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[Suikoguy]

She may very well be a fine rep, but she's being primaried by someone who is arguably a better rep who's more in line with Bernie's policies.

Seems like wasted resources, but whatever. Her position on payday loans is sad, but she seems very progressive otherwise. Why not focus on candidates that are not?

I'd be all for Sanders pushing for a new DNC chair. Her strategy for 2014 was a disaster. You don't run away from what you accomplished.

 

[Sinoox]

Even Hillary supporters should get behind this. This woman has not been doing her job.

 

[Suikoguy]

You realize that third parties receive additional funding if they are voted for by 5% or more of the election? This leads to more funding for more campaigns.

Watch the video I posted in one of my replies to you:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s7tWHJfhiyo

You don't seem to understand that core problem.

Even Hillary supporters should get behind this. This woman has not been doing her job.

Yet another who is conflating her being a Rep and her Performance as DNC. See the post right before yours.

 

[AntraxSuicide]

She may very well be a fine rep, but she's being primaried by someone who is arguably a better rep who's more in line with Bernie's policies.

Not if he gets blown out. By definition, that means the people in her district don't feel he represents them.

 

[Knox]

In what way has the DNC shit on the Sanders campaign?

The only logical thing I can think of is scheduling so few debates. But the DNC gave into his demands for more debates and nearly doubled the schedule very early on. And the debates haven't exactly helped Bernie. In fact, with his inability to modulate his message, the debates only contributed to the validity of Hillary's claim that he's a one-issue candidate.

I can't think of any realistic thing the DNC has done to shit on Bernie Sanders that doesn't amount to some attempt to excuse him being handily defeated.

They gave them more debates after he started winning, before that they were happy to hide the debates on Saturday nights and opposite NFL playoff games. It's pretty obvious they wanted to sweep the primary under the rug from the get go.

A few days ago DWS said Sanders' denouncement of threats and alleged thrown chairs from some of his supporters wasn't strong enough. I don't know what else he's supposed to say. To me it seemed like she was trying to paint his supporters in the same vein as Trump supporters. I feel like what they really want is for him to come out and completely absolve the DNC of any wrongdoing in Nevada or elsewhere so his supporters can fall in line.

To be honest I'm not as informed on current goings on as I should be. I'm a Bernie supporter but I've recognized the fact that he's been done for some time. I probably shouldn't have made the initial post but since I've gotten a few responses I didn't want to make it seem like a total drive by.

 

[Frozenprince]

that's fine, im not the only one who thinks it so whatever

Yeah and a not insignificant portion of the population thinks the moon landing was fake too.

 

[Kusagari]

Seems like wasted resources, but whatever. Her position on payday loans is sad, but she seems very progressive otherwise. Why not focus on candidates that are not?

I'd be all for Sanders pushing for a new DNC chair. Her strategy for 2014 was a disaster. You don't run away from what you accomplished.

Why do you not want a progressive in office who will actually fight for other progressives and not keep people like Ros-Lehtinen in office?

 

[collige]

Seems like wasted resources, but whatever. Her position on payday loans is sad, but she seems very progressive otherwise. Why not focus on candidates that are not?

I'd be all for Sanders pushing for a new DNC chair. Her strategy for 2014 was a disaster. You don't run away from what you accomplished.

All he did was answer a question in an interview. What resources were wasted?

Well, it's up to the people in her district to decide if he's a better rep. Just because he's inline with Bernie doesn't make him better for them.

By that logic no one should ever endorse any candidate not from their district.

 

[Suikoguy]

A few days ago DWS said Sanders' denouncement of threats and alleged thrown chairs from some of his supporters wasn't strong enough. I don't know what else he's supposed to say. To me it seemed like she was trying to paint his supporters in the same vein as Trump supporters. I feel like what they really want is for him to come out and completely absolve the DNC of any wrongdoing in Nevada or elsewhere so his supporters can fall in line.

You a fan of those who say women who look at other men deserve to be cheated on?

That's what Sanders did, he denounced the tactics, then deflected the blame.

Oh and Nevada did nothing wrong.

"There’s no clear evidence the state party "hijacked" the process or ignored "regular procedure.""

 

[Suikoguy]

Why do you not want a progressive in office who will actually fight for other progressives and not keep people like Ros-Lehtinen in office?

