Clinton campaign didn't do tracking polls for the last month, ignored Michigan issues

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Smokey_Run said:
Debate prep according to the site. Don't know why you have to spend half the month sequestered in debate prep.
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Ignoring the exact length issue, why would you even need to stay in a single state to do debate prep?
eyeball_kid said:
It really is pretty amazing when you think about it. A candidate that demanded she fly home to her New York mansion every night to sleep in her own bed. You couldn't write a more anti-populist candidate than that.
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That's not true right?

I thought that was something Trump was doing actually, not Hillary.
 
Fox Mulder said:
We're all plebs that were supposed to fall in line and vote for her turn.
.
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In a very strange way, the Republicans actually got this right (by dumb effing luck if you ask me).

The Republican plebs were supposed to nominate Jeb or Rubio, maybe Kasich...The Republican plebs said fuck it...nope. And nominated Trump.

The Democrats faced the same wave (and really, it is the same wave...just hit at different places on the beach) with Bernie. The Democrat plebs were supposed to vote for Hillary...The Democrat plebs said eff it and backed Bernie...However, the DNC had their thumb on the scale...So Hillary was nominated.

The DNC took every one for granted....every Bernie supporter, every blue collar AFL-CIO type...to just fall in line.
 
orthodoxy1095 said:
Ignoring the exact length issue, why would you even need to stay in a single state to do debate prep?

That's not true right?

I thought that was something Trump was doing actually, not Hillary.
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They both did the crazy sleep only at home thing. Biggest Difference was Trump was smashing that campaign trail day after day even while doing it.
 
orthodoxy1095 said:
Ignoring the exact length issue, why would you even need to stay in a single state to do debate prep?

That's not true right?
Click to expand...

It was, but she was probably doing it because Trump was doing the same thing and she thought she had a huge lead.

http://www.latimes.com/politics/la-na-pol-clinton-trump-travel-20161013-snap-story.html

This year’s presidential nominees may have the strangest commutes in American politics.

Almost every morning Hillary Clinton and Donald Trump wake up in their own beds – she in a stately home in suburban Westchester County, N.Y., he in a penthouse atop Trump Tower in Manhattan or occasionally his Mar-a-Lago estate in Florida – and step into a motorcade that whisks them to a nearby airport.

They fly on their campaign planes to whatever battleground state is their target of the day and, after a speech or two and perhaps a fundraiser, they usually return home for the night rather than bunk down in a hotel on the road.
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http://www.politico.com/story/2016/11/clinton-trump-sleeping-at-home-230605

Instead of more efficient campaign trips, she has prioritized ending her days surrounded by the creature comforts of her own homes — either her farmhouse in Chappaqua or her brick Georgian-style mansion in Washington, D.C.

In a campaign of unprecedented contrasts, it is one of the most striking similarities between Clinton and Donald Trump. Here are two well-to-do New Yorkers who add hours of travel to their schedules, and thousands of dollars to their campaign expenses, in order to avoid sleeping in the Middle America they promise they are running to represent. For Clinton, it marks a contrast from how she ran during the primary, or even during her post-convention bus tour when she stayed on the road during stops across Ohio and Pennsylvania. For Trump, it’s a continuation of a strategy that has been in place since Day One.

“They should be focused more on talking to voters rather than worrying about how comfortable the bed is that they’re sleeping in,” said Lanhee Chen, who served as a top policy adviser for Mitt Romney in 2012 and noted that Romney, a multimillionaire in his own right, rarely returned to his homes during the final months of the presidential campaign four years ago.

But for Trump, near-nightly returns to Manhattan — from as far west as Reno, Nevada — mean a chance to sleep in his marble-and-gold hued 66th floor penthouse in Trump Tower. For Clinton, the hops to Chappaqua allow her to spread out in her colonial five-bedroom home, complete with 1.1 acres of land and a swimming pool.

Even when Trump doesn’t return to Manhattan, he almost always overnights in one of his many other properties: the sumptuous Mar-a-Lago in Florida, the exclusive, private Trump National Golf Club in Bedminster, New Jersey, or his Trump-branded hotels in Chicago, Miami and Las Vegas. Through Saturday, only four nights in October had Trump not slept in a bed that he or one of his companies owned.

Take the day of the second debate. Both candidates began in New York and jetted to St. Louis. They debated there. Then they both beat a path from the stage back to the airport, where their planes were parked next to one another, en route to New York where both landed past midnight.

Clinton didn’t deplane in Westchester until nearly 2 a.m.

Campaign veterans say this is all highly unusual, and speaks to the odd dynamics of this year’s race. Plenty of past candidates, even wealthy ones, have suffered the indignities of motel and Marriott living while fighting to win the highest office in the world. Just not these two.

