PS4K information (~2x GPU power w/ clock+, new CPU, price, tent. Q1 2017)

ArkhamFantasy said:
Phantom Pain, Tomb Raider, and Call of Duty were all running on Xbox 360's. Those games are 3 months old, and the PS4 is 10x more powerful than the 360.

So they go from making games for Xbox 360 for 10 years, and now all of a sudden, out of nowhere, for no apparent reason, before the system has even been maxed out, we need a new console?
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Which shows something... The flexibility and scability of tools will be very important in the near future.
 
Sony greed is back and with full force... I am sure that won't backfire some day. I wouldn't be surprised if it fails miserably because what they are doing is a big fuck you for the early adopters. If they think they can get away with tablet/smartphone approach they won't do very well. Consoles are not essential to people and they will never be. What's going to push people to fork out another $400 or more? High FPS? High resolution? reality is that the average person doesn't give a fuck. The PS4 sold 36 mil units in two and half years. How much did the iPhone or the iPad sell in the same period?
 
I'm more curious about the long term plans, particularly as we move towards the PS5. At least people who purchased the vanilla PS4 near launch will still be able to play PS4k games with all the same gameplay features. Whereas people who will pay $400-$500 for a PS4k may only have half the console generational lifetime until developers start removing features and the online community is split.
 
Chezzymann said:
People like me who got a PS4 this christmas are the ones who are screwed the most. Hopefully the OG PS4 is strongly supported (as in gets nearly all the PS4K games and the mostly run decently) for the next 3 years or so.
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Yup. Just got a PS4 for Black Friday 2015 expecting a good 2-2.5 more years out of it.
 
Jimmy Stav said:
This is how I feel about it, more or less. I've only had my PS4 since December and I can fully acknowledge that most games run like shit. It isn't like a PS4k will compromise all of the slick optimization happening on the current system.
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Personally, I have little faith that the AAA players will suddenly restain themselves from flexing their graphical prowess when presented with even an incremental hardware upgrade.

Like I said earlier, if this new business model takes off, I'd fully expect some games to eventually eschew "mere" framerate/IQ improvements in favor of graphical features (think Gameworks) exclusive to the 4K version. It'd certainly make for easier marketing. And then we'd arrive back to the same issue of fluctuating framerates/dynamic resolutions we've always had.

Call me jaded, I guess.
 
BoxManLocke said:
Why would they keep selling the base PS4 if Sony considered you HAD to upgrade ?
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Profit. They can sell old PS4's at a reduced price and make bank off of people willing to play games at 20 FPS, and whatever other downgrades have to be made. They still sold PS3's after the PS4 came out, didn't they? That didn't change the fact that the PS3 got horribly gimped versions of games. Take Shadow of Mordor, for example. That game was gutted for PS3. Who's to say the same won't happen here? At least I got a good 10 years out of my PS3, though. I haven't even gotten 3 years out of my PS4, and it's already obsolete. That's not how consoles are supposed to work.
 
BoxManLocke said:
Yeah, "sacrifices" as in won't look as good as PS4K or run at 30fps vs 60. It's a given, isn't it ?

Doesn't mean the games can't perform decently.
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OP clearly states several times the game is not rendered at 4K, but is upscaled, which really has very little to do with performance, 4K TV's already do this. It is also unlikely that devs will use the extra juice just to double the framerate.
 
OsirisBlack said:
Related info from a meeting we had yesterday was waiting for it to be approved before posting.

Price is currently $399.99 they were discussing a better CPU which would raise the price to $499.99 we were guaranteed the price will be no higher than $499.99 (He mentioned the CPU upgrade quite a bit almost as if they haven't really decided on a final spec could be a pricing issue.) also there is currently no plan for any type of trade in program for current PS4 users but that could change.

They stated that the GPU is twice as powerful as standard PS4 and much faster. They did not say exactly how fast but that is was running at a higher clock speed while being much smaller than the original.

It will have a 4k blu ray player and will upscale games that are not natively 4k.

Also there was talk of some sort of VR lounge for the media player app which is supposed to be getting a substantial upgrade.

It was stated plainly and with no room for interpretation that there are developers that already have development kits for the PS4K and that they are making games that will directly target and take advantage of the higher specs of the PS4K. It was also stated that these games will in fact work for the PS4 but with considerable sacrifices made to performance.

It was also made very clear that current games would not be getting any type of performance upgrades by being played on the system and any benefits to older games would come via patch per game and per developer. When asked if this was going to happen the response was "Its a possibility but doubtful with the exception of a handful of games."
We were also given a list of games that will be available at launch that will directly take advantage of the PS4K where the differences are and I will quote him "Significant."