Err, i'm not familiar with what you are referring too. Sorry.

All he did was answer a question in an interview. What resources were wasted?

Depends on if he fundraises for him. You do have a point, I guess his "support" does not automatically translate into resources.
Edit: You can also see what Damaniel wrote in the post after mine. I don't think DWS is a good candidate for being primaried. You will never get anything done if each candidate has to be meet a purity test.

 

[Damaniel]

I'm not the biggest fan of DWS, but isn't the point of downticket support to get Republican seats replaced with Democratic ones? I think that would be a better use of time and resources than supporting Democrats that are more 'pure' to replace existing Democrats. But then again, what else would I expect from Bernie 'Bern it all down' Sanders?

 

[brainchild]

DWS has been unopposed in several races and hasn't faced a primary opponent since first winning election in 2006. She has handily won all of her races for reelection and her constituents seem to be generally happy with her representation. So what is this, then? She obviously fairly represents the views and ideals of the party. So instead, because she was unfair to poh Bwernie, she's going to get primaried by the Green Tea Party candidate? Yeah, DWS is a real piece of shit DNC Chair, but advocate for her replacement. What is this primary shit?

Hmm, but nope, HillGAF is so in the tank for Hillary and are establishment shills, boohoohoo.

Bernie pushed for someone to primary against Obama, despite Obama not personally snubbing Bernie in any way. I wonder if there's more to this story than Bernie throwing temper tantrums? Many he just has certain convictions about the general conduct of politicians?

Sanders walked into a Sunday interview with this in his pocket. Clinton is on Meet the Press tomorrow and this is his way of countering that. He is picking a fight at a time where he needs to keep his base fired up. He knows that Canova has no chance and he damn well knows that his weighing in on the matter won't move the needle at all.

What is disgusting about being critical of this strategy?

Because the critique is disingenuous, IMO. Nobody gives a shit about Bernie's endorsements, and it's not going to affect party unity in any way. This is just another opportunity to shit on Bernie because HillGAF is still salty that Bernie's going all the way to the convention.

No bubble here. I know he's been on this horse for a while. My point is that the overt endorsement of her primary opponent as the one real moment of down ticket support you're going to throw out all primary, coupled with reiterating his comments about her performance as chair of the DNC, just a few weeks before the last primaries, sure as hell isn't the act of someone interested in unity.

It's dumb. It only hurts his bargaining position with Clinton, the DNC, the convention, and the party platform.

I don't think he particularly cares about that because I think he wants to be the source of a misguided attempt at re-creating the 1968 convention. He's a professional protester and knows nothing else. This is him drying out the kindling to make sure there will be enough friction come the convention to spark a good fire. That is also incredibly dumb, destructive, and likely going to result in something that is actually dangerous. But then Bernie Sanders has never let doing what's right get in the way of his inquisition and now he's got a good sized pack of prosecutors behind him.

His endorsement is completely inconsequential. You're effectively concern trolling.

 

[royalan]

They gave them more debates after he started winning, before that they were happy to hide the debates on Saturday nights and opposite NFL playoff games. It's pretty obvious they wanted to sweep the primary under the rug from the get go.

1) Bernie hasn't been winning since New Hampshire. Hillary has maintained a firm lead since then, so I don't think that quite answers it. I mean, even Hillary was on board with there being more debates and town halls. She excels at them.
2) If the DNC wanted to sweep this primary under the rug, they would have advocated shortening the primary schedule, not elongating it compared to 2008.

A few days ago DWS said Sanders' denouncement of threats and alleged thrown chairs from some of his supporters wasn't strong enough. I don't know what else he's supposed to say. To me it seemed like she was trying to paint his supporters in the same vein as Trump supporters. I feel like what they really want is for him to come out and completely absolve the DNC of any wrongdoing in Nevada or elsewhere so his supporters can fall in line.

To be honest I'm not as informed on current goings on as I should be. I'm a Bernie supporter but I've recognized the fact that he's been done for some time. I probably shouldn't have made the initial post but since I've gotten a few responses I didn't want to make it seem like a total drive by.

For starters, Bernie could have condemned the actions of his supporters in Nevada without attaching a "BUT they kind of asked for it. [insert debunked version of the events pulled straight from Reddit here]". What his supporters did was unacceptable and, yes, potentially dangerous. The second thing he could have done was not tie those events to the crusade he's had against DWS since before this primary even started.

