MisterXDTV
Member
Not with this new iterative business model where you buy digital games that are forward and backward compatible at the same time.
In the past every gen was like pressing a big reset button... Now, not anymore
PS4 Neo presentation might have leaked
- Thread starter Nibel
- Start date
Not with this new iterative business model where you buy digital games that are forward and backward compatible at the same time.
In the past every gen was like pressing a big reset button... Now, not anymore
Neo or not, the PS5 was never going to release in 2017, probably not till at least 2019. This is actually alleviating the sting of being "locked to lower specs." You'd be locked to even lower specs (aka the base ps4) till 2019 if it wasn't for this release.
October? I thought it was September for the cutoff point? Square better make a NEO version of FF15 anyway.
Yup, just saw that.
Not to worry. October onwards game need to ship with a neo mode built in. As in if someone bought a disc and started the game up offline, there would be a Neo mode.
Late september games (like FFXV) require a day 1 Neo patch if they're not shipping with a neo mode on disc.
StrongBlackVine
Banned
I don't see how more than doubling the GPU power while giving the CPU a paltry uptick is not underwhelming. The bottleneck is staring us directly in the face.
It'll be about both.
People left the 360 for the PS4 no problem, and they will switch back to Scorpio no problem if it suits them.
Karspankey
Banned
I suppose so. I had a conversation with my brother today about Neo and Scorpio, as he isn't in touch with the latest news and what not. I explained to him that while Scorpio will be more powerful, it won't be as if Microsoft has finally "beaten" Sony because the price points in the two might differ up to $200, possibly even more. Power is only a fraction of what makes a console sell and I'm glad others agree!
mckmas8808
Mckmaster uses MasterCard to buy Slave drives
Thanks. Glad you said this.
El-Pistolero
Member
Oh! Definitely. Power advantage only matters when everything else is equal (same or close launch dates, identical prices, comparable brand appeal).
To be fair, digital games in console had not exploded yet.
Actually it is for 2 reasons. You risk being Sega with yet another new console just 2 years later. It would piss of a lot of NEO owners they spent 399.99 dollars for 2 years. The second reason is it would not be much of a jump in 2018 it would be just a souped up Scorpio. We won't see a PS5 till probably 2020 when the next node shrink happens.
mckmas8808
Mckmaster uses MasterCard to buy Slave drives
They probably care more about waiting on HBM first. I think that's in 2019.
InsaneTiger
Member
This, totally what Kobe said. I have gone more and more digital as I get older, especially this generation. Switching to a completely different ecosystem would require me to repurchase so many games.
Don't give a shit, not doing, "moar power" be damned.
CrispyBoar
Banned
Again, they went from 360 to PS4 because of Xbox One's bad reception, not because of power. Same reason why they went to Xbox 360 after PS2, because of the bad reception that PS3 had.
Plus you need to read MisterXDTV's post.
Exactly why I'll be waiting for a while to purchase a new TV.
MisterXDTV
Member
Not only that, but at launch neither of the consoles had backward compatibility so even if you had a 360, there was no reason at all to stay loyal
StrongBlackVine
Banned
No I am saying moving to the PS5 after 5 years of the current PS4 would be preferable to this half-step. Not sure why people think Sony is locked to into 7 or 8 years generation when the other platform makers are not. Where is this rule or pattern that PS generations last 7 years? That has only happened once.
BigTnaples
Todd Howard's Secret GAF Account
Because the enhancements are going to sit heavily in the GPU load camp...
NEO games will be the same as PS4 games. The situations in the games will not be any more complex, they will just look prettier.
Just like on PC, when you are CPU limited by PS4 games, you can crank up the fidelity without much of a change in Performence. Same instance here. You will get better framerate and visuals with the NEO, but you aren't suddenly going to have 30 more AI in a given scene than PS4...
based off that screen it could still be 2016 or 2017
I can agree at times on the last one. But the other 2? Jaguarsfan.gif
It's especially funny when math is involved.
except the cpu on scorpio is potentially much much better
i can see 30fps vs 60fps difference if this turns out true
BigTnaples
Todd Howard's Secret GAF Account
He wasn't trying to give you heads up, he was laughing at you..
Though I'm glad it helped you with your purchasing decision, I wouldn't thank him.
even if one console could do 60fps over the other, I don't see devs fragmenting their games like that
Omnistalgic
Member
Yeah, definitely...Neo should be fine at the rumored specs. I think the enthusiast here on GAF (me included) was just hoping it gets closer to an actual top of the line box at an affordable price.
i did say it didn't seem that outlandish. :3
Speaking of tvs. I won't be getting a new tv for the next 2-3 years. By then I hope tvs support hdmi 2.0
InsaneTiger
Member
I agree with this statement. Resources are better utilized for something other than resolution. Give me more stable, native 1080/60 and just up rez the output.
