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[Shao Kahn Brewing a Stew]

The first PS4K exclusive/Digital foundry threads are going to be so good.

God is real.

 

[Marty Chinn]

I don't understand the outrage tbh. In my view this is like getting pissed off that the Google Nexus 5x is released after I bought my Nexus 5 a year ago. Sure I get that this is something new in the game console space but it isn't exactly a new concept for consumer electronics. My Nexus 5 still works fine and runs all of the apps and games I could run on a Nexus 5x. Eventually I'll upgrade my Nexus 5 to the 5x or something better.

It's not uncommon for a large portion of GAF to react negatively to any sort of news or change in the video game industry but this time it just seems particularly silly.

Ya, but you being with Android should understand how fragmentation was a huge issue. Also you should look at the GPU capabilities of the best phones out there and then look at what the target that developers aim for. Multiple iterations has drawbacks.

 

[quesalupa]

Why are they branding it this way and how is it different from being a PS5? N3DS had a small spec bump so that made sense but this GPU is apparently twice as strong.

 

[MrHoot]

It's certainly possible, but the only thing you can really do is complain and hope that devs maintain a decent standard for the base model.

There's definitely pros and cons to the incremental hardware strategy but it was bound to happen with the move to AMD and X86. If Sony didn't shoot first then MS would, but likely they're both releasing an upgraded model at the same time. Hopefully the pros become tangible enough to everyone that makes upgrading a palatable decision.

I think eventually these growing pains will pass, as lame as that sounds. Gamers who feel like you do may really decide to move to PC or wait and only buy the .5's, but maybe that's a risk MS & Sony are willing to take.

The thing is I already game on PC. The only reason I have consoles at this point is that certain games still do not come out on PC, some very high profile. And some exclusive like Bloodborne.

It's only bad when one of the only justification for consoles even existing today is slightly more convenience and holding exclusives hostage. But when you start to now take out the former while keeping the latter, at a higher price point, it's really ticking me off

 

[RoyalLaFlame]

nope pretty serious.
there isnt one single reason for this outrage.

When I buy a console I know that developers will squeeze everything out of that box. Having one set of hardware instantly grants that. Having two sets of hardware doesn't kill that line of thought but developers won't bother as much with optimization on the original hardware. "Do you really think Sony would allow that?" Yes, yes I do. Skyrim just shows that even a shitty port sells - good for Sony, bad for us.

When I play a MP game on my PS4 I know that other people have the same experience as me, making everything fair (minus internet connections). "Oh but they can fix the FPS on both versions" - well that defeats the purpose of a new, more powerful box that plays the same games (that parity clause thingy). Having a better machine doesn't make you a better player sure but you get what I'm saying.


People have the right to be concerned until proven otherwise.

 

[BleedOrange]

If Sony thinks they can actually do this and get away with it, they've lost their minds. This isn't how Consoles are supposed to work. It's an outright betrayal of the 40+ million who already bought the Console, and it will badly split the user base. Sony and PlayStation are done in the Console space if any of of this turns out to be true, and I'm done with them period. This is just disgusting to me.

l o l

 

[orochi91]

If there is a trade-in program, consider me sold.

If not, I'll buy an NX and laugh at Sony.

GameStop will likely have trade-in initiatives, same with other retailers.

Can't imagine Sony themselves doing trade-in programs.

 

[MogCakes]

Not even close.

Oculus + min spec PC = $1500

OGPS4 ($400) + PSVR ($450 w/cam) + PS4K ($400)= $1250 - $200 PS4 trade in = $1050

Consider that i might be able to upgrade my rig and buy oculus for only a slightly higher cost from buying a ps4k and psvr.

 

[kowhai]

Well, I guess I'm going to have to start saving as I'm a real sucker when it comes to new console hardware.

 

[Redmoon]

Fully support this move (mostly just like having stronger hardware ). Count me in.

 

[Necro900]

It's real.

Proof?

 

[nOoblet16]

This is really sounding like a PS5 with those massive hardware upgrades.

PS4 owners are gonna be pissed. Glad I waited to buy mine!

2x is not massive enough to be a new generation. We've had more than 2x the differences between hardware in the same generation (xbox vs ps2).

A new gen Playstation would be something that is 7-8 times more powerful, I mean even with the low speced modestly made PS4 we had that much of a performance difference between the PS3 and PS4.

 

[The Last One]

I don't get why devs already have dev kits of the PS4K if Sony still haven't decided about the CPU upgrade.

 

[Blanquito]

Wait, where is the q1 info coming from?

 

[opticalmace]

Sounds great to me. I'd almost certainly upgrade, particularly if they offer some type of discount or incentive for current owners.

Wait, where is the q1 info coming from?

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?p=199662492&highlight=#post199662492

 

[Maintenance]

Let me get this straight.

You're mad at Sony for doing this.

But yet you want Microsoft to do the same thing to spite Sony for doing this?

Yes.

Burn it all down.

 

[narutomaki04]

I'm pretty conflicted. I kind of want this to happen and not to at the same time

 

[Sarobi]

Why are they branding it this way and how is it different from being a PS5?