 

[brainchild]

1) Bernie hasn't been winning since New Hampshire. Hillary has maintained a firm lead since then, so I don't think that quite answers it. I mean, even Hillary was on board with there being more debates and town halls. She excels at them.
2) If the DNC wanted to sweep this primary under the rug, they would have advocated shortening the primary schedule, not elongating it compared to 2008.



For starters, Bernie could have condemned the actions of his supporters in Nevada without attaching a "BUT they kind of asked for it. [insert debunked version of the events pulled straight from Reddit here]". What his supporters did was unacceptable and, yes, potentially dangerous. The second thing he could have done was not tie those events to the crusade he's had against DWS since before this primary even started.

There is exactly ZERO evidence that any of the delegates in Nevada had anything to do with the harassment that ensued after the convention.

In fact, all current evidence points to people from other states harassing Lange. So, two separate issues needed to be addressed, and they were.

 

[Suikoguy]

There is exactly ZERO evidence that any of the delegates in Nevada had anything to do with the harassment that ensued after the convention.

In fact, all current evidence points to people from other states harassing Lange. So, two separate issues needed to be addressed, and they were.

Once again you discount the conduct of those AT the convention. I'm sure it won't be the last.

 

[manakel]

Consequently, I wish people would stop with this toxic snark (on both the Sanders and Clinton sides), and just show up to fucking vote. Better yet, actually try to engage in some sort of political process that actually deals with the lived political realities of people, you know actual politics. It's this sort of insulated, myopic, horse race focused bullshit that leads so many people to think this shit doesn't matter in the first place. Stay focused on the actual politics of day to day life and maybe these apathetic people (who Bernie Sanders only begins to reach the tip of) might actually start engaging in political processes.

Thank you for bringing rationalization into this thread. Unfortunately, most people will just skip over it and continue to snipe back and forth with one another.

The responses in this thread clearly demonstrate that HillGAF is prepared to oppose anything that Bernie promotes, considering that ejecting DWS would be a net positive for the party.

This is all kinds of pathetic, and that cult of a community is NO DIFFERENT than the Bernie supporters on reddit, despite how much they like to mock them.

Disgusting.

Exactly this. Regardless of whatever Bernie would do, people would still find fault in it and find some reason as to why he continues to be a "salty, petty old man" that is throwing a temper tantrum.

I also find it abhorrent that people throw around claims that people don't care about minorities, are racist/misogynists/anti-lgbt if they aren't voting for Hillary. Trust me, there isn't an ounce of my being that could vote for Trump. However, casually throwing around serious claims like that and painting everyone with a large brush is disgusting. And people should be ashamed for it.

It's unfortunate that so many people lack the basic understanding that attacking someone for their views/beliefs isn't going to magically make them align with yours. If anything, it's going to push them farther away.

 

[brainchild]

Once again you discount the conduct of those AT the convention. I'm sure it won't be the last.

The conduct at the convention doesn't even remotely compare to what happened afterward.

Speaking of, here's Barbara Boxer's conduct at the convention as she "fleed in fear of her life".

 

[Suikoguy]

The conduct at the convention doesn't even remotely compare to what happened afterward.

Speaking of, Here's Barbara Boxer's conduct at the convention as she "fleed in fear of her life".

You are just like Sanders in deflecting blame. Are we sure you are not him?

 

[Outdoor Miner]

Bernie could have done so much with his campaign and the enthusiasm he has garnered. There are so many vulnerable Republican seats in the House and Senate this year as a result of the Trump nomination. Would have been the closest thing to that revolution he so often speaks of.

A complete fucking tragedy.

 

[BlastProcessing]

Bernie pushed for someone to primary against Obama, despite Obama not personally snubbing Bernie in any way. I wonder if there's more to this story than Bernie throwing temper tantrums? Many he just has certain convictions about the general conduct of politicians?



Because the critique is disingenuous, IMO. Nobody gives a shit about Bernie's endorsements, and it's not going to affect party unity in any way. This is just another opportunity to shit on Bernie because HillGAF is still salty that Bernie's going all the way to the convention.



His endorsement is completely inconsequential. You're effectively concern trolling.