For the PSVR

Eve Valkyrie
Robinson
GT Sport

For the PS4K

Deep Down (Thought this was dead)
GOW4 (This was the exact abbreviation on the sheet I can only assume its god of war 4)

There were more games on the list but these are the ones that stood out to me.



That's all I can remember off the top of my head I'll see if I can get any more information.
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This is exactly what I said would be an issue with this route compared to how it's been. Vanilla PS4 will be put on the back burner in favor of the new hardware, thus lowering the value of the original system as compared to the 3 prior Playstation consoles since devs won't give a shit about getting every last frame they can or every bit of detail they can with the original. Whereas before, it was the one console (with the typical slim versions and very mild increases to hardware) and you knew devs would push the boundaries of the system to heights nobody would deem possible.

Now? Fuck it. New hardware, all efforts into that and for games on the old model? Just make sure it isn't complete garbage and ship it. However, with the amount of titles we've seen release at sub 30fps, I wouldn't be surprised to see that become the norm with the PS4 while PS4K gets all the attention.

Edit: I should say that while I don't approve for this move in the console market, I am excited to see what the games look like with the new hardware.
 
lebowski4ever said:
i hope they offer an upgrade path for existing ps4 owners...
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I doubt that Sony hasn't been looking at online feedback to the possibility of it happening and seen the trepidation it's been met with. My thinking is if Sony doesn't offer a proper upgrade then there's always going to be retailers who jump at the opportunity to offer extra credit towards the trade.
 
PS4 games are around 47 GB. I bet PS4K games will be around 70-80 GB if they are 4K or for the added features and res. Sony need to throw at least a 2TB HDD for it.
 
FloatOn said:
Once again it pays to jump into the console game late. If at all. I feel sorry for early adopters.
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Early adopters like me will have gotten 3 years and hundreds of hours out of the PS4. One could argue you missed out!

Now, if I'd just bought a PS4, that'd be different.
 
meanspartan said:
That's exactly what I feel. This is arrogant 1st Place Sony right here, making their "triumphant" return.

I hate this move. I'm happy for everyone excited about it, good for you. But for me this really blows. If its confirmed, I'm cancelling my PSVR preorder. There is no way OG Ps4 VR will be supported for long if Ps4.5 is a thing. Or if it is, I will have paid for the "lesser" version. No thanks. Fuck off with this bullshit Sony.
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I think Sony expects us to buy PSVR, and once we know how great VR is, and we see what kind of experiences are possible in the PS4k, we are going to be happy to take a 2nd/3rd job to buy it.
 
DigSCCP said:
Is anyone saying "your PS4 will run the game the same way as before" at least reading the OP?
Its clear on the OP that some devs will target the 4K and the OG will suffer "sacrifices".
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That isn't even close to true. The devs will "target" the PS4K in that they will make more use of its power. There is no doubt that the PS4K will have a default emulation mode that would match the PS4 specs exactly so current PS4 games would run unchanged. By targeting the PS4K the devs will allow the game to not run in that mode so they can use the extra power for things like better resolution, lighting, and other image quality enhancements. PS4 console games simply would not get access to that extra power and would behave as they always would have.

PS4K games looking better in no way at all means that PS4 games will look worse. Just think about that for moment. Nobody has ever said that PC games were making console games look worse. If anything people complain about the the exact opposite.

Developers are not going ignore the largest market which will be the PS4. The only time I could see a game being offered on the PS4K and not the PS4 would be if the game simply could never be done on the PS4 in the first place. I could see some PC ports, particularly VR games, being like this. However once again the PS4 is losing out on nothing here as it would never get those ports even if the PS4K didn't exist.
 
Hmmm, as long as it's easy to transfer over the 3 TB hard drive I currently have in my PS4 to this one and there is a reasonable price, I'm honestly open to this,
 
FloatOn said:
Once again it pays to jump into the console game late. If at all. I feel sorry for early adopters.
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Nah, no reason to feel sorry for us. I'm glad I bought my PS4 Day 1 and I'll be glad when I buy my PS4K Day 1. 3-3.25~ years is a little short imo, but 4 would be my preferred cycle anyways and that's close. Hopefully We get the PS5 in about 4~ from the PS4K.
 
Camp1nCarl said:
Well, considering the most recent example of this as Hyrule Warriors which left the millions of 3DS owners screwed compared to the incredibly small amount of N3DS owners. Their fears might be warranted...
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I may be misunderstanding you, as Hyrule Warriors came out on the original 3DS.
 
NullPointer said:
Yeah, and I didn't even get six years of use out of it.