“Generally, one or two nights a week he’d be in Chicago to see his family,” said Eric Lesser, who served as a traveling aide for then-Sen. Barack Obama in 2008. “Everyone on that campaign has every Hampton Inn and Hilton Garden and Marriott Courtyard in all of America memorized. It was constant motion.”

The detours back to New York would amount to political malpractice in any other cycle — except that both candidates are doing it. Traditionally, a candidate’s time is viewed as the single most precious commodity in any race.
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orthodoxy1095 said:
Ignoring the exact length issue, why would you even need to stay in a single state to do debate prep?

That's not true right?

I thought that was something Trump was doing actually, not Hillary.
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It probably ties into wanting to be home every night and the internal campaign feeling there was no way they could lose.
 
antonz said:
They both did the crazy sleep only at home thing. Biggest Difference was Trump was smashing that campaign trail day after day even while doing it.
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eyeball_kid said:
They both were.
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Christ in heaven.

That is insane.
numble said:
It was, but she was probably doing it because Trump was doing the same thing and she thought she had a huge lead.

http://www.latimes.com/politics/la-na-pol-clinton-trump-travel-20161013-snap-story.html



http://www.politico.com/story/2016/11/clinton-trump-sleeping-at-home-230605
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I guess that makes sense for her rationale.

Hindsight and all that.
 
Just the list of urban cities she visited don't make sense. They already supported her. She needed to get out to the countryside and rural areas to meet people. Face to face conversations can change impressions and also it makes them feel good you visited their region of the country.

You could tell they had no focus on these areas. Not even 30 minute drives outside of major city/urban areas typically had no Hillary signs or presence. Going by her tour schedule it would seem no visits either. Trump handled this like he was a contestant on The Apprentice. He was out all hours of the night in the most random towns. I seem to recall reports of him showing up to events around midnight and that seems to have been rewarded.
 
Trump: "We will make America great again!"
Clinton: "Well I think America is already pretty darn good!"

Every time she said that, it was just so apparent how out of touch she really was with a majority of Americans. She didn't get it. I can't believe how badly they messed this up.
 
Chococat said:
Please stop saying this. I've said twice now in this thread Michigan got blitzed in the last few weeks by Hillary and surrogate. In Michigan, the problem was not coming here, but not reaching out to the rural areas. Most place were to shore up support from the existing base.
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But what about before the last few weeks? Why did she wait until the last few weeks? She really only went to Michigan once before the last few weeks while Trump was there quite a few times.
 
chubigans said:
Trump: "We will make America great again!"
Clinton: "Well I think America is already pretty darn good!"

Every time she said that, it was just so apparent how out of touch she really was with a majority of Americans. She didn't get it. I can't believe how badly they messed this up.
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This country has never been great. They're both wrong IMO.
 
I work with among a lot of blue collar workers in PA, and thy have been calling each other racist mysogynist deplorables as a meme all week. She ran a terrible campaign lol.
 
Hillary coming here and doubling down to the state wouldn't have changed anything.

Our issues have been for the most part the same as the nations. Yes the Flint crisis happened, but our problem wasn't cleaner water. But rather rooting out corrupt politicians, whom Hillary was largely seen as.
 
thinking back to it now clinton's campaign was rather dull. trump's had an edge and a punch to it. you never stopped hearing about it but Clinton's was just..safe and dull.
 
gogosox82 said:
But what about before the last few weeks? Why did she wait until the last few weeks? She really only went to Michigan once before the last few weeks while Trump was there quite a few times.
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Nice people have already posted her travel times for those months. My point was only to correct she never visited. Not to justify it.

It's really weird, my rural mother complained a week before the election why are the candidates visiting Michigan so much? It was my first inclining something was wrong. So much for rural people being dumb.

Canceling of the fireworks was the second.

And Comey email bomb never sat right with me.

Shows that I need to climb out of the liberal bubble of GAF and challenge my views more.
 
malfcn said:
Telling a few states and industries they would be jobless didn't help.
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Even if you can't bring back the old jobs, it was insane for me to hear her just dismiss the complaint and say she'd work to make new jobs in clean energy. The people asking those questions didn't give a crap about new jobs in a sector they didn't understand or were familiar with.

Would it have been so hard to just say "I'll do my absolute best to make new jobs and drive unemployment down wherever I can"? Some of those debate answers were just clueless. And I, like others, sort of overlooked them since, you know, Trump said outrageous and inflammatory things... but to millions watching, her dismissal of their problems convinced them right then and there not to vote for her.
 
Sub Boss said:
Many people viewed Hilary Clinton as some kind of Criminal Narcissistic Sociopath, im not sure how her image fell that low.
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The criminal part is up for debate, but I can see the other two parts. Every new story I see about her extreme arrogance and hubris seems to be evidence of it.
 
Kin5290 said:
Probably both suppressing Clinton turnout and galvanizing Trump turnout (with polling not able to reflect the voter shift due to an event taking place 8 days before the election).

