, overlong, and overstuffed with setup for future films.
Most of the scripts require Cavill staring at things looking troubled, so it might not be his fault.
I can't say exactly but I think Superman has much more screentime than Clark Kent. On the contrary, we have many Bruce Wayne scenes.
Batman doesn't kill because he's insane, and knows he's insane. That one rule is the only thing keeping him from becoming a monster worse than any villains he's ever fought. He's not doing it out of mercy. He's doing it because killing will make things worse.
I meant with how people are responding to the violent Batman. For a film that was announced with a quote from TDKR, you'd think most would just draw the parallel and be done with it.
RepairmanJack
Member
Also the end of the movie, especially Bruce's speech to WW
Reminded me of this
The only problem is we don't really get this sold in the movie. We don't know these other meta's yet. We don't know if they'd be inspired by him, we don't know that they won't want to fight given the chance. If they killed Supe's for the sole purpose of inspiring the Justice League it just isn't sold well at all.
I don't mind a violent Batman, he can beat thugs to within an inch of their life as long as they're not DEAD !
Oh we don't, but we know his death at least inspires Bruce... to start trusting them and looking for their help
He only needs to inspire one
George Oscar Bluth II
Banned
JUSTICE LEAGUE PART 2
INT. BARRY ALLEN'S ROOM IN THE JUSTICE LEAGUE HEADQUARTERS - DAY
Barry Allen stirs in his sleep and suddenly jolts awake, sweating. He walks over to the water dispenser and pours himself a cup then sinks down into a chair and rubs his head.
INT. JUSTICE LEAGUE HQ MAIN HALL - DAY
Superman and Wonder Woman are having a casual conversation of Batman's current activities and behaviour.
Martian Manhunter can be seen eating Oreos and silently conversing with the Green Lantern (Kyle Rayner) in the background. Barry Allen walks in unusually quiet and looking slightly shaken...
Superman looks a little bemused.
Superman goes to sit with Martian Manhunter.
*Cough*
Or... Uh... something like that.
INT. BARRY ALLEN'S ROOM IN THE JUSTICE LEAGUE HEADQUARTERS - DAY
Barry Allen stirs in his sleep and suddenly jolts awake, sweating. He walks over to the water dispenser and pours himself a cup then sinks down into a chair and rubs his head.
INT. JUSTICE LEAGUE HQ MAIN HALL - DAY
Superman and Wonder Woman are having a casual conversation of Batman's current activities and behaviour.
SUPERMAN
He's been acting a little strange lately. Well, stranger than usual. Quite paranoid.
He's been acting a little strange lately. Well, stranger than usual. Quite paranoid.
WONDER WOMAN
Tim told Vic, and Vic told Barry who then told me that Bruce punched Nightwing right in the face. Something is definitely up, and it's got him scared.
Tim told Vic, and Vic told Barry who then told me that Bruce punched Nightwing right in the face. Something is definitely up, and it's got him scared.
Martian Manhunter can be seen eating Oreos and silently conversing with the Green Lantern (Kyle Rayner) in the background. Barry Allen walks in unusually quiet and looking slightly shaken...
SUPERMAN
Hey, Barry... Are you okay?
Hey, Barry... Are you okay?
BARRY
Hmm? Oh. Yeah, I'm fine. Just had a really strange dream. More of a nightmare, really.
Hmm? Oh. Yeah, I'm fine. Just had a really strange dream. More of a nightmare, really.
WONDER WOMAN
Do you want to talk about it?
Do you want to talk about it?
BARRY
It was about us... Well, just Clark and Bruce actually. You were there, Diana, but barely. It was like I was watching a moody version of your life story, Clark.
It was about us... Well, just Clark and Bruce actually. You were there, Diana, but barely. It was like I was watching a moody version of your life story, Clark.
Superman looks a little bemused.
BARRY
You were different, nothing like the people you are now. Your dad told you to let him die in a tornado when you could've saved him. He also said you should've maybe let your fellow school kids die on a bus to keep your identity secret. You also killed Zod when he came to Earth to try and turn it into another Krypton. Oh yeah, there was also a ton of property damage and you made a bad joke then kissed Lois instead of saving anyone. Totally not like you or him, I know.
