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[Thraktor]

To clarify, here's a rough suggestion of how I would see shoulder buttons working:

If the display is really 6.2 inches like the earlier rumor claimed, it would be literally impossible to reach all of the buttons when the controller parts are attached to the main body, though.

Actually, even if the device was 3DS XL-sized, the distance between circle pad and buttons would be too big to use buttons and circle pads at the same time.

It would be awkward, but not impossible. The point is that you can flip either side upside down to have the primary controls on top, whether they're buttons or slide-pads.

Do everyone realize that most mockups looks uncomfortable?


It looks like this:

Flat and rectangle

Yes, I'm aware that the flat rectangles I drew to quickly illustrate my concept look like flat rectangles. This isn't meant to be an ergonomically refined proposal, just a quick demonstration of how reversible controllers and back-lit buttons might operate.

Shouder buttons on bottom and top is a waste of button inputs and prone to accidentally be touched in handheld mode.. The triggers on the wii controllers worked great. There should be a more clever solution for your mockup to work. I think asymmetric design is a better option and solves problems.

I agree with the IR though, didn't think of the motion pointing option.

The shoulder buttons wouldn't do anything while on the bottom (and it would be difficult to accidentally press them anyway if they're in slightly from the sides). The system would know which way up the controllers are and only enable the appropriate buttons.

 

[LegendofLex]

No I wouldn't but I think it's fairly safe to assume the controller parts are deeper than the tablet and secure enough that you can safely swing it around by the detachable sides without risk of the expensive part detaching and flying across the room.

There's a delicate balance between "attached sturdily" and "easy to attach/detach." I hope Nintendo gets it right, because this is probably the place where it's easiest to go wrong with the detachable controller concept.

 

[forknknife]

Holy hyperbole Batman.

Besides the fact that Street Fighter will always be better with an arcade stick I assure you SF is not anywhere near "unplayable" because of the PS4's motherfucking Dpad.

C'mon.

It is. The arrow buttons create a lot of friction in the fingers and pulling off stuff is possible, yes, but horrible compared to doing it with a proper dpad. I cannot play comfortable for longer than an hour, that to me is the definition of "almost unplayable".

 

[Persona7]

32GB sounds like trash unless miiverse isn't going to be updated to allow video clips.

 

[Branduil]

All of these mockups would be horrifically uncomfortable in attached mode.

 

[Roo]

All of these mockups would be horrifically uncomfortable in attached mode.

I agree.
Still have yet to see a mockup that looks even remotely comfortable to hold.

 

[Skittzo0413]

All of these mockups would be horrifically uncomfortable in attached mode.

It's a lot easier to draw simple shapes like rectangles in Paint to show off ideas about how the dpad, triggers, shoulder buttons, analog sticks, etc. will all work than it is to create a design of a brand new piece of equipment with all of those things while trying to incorporate aesthetic design and ergonomics.

Really, these mockups are meant to show how the controllers could function or be arranged, not to show the final design. It's essentially the same as patent drawings which illustrate concepts rather than show off designs.

 

[Maintenance]

I kind of hope it doesn't a hard drive. Just give me the option to use an external one and I'm all set. If you're going physical, 32 gigs will be enough and if you're going all digital or a mix of both, whatever size HDD they provide won't cut it.

I've seen everything, people claiming for fucking 32 GBs on a home console. That's not nearly enough for the handheld.

What are you people smoking.

 

[wrowa]

Thinking about it, I really don't think that the NX controller parts are meant to be used in NES-style. The ergonomics just don't work.

In order to work NES-style, face buttons and circle pads would need to be on the different sides of the pad (if they are too close to each other, the controller would be too cramped to hold comfortably). On the other hand, you need buttons and circle pads in close proximity in standard/handheld mode or otherwise you can't reach both buttons and circle pads comfortably (making more complex games hard to realize / awkward to play).

Meaning: The detachable controllers will be designed to be used in classic Wiimote-fashion. One-handed, vertically, focus on motion controls + simple inputs.

I made quick and dirty edits of Thraktor's mockup to visualize my point (I hope you don't mind, otherwise I'll remove the images).

The way the button layout has to look like in order to allow for comfortable play in handheld mode:

But this would result in this when using the controller parts horizontally:

That wouldn't be comfortable either. It'd be possible that the right part of the pads wouldn't be detachable, but then the pads would be too small to hold (and also still too cramped).