And then you have anecdotes in other threads of black voters deciding to stay home because "she's just more of the same". Well, we aren't going to be having more of the same Obama Justice Department upholding civil rights under a Trump administration.

From the KI1600 guys (who cited somebody I don't remember), 3 factors could contribute to sinking Clinton. A rural Trump upswell, Never Trump Republicans skulking back home to Trump, and depressed Clinton turnout. Only one could have been survivable, but all three happened in the end.
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Exactly. It was just a combination of all these factors at the very end that ended up costing her. If the election was held next Tuesday I think with another 7 days of campaign they would be fine. There internal data showed last Wednesday that Michigan was gone and they decided to visit etc., If there were more days to campaign she would have hit those areas hard with a week to go and win I believe.

If Comey's letter effected 1-2% that's about 1.3 million to 2.6 million voters that could have gone to Trump, stayed home, or vote 3rd party etc.,
 
To people saying she could have won Michigan had she visited more: I moved back to Michigan from South Dakota in August. I have seen as many Trump signs/bumper stickers here as I saw there....that's a lot in case you aren't familiar with South Dakota. Clinton lost Michigan at least 6 months ago and it was extremely obvious to anyone here. She treated the Michigan working class like we were stupid, and would vote for her regardless. Trump told Michigan what people want to hear. She literally stood no chance of winning here as of Nov 8.
 
antonz said:
They both did the crazy sleep only at home thing. Biggest Difference was Trump was smashing that campaign trail day after day even while doing it.
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You can't take that away from him. Just look at the difference. I just compared the number of listings per day according travel calendar provided a page or two back.

September:
Clinton: 0 events for 7 days, 1 event for 13 days, 2 events for 9 days, 3 events for 1 day
Trump: 0 events for 2 days, 1 event for 9 days, 2 events for 10 days, 3 events for 9 days

October:
Clinton: No info for 2 days, 0 events for 5 days, 1 event for 9 days, 2 events for 11 days, 3 events for 4 days
Trump: 0 events for 1 day, 1 event for 8 days, 2 events for 7 days, 3 events for 14 days

November:
Clinton: 0 events for 0 days, 1 event for 0 days, 2 events for 3 days, 3 events for 3 days, 4 events for 1 day
Trump: 0 events for 0 days, 1 event for 0 days, 2 events for 1 day, 3 events for 3 days, 4 events 1 day, 5 events for 2 days
 
So this means that the DNC is getting a house cleaning I hope. Clinton needs to be gone, as well as pretty much anyone in that administration.

You are basically the New England Patriots that lost to a high school team in Football. From Maine.
 
In hindsight, yes, Clinton was a terrible candidate and her campaign did countless mistakes.

But let's remember that two days ago, all available information suggested that Clinton would win straightforwardly. All the scientific polls. All the poll aggregators. All the aggregators of aggregators. Obama's high approval rating. The betting markets. The stock markets. Her three debate victories.

It's easy to rewrite history to make her a total failure, but she looked like she was doing a fine job and was on course to winning.

If anything, the pollsters and media have even more to answer for. We simply did not have accurate information regarding this race. I haven't heard the word 'Wisconsin' uttered during this entire campaign. It's complete bullshit.
 
Chariot said:
The hell. She should've showed up there. Not showing up is worse from where I stand, as the people will feel like they don't matter to you and because you can't refute misconceptions. Be there, tell them you care for them too and explain why your policies woukd benefit them.
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this election was anything but about the policies, either. they had a messaging problem for sure, but no one cared that her policies were better for them. Trump had literally no policies.

maybe showing up would have helped, but this was about a lot more than just her showing up. she wasn't the right candidate, full stop, to appeal to them.


freethoughtbubble said:
That's a good point but good lord what does say about her as a candidate? Not being able to step foot somewhere for fear that your mere presence will harm your chances is the textbook example of being toxic. Radioactive, even.
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its definitely a proven fact now she was the wrong candidate for this cycle. she may have won if she was running in something that was like the 2008, or even 2012 election climate. Obama should have been the candidate of 2016.
 
The hubris of Clinton has gotten to the point where it's laughable. They deserved every bit of this loss.

The only silver lining to Trump winning is Hilary's political career is OVER.
 
The anger and disappointment we all feel is beyond belief. I wonder if we will move past this. I'm floored. I still cannot believe that this is happening. And the uncertainty is unreal and scary.
 
The worst part about her arrogance is that she and her family will be fine. The rest, the people who believed in her and posted dank memes, they will suffer.

Politicians man. Just can't.
 
So much money spent on an ineffective and embarrassing campaign.

If this is the kind of managment she would bring to the White House, no thanks.

DNC really needs to be rebuilt. It's a mess.
 
Just remembered: About a month back, there were rumblings from the Clinton Campaign that they couldn't believe they were "only" leading Trump by 4%.
 
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