Shooting the guy would have made a lot more sense though. Blowing him up only endangered Martha and himself.
IMO would have been better to write the scene differently and not put Batman in that standoff in the first place.
Batman v Superman Spoiler Thread: Don't believe everything you read, Son
- Thread starter N7Commander95
- Start date
- Status
IMO would have been better to write the scene differently and not put Batman in that standoff in the first place.
FlutterPuffs
Member
So I just finished watching Batman vs Superman, and I quite like it.
Puzzled why Snyder used a Malick-ish disjointed dreamy style of pacing and editing for the first two half of the movie, which doesn't work at all, but Batman and Alfred was awesome, and well, some moments were alright. Way better than Man of Steel for me. Don't get me wrong, I don't think it's a good movie, so it's more like Watchmen. A little too slow at times, with scenes that would have flowed better if they were in comic book panels, rather than in a film.
There's a possibility that we are dealing with a world where Superman entered the scene a couple of years later than how it was in the comic books. Batman is broken, has no qualms over killing and Lex Luthor, well, we are dealing with Alexander Luthor here who is a separate character than the bulky bald guy who was in the comics. http://fortune.com/contentfrom/2015/10/5/lex-luthor-jr/ntv_a/3dsBA58oDAfxgFA/
Puzzled why Snyder used a Malick-ish disjointed dreamy style of pacing and editing for the first two half of the movie, which doesn't work at all, but Batman and Alfred was awesome, and well, some moments were alright. Way better than Man of Steel for me. Don't get me wrong, I don't think it's a good movie, so it's more like Watchmen. A little too slow at times, with scenes that would have flowed better if they were in comic book panels, rather than in a film.
There's a possibility that we are dealing with a world where Superman entered the scene a couple of years later than how it was in the comic books. Batman is broken, has no qualms over killing and Lex Luthor, well, we are dealing with Alexander Luthor here who is a separate character than the bulky bald guy who was in the comics. http://fortune.com/contentfrom/2015/10/5/lex-luthor-jr/ntv_a/3dsBA58oDAfxgFA/
But its not like these characters have been consistent in how they act during those 75+ years. People seem too be more hurt with all changes made to the characters (in their head) because the movie isn't a 9 or a 10 but a 6 and blame it their perceived changes to the characters. The Dark Knight was good enough that fans let all changes to the characters slide.
ryutaro's mama
Member
Fair point.
Glass Shark
Banned
When I judge this film in a vacuum, it's mediocre at best. It does not stand up to basic scrutiny and things that would be taught in Filmmaking 101.
When I judge this film based on what it could be, it's a raging dumpster fire.
Poodlestrike
Banned
ALL reporters? They do have specialized fields of knowledge. They can't be expected to know literally everybody over a certain arbitrary level of fame.
Well, that's true of basically all films, if you want to get abstract enough. You can't judge them by how they fail to meet their potential, we have no idea what that potential is.
But as to the other thing, I can't say, I'm seeing it later today. Maybe just call it a mediocre movie if that's what you think it is rather than judging it by the arcane standards of what might have been.
I agree with you its mediocre but for me the biggest problem is that tries too much. Pa and Ma Kent are wasted, ManBat dream, Lois is only there to get saved and everything at the Daily Planet is pointless and that results in weird pacing.
Your 2nd point can be said about all movies.
Glass Shark
Banned
When I go see a movie that's an original property, I have no expectation for what to think and if it's even good (not great) it can be a pleasant surprise.
When your trailers and marketing hype up the film and the cinematic universe you're building and you're dealing with some of the most beloved heroes in pop culture for nearly a century, it's not unreasonable to have high expectations. I'm not saying the movie should have been perfect, but DC squandered so much potential.
When your trailers and marketing hype up the film and the cinematic universe you're building and you're dealing with some of the most beloved heroes in pop culture for nearly a century, it's not unreasonable to have high expectations. I'm not saying the movie should have been perfect, but DC squandered so much potential.
KOMANI
KOMANI
Absolutely right. I don't care if this superhero kills or this one doesn't... What matters is if there's a good movie in there.