A new OS came out, and app-makers stopped supporting the previous one, and iPad 1 owners couldn't upgrade the OS. Other apps updated and then ran like crap afterwards.

So I got maybe four years out of it, if that? That may seem like a nice amount of time in the Apple-verse, but it felt like an unsupported POS to me.
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That's what bugs me about the idevices I've owned over the years. It genuinely feels like they throttle down your old hardware with firmware updates once the new hardware releases. No doubt trying to nudge you to upgrade.
 
GameAddict411 said:
Sony greed is back and with full force... I am sure that won't backfire some day. I wouldn't be surprised if it fails miserably because what they are doing is a big fuck you for the early adopters. If they think they can get away with tablet/smartphone approach they won't do very well. Consoles are not essential to people and they will never be. What's going to push people to fork out another $400 or more? High FPS? High resolution? reality is that the average person doesn't give a fuck. The PS4 sold 36 mil units in two and half years. How much did the iPhone or the iPad sell in the same period?
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Is it really a big fuck you to early adopters? You bought the console knowing how powerful it was and what the price was. They are continuing to support it, and might be able to support it for longer now.

The only really beef that people have is that it might, and this is a might, result in worse ports than before. But who knows to what impact there might be. it might be significant, or it might still be 99% of what you would have got anyways. There will never be any way to prove it.
 
AstroNut325 said:
How is Sony throwing their current PS4 user base to the curb? A 2016 microwave doesn't throw the 2015 microwave buyers to the curve. Is Ford throwing the 2015 Mustang buyers to the curb by introducing the 2016 Mustang?
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By giving it's much larger install base second tier versions of games. Obviously nothing has happened yet but that's the scenario that comes to mind.
 
I hope this isnt true. I want games being made primarily with my PS4 hardware in mind, and not this PS4K stuff...

However, with PS4 as it is being so successful I still find hard to believe in such a thing. Guess I can just wait and see.
 
DietRob said:
Ah I see. Your right I didn't take into account various countries and the price fluctuations that can happen. However, you are wrong about not being able to 'ride this until next gen'. From all indications you will absolutely be able to so. I suspect that part of your reason for buying a PS4 instead of more computer parts is because you have interest in the offerings from their exclusive studios. Otherwise it wouldn't make sense for you to purchase it considering at the time of it's release it was already significantly less powerful than a PC built for gaming.

It will still serve it's purpose for you. I'm more interested in hearing from those who don't already own a gaming PC.
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Yes, I've bought my PS4 because of exclusives as you stated. The problem is, I don't think I'll even buy them if they do something similar to what Nintendo did with Hyrule Warriors Legends. I'm on mobile right now so I can't get the video, but there are comparisons on youtube that are easy to find. That's my fear, and the OP just confirmed that.

I'd rather skip a game if they do something like that, I did the same with Bayonetta (PS3) and many other games, even though I wanted to play them.
 
Camp1nCarl said:
Well, considering the most recent example of this as Hyrule Warriors which left the millions of 3DS owners screwed compared to the incredibly small amount of N3DS owners. Their fears might be warranted...
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Just going to quote myself.

EventHorizon said:
Hyrule Warriors Legends is a port from the more powerful Wii U system. If the new 3DS didn't exist all you would get would be the "complete garbage on regular 3DS". Also note that Hyrule Warriors Legends released 5 years after the initial release of the 3DS. That is the equivalent of a generation anyway. For example the Xbox 360 released only 4 years after the original Xbox.

Just like with the hysteria over the PS4K, this was interpreted all wrong. It wasn't that the original 3DS got short changed. It was that the original 3DS was lucky to get the port at all and was probably only done due to the similarities between the 2 versions of the 3DS. Without the newer 3DS it is unlikely that the original 3DS would have ever gotten the port at all.
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Jimmy Stav said:
This is how I feel about it, more or less. I've only had my PS4 since December and I can fully acknowledge that most games run like shit. It isn't like a PS4k will compromise all of the slick optimization happening on the current system.
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You're probably playing the wrong games then. 70% of the top 10 best selling PS4 games at retail last year run at 60fps, and the vast majority of download-only games also run at 60fps.
 
I guess I'll wait until next year to get a PS4. There's no point getting one now when a better version will be out in less than a year.
 
Xander Crews said:
Early adopters like me will have gotten 3 years and hundreds of hours out of the PS4. One could argue you missed out!

Now, if I'd just bought a PS4, that'd be different.
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And a lot of people did this past holiday season. How do they feel when they hear about this? It's different when we are at the end of the lifespan and a new console is around the corner. But people bought Ps4s in the last few months reasonably expecting at least 2-3 years more of a current console. And no, getting ports of games that target Ps4.5 is not the same, people didn't buy Ps4 thinking they'd have a gimped experience so soon.