Because it's just an upgraded PS4, that plays PS4 games.

 

[Tainted]

Why are they branding it this way and how is it different from being a PS5?

Because its Backward Compatible

 

[Gurnlei]

I'd imagine GameStop would have a nice $200 credit for those buying the PS4K. Unofficial trade in program.

If there's a price drop expect a bit less.

 

[Marty Chinn]

I don't get why devs already have dev kits of the PS4K if Sony still haven't decided about the CPU upgrade.

Dev kits can come in different phases. It doesn't mean the dev kit is final. It's to help developers get started.

 

[David Ricardo]

Running on 1/16 th of the memory on hardware that is something like 10-20 % of the power.

Lets not also factor in the fact that Ps4 and Xb1 are X86 and easy to develop for, old gen not so much.

But also most of the sales are on current gen, last gen is a small percentage now.

In 2017, the OG Ps4 with 50 million owners will still be the vast majority, so lets face it, Vanilla Xb1 and Ps4 will get most focus from software easily in 2017.

The COD example was something extreme, but I used to show you how important it is to have developers targetting your system. Qhen they start targetting the next iteration of the console, we og PS4 users will start getting crappy ports.

 

[bitbydeath]

These posts are so far off target I don't even think people read any more.

If you read the thread, the people against it are largely arguing that they don't believe devs will keep optimizing games for OG PS4 and instead optimize for PS4K instead and that will result in poor performance.

If PS4K can run PS4 games without any changes made what makes you think the opposite wouldn't happen?

Optimisation won't be a large task for anyone as the same API is used means the code is exactly the same.

 

[sora87]

Ooh yeah, didn't think about that.
Ps4 v PS4k

Talk about having a monopoly on the industry, not even bothering with xbox one anymore! /s

 

[jony_m]

Lol that's cute, you think you're going to get trade in at 200 when this is out? Not to mention: Computers are modular, consoles are not.

you are right, maybe 120-150... I for one am planning to keep the OG PS4 to use VR in the tub...

 

[jeffram]

Are we saying there's a large group of people who would have never bought a PS4 but now will because of a better spec'd PS4?

I'm saying more consoles in the ecosystem. Some PSK owners will be new to PS, and some will sell or give away their ps4s.

 

[Blanquito]

Sounds great to me. I'd almost certainly upgrade, particularly if they offer some type of discount or incentive for current owners.


http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?p=199662492&highlight=#post199662492

Thanks

 

[Art Vandilay]

A trade in program? LOL.

We're going to need a mod to change your tag.

 

[Gurish]

Guys I realize it's not enough for 60 fps on PS4 settings right? (for demanding AAA games like U4, not cross gen stuff) but I think it might even be for the better, exclusives will probably be the best looking game period.

Can you imagine GOW4 on ultra settings? it's going to be the best looking game of the gen including everything on PC.

And David Cage's game on ultra? holy shit!

 

[quesalupa]

Because it's just an upgraded PS4, that plays PS4 games.

Because its Backward Compatible

I guess that makes sense but I feel like they could put in a little more effort and call it PS5. I don't really care though, just feel like Sony's going to lose money on this.

 

[The Last One]

Dev kits can come in different phases. It doesn't mean the dev kit is final. It's to help developers get started.

Oh I see. Thanks for the info.

 

[texhnolyze]

Steady 30 FPS is fine, but 60 FPS is nicer to have. Us console peasants want nice things too.

Don't get me wrong, I'm a peasant myself.

You wanna specifically call someone out, or are you gonna roll with the generalizations?

Isn't name-calling against the rule here?
There are so many threads like this one if you want to dig. Another one.

 

[Insumatposa]

Everyone thought this was CGI and not possible on VR and on PS4: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aA5pT_H41mY

Now think again!

Spoiler

PS4K

 

[Maintenance]

Dev kits can come in different phases. It doesn't mean the dev kit is final. It's to help developers get started.

Exactly. IIRC the kit that Guerrilla Games had for Shadow Fall initially had 4GB GDDR5.

 

[ArgentPixel]

I can definitely see a three to four year console cycle with at least one generation of "forward-compatibility" until streaming is good enough to kill off the conventional console in favor of streaming set tops.

 

[Marty Chinn]

I'm saying more consoles in the ecosystem. Some PSK owners will be new to PS, and some will sell or give away their ps4s.

You'd have to show that these people would have never bought a PS4 to begin with though. Someone buying a PS4.5K instead of a PS4 because the option is available doesn't suddenly increase the user base at a higher rate than it would have if the PS4.5K didn't exist.

 

[Corto]

The first PS4K exclusive/Digital foundry threads are going to be so good.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E9VhD4SccSE

 

[Negaduck]

That's unfortunate. I literally bought a ps4 two weeks ago. Might have waited for the better one. But if the games still work on the regular ps4 I'm okay with that.

Not happy but okay.

 

[Darryl M R]

I will pre-order this and have it day one if it can run all my digital games easily. I just hope it has an easy swappable hard drive OR YOU KNOW WHAT SONY AN EXTERNAL HARD DRIVE OPTION.