Glass Shark
Banned
And in this case, there isn't. People are wringing their hands over Superman destroying cities or Batman killing or the movie not matching the tone of the comics, but none of my complaints with the film have anything to do with any of those. It's just not a good movie, end of story.
KOMANI
KOMANI
It's probably not, I've always been upset with Warners going with Snyder instead of Aronofsky but I will see this movie tomorrow and see for myself. But, again, I doubt it's good because of who's writing it and directing it.
ryutaro's mama
Member
He's there covering a billion titan of industry and knows who he is but is clueless about another billionaire titan of industry?
LOL @ the notion that Bruce Wayne has an "arbitrary level of fame".
In the DC universe.
I think few people are saying this a good movie but for some reason many people in the BvS threads seem to have some sort agenda against this movie, even people that have not seen the movie, saying its the worst superhero movie ever made when its not even close to that.
People are weird
Glass Shark
Banned
Hell, in my mind there's no way Clark wouldn't know he's Batman already. Supposedly he's been fighting crime in Gotham, THE CITY RIGHT NEXT TO YOURS, for 20 years. He's nearly a superhuman. If you're Superman, first thing you do is hop on over and use your X-ray vision to check this dude out and see if he's not a threat.
NOTHING MAKES SENSE
This movie deserves a Plinkett review, it's that bad
KOMANI
KOMANI
Lately I've felt Metropolis should embody more of California the way Gotham embodies NY.., or at least they don't occupy the same city. If Metropolis should be NY, make Gotham Chicago or Detroit.
Its just stupid and its not even nitpicking. Superman notices it when he is in America and Lois Lane is about to get shot in the fucking middle east, but he never looked across the river what this bat resembling sign on the sky could stand for?
Glass Shark
Banned
You can take those statements as contradictory if you want, but I don't believe they are. And it's not like I have some vendetta against this film. I really wanted it to be good. I'm a huge fan of DC and Batman and have been for years. I'm pissed at them for screwing up this opportunity.
ryutaro's mama
Member
Which begs the question, why does Superman even know that particular Bat signal is for him?
Hell, for all he knows, it could have be Gordon signaling the Batman.
There was nothing special about his usage of the signal that would make it Superman-centric.
Glass Shark
Banned
there are so many things like this in the film that are thrown in for convenience's sake when it makes sense for the plot and ignored or thrown away when it doesn't
I'm amazed that Gotham, a city plagued with unspeakable crime and terrorized for years to the point it requires a masked vigilante to help bring it some semblance of sustainability, is RIGHT NEXT to Metropolis, where Superman is just sort of ignoring the constant, unending crime sprees going on only a few miles away from him...
It's also a terrible "what a small world" tactic. I wouldn't be surprised if Keystone City or Central City are right next to Gotham and Metropolis too.
It's also a terrible "what a small world" tactic. I wouldn't be surprised if Keystone City or Central City are right next to Gotham and Metropolis too.
Gotham has always been speculated as essentially being New Jersey next to New York (Metropolis). It's never been fully defined, but that's kind of what people assumed.
Glass Shark
Banned
and yet Supes just happens to see a random apartment fire on TV and decides that's worthy of saving
LIKE WHAT?
the movie is so shallow... they could have done so much more with the aspect of "you're Superman but you can still only do so much"
I mean the situations where they show him saving people... I'm sure in every one of those moments there is something straight-up worse happening somewhere else on the globe, but no, he has time to float there and bask in the sunlight while some random American family's house is flooding
this movie
Now you're being silly, he's Superman, not god, and tbh, he doesn't ow the world a thing when they've been treating him like shit.
Glass Shark
Banned
ok Martha
Hello, Martha Kent.
"Be their hero, Clark. Be their angel, be their monument, be anything they need you to be. Or be none of it. You don’t owe this world a thing. You never did.”
"Be a hero. Or don't. Whatever."
Man, I miss Rosemary Harris's inspiration speeches in Spider-man so much after this film...
Clark's parents sucked.
Doesnt stop him from going to Mexico to save people from a fire.