Another thing that would be possible, though, is controllers that - similar to the Wiimote - have two additional buttons at the bottom. The quick and dirty mockup doesn't look good, but if the NX has a 6 inch screen, all of the buttons would in all likelihood be considerably smaller than on these pictures (meaning there would be more space between upper and lower half of the pad). If they do that, the controllers could be used NES-style as seen with the Wiimote back in the day.

 

[Nags]

Nintendo would be smart to take a page from Sony. That share button is the biggest success that no one talks about. Split Dpad is superior too, so I hope that's true.

 

[Drilbit777]

Eh a split button I would not be a fan of. I've always enjoyed the d pad they had with the Wii U controller and they should stick to that

 

[Peltz]

Yikes.

Hopefully the real product makes sense. These rumors make it sound so Frankenstein-esque.

 

[Dr. Buni]

Share button is love. Gimme. Split D-Pad though... eh no thanks. :/

 

[Bjoern the Smexy]

32GB sounds like trash unless miiverse isn't going to be updated to allow video clips.

It's still a prototype.
Don't get upset by prototype numbers.
They're prototype numbers.

 

[Hermii]

I've seen everything, people claiming for fucking 32 GBs on a home console. That's not nearly enough for the handheld.

What are you people smoking.

Its 32 gb with sd card support. And the dock has usb output which will probably support external drives like Wii U.

For physical releases it is possible that patches/ dlc/ save games will be stored on the cartridge since most games will probably be much less than 32gb. Just my speculation.

Also since there is no way you can have a hdd in a mobile unit, 32gb will give the best price/ gb ratio.

 

[Persona7]

It's still a prototype.
Don't get upset by prototype numbers.
They're prototype numbers.

yeah, I can read.

 

[forknknife]

I got it guys! Mock up coming soon!

 

[udivision]

These mockups are suffering from dealing with the portable/comfortable/detachable compromise. You have to sacrifice in some area, it seems.

I wonder how well the real thing will fare...

By comfortability, I'm talking about button placement.

 

[Maintenance]

Its 32 gb with sd card support. And the dock has usb output which will probably support external drives like Wii U.

For physical releases it is possible that patches/ dlc/ save games will be stored on the cartridge since most games will probably be much less than 32gb. Just my speculation.

Also since there is no way you can have a hdd in a mobile unit, 32gb will give the best price/ gb ratio.

I don't care about the cartridges, I'm a digital buyer. The handheld having 32gb is already not enough, but the dock having nothing is even more stupid. If this thing gets any third party release then all the storage is gone, only Nintendo EAD still makes small (talking about GBs here) games.

I'm not talking about putting a HDD inside the mobile, I'm talking about the dock.

 

[Jinketsu]

Do everyone realize that most mockups looks uncomfortable?


It looks like this:

Flat and rectangle

They're mockups of the concept and general button layout, not mockups of the ergonomic design and form factor. Nobody is trying to mock that up in this thread.

 

[Skittzo0413]

Another thing that would be possible, though, is controllers that - similar to the Wiimote - have two additional buttons at the bottom. The quick and dirty mockup doesn't look good, but if the NX has a 6 inch screen, all of the buttons would in all likelihood be considerably smaller than on these pictures (meaning there would be more space between upper and lower half of the pad). If they do that, the controllers could be used NES-style as seen with the Wiimote back in the day.

I do like that last mockup. At that point it seems kind of crowded on the controller, but it could work. Still no answer for triggers though as far as I can tell.

They're mockups of the concept and general button layout, not mockups of the ergonomic design and form factor. Nobody is trying to mock that up in this thread.

Yes, I hope more people read this because it's getting tiresome hearing about how these simple MS Paint mockups look uncomfortable to hold and whatnot. Of course they do, they're simple mockups after all.

 

[MoonFrog]

To clarify, here's a rough suggestion of how I would see shoulder buttons working:

It would be awkward, but not impossible. The point is that you can flip either side upside down to have the primary controls on top, whether they're buttons or slide-pads.



Yes, I'm aware that the flat rectangles I drew to quickly illustrate my concept look like flat rectangles. This isn't meant to be an ergonomically refined proposal, just a quick demonstration of how reversible controllers and back-lit buttons might operate.



The shoulder buttons wouldn't do anything while on the bottom (and it would be difficult to accidentally press them anyway if they're in slightly from the sides). The system would know which way up the controllers are and only enable the appropriate buttons.

So we press them with our palms when the controllers are used NES like? Or are there replacements on the side connected to the screen?

 

[Branduil]

Thinking about it, I really don't think that the NX controller parts are meant to be used in NES-style. The ergonomics just don't work.