Funny how we are talking about news that isn't new.
Do you not think MS are rebuilding that faith though?
Play Anywhere is pro consumer. Xbox One being forward compatible with Xbox Scorpio is pro consumer. Elite controller is pro consumer. EA access is pro consumer. Games with Gold has probably edged Plus this generation and the Xbox has a solid line up in the immediate future where as a lot of PS4 exclusives have a 2017/2018 release date.
I don't even have an Xbox One yet but I am getting the S next month because for me they have rebuilt the trust whilst Sony have sort of sat on their laurels.
True, but Phil Spencer said in his sit down with Major Nelson at E3 that forwards compatibility with Xbox is a huge thing now. Have Sony made those guarantees for the PS5?
Audioboxer
Member
Damn tons of failing at reading (and maths) at the start of this topic 
Good to see the slides leak that all the news articles were ran from.
Good to see the slides leak that all the news articles were ran from.
It wasn't just because of any one thing. It was the perfect storm.
Power was definitely a factor, but not alone. It became a major factor due to the price.
Typically a machine with more power would cost more, and people would weigh their options and think of whether that extra power is really worth the extra price, but a machine that has more power AND costs less. Made it a no brainer for people.
In this case though, it is safe to assume that if the neo is launching with these specs, it'll be cheaper than the scorpio. And hence the traditional "is it really worth the extra price" category will come into play. So yeah, it's not the same situation as PS4 vs Xbone.
TheRealTalker
Banned
welp
Shpeshal Nick
aka Collingwood
They did take off a fair bit. I think BC may help churn a few. Knowing most (if not all) their 360 library, One library and future titles will all play on one box would be enticing when combined with the "power factor".
why not ? its a whole different system.
tomb raider definitive was almost 60fps on ps4 while 30 with dips on xbone
dont see why devs wouldnt use the power they have. that doom dev was pretty happy about scorpio
LordBaztion
Member
but perception between Sony and MS right now is way different than it was in 2013. It could be argued that MS is being more consumer friendly with BC, play anywhere and GwG. In front of that you have power.
Besides, if you already have a PS4 to play Sony games, why upgrade your PS4 when you could buy another console and have access to not only new games but also better performing third party ones. New games will work fine you the PS4 anyway.
I'm not saying Scorpio willl turn over the curent circumstance but it will peruade people from staying on Sony ecosystem and have s better competitive proposition.
geordiemp
Member
Zen CPU (I5 like) will destroy the jaguar (atom like), some games will run at 60 FPS on Scorpio and 30 FPS on Neo.
Destroyed.
They do already - see all 3rd party AAA PC games. All of them. Scorpio could be a win10 walled PC....
They do this on PC already.
60fps is a design decision IMO. if a higher framerate is important to a developer and their game, they will target it on all platforms
StrongBlackVine
Banned
I need to see some comparisons between base PS4 games and PS4 Neo versions. On paper this is weak. I doubt we will see many games jumping from 30fps to 60fps like we would would with a new CPU, but yes the games will look nicer and should hopefully never drop below 30fps.
60fps WITHOUT a need for a visual downgrade to accomplish is what we(I) wanted from Neo.
LukasTaves
Member
But AFAIK sony is still not committed in delivering forward compatibility after Ps4/Neo life cycle.
Though, I would bet they will end up doing that because it would really hurt them not to when their competition is.
I don't know. I think the Neo is a mistake.
MS maybe they want to 1 up Sony, but at the same time Sony doesn't own the OS on most computers, MS does, so they technically can support the newest computer hardware with their platform now, and maybe doesn't matter. It's like a chess match that maybe Sony doesn't have the resources to win.
MS maybe they want to 1 up Sony, but at the same time Sony doesn't own the OS on most computers, MS does, so they technically can support the newest computer hardware with their platform now, and maybe doesn't matter. It's like a chess match that maybe Sony doesn't have the resources to win.
Even though i don't agree with iterative units, i also don't agree that NEO needs to be any more powerful than it is right now.
As people have said, power only matters when things are equal, and Sony and MS's intentions for both products are anything but equal, hell their ecosystems aren't equal right now, that's why i don't own an XB1.