I dont know a lot of american citys, but from the part of decay, Gotham looks a lot like the modern Detroit to me.
ryutaro's mama
Member
Speaking of fires, wouldn't Superman's frozen breath have come in handy as a bomb is going off? As a building is burning?!?!?
WHY DIDN'T HE USE HIS FREEZE BREATH?!?!?
WHY DIDN'T HE USE HIS FREEZE BREATH?!?!?
AND WHERE WAS HIS X RAY VISION ON THE BOMB WHEELCHAIR?!?!?!
Glass Shark
Banned
well at least Snyder got one aspect of Superman from the comics right, his powers come and go as dictated by the plot
He said himself that he let his guard down. He simply didn't check.
ryutaro's mama
Member
Scores of people dead cause Superman's head wasn't really in it.
Just like in the comics.
Clark's parents are actually the reason why I can buy the Superman we get in Man of Steel and BvS (I haven't seen BvS yet. I'm waiting for Netflix or On Demand). In that respect, Snyder was actually pretty consistent in following through on a Clark Kent that was raised by those particular Kents, into the callous, unfeeling Superman he is in MoS.
The Kents from Smallville, Donner's films, and even Lois and Clark wouldn't have tolerated half of the shit that MoS Clark/Superman have done. There is no way in hell those Kents would have let a school bus full of children die (Hell, Pa Kent would have dove into the lake himself, powers or not, if Clark wasn't there, and drown in the process), or tell Clark that he doesn't owe the world a thing.
If anything, I blame the Kent's bad parenting on why this Superman is the way he is. Me and my wife look at the Snyder Superman movies like they take place in the Justice Lords universe, and the "real" Superman universe just hasn't been seen yet. We're getting a Earth 3 perspective of Crisis on Infinite Earths, and in the third/fourth movie, the JLA proper is going to appear, and a crazy battle across worlds is going to take place.
Sigh. I can dream.
As a huge DC (and Marvel) fan, I'm really bummed that MoS and BvS were so damn disappointing. I don't care about reviews, but talking to friends and reading posts from the people that have seen it, and have similar tastes in movies as I do (ie, Chris Stuckman and Jeremy Jahns), I'm really, really disappointed. I mean, I knew what to expect from a Snyder movie, but I was hoping that this time would be different.
SporeCrawler
Member
So anybody thinks this got too much hate from the critics? I think its a 7-8 out of 10 with a potential of being 9 out of 10 if they did a few things better. 3.4 seems way too low.
Glass Shark
Banned
That's not how RT works. The average rating is 5.2/10... which I'd say is slightly high.
ambar_hitman
Member
HOLY sh*t what a movie.
Stays true to the comics unlike any other DC movie so far.
-Doomsday grows horns
-Death of Superman story line
-Flash time travel
-Injustice story line hinted
-AQUAMANNNN
-Dark Sied is coming
-Batman is bad a*s
Some things which are confusing/misunderstood by many and my interpretations for thesame:
1. That wasn't entirely a dream sequence. It was a nod to Injustice Storyline. In fact, the entire "dream sequence" was probably a future vision OR an alternate universe, where Superman becomes a tyrant after Lois is killed by Joker, and Superman blames Batman for it because he never killed Joker when he had a chance. Since they showed Parademons working with Superman's forces, it seems it was kind of a vision.
2. That guy warning Bruce, was actually Flash (Ezra Miller), from the future using Speedforce. It seems he went back too far by mistake i.e. before formation of Justice League, and hence Bruce doesn't know him. That's why he says: "Too soon Bruce, too soon?" Also he says Lois is the key, again the nod to point 1.
3. Superman dying is PERFECT. That is Death of Superman storyline. Doomsday kills Superman in comics. Its then revealed that Superman never died, his heart beat became so slow that everyone presumed he was dead. By slow I mean, one heart beat in weeks (or was it months???)
4. In the end when Lex says Devil is coming, and those in the stars know that god (Superman) is dead, he means that Darsied is coming. It seems all this was planned by Darksied, to systematically take out Superman before he can invade earth.