I don't understand why people on here are so quick to be like

"So what!? You'll still get games on Ps4 it doesn't affect it at all!"

As if we didn't only just recently finish off a cross gen era filled to the brim with shit Ps3 and 360 ports of current gen games.

People who bought a Ps4 in the last few months bought into years of Cross-Gen quality and didn't even know it lol.

I hope Sony reconsiders this.
 
Chezzymann said:
And ran terribly compared to the new 3DS version.
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Yeah but that was because the 3DS simply couldn't handle the game. Nintendo didn't focus on the N3DS to its detriment. The N3DS version already looked like a completely different game than the Wii U version, and they simply couldn't cut the game down any further.
 
I think the PS4 will be just fine. The increased specs are for running UHD player, upscaling to 4K, and PSVR. I don't expect to see any games actually running at 4K. It will all be about the upscaling capability.

Also, think about a $200 PS4 as a result. It will be the PS2 all over again. Not a terrible move at all if I'm reading it correctly. I could be wrong, though.
 
For those wishing this fail, God bless you. My outlook is very simple, I'm on board for PS4K, and if I get 2 or maybe 3 years out of PS4K. I'm cool with that as long as it offers over a hundred or so Standard and VR games at a quality level.
 
meanspartan said:
And a lot of people did this past holiday season. How do they feel when they hear about this? It's different when we are at the end of the lifespan and a new console is around the corner. But people bought Ps4s in the last few months reasonably expecting at least 2-3 years more of a current console. And no, getting ports of games that target Ps4.5 is not the same, people didn't buy Ps4 thinking they'd have a gimped experience so soon.

I don't understand why people on here are so quick to be like

"So what!? You'll still get games on Ps4 it doesn't affect it at all!"

As if we didn't only just recently finish off a cross gen era filled to the brim with shit Ps3 and 360 ports of current gen games.

People who bought a Ps4 in the last few months bought into years of Cross-Gen quality and didn't even know it lol.

I hope Sony reconsiders this.
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No way they'll go back on it now. The best we can hope for is a good GameStop promo for $200 credit or so trade in towards a PS4K.
 
David Ricardo said:
I'm saying quite the opposite. I expect developers to choose 1440p ultra graphics instead of 4k medium, if given the option.

Basically, I don't believe this console is about 4k at all. That's just sugar coating so people can think "well, I don't have a 4k tv, if the PS4k is only for 4k PS4 games it doesn't affect me".
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The advantage PSVR has is price. $500 vs. $600+PC for Oculus. While buying PSVR and another Ps4 may still be cheaper than Oculus and a PC, it gets close enough to make me pause. If I have to spend $900, I may as well spend $1000/$1100 to get the better Oculus experience by buying the Rift and spending about $500 on a nice Graphics Card upgrade for my PC.
 
I don't see the big problem with this. Multi-plat games are currently facing the same issues, where PC's are twice (or more) times more powerful than PS4 or Xbone. Having games play on both PS4 and PS4K will be no new issue..
 
Protann said:
Look at this thread. People here are okay with it, and can't wait to let Sony drain their bank accounts with new incremental consoles every 3 years.
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I usually can't stand the latter years of a console generation, so this is perfect for me. Instead of the PS4 collecting dust for 3 years and only getting used for the rare killer exclusive I get to sell it and play with decent graphics for 3 more years.

Pretty much the same reason I don't keep my phones for 6 years either.

I say bring it.
 
Maintenance said:
Yes, I've bought my PS4 because of exclusives as you stated. The problem is, I don't think I'll even buy them if they do something similar to what Nintendo did with Hyrule Warriors Legends. I'm on mobile right now so I can't get the video, but there are comparisons on youtube that are easy to find. That's my fear, and the OP just confirmed that.
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I'm not a game developer but I know there are quite a few developers that post here on GAF. Have any of them chimed in on this narrative that games are going to start performing considerably worse on PS4 now that there could be a more powerful system coming?

I'm having a hard time buying into this idea that a PS4 isn't even going to be worth owning because everything is going to start running like shit.
 
If the info about sacrifices are true then I am ditching console gaming outside of Nintendo (depending on what the NX is). I have a gaming PC... I don't care enough about Sony exclusives to have to enter into an update cycle.
 
Kssio_Aug said:
I hope this isnt true. I want games being made primarily with my PS4 hardware in mind, and not this PS4K stuff...

However, with PS4 as it is being so successful I still find hard to believe in such a thing. Guess I can just wait and see.
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Devs would not abandon the larger install base for a comparatively meagre increase.
 
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