You were different, nothing like the people you are now. Your dad told you to let him die in a tornado when you could've saved him. He also said you should've maybe let your fellow school kids die on a bus to keep your identity secret. You also killed Zod when he came to Earth to try and turn it into another Krypton. Oh yeah, there was also a ton of property damage and you made a bad joke then kissed Lois instead of saving anyone. Totally not like you or him, I know.
SUPERMAN
Well then... that's certainly is a nightmare of sorts. What about Bruce?
Well then... that's certainly is a nightmare of sorts. What about Bruce?
BARRY
He killed people. He actually killed people left right and centre. Just gunned 'em down. Oh yeah, and he also branded real bad criminals... Just straight up burned a bat symbol on them.
He killed people. He actually killed people left right and centre. Just gunned 'em down. Oh yeah, and he also branded real bad criminals... Just straight up burned a bat symbol on them.
WONDER WOMAN
That doesn't sound anything like Bruce. He has a code that he--
That doesn't sound anything like Bruce. He has a code that he--
BARRY
Yeah, I know. We all know. He's told us like a hundred times. Also, Clark, he tries to kill you because he thought you were a threat to humanity. Lex Luthor kidnaps your mom and tells you to kill Batman if you want her to live. Bruce then proceed to beat you down because you were holding back and almost finished you off before Lois came and talked him down. Well, actually he agreed to help because she triggered some PTSD kinda thing about his mom because yours and his share the same first name and... I can't remember all of it. Anyway, Doomsday arrives because Lex made him from Zod's body and you fight him off and... you die killing him. It was a really detailed dream so I can't remember everything but that was the gist of it.
Yeah, I know. We all know. He's told us like a hundred times. Also, Clark, he tries to kill you because he thought you were a threat to humanity. Lex Luthor kidnaps your mom and tells you to kill Batman if you want her to live. Bruce then proceed to beat you down because you were holding back and almost finished you off before Lois came and talked him down. Well, actually he agreed to help because she triggered some PTSD kinda thing about his mom because yours and his share the same first name and... I can't remember all of it. Anyway, Doomsday arrives because Lex made him from Zod's body and you fight him off and... you die killing him. It was a really detailed dream so I can't remember everything but that was the gist of it.
SUPERMAN
Luthor kidnapped my mom? So he figured out who I am?
Luthor kidnapped my mom? So he figured out who I am?
BARRY
Yeah, your secret identity wasn't that convincing. But as I said, I can't remember all the details. I do remember that Lex was pretty different though. Psychotic and quite... flamboyant. Annoying, actually.
Yeah, your secret identity wasn't that convincing. But as I said, I can't remember all the details. I do remember that Lex was pretty different though. Psychotic and quite... flamboyant. Annoying, actually.
SUPERMAN
Are you sure this was just a dream? It's ridiculously detailed.
Are you sure this was just a dream? It's ridiculously detailed.
BARRY
I'm pretty sure I can't travel between alternate realities in my sleep if that's what you're saying, Clark.
I'm pretty sure I can't travel between alternate realities in my sleep if that's what you're saying, Clark.
WONDER WOMAN
It was just a dream, Clark. A very strange dream.
It was just a dream, Clark. A very strange dream.
SUPERMAN
Yeah, of course. I'll just be thinking about it all day because those are some of my worst fears... but it's fine.
Yeah, of course. I'll just be thinking about it all day because those are some of my worst fears... but it's fine.
Superman goes to sit with Martian Manhunter.
WONDER WOMAN
So I was hardly in it at all?
So I was hardly in it at all?
BARRY
Don't worry, Diana. I'm sure I'll have another nightmare but this time it'll be your life story. Then I'll have another one about the League. My own little nightmare saga... I'm gonna get some coffee.
Don't worry, Diana. I'm sure I'll have another nightmare but this time it'll be your life story. Then I'll have another one about the League. My own little nightmare saga... I'm gonna get some coffee.