5. Batman killing is OKAY. This is TDKR version of Batman, not that pansy Nolan Batman
Stays true to the comics unlike any other DC movie so far.
-Doomsday grows horns
-Death of Superman story line
-Flash time travel
-Injustice story line hinted
-AQUAMANNNN
-Dark Sied is coming
-Batman is bad a*s
Some things which are confusing/misunderstood by many and my interpretations for thesame:
1. That wasn't entirely a dream sequence. It was a nod to Injustice Storyline. In fact, the entire "dream sequence" was probably a future vision OR an alternate universe, where Superman becomes a tyrant after Lois is killed by Joker, and Superman blames Batman for it because he never killed Joker when he had a chance. Since they showed Parademons working with Superman's forces, it seems it was kind of a vision.
2. That guy warning Bruce, was actually Flash (Ezra Miller), from the future using Speedforce. It seems he went back too far by mistake i.e. before formation of Justice League, and hence Bruce doesn't know him. That's why he says: "Too soon Bruce, too soon?" Also he says Lois is the key, again the nod to point 1.
3. Superman dying is PERFECT. That is Death of Superman storyline. Doomsday kills Superman in comics. Its then revealed that Superman never died, his heart beat became so slow that everyone presumed he was dead. By slow I mean, one heart beat in weeks (or was it months???)
4. In the end when Lex says Devil is coming, and those in the stars know that god (Superman) is dead, he means that Darsied is coming. It seems all this was planned by Darksied, to systematically take out Superman before he can invade earth.
5. Batman killing is OKAY. This is TDKR version of Batman, not that pansy Nolan Batman
How the hell would he know to check? (X Ray)
Hmm everyone is telling me its a mediocre movie.
/confused
Glad you enjoyed it though, I'm looking forward to it myself.
All that means nothing if the execution is awful.
ambar_hitman
Member
Almost 90% of the people will think its average. I think after JL1 and 2 people will realize what this movie was trying to do.
Thomas fucking Wayne trying to throw the first punch, I was ready to leave the theater right then.
But to be fair the movie was ok, does not deserve the RT score.
Few too many wtf moments, Snyder either hates Supes or I don't like his view on him.
The Martha thing was dumb but cute, I wish they were friends hour into the movie.
Wonder Womans theme was the only new song to stand out.
But to be fair the movie was ok, does not deserve the RT score.
Few too many wtf moments, Snyder either hates Supes or I don't like his view on him.
The Martha thing was dumb but cute, I wish they were friends hour into the movie.
Wonder Womans theme was the only new song to stand out.
Death of Superman would be make more sense when it wouldnt be the second movie with him and if he wouldnt be confirmed to appear in the second next movie that comes one year later.
I mean, if Captain America dies in Civil War, it is after people attached to this character in 5 movies and he most likely wont show up before Infinity War starts in 4 years...
I mean, if Captain America dies in Civil War, it is after people attached to this character in 5 movies and he most likely wont show up before Infinity War starts in 4 years...
So how do you do the Red Hood story now since the whole premise of the movie hangs on his no killing rule.
Also... why doesn't he just kill all future supervillains from here on out... including Joker.
Because that would be a prequel since Jason Todd is already dead and you can write it off as "no killing" still being a prominent thing for Batman.
Not. Rocket. Science.
crazyrabbits
Banned
To be fair, this is a problem that affected the Nolan films too. Bruce is Batman for about a year, with the only major fights he has being his initial reveal and fight with Ra's and the whole Dent/Joker business. Between that time, we mostly know that he's been fighting low-level crooks. Then he disappears for eight years, shows up a couple more times and is assumed to be dead. Despite this, he's revered and given an honorary statue.
It seems BvS is even worse in this regard, as (despite the Bruce in that world having been around for 20+ years, apparently), Supes is around for six months apparently and has already become revered as a messiah, to the point that he has statues built for him.
I've said it in other topics before, but I wish we had received a straight Supes sequel to really build his mythos before jumping into this.
ambar_hitman
Member
I don't they will bother with Red Hood story arc.
All future super-villains aren't weak enough for Batman to kill them.
(He does KILL Darksied in comics though)
- Status