In order to work NES-style, face buttons and circle pads would need to be on the different sides of the pad (if they are too close to each other, the controller would be too cramped to hold comfortably). On the other hand, you need buttons and circle pads in close proximity in standard/handheld mode or otherwise you can't reach both buttons and circle pads comfortably (making more complex games hard to realize / awkward to play).

Meaning: The detachable controllers will be designed to be used in classic Wiimote-fashion. One-handed, vertically, focus on motion controls + simple inputs.

I made quick and dirty edits of Thraktor's mockup to visualize my point (I hope you don't mind, otherwise I'll remove the images).

The way the button layout has to look like in order to allow for comfortable play in handheld mode:




But this would result in this when using the controller parts horizontally:



That wouldn't be comfortable either. It'd be possible that the right part of the pads wouldn't be detachable, but then the pads would be too small to hold (and also still too cramped).

Another thing that would be possible, though, is controllers that - similar to the Wiimote - have two additional buttons at the bottom. The quick and dirty mockup doesn't look good, but if the NX has a 6 inch screen, all of the buttons would in all likelihood be considerably smaller than on these pictures (meaning there would be more space between upper and lower half of the pad). If they do that, the controllers could be used NES-style as seen with the Wiimote back in the day.

Yes, if you look at the Wiimote, the NES mode worked thanks to the 1 and 2 buttons, which were basically inaccessible in vertical mode and thus only used for very minor functions at best.

It seems more likely to me that a split D-pad would exist to facilitate left-handed modes. We certainly haven't heard anything about the crazy shoulder button setups that would be required to make such a concept work.

 

[OG_Original Gamer]

This wasn't written anywhere in Iwata's plans.

I'm assuming the hybrid would technically be capable of handling scene complexity, textures, and most if not all shaders. It would just not be capable of rendering in a resolution, preferably 1080p.

 

[Dark Cloud]

I know I don't like these mockups either, but none of us work at Nintendo so I know they'll come up with something better.

 

[Chezzymann]

I was thinking about this. What if there's actually two sets of face buttons, they both have that "split dpad" functionality, and both can be used as either dpad or face buttons? Then that two player thing could make sense.

 

[MR ARCADE FOREVER]

Report :NX will have a power button

 

[Doc Holliday]

I'm extremely concerned that the NX is a solution to a problem that we don't have.

Wouldn't it be more beneficial to Nintendo to have 2 seperated systems that share the same OS ala iPhone/iPad vs 2 seperated systems.

Nintendo benefits from selling two separate systems and from having one ecosystem to make games for.

By making a hybrid you're making a portable that's too big and a console that's too weak plus you make less money by selling only one sku.

 

[MuchoMalo]

I don't care about the cartridges, I'm a digital buyer. The handheld having 32gb is already not enough, but the dock having nothing is even more stupid. If this thing gets any third party release then all the storage is gone, only Nintendo EAD still makes small (talking about GBs here) games.

I'm not talking about putting a HDD inside the mobile, I'm talking about the dock.

It has two USB ports. Just buy an external.

 

[Dark Cloud]

I'm extremely concerned that the NX is a solution to a problem that we don't have.

Wouldn't it be more beneficial to Nintendo to have 2 seperated systems that share the same OS ala iPhone/iPad vs 2 seperated systems.

Nintendo benefits from selling two separate systems and from having one ecosystem to make games for.

By making a hybrid you're making a portable that's too big and a console that's too weak plus you make less money by selling only one sku.

Tbf this hybrid may one be one system with more NX systems coming.

 

[Maintenance]

It has two USB ports. Just buy an external.

Yes, because shipping another console without HDD is such a great idea.

For fuck's sake, y'all defend anything Nintendo does.

 

[thisisvlad]

I'm extremely concerned that the NX is a solution to a problem that we don't have. QUOTE]

So this weekend, I'm taking a flight out of town to a wedding. Games that I'm currently in-progress on my Wii U will stay behind (XC X & TP HD), while my 3DS will be with me on board (probably some VC games, we'll see after the upcoming direct.) I dislike having this disconnected experience. Once I leave home, my entire experience stays behind and I adopt a new one - when I return the same thing occurs in reverse.

I won't speak for everyone, but the concept of having a single device that contains all of my games/data with a consistent experience regardless if I'm in a hotel, on a flight or at home, is exactly what I've wanted for quite some time.

 

[MuchoMalo]

Yes, because shipping another console without HDD is such a great idea.

For fuck's sake, y'all defend anything Nintendo does.