 

[MUnited83]

isnt the same with pc. or do you play the division 60fps on your ps4?
you will get the game that would suppose to get even if the ps4k didnt exist.
you know im right.

No you're not, and thats not how it works.

 

[FATALITY]

You seriously can't see why people would be upset that the console they bought being outdated quite unexpectedly is an issue?

I would be pissed if this turn out to be true and I recently bought a PS4, it's not what people want for console gaming and quite honestly this is probably the shittiest idea I have seen for a console that is up there with MS making their console online only. Not that I believe this is true though.

you will still play the games you were supposed to play nothing will change. you will u4 1080p 30fps and people with ps4k will run at 60fps. im not seeing the issue here

No you're not, and thats not how it works.

so how it works then. insiders already said og ps4 will be fine. sony is not stupid.

 

[woen]

The COD example was something extreme, but I used to show you how important it is to have developers targetting your system. Qhen they start targetting the next iteration of the console, we og PS4 users will start getting crappy ports.

In 2024 maybe.

I guess that makes sense but I feel like they could put in a little more effort and call it PS5. I don't really care though, just feel like Sony's going to lose money on this.

PS4K may be a code name for this rumored upgraded PS4.

 

[Me_Marcadet]

These posts are so far off target I don't even think people read any more.

If you read the thread, the people against it are largely arguing that they don't believe devs will keep optimizing games for OG PS4 and instead optimize for PS4K instead and that will result in poor performance.

They need to explain how this would be possible if ps4 and ps4k share the same architecture and development process.

The whole point of the ps4k is to expand the ps4 platform, not divide it. When a dév will work hard on ps4k version, it will also benefit the ps4 version and vice versa.

That was not the case with ps3 and ps4.

All Sony has to do is clear out the misconception that by developing for the ps4k, you don't do anything for the ps4.

 

[Head.spawn]

In the world where the PS4K does not exist:

Games are released for OG PS4, but they're highly downgraded versions of PC games, or if they're exclusives they're downgraded from the original assets / vision in order to optimise the game and get it to run on weak hardware with a poor CPU.

In the world where the PS4K exists:

Games are released for OG PS4, but they're highly downgraded versions of PC games, or if they're exclusives they're downgraded from the original assets / vision in order to optimise the game and get it to run on weak hardware with a poor CPU, and also you also have a '4k version' for the PS4k that gets closer to that original spec / PC version.

...so what's the problem here? If you're just a PS4 owner nothing has really changed for you. You're getting the same games.

Pretty much my thoughts exactly.

 

[Prologue]

I don't believe the 2x gpu, And I definitely don't believe a Q1 2017 release date if any such annocuemnt would be made at E3.

 

[eFKac]

I'm done with console gaming with the exception of Nintendo. Back to PC gaming after a 10 year break for me. Whats the point if I have to get another 400€ box after 3 years?

Nintendo is likely to follow that trend as well.

They are guilty of it in handheld space for some time.

But I'm with you, enjoyed my 7 years of console gaming, but it's time to go back to PC, now that I have enough disposable income, it won't be like last time when I had to run games on minimum.

Hopefully Sony starts releasing their games on PC soon, we already see some of them going that route.

 

[Demanufacture]

you will still play the games you were supposed to play nothing will change. you will u4 1080p 30fps and people with ps4k will run at 60fps. im not seeing the issue here

Because games on 1080p 30fps games PS4k (they will happen) will probably be all over the place on PS4. I highly doubt we are going to see the same level of optimisation for PS4 after the new machine comes out.

 

[ArkhamFantasy]

you will still play the games you were supposed to play nothing will change. you will u4 1080p 30fps and people with ps4k will run at 60fps. im not seeing the issue here

That's not going to happen. Console developers have never targeted 60 FPS, every time they get more powerful hardware they use the extra power for graphics, always, consistently, for 30 years.

Hyrule Warriors 3DS JUST came out, the New 3DS version is NOT 60 FPS, and the original 3DS version runs like garbage.

 

[JustenP88]

What if this mid step prolongs the generation though?



Are we saying there's a large group of people who would have never bought a PS4 but now will because of a better spec'd PS4?

I don't really care about "the generation". If they have the capacity to produce that product, at that price, I want it. I'm not worried that I spent $400 on a lesser model 3 years prior. I've got more hours of entertainment out of my PS4 than anything else in my house over that timeframe so I'm fine with the value I've received.

Not to mention the fact that I'll probably be able to get a bit out of trading in the old PS4. This transaction could end up costing me only $200-$300 out of pocket. That's a pretty damn good value for the machine described in the OP.

 

[geordiemp]

I'm done with console gaming with the exception of Nintendo. Back to PC gaming after a 10 year break for me. Whats the point if I have to get another 400€ box after 3 years?

I think generally PC gamers will still mainly be PC gamers, Nintendo fans will be Nintendo fans, and Gamers that mainly game on Ps4 will stay with Sony. No changes.

The unknown is Microsoft, if they move allot of games to Windows on how they will treat Xbox, but who knows (imo).