*Cough*
Or... Uh... something like that.
So just came back from seeing it, gotta say I'm pleasantly surprised. I actually like it a lot.
But I do have some question for those of you who have seen it, concerning the ending:
But I do have some question for those of you who have seen it, concerning the ending:
1. What exactly Lex getting at in the end?
2. Who is coming (the devil?)? Was it just an allegory/metaphor for Superman dying and every evil person (entity?) know this and is coming for earth (Metropolis/Gotham)?
3. And why didn't Batman Brand Lex, did he want to make sure he is not killed in prison?
4. Oh yeah almost forgot, what exactly was the Flash referring to, when he jumps in time to talk to Bats? I understand it's probably a story arc for future releases, but for those of you who are in the know about the world, what was that warning for?
2. Who is coming (the devil?)? Was it just an allegory/metaphor for Superman dying and every evil person (entity?) know this and is coming for earth (Metropolis/Gotham)?
3. And why didn't Batman Brand Lex, did he want to make sure he is not killed in prison?
4. Oh yeah almost forgot, what exactly was the Flash referring to, when he jumps in time to talk to Bats? I understand it's probably a story arc for future releases, but for those of you who are in the know about the world, what was that warning for?
Coming back from the brink, with all that experience sounds better than yet another Bats just starting out. Just meeting the usual suspects all over again.
This is amazing XD! I think you just sold me even more to seeing Batman v. Superman :').
Yeah I wonder ... it compromises most future films about BatFleck ... If they can't even show his legendary battles against the Joker , Freeze etc alongside Robin, Nightwing ... then what is left to tell ?
They can't make a prequel since Ben Affleck is too old ...
1 Darkseid. The devil and his demons are similar to his Parademons.
2. More or less that and Earth in general.
3. Because he's hopeful and not as angry anymore, he wants to be a better person
4. Red Son, Injustice, just about any arc where Supes loses his shit, but in Injustice he loses his shit as a direct result of Lois dying
Wiggle room for Batman Beyond
RepairmanJack
Member
Batman Beyond? Solo Batfleck be a set-up for a new bats with the suit for Supes being a precursor to the Beyond suit? Could also tie in with Babs possibly being the person in Bruce's bed. Unless I'm remembering wrong.
Wow, thanks for the clarification (and the fast answer
)! Made me like the movie even more now!
Batman Beyond doesn't make sense yet ... it's waaay too early.
Justice League Batman is supposed to be at his peak.
RepairmanJack
Member
Justice League happens before Batfleck movie and we don't really know what the plans are for the solo film. Yeah it's too early but after 20 years of fighting crime what story can we see coming from a solo bat film? I completely welcome something new and refreshing, just don't know what it'd be.
Between the poor reviews and really mixed comments in this thread.....is this is a good movie?
Was looking forward to seeing this and hearing how violent Batman is in this, was looking forward to watching it
Any comments would be much appreciated!
Go see it .
You won't agree with everything the movie does, but you'll get exactly what you want out of "Batman vs Superman".
I think the absolutely awful reviews come from a mix of really high standards in comics movies, snyder hate, the movie having its fair share of bad things.
It's not a bad movie, it is far from the "garbage" reviews made it out to be.
Like it's in no way worse than man of steel.
This Batman should have been in the middle of his career... not coming back from retirement.
That way you don't have to go through the origins and the first meetings with the villains AGAIN but you still have some time to develop the character in several movies.
What??
I know there are some adaptations of the characters that makes him look like a loon (Dark Knight Returns, Man-Bat etc..) but for the most part canon Batman is not insane. Bruce Wayne deep down is one of the nicest guys out there.
Nothing in the movie suggests he ever retired actually. It's really weird and makes his first confrontation with Superman even more out of place.
I somewhat enjoyed parts of Man of Steel, so if this is better then that, I'm game for watching it
. Thank you for the answer !He dresses up like a bat and doles out vigilante justice. He's extremely intelligent. He isn't unaware that what he does is borderline. It's why, time and again you have villains saying he's a hairs breath away from being just like them.
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