You're right that it sucks, but it would also force them to raise the price by at least $50 in something that really needs to be cheap. It sucks, but something has to give. They're trying to make this as cheap as possible. It's not like them including it would save you money anyway, so you're overreacting a little bit. Every company overcharges for storage. Maybe they could have a $250 regular SKU and a $350 500GB SKU for people like you. :/ They have to choose who to make happy. I agree that it was a mistake with Wii U, but with NX there's a lot to consider. They can put an HDD in the dock, but if they require people to buy it with that people who don't really use it will feel like they've wasted their money or the price will just flat-out be too high. Besides that, you can bet your ass that buying an NX + external HDD will be cheaper than what an NX with a hard drive would be.

In fact, to be perfectly honest, I'd love to see budget Xbone and PS4 SKUs where you have to add your own HDD.

 

[KojiKnight]

Yes, because shipping another console without HDD is such a great idea.

For fuck's sake, y'all defend anything Nintendo does.

There is validity to not releasing multiple sku's with multiple hard drive sizes, and a lot of people have spare externals or already use them for their wii u.

 

[Metal B]

I'm extremely concerned that the NX is a solution to a problem that we don't have.

Wouldn't it be more beneficial to Nintendo to have 2 seperated systems that share the same OS ala iPhone/iPad vs 2 seperated systems.

Nintendo benefits from selling two separate systems and from having one ecosystem to make games for.

By making a hybrid you're making a portable that's too big and a console that's too weak plus you make less money by selling only one sku.

Consoles in general solution to a problem that we don't have.

It actually solves some problems.
1. It wants to be a tablet, which is exclusive to gaming, and this time, there is a well-known company behind it, which could support the platform alone.
2. Nintendo's hybrid solution is a work around Sony and Microsoft. It isn't a console, it's a hybrid. You want a console experience on the go, handheld games at home and mobile-games with buttons? The Nintendo NX is everything and more. This alone gives it a special status.
3. There is still the possibility, that the locking station advance the power of the NX. Some games could be station only.

Yes, because shipping another console without HDD is such a great idea.

For fuck's sake, y'all defend anything Nintendo does.

Nintendo was really clever to give us cheaper, optional solution with their consoles and handhelds.
I'm sure, you can put any MicroSD and connect any extern HDD into the NX.

 

[Maintenance]

It's not like them including it would save you money anyway

Actually yes, it would. One of the (multiple) reasons I stopped buying games for my Wii U is that there is basically zero storage there. I'm not from the US so the prices are not the same.

There is validity to not releasing multiple sku's with multiple hard drive sizes, and a lot of people have spare externals or already use them for their wii u.

Oh yes, the huge Wii U install base.

 

[KingBroly]

To clarify, here's a rough suggestion of how I would see shoulder buttons working:

It would be awkward, but not impossible. The point is that you can flip either side upside down to have the primary controls on top, whether they're buttons or slide-pads.

Yes, I'm aware that the flat rectangles I drew to quickly illustrate my concept look like flat rectangles. This isn't meant to be an ergonomically refined proposal, just a quick demonstration of how reversible controllers and back-lit buttons might operate.

The shoulder buttons wouldn't do anything while on the bottom (and it would be difficult to accidentally press them anyway if they're in slightly from the sides). The system would know which way up the controllers are and only enable the appropriate buttons.

Could you flip them around? Not swap them, but turn them both 180 degrees?

 

[Genio88]

I don't care about the cartridges, I'm a digital buyer. The handheld having 32gb is already not enough, but the dock having nothing is even more stupid. If this thing gets any third party release then all the storage is gone, only Nintendo EAD still makes small (talking about GBs here) games.

I'm not talking about putting a HDD inside the mobile, I'm talking about the dock.

Storage is the least of my "concerns" about NX, it'll likely support micro sd cards for external storage and those are now very cheap and have good read/write speed, with about 35$ you can already get a good 128GB micro SD, and prices for those goes always lower

 

[LegendofLex]

I'm extremely concerned that the NX is a solution to a problem that we don't have.

A multi-device solution will inevitably introduce complications that a single device won't.

The toughest thing about the rumored configuration is throwing the display onto a TV and maybe detaching the controllers for home use (although you'll probably be able to avoid this with a separate controller).

With multiple devices, you have at least one (likely more) of the following problems:

1) You're locked in to one form factor (TV or portable) unless you buy another device. This is currently the situation with 3DS and Wii U. Although Wii U tries to solve it by having Off-TV Play, that's not true portability.

