I can't imagine having to wade through the minefield of multiple different international ratings boards. That sounds like one one hell of a nightmare if you're making anything that isn't vanilla.
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Western Localisation Of Tokyo Mirage Sessions #FE Features Costume And Age Changes
- Thread starter Storm Chamber
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I can't imagine having to wade through the minefield of multiple different international ratings boards. That sounds like one one hell of a nightmare if you're making anything that isn't vanilla.
At the very least with Wii U homebrew being a thing we can look forward to an uncensor patch in the future. Because this looks like 4kids level of fuckery.
I'd suggest to anyone thats not a fan of these changes to setup your Wii U with homebrew asap, while its still available on the latest firmware and stupidly easy to do.
I'd suggest to anyone thats not a fan of these changes to setup your Wii U with homebrew asap, while its still available on the latest firmware and stupidly easy to do.
That's not surprising in light of the changes Squenix made to DQ8 when it came to Jessica and Red's outfits. CERO seems to be really hawkish about family-friendly content.
KirbYuuYuu
Member
I wouldn't go that far. There's still Japanese elements in there.
Pancake Mix
Copied someone else's pancake recipe
CERO A has gotten stricter, yeah.
Might be why Tharja's trophy was removed from Smash 3DS too, worldwide.
Yeah, I can see why that would be a stickler for any ratings board, given the "accuracy" of how it looked in game from the ESRB leaked images and being able to look at it from any angle.
I dont think applying a patch is going far at all.
edit: oh i think you're talking about the 4kids comment. Lol
Palculator
Unconfirmed Member
I believe their comment was regarding the "4Kids level of fuckery", not the patch. As in, 4Kids removing all traces of Japan in their localisation, whereas this game still retains plenty of them.
shadow2810
Member
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=slEH7k2ZTxU
"Feel" PV with editted outfit.
Also Tsubasa is still showing cleavage in her Carnage form at 1:11, make me wondering why they decided to change one but keep the other ¯\_(ツ
_/¯
"Feel" PV with editted outfit.
Also Tsubasa is still showing cleavage in her Carnage form at 1:11, make me wondering why they decided to change one but keep the other ¯\_(ツ
_/¯bishopcruz
Member
Things have gotten stricter after Bill 156. That thing added one hell of a chilling effect to media in Japan.
We should at least be happey that overall we have far less censorship than japan does. If I lived there I would be livid about changes to games like the Witcher. Hell they can't even get an uncensored MGSV, and Japan is that game's country of origin.
Yeah, a lot of Japanese games get censored for violence in their own country. Ni-oh is a recent example of not having decapitations/dismemberments in the Japanese version.
Palculator
Unconfirmed Member
Same with Nioh, as I recently found out. When I saw heads flying off whilst playing the demo my first thought was about possible German censorship too, lol. But doesn't seem like that will be the case. To be fair, I always understood the averse reaction to violence more than to sexuality and thus could see why it's being censored here, but I've made it pretty clear that I'd rather have no censorship in art at all.
Pancake Mix
Copied someone else's pancake recipe
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=slEH7k2ZTxU
"Feel" PV with editted outfit.
Also Tsubasa is still showing cleavage in her Carnage form at 1:11, make me wondering why they decided to change one but keep the other ¯_(ツ
Already posted.
Yeah, it does look like Tsubasa is imagining herself with larger boobs. My guess is that someone put their foot down for her Pegasus Knight outfit and decided it would stay.
Wild guess: Tsubasa in that outfit for Smash NX?
bishopcruz
Member
And nudity simply isn't allowed in any console game. Period. It makes me wonder if part of the reason we have all this creepy "almost" nudity is simply because its the only option.
The nudity thing though is, if I had to guess a relic of the Saturn/PS1 era where the console manufacturers made heavy restrictions to avoid ero-games coming to their systems.
shadow2810
Member
I missed the post then, my bad.
Psycho_Mantis
Banned
I'll admit I don't see much point in that change. The costume changes though? Still fail to see how these changes are putting people off the game.
Is it able to keep the same effect? Were the original costumes that skimpy?
I'm not sure what you're asking.
-shadow-
Member
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=slEH7k2ZTxU
"Feel" PV with editted outfit.
