Support NeoGAF

[GraveRobberX]

Ok. That's not what I meant. I worded it incorrectly.


Has there ever been a console game that had a MANDATORY patch? A game literally unplayable/incomplete without s patch despite being sold physically.

Obviously almost all games have patches now. But they aren't mandatory. You could never connect to the internet and play the game, albeit a worse version.

But I can't think of many/any (excluding mmo/online only games) games that werent playable in their physical retail form.

I'm going to guess here but Master Chief Collection for X1
There was hub bub that it was a mandatory install due to Disc not having everything
Had to DL the rest

I maybe forgetting or recalling it differently, but I remember there was something really fucked up with MCC retail purchase

 

[EDarkness]

Thing is you can do that on healthy stable platforms
Ninty is reeling, they want to get back on track

Do you think if people go no I won't buy, then pub goes fine, there's no demand, then what?
You go back into the stupid cycle fiasco Ninty is trying to get out of

Buy Ninty hardware for Ninty games, some "exclusive" third party/indie games
Most publishers scoff and throw shovel ware or dilapidated titles
Why invest in a dead system that doesn't support our greedy outlook...

We're ok making money on the other 3 platforms, we're ok

If third parties are going to exploit the shit out of that user base, then do they deserve to win? Dumb ass companies are still dumb ass companies. Sucks for Nintendo and for their customers, but they should buy these games. If dumb companies don't want to support that group without exploiting them, then so be it. It's my money and I can spend it on other things.

 

[Undead Fantasy]

I'm going to guess here but Master Chief Collection for X1
There was hub bub that it was a mandatory install due to Disc not having everything
Had to DL the rest

I maybe forgetting or recalling it differently, but I remember there was something really fucked up with MCC retail purchase

Wasn't that only the online portion of it? As far as I remember all campaigns where on the disc.

 

[Astral Dog]

NINTENDOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[mrk8885]

I'm going to guess here but Master Chief Collection for X1
There was hub bub that it was a mandatory install due to Disc not having everything
Had to DL the rest

I maybe forgetting or recalling it differently, but I remember there was something really fucked up with MCC retail purchase

IIRC, that was because the game was hella broken, but I don't recall the game being incomplete as sold. I could be wrong though.


I'm just thinking about all my old games and comparing it to this nonsense.

What if I couldn't play tmnt 2 the arcade game because the servers to download a mandatory patch were taken down?

What if you had to download disc 2/3 of ffvii because square was too cheap to sell them to you?


I really hate this development.

 

[Gamezone]

Have they responded to this at all? Or is it still too new?

Have people even made them aware?

 

[UnemployedVillain]

From DRAMExchange:

Item Daily High Daily Low Session High Session Low Session Average Session Change History
MicroSD 16G C4 (Major Brand) 5.00 4.80 5.00 4.80 4.895
0.00 % [Historical Price Chart]
MicroSD 8G C4 (Major Brand) 3.70 3.48 3.70 3.48 3.535
0.00 % [Historical Price Chart]
OEM MicroSD 16G C4-C6 5.00 3.70 5.00 3.70 4.400
0.00 % [Historical Price Chart]
OEM MicroSD 8G C4-C6 3.60 2.85 3.60 2.85 3.339
0.00 %

The jump to 16GB isn't free. And this is your standard microSD in large volume. Add the proprietary stuff for Nintendo and the smaller volume. The cost difference is likely greater.

No corporation is simply going to eat that cost.

And investing into better compression isn't going to happen. It's not needed anywhere else. So it would have to be an investment that a developer/publisher have to make just for the Switch. The internal rate of return for such a thing would be well below expectations.

This is simply Nintendo's decisions coming to bite them in the rear.

Switch game cards aren't even SD cards. You have no idea what you're talking about

 

[Seik]

So people weren't turned off by the ridiculous pricing of a years-old port, but the downloadable patch is what does you in?

I was already upset by the pricing, but I was still willing because I don't own it on the U. Both this and having to DL the game even with a cart makes this a quite horrible, unappealing package.

That said, thinking about it, full price alone makes it so much worse that WB cheaped out on the cartridges. -_-

 

[Justified]

Ok. That's not what I meant. I worded it incorrectly.


Has there ever been a console game that had a MANDATORY patch? A game literally unplayable/incomplete without s patch despite being sold physically.

Obviously almost all games have patches now. But they aren't mandatory. You could never connect to the internet and play the game, albeit a worse version.

But I can't think of many/any (excluding mmo/online only games) games that werent playable in their physical retail form.

Tony Hawk 5 is just the demo on the disc with out the Day 1 download

 

[Gamezone]

Honest question here:

What makes this any different from mandatory installs on PS4 or Xbox One? I don't hear anyone calling for Sony or Microsoft's heads over that.