That won't change just because they bring out a more powerful box. I had a 360 as my main unit for years before i got a PS3, because the planets aligned and they had a good mix of software that appealed to me at a much cheaper price than PS3
As people have said, power only matters when things are equal, and Sony and MS's intentions for both products are anything but equal, hell their ecosystems aren't equal right now, that's why i don't own an XB1.
That won't change just because they bring out a more powerful box. I had a 360 as my main unit for years before i got a PS3, because the planets aligned and they had a good mix of software that appealed to me at a much cheaper price than PS3
nelsonroyale
Member
Hmm, this thing shouldnt be too expensive if those are the specs they are going for. Really it should probably just be the system refresh.
Game will still likely target PS4 and xbone as the base, or at least they should. I expect uptake of these new iterations to be pretty slow relatively speaking.
Game will still likely target PS4 and xbone as the base, or at least they should. I expect uptake of these new iterations to be pretty slow relatively speaking.
BigTnaples
Todd Howard's Secret GAF Account
The system would bomb if games didn't look noticeably better in NEO mode, since that is the entire selling point/concept behind the console. It's sole purpose is to make games that are "a lot prettier" than the PS4 versions, nothing more, nothing less. If the games don't look significantly better, then this wouldn't make it out to consumers.
Most 3rd party games are on the PC. I can't remember to many big time games that run at 30 FPS on the PC intentionally. Any game that will be ported to the PC will support 60 FPS after that it will be if the hardware can handle it or not. If the Scorpio runs with the Zen I can't see many games not being able to run at 60 FPS.
Jakartalado
Member
I'm expecting a big push from Sony Titles in this FY (2016).
Since we are discussing, I'm pretty sure we wil see something like...
The Last Guardian
PS4: 1080p and 30 fps
Neo: 4K and 30 fps, or 1080p and 60 fps
Gran Turismo Sport
PS4: 1080p and 60 fps
Neo: 4K and 60 fps (resolution maybe a bit lower, but framerate won't fall 60 fps).
Horizon Zero Dawn
PS4: 1080p and 30 fps
Neo: Around 1800p just like the slide and 30 fps, although Guerrila Games is very talanted and may push the 4K and 30 fps, and for 1080p a solid 60 fps what I expect.
Also....
I think Final Fantasy XV will be:
PS4: 900p and 30 fps
Neo: 1080p and 60 fps (which is sad, but time is short for Square-Enix)
I wish we had more details. I really want to know about Battlefield 1, Titanfall 2 and so many others. How they are going to push this hardware. 1080p and 60 fps is what I expect, but is it time to upgrade to a 4k TV?
Since we are discussing, I'm pretty sure we wil see something like...
The Last Guardian
PS4: 1080p and 30 fps
Neo: 4K and 30 fps, or 1080p and 60 fps
Gran Turismo Sport
PS4: 1080p and 60 fps
Neo: 4K and 60 fps (resolution maybe a bit lower, but framerate won't fall 60 fps).
Horizon Zero Dawn
PS4: 1080p and 30 fps
Neo: Around 1800p just like the slide and 30 fps, although Guerrila Games is very talanted and may push the 4K and 30 fps, and for 1080p a solid 60 fps what I expect.
Also....
I think Final Fantasy XV will be:
PS4: 900p and 30 fps
Neo: 1080p and 60 fps (which is sad, but time is short for Square-Enix)
I wish we had more details. I really want to know about Battlefield 1, Titanfall 2 and so many others. How they are going to push this hardware. 1080p and 60 fps is what I expect, but is it time to upgrade to a 4k TV?
Karspankey
Banned
What are you talking about man the PS4 and XBOX One share the same baseline architecture and so will the Neo and Scorpio. Just because there is a different in power, doesn't mean that it is incompetence on Sony's end.
bitbydeath
Member
It is old. SIE formed on April 1, meaning the presentation was held prior to that date, likely GDC.
MS would be very smart to improve their bc going forward. They also need to work with publishers to bring more tittles to the 360 emulation.
I'll be honest, a system that could play all 360,one, and Scorpio tittle would be pretty interesting. Just for being able to play my 360 library.
MisterXDTV
Member
No doubt in my mind that PS5 will be backwards compatible with PS4/Neo digital games.
Obviously a time will come when new games will no longer be able to run on the old hardware but it will be a soft transition, not sudden...
PC is a whole different story. devs know PC gamers like to tweak their stuff and run and higher framerates regardless of dev intent.
for console games I think devs like to target consistent experiences
what ? so why dont they lock it to whatever fps they designed it for on all platforms including pc ? why can i unlock on my powerful pc and not on my powerful console ? doesnt make much sense
^lol reads like parity nonsense