Of course people give a shit about his endorsements. There is a reason ABC used this as their teaser for the interview. So it obviously got attention. It also has obvious consequences. In no way is discussing it disingenuous.

Edit: I see I was too late in this response. See you at the crossroads, friend.

 

[Dubbedinenglish]

Bernie could have done so much with his campaign and the enthusiasm he has garnered. There are so many vulnerable Republican seats in the House and Senate this year as a result of the Trump nomination. Would have been the closest thing to that revolution he so often speaks of.

A complete fucking tragedy.

He could've endorsed plenty of Dem primary candidates to find more like minded people to build a coalition in he DNC and actually moved the needle to the left. He could've done a lot more but again proves the "revolution" is limited to himself.

 

[LosDaddie]

If you actually support the Dem party, then there's no doubt you want her gone as well. She's been disastrous

 

[eBay Huckster]

If you actually support the Dem party, then there's no doubt you want her gone as well. She's been disastrous

i want her gone from the DNC position, which 1) primarying her won't do shit about and 2) is being resolved at the end of this year anyway

 

[Suikoguy]

If you actually support the Dem party, then there's no doubt you want her gone as well. She's been disastrous

How has she been disastrous in the capacity of being a house rep?

 

[Knox]

1) Bernie hasn't been winning since New Hampshire. Hillary has maintained a firm lead since then, so I don't think that quite answers it. I mean, even Hillary was on board with there being more debates and town halls. She excels at them.
2) If the DNC wanted to sweep this primary under the rug, they would have advocated shortening the primary schedule, not elongating it compared to 2008.



For starters, Bernie could have condemned the actions of his supporters in Nevada without attaching a "BUT they kind of asked for it. [insert debunked version of the events pulled straight from Reddit here]". What his supporters did was unacceptable and, yes, potentially dangerous. The second thing he could have done was not tie those events to the crusade he's had against DWS since before this primary even started.

1) I just meant that he was winning states, not winning overall. Before that I don't think many people thought Hillary would have any competition at all.
2) I guess. Seems hard to believe they'd pick Saturday nights as a great time to get their candidates in front of an audience, but whatever.

I think you're right in the way he should have responded to the Nevada stuff. He should have kept the denouncement as a single statement, then if he wanted to talk about whatever lead up to it that could be it's own thing.

 

[pigeon]

How has she been disastrous in the capacity of being a house rep?

The payday loan bill seems kind of problematic. I'm not super happy with DWS's actions on that front. She has apparently voted for a few bills that would block or limit the CFPB. Admittedly so have a lot of other Democrats but that doesn't necessarily say anything.

http://www.politifact.com/florida/s...-wasserman-schultz-attacked-bank-donations-a/

That said, she is not my representative.

 

[Suikoguy]

The payday loan bill seems kind of problematic. I'm not super happy with DWS's actions on that front. She has apparently voted for a few bills that would block or limit the CFPB. Admittedly so have a lot of other Democrats but that doesn't necessarily say anything.

http://www.politifact.com/florida/s...-wasserman-schultz-attacked-bank-donations-a/

That said, she is not my representative.

Good, this should be brought up.
But if one issue is enough to be primaried, we will be spending way too much money on constant primaries.

 

[Elfforkusu]

Not really.

Dude is burning every bridge with the DNC he can. That's not how you change things in this country.

He's running an insurgent campaign on one of the major parties of a two party system, attempting to change the direction of that party. Just by running and opposing Hillary at all, he's burned some bridges with the DNC.

One of the methods to change the direction of the party is to change the candidates that represent it. As in, endorsing Democratic replacements to Democratic representatives. This is exactly what I want him to be doing now that he's (effectively) out of the running for nominee.

My only issue is that he's not endorsing more people! Just the head of the DNC comes across as sour grapes, and (until proven otherwise) it probably is.

 

[HariKari]

He's running an insurgent campaign on one of the major parties of a two party system, attempting to change the direction of that party. Just by running and opposing Hillary at all, he's burned some bridges with the DNC.

The DNC has become part of the problem.

 

[Suikoguy]

The DNC has become part of the problem.

Shaun King went off the deep end weeks ago. But thanks for sharing and not including any summary of the link you posted.