Also Tsubasa is still showing cleavage in her Carnage form at 1:11, make me wondering why they decided to change one but keep the other ¯\_(ツ
I actually like the edited top, but you can see that the removed shadows on her pelvic have been drawn out terribly, especially when she starts dancing on the top of the building (also, serious safety hazard right there!). They clip in and out of existence every time the shadows of her arms are cast on her body. It's a bit weird to see how far they went with the localisation some really odd things. Well that and the fact that whoever's on the horse has some serious cleavage...
Psycho_Mantis
Banned
Despite the change is the dungeon still able to convey the same message/atmosphere?Second question is because for once I see that as a reason for the characters to have revealing designs so I'm asking if the initial designs were that tasteless?
Good call. The system is dead at this point, may as well homebrew it like I did with the Wii at the end.
Oh... you might want to read up on some of the changes that were made to this game in the thread; the OP hasn't been updated at all with this stuff.
From the dungeon in question:
I've been avoiding spoilers, but apparently one of the focal points of the dungeon is about a perverted paparazzi who's been out to take shots of gravure idols, and one of the pivotal moments is Tsubasa overcoming her shame and posing for him in a swimsuit. That has been fundamentally changed in the Western version, up to her animations when she's posing in her new clothes.
Despite the swimsuit DLC being removed and removed in that scene, she's still wearing it for certain segments like her special attack:
I'm not sure "tasteless" really fits anything we've seen from the original game that has been modified.
Palculator
Unconfirmed Member
The point is clear, in both of them. You've also made it clear you lean in favour of those changes, and that's fine, but I maintain that this goes beyond the purview of what's normally considered localisation. I don't want to act like an armchair sociologist, but our media doesn't really give me the impression that slightly revealing clothes would be so incompatible with the targets for this release that alterations to those would count as "localising" them. Hell, we have nudity in kid's films here in Germany, so at the very least grant me that for the German release this does not count as localisation at all (presuming we'll get the same version which seems highly likely.)
I understand and agree that localisation isn't just about translating the script into another language, but the other changes here are regarding things that don't really relate to conveying the original to another audience. Consider the dungeon photo changes, for example. If this was about culture differences alone and the fear that idol culture isn't something Western audiences can relate to, they could've altered the photos to be more representative of the modelling and pop industry specific to those cultures so that it has the same effect to them as it does to Japanese natives familiar with idol culture. But they didn't, they covered them up to be less revealing, which isn't something our models and stars actually do. It's very clearly something Nintendo of America opted to censor to avoid subject matter they specifically want to avoid, not an effort to convey the product as it was made to another audience.
KonradLaw
Member
Palculator
Unconfirmed Member
Well, I don't know the actual paperwork, but it's a crossover using Fire Emblem which they do own the rights to, so they definitely have some say in its release and I'd presume the Wii U exclusive release was a clause when use of the brand was first authorised.
If they wanted to make it to US standards they would have sex tapes rolling in the background. People like to act like Idols are somehow foreign to us when they are not. What do people think Kim K and her clan are? Disney channel has been churning them out for years now as well. It's the hypocrisy I dont get.
Palculator
Unconfirmed Member
Sex tapes, almost naked dancers on stage in suggestive poses, "accidental" nip slips and getting off your tits on as many drugs as you can mix into two bottles of whiskey and whateverthefuck else our so very formidable pop idol industry gets up to these days. What was that thing where Lady Gaga hired a girl to vomit food dyes all over her on stage?
That's really the absolute worst part of it. The part that really makes me feel like I'm being treated like an idiot by Nintendo. Everything in TMS is extremely tame by the West's own Entertainment Industry's standards. Extremely tame. None of it comes remotely close to what our own "idols" have worn as teenagers themselves on broadcast TV and at events that kids go to. Just look at everything and everyone since Brittney and Christina and they weren't even the start of it. We go back at least as far as Marilyn Monroe.
Astral Dog
Member
Super skimpy.
Oh yeah, and that makes the Scenario change even more baffling. Being uncomfortable about getting her photos taken in a swimsuit? Hah, if they were doing this on the US Industry, it'd be about her getting raped and having it video taped by said photographer (hi Law & Order SVU).
KirbYuuYuu
Member
I'm going to go on a limb and say that I think the people who criticize the idol aspects don't exactly like it here either.
That is my guess.
That is my guess.
Kayo Police
Member
Is it against TOS to discuss the Wii U homebrew thing for unpatching games?
If not I would like to know more.
If not I would like to know more.