2) If you want to seamlessly hand off between TV and portable, you need to sync up data between devices, either via the cloud or local connection. Having to do this lots of times means there's lots of potential for something to go wrong.

3) If you want to play the same games across devices, you need to either physically or digitally migrate them or duplicate them between devices.

4) If there's a power/functionality gulf between devices, some software will inevitably work on one device and not the other. You'll need to buy both to get the full library (and Nintendo will have to have a steady stream of software support for both). A good example of a power gulf is if the console can play games that the handheld can't. A good example of a functionality gulf is if the handheld has a touch screen but the console doesn't. (You might not be able to play such a game on the TV, but at least you can play it on the device you already own.)

 

[Clefargle]

Actually yes, it would. One of the (multiple) reasons I stopped buying games for my Wii U is that there is basically zero storage there. I'm not from the US so the prices are not the same.



Oh yes, the huge Wii U install base.

Why couldn't this be solved by Micro SD Cards??

 

[MuchoMalo]

Actually yes, it would. One of the (multiple) reasons I stopped buying games for my Wii U is that there is basically zero storage there. I'm not from the US so the prices are not the same.



Oh yes, the huge Wii U install base.

So you live in a dream world where fair prices are charged for internal storage. Makes sense.

Though, maybe the difference between us is that I've given up on thinking of this as console, while you still see it primarily as a console. That would explain things.

 

[Agent Unknown]

I really like the D-pad on the PS4 dual shock (surprised some people don't) and including a share button is a good idea and shows they are paying attention to the competition.

 

[Jaagen]

I hope Nintendo future proofs the system by including UHS-II support. It supports faster read and write speeds than regular cards, which cuts down loadtimes. I also hope that Nintendo takes advantage of fast flash storage in the gamecarts as well.

 

[SFenton]

I really like the D-pad on the PS4 dual shock (surprised some people don't) and including a share button is a good idea and shows they are paying attention to the competition.

Yeah, the DPad is one of the only things I *do* like about DS4.

Someone mentioned it earlier but I *would* prefer a Vita style DPad to DS4, but I wouldn't complain if we got DS4.

 

[SatoAilDarko]

Every is great except the split D-Pad. That horrible.

Even if it's split the other directions will still move when you press one just like a regular D-pad. You can't for example press opposite directions at once. You can press A and X together but not up and down on a PS-style d-paf.

You can map stuff to individual directions on a D-pad fine.

Also every Nintendo system from the NES to now (including the Virtual Boy) had a D-Pad.

 

[Maintenance]

Why couldn't this be solved by Micro SD Cards??

Why couldn't this be solved by Nintendo putting a hard disk like all the other major manufacturers are doing recently.

So you live in a dream world where fair prices are charged for internal storage. Makes sense.

Though, maybe the difference between us is that I've given up on thinking of this as console, while you still see it primarily as a console. That would explain things.

If they want it to replace the Wii U and the 3DS then it have to be better than both. I'm not even going to bother to answer the other thing because I would be wasting my time apparently.

Storage is the least of my "concerns" about NX, it'll likely support micro sd cards for external storage and those are now very cheap and have good read/write speed, with about 35$ you can already get a good 128GB micro SD, and prices for those goes always lower

If the game sizes keep growing 128GB won't be enough for more than 4 major games. (In before someone says "who plays more than 4 games at once")

 

[Jaagen]

Why couldn't this be solved by Nintendo putting a hard disk like all the other major manufacturers are doing recently.

It's Nintendo. They'll remove the charger if is saves them a penny.

 

[Neoxon]

It has two USB ports. Just buy an external.

That may be a problem if both ports are taken up by the GameCube Adapter, hence why I'm hoping for more than 2.

 

[Maintenance]

It's Nintendo. They'll remove the charger if is saves them a penny.

Oh I know it's NIntendo, doesn't mean I don't think that's bullshit.

 

[Hermii]

Why couldn't this be solved by Nintendo putting a hard disk like all the other major manufacturers are doing recently.



If they want it to replace the Wii U and the 3DS then it have to be better than both. I'm not even going to bother to answer the other thing because I would be wasting my time apparently.



If the game sizes keep growing 128GB won't be enough for more than 4 major games. (In before someone says "who plays more than 4 games at once")

I doubt very much this will get nearly the third party support of the ps4 one, Im not sure if its even powerful enough to run those games with a tegra. The average NX game will probably be smaller.

And Im sure you already own a PS4, if you are mainly home console gamer why would you want the inferior NX version?