For Example: https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...is-winning-the-popular-vote-by-a-wide-margin/

 

[Kusagari]

Err, i'm not familiar with what you are referring too. Sorry.

The worst kept secret in Florida politics is how Debbie will do anything in her power to keep her Republican friends in office. Ros-Lehtinen is the biggest example representing a district that actually voted for Obama in 2012. And yet in 2012 she got an opponent who got absolutely zero support from the Democratic Party in the state and in 2014 the party didn't even try to find an opponent in both a gay-friendly district, there's a reason Ros-Lehtinen is one of the few Republicans who goes out of her way to speak about LGBT rights, and a district trending Democrat as a whole. Debbie goes out of her way whenever she can to praise Ros-Lehtinen in public and has actively tried to sabotage her opponents in the past, 2008 being the biggest example.

She's also done this in the past with the Diaz-Balart brothers.

 

[DR2K]

Debbie stole the cookie from the cookie jar

 

[kirblar]

Shaun King went off the deep end weeks ago. But thanks for sharing and not including any summary of the link you posted.

For Example: https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...is-winning-the-popular-vote-by-a-wide-margin/

King was always horrible, but it took people a long time to catch on.

 

[royalan]

The DNC has become part of the problem.

Shaun King should not be used as a measure for anything.

 

[Suikoguy]

The worst kept secret in Florida politics is how Debbie will do anything in her power to keep her Republican friends in office. Ros-Lehtinen is the biggest example representing a district that actually voted for Obama in 2012. And yet in 2012 she got an opponent who got absolutely zero support from the Democratic Party in the state and in 2014 the party didn't even try to find an opponent in both a gay-friendly district, there's a reason Ros-Lehtinen is one of the few Republicans who goes out of her way to speak about LGBT rights, and a district trending Democrat as a whole. Debbie goes out of her way whenever she can to praise Ros-Lehtinen in public and has actively tried to sabotage her opponents in the past, 2008 being the biggest example.

She's also done this in the past with the Diaz-Balart brothers.

Interesting, it appears like Obama nominated her. Should have kept Donna Brazile (I like her better anyway).
At the very least it appears to warrant more investigation. But it does sound a little like a conspiracy theory.

Oh and thanks for responding with that summary. It's something to consider for sure.

 

[Aylinato]

Hey if your "morals" are more important than civil rights and anything Sanders stands for you deserve to feel guilty

For the record,


If Bernie cared about civil rights he wouldn't be trashing Hillary like he is, she's the nominee get the fuck over the bridge already. He lost, he can't win, he needs to suck it up. If he cares about anything he cares about he'd stop and start supporting her vs trump instead of throwing hissy fits about blah blah blah. He's beat, he can't win, all he is doing is hurting his own ideology at this point, all progressive ideas are being hurt by him, if he called at all he'd stop. Unfortunately his ego is more important to him then his ideas about where America should progress, and he's just hurting his own values more staying in the race then supporting Clinton.

Essentially Bernie sanders is damaging to his own ideals because he's letting his inflated ego risk 30+ years of 2 Supreme Court justices, 8+ years of republicans presidents, and who 14+ years of redistricting for congress. Do you realize how fucking stupid he's been over all these issues! It's like he forgot the bigger picture because his ego got bruised since he lost.

He's running an insurgent campaign on one of the major parties of a two party system, attempting to change the direction of that party. Just by running and opposing Hillary at all, he's burned some bridges with the DNC.

One of the methods to change the direction of the party is to change the candidates that represent it. As in, endorsing Democratic replacements to Democratic representatives. This is exactly what I want him to be doing now that he's (effectively) out of the running for nominee.

My only issue is that he's not endorsing more people! Just the head of the DNC comes across as sour grapes, and (until proven otherwise) it probably is.

Oh sweet Jesus, an insurgent campaign that believes everything that he believes? Omg it's like Bernie thinks in a fantasy land where only he is correct.

Let me tell you what's actually happening, Bernie is in the party conveniently to push own personal agenda. Unfortunately for anyone who cares about that agenda he's let his ego dictate his responses to him losing epically.