Palculator
Unconfirmed Member
Hopefully. But I didn't mean to say they endorsed it, it was just about how the changes to the aspects drawn from idol culture don't count as localising said elements to our culture, far from it.
Only if you use it for illegal means, because that would be illegal. But there is a thread specifically for Wii U homebrew here, I'm sure they can help you out.
It does, and it's surprising to find out that it was made exclusively for the localized version of the game. It's just that I don't know if it fits the context or the other characters' reactions anymore, and it's pretty much impossible to not think of the original version when it will come up as I actually play the game.
Definitely something I'd rather have her wear in battle than the swimsuit, though.
Unfortunately due to how it looks it *completely* changes the context of the scenario and changes the character, which is bad.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=slEH7k2ZTxU
"Feel" PV with editted outfit.
Also Tsubasa is still showing cleavage in her Carnage form at 1:11, make me wondering why they decided to change one but keep the other ¯\_(ツ
Why did they remove the Japanese text? Now there's all this awkward empty space in the cutscene.
Mr Waluigi
Banned
Both this and Fatal Frame wanted to make a point about idol culture in Japan.
I don't know why they decided to change FF costumes that were too "sexy", but I can see why they'd censor Tokyo Mirage. Fire Emblem has become increasingly popular in the Occident, hasn't it? I can see why they've censored Awakening and Fates and this, since otherwise it would slow down the series' increasing success over here.
Do we know if it's Nintendo's fault, or Atlus', or both? I see everyone attacking Nintendo about it but it looks like there are too many changes to be something that Nintendo alone has decided.
I don't know why they decided to change FF costumes that were too "sexy", but I can see why they'd censor Tokyo Mirage. Fire Emblem has become increasingly popular in the Occident, hasn't it? I can see why they've censored Awakening and Fates and this, since otherwise it would slow down the series' increasing success over here.
Do we know if it's Nintendo's fault, or Atlus', or both? I see everyone attacking Nintendo about it but it looks like there are too many changes to be something that Nintendo alone has decided.
shadow2810
Member
Nintendo.
1. Precedent. Consider everything Atlus has released up until now. Consider Persona 4: Dancing All Night.
2. Nintendo's statement:
This is a game that explicitly takes place in Japan though, it shouldn't be an anomaly to see it in this game. The English subs are there regardless, too.
orthodoxy1095
Banned
Without even a remote amount of context, that new costume looks miles better.
I do wonder what the background to the swimsuit is. I can't imagine there's a "good" justification, but I do wonder.
J
Jotamide
Unconfirmed Member
What I find the most offensive in this whole situation is how NoA is bent on censoring bikinis, cleavage, and anything that remotely accentuates the female form. I would have no issues if they were removing creepy shit but this is basically saying "we're ashamed that the idols of TMS are so provocative". Like it is not politically correct to have attractive characters in media anymore. Treehouse in not localizing this game, they are butchering it a this point. I generally hate fanservice in games/anime but this 4Kids levels of ridiculous.
orthodoxy1095
Banned
That much thigh and lace isn't consistent with an E10? Sheesh.
dakkumauji
Member
they are barely marketing this as a fire emblem game to the point you have to dig to see that it has something to do with the series
Palculator
Unconfirmed Member
To me, as a third party here, it would appear that this post has been written without having thought of the children.
Robert at Zeboyd Games
Banned
Here's the description on the official page at Nintendo.com:
Lots of mentioning of Fire Emblem there (in fact, noticeably more FE mentions than SMT).
Okay, this is now officially a joke. It has to be. NoA has to be intentionally going over every single aspect of this game that might even be considered the least bit sexual and removing it. They're putting more work/attention into making all of these unnecessary changes than the things that really matter (dub, anyone?).Found another edit being discussed, apparently they removed the pelvic shading on Tsubasa in cutscenes. When this comes out, it's going to make for one hell of a game of spot the difference.
NA on top, Japan on the bottom.
NA: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XNiIJtWcMIg
JP: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VVOh85A1lLg
This is just frustrating, what exactly is their thought process? I'm...I'm just confused over this whole thing. We can have swimsuits (of characters over the age of 18), we can't have slight boss cleavage (her breasts aren't exactly hanging out in the original Japanese version, it's just a bit of cleavage), and now we can't have pelvic bone shading. What's next? Are they going to edit the back of the female characters' necks? You know, 'cause someone somewhere might find that sexually attractive.
Get your priorities straight, Nintendo. :/
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