One method to change is to slowly change things, but u fortunately bernies done nothing but scorched earth policy and tried creating a tea party within the Democratic Party. We don't want purity tests and he fails to understand how anything gets done on a political scale. He's ineffective in everything he's done as he's pissed off more people with his pettiness then convince that his ideas are better, and in fact has made more enemies in the Democratic Party then any allies, especially if this is is first endorsement for anything down ticket (hahahaha oh I'm losing lets oppose the chair because I'm losing not because he's a better candidate for that position, come on)

He isn't endorsing more people because he doesn't give a shit about down ticket elections he only cares about personal grudges and I'm ashamed of ever speaking any supporting words of him in the last 12 years because of his disregard for democracy (he's losing by 3 million votes but doesn't want to help the person who can push his agenda, grow up and act like an adult)

 

[Kusagari]

Interesting, it appears like Obama nominated her. Should have kept Donna Brazile (I like her better anyway).
At the very least it appears to warrant more investigation. But it does sound a little like a conspiracy theory.

Oh and thanks for responding with that summary. It's something to consider for sure.

I'm well aware of how much of a conspiracy theory it must sound to people who don't follow Florida politics closely. But I do because it directly impacts me. I actually am a constituent of Debbie's.

Here's an article from 2008 talking about how Debbie refused to support the opponents to Ros-Lehtinen and the Diaz brothers because she didn't want to "stab them in the back.":

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/03/19/AR2008031903410_3.html

 

[JP_]

more specifically, voting for a third party rather than mobilizing forces within one of the major parties such that they're dramatically more amenable to such a change is doing nothing

This is what Sanders is doing and it gets him a lot of flak on gaf because he's "not really a democrat."

 

[Suikoguy]

I'm well aware of how much of a conspiracy theory it must sound to people who don't follow Florida politics closely. But I do because it directly impacts me. I actually am a constituent of Debbie's.

Here's an article from 2008 talking about how Debbie refused to support the opponents to Ros-Lehtinen and the Diaz brothers because she didn't want to "stab them in the back.":

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/03/19/AR2008031903410_3.html

From your link:

"Liberal bloggers are irate that Wasserman Schultz, who co-chairs the Democratic Congressional Campaign Committee's Red-to-Blue program"

Could it just be misguided attempts at "converting" people? Such a program seems so pointless in this polarized climate...

 

[eBay Huckster]

This is what Sanders is doing and it gets him a lot of flak on gaf because he's "not really a democrat."

i mean, irrespective of whether i agree with what he's doing, as far as i can tell GAF is giving him shit for constantly attacking the exact people within the party he needs to work with

 

[mcfrank]

i mean, irrespective of whether i agree with what he's doing, as far as i can tell GAF is giving him shit for constantly attacking the exact people within the party he needs to work with

While simultaneously taking money from supporters by convincing them these same dnc super delegates with switch to him any day now.

 

[Kusagari]

From your link:

"Liberal bloggers are irate that Wasserman Schultz, who co-chairs the Democratic Congressional Campaign Committee's Red-to-Blue program"

Could it just be misguided attempts at "converting" people? Such a program seems so pointless in this polarized climate...

That program is still happening today. It's where the DNC finds districts they see as vulnerable and pour money in to try to turn them blue. Debbie was the chair of the committee for this back in 2008 and refused to support the challengers to those three candidates because of her personal ties with them.

 

[Aylinato]

This is what Sanders is doing and it gets him a lot of flak on gaf because he's "not really a democrat."

Bernie gets flak because he's acting like a sore loser, he's down 3 million votes bu saying the election has be rigged against him. He's said delegates should elect him over Clinton because he's what the people want (3 million less people want him). Anytime he loses democratically he blames the DNC for being corrupt instead of any of his own shortcomings. Instead of being an awesome leader like Barack Obama and being diplomatic he's half assed any sort of moment where he could of risen above the fray and instead been e aptly what he preached against.


He's become a parody of what his campaign is about and it disgusts me.

 

[JP_]

i mean, irrespective of whether i agree with what he's doing, as far as i can tell GAF is giving him shit for constantly attacking the exact people within the party he needs to work with

I mean, he gets shit for every conceivable reason, but a popular one (relating to mobilizing change within the party) is that he was an independent and shouldn't meddle in the democratic party's affairs.

Also, it's hard to change a party if you never criticize the party. Party shakeups aren't inherently bad. Tea party wasn't bad because it changed the GOP, it was bad because of how it changed the GOP. Debate the merits of the changes all you want, but I'm not a fan of this idea that you can't be honest and criticize your own party. A big reason why so many people hate politics is that they view both parties negatively -- when people say both parties are the same, you and I can point out why that's wrong, but I think what they're getting at is the connection to big money. That's why Sanders' message resonates.

 

[Suikoguy]

That program is still happening today. It's where the DNC finds districts they see as vulnerable and pour money in to try to turn them blue. Debbie was the chair of the committee for this back in 2008 and refused to support the challengers to those three candidates because of her personal ties with them.

Oh, that's worse...
Was not familiar with the Red to Blue program.

 

[Elfforkusu]

He isn't endorsing more people because he doesn't give a shit about down ticket elections he only cares about personal grudges [...]

We'll see about this, won't we? A lot of time before the elections.

Probably the less I say about the rest of your post, the better. I'll just say I disagree, and I think "falling in line" is exactly the problem with modern politics and why the country is in an increasingly shitty state. From there, it's just tactics. Do you try to move the Republicans, or try to move the Democrats?

 

[Aylinato]

We'll see about this, won't we? A lot of time before the elections.

Probably the less I say about the rest of your post, the better. I'll just say I disagree, and I think "falling in line" is exactly the problem with modern politics and why the country is in an increasingly shitty state. From there, it's just tactics. Do you try to move the Republicans, or try to move the Democrats?

It's a systematic two party system. It cannot be changed unless you change both parties and get them to agree. He hasn't done that, so he has to do what he can but unfortunately he's failing.

 

[excelsiorlef]

I also find it abhorrent that people throw around claims that people don't care about minorities, are racist/misogynists/anti-lgbt if they aren't voting for Hillary. Trust me, there isn't an ounce of my being that could vote for Trump. However, casually throwing around serious claims like that and painting everyone with a large brush is disgusting. And people should be ashamed for it.

It's unfortunate that so many people lack the basic understanding that attacking someone for their views/beliefs isn't going to magically make them align with yours. If anything, it's going to push them farther away.

The idea isn't that you are personally any of those things, just that if for whatever reason preventing someone (Trump) who is extremely all those things and would in fact encode discrimination on the basis of all those things further into law up to and including the Supreme Court (via nominating people who are those things) isn't enough of to motivate you to do what it takes (ie voting for the only viable person who can stop him) then frankly it becomes clear that the level in which you actually care about women, minorities and LGBT folk is frankly and legitimately up for debate.

It's about apathy not hate

 

[Poodlestrike]

I find it kind of telling that the only down-ticket race Sanders and his supporters (speaking of a general average, not trying to paint all Sanders supporters with the same brush, similar qualifiers) have thrown any kind of weight behind is a primary challenge of another Democrat. Purity is what's important to them, not results. They've really bought into the notion that the real evil, the real obstacle, is corrupt elements within the Democratic Party, not the, you know, Republicans.

Not that I'm opposed to ousting DWS from her DNC Chair position, she's awful at it, but primarying her won't accomplish that in the slightest.

 

[royalan]

I mean, he gets shit for every conceivable reason, but a popular one (relating to mobilizing change within the party) is that he was an independent and shouldn't meddle in the democratic party's affairs.

To be fair, basing this purely on the many threads we've had on this primary on GAF, I haven't seen much of anyone criticizing Bernie for being an independent running in the Democratic party and "meddling in our affairs" (whatever that means). I mean, Bernie had considerable support among Democrats at the start of this. More than the three other actual Democrats who were in the race at the start of this and quickly dropped out.

The criticism stems, I believe, from Bernie behaving as though the DNC should have rolled out a red carpet for him for being an Independent running in the Democratic party. That is literally what his argument for the nomination has devolved into, that despite Hillary Clinton trouncing him in both pledged delegates and popular vote, he should get the Democratic nomination because "Independents like me."

There have been issues with voter suppression in various states that have affected both candidates. But the DNC has no control over that and, otherwise, the primary process has been handled more than fairly by the DNC. He's trashing the DNC and the entire primary process as "unfair" and "rigged" without any evidence to substantiate these claims (as per usual with most of his accusations), dragging the DNC's legitimacy through the mud, and all because he's losing. He's losing fair and square and he can't seem to take that.