The fact that you are buying a physical, worthess cartridge without a solid connection in order to dowbload the remaining chunk?

 

[Calm waterfall]

They should eat the costs because they're Warner Bros, not a small indie dev. We don't know how much cards costs but we know it's not a significant amount of money added to the cost.

Are you fucking kidding me? WB is a corporation not a charity. If it is a small cost then why does not Nintendo eat the difference? It's their system and its their shitty small storage + the higher cost of cartridges that is causing this issue. Of course you won't blame Nintendo because you are a fanboy. This is probably the dumbest post I have read on neogaf for a while and that says something.

 

[Astral Dog]

I was already upset by the pricing, I was still willing because I don't own it on the U though. Both this and having to DL the game even with a cart makes this a quite horrible, unappealing package.

That said, thinking about it, full price alone makes it so much worse that WB cheaped out on the cartridges. -_-

Even if they did.the fact that Nintendo even allows this and offers a format wich is more expensive with less data capicity than competitors or in some cases their previous system is quite a big bite in the ass for third party
Publishers. This is only the beggining

 

[Weevilone]

I'm definitely grabbing this on PS4 instead of Switch. Nintendo should stop this crap.

It's bad enough that a rehash game was priced at 60 bucks. This is over the top.

 

[Gamezone]

I'm going to guess here but Master Chief Collection for X1
There was hub bub that it was a mandatory install due to Disc not having everything
Had to DL the rest

I maybe forgetting or recalling it differently, but I remember there was something really fucked up with MCC retail purchase

Just stop it with the Halo Collection. Like every other PS4/XBO game, the offline parts are completely playable.

 

[RichiRamjag]

Are you fucking kidding me? WB is a corporation not a charity. If it is a small cost then why does not Nintendo eat the difference? It's their system and its their shitty small storage + the higher cost of cartridges that is causing this issue. Of course you won't blame Nintendo because you are a fanboy. This is probably the dumbest post I have read on neogaf for a while and that says something.

I don't know... You're kind of exaggerating there. That's not really all that bad.

 

[TheSkullPrince]

Uh oh, have they said this about any other upcoming Switch games?

 

[Seil]

I'm definitely grabbing this on PS4 instead of Switch. Nintendo should stop this crap.

It's bad enough that a rehash game was priced at 60 bucks. This is over the top.

Your solution is to give the company at fault money elsewhere and blame Nintendo for the whole problem? lol

 

[Gamezone]

Tony Hawk 5 is just the demo on the disc with out the Day 1 download

It's not. I don't know where this rumor started. Buggy as hell, the complete game is on the disc. I've even tested it myself after many conflicting messages.

 

[Seil]

Uh oh, have they said this about any other upcoming Switch games?

No one's said it about any game. We only know this from the case. it's not information provided in any product description, even the eShop version is pretending to be a 7.1GB game with no mention of the extra download right now.

The whole thing is shady on top of being shitty.

 

[RichiRamjag]

Your solution is to give the company at fault money elsewhere and blame Nintendo for the whole problem? lol

That'll teach em!

 

[Seik]

Your solution is to give the company money elsewhere and blame Nintendo for the whole problem? lol

Well, while I didn't play it on the Wii U and have both a Switch and PS4, If the PS4 has the complete game on the disc, I'll naturally be inclined to go there.

If I or anyone want to diss WB while enjoying the game, simply buy the game later and used.

 

[Weevilone]

Your solution is to give the company at fault money elsewhere and blame Nintendo for the whole problem? lol

I'm not trying to punish myself and my kids so they can't play the game, out of some ill conceived plan to stick it to WB. My solution is to purchase it on a different format where I have 2TB of storage space. If by some unlikely chance they pull the same shit there it won't matter at all.

It sucks they did this and Nintendo should stop it because it's hurting their new platform. I thought I was fairly clear.

Would have liked to buy it on Switch.

 

[Gamezone]

No one's said it about any game. We only know this from the case. it's not information provided in any product description, even the eShop version is pretending to be a 7.1GB game with no mention of the extra download right now.

The whole thing is shady on top of being shitty.

And as already mentioned, the online description also doesn't mention this.

 

[Gamezone]

Media is picking up the news. Polygon also contacted WB.

http://www.polygon.com/platform/amp...city-undercover-download-size-nintendo-switch

 

[TheSkullPrince]

So what's really going on here then?

 

[Seil]

I'm not trying to punish myself and my kids so they can't play the game, out of some ill conceived plan to stick it to WB. My solution is to purchase it on a different format where I have 2TB of storage space. If by some unlikely chance they pull the same shit there it won't matter at all.

It sucks they did this and Nintendo should stop it because it's hurting their new platform. I thought I was fairly clear.

Would have liked to buy it on Switch.

Your post comes across as shifting the entirety of the blame on Nintendo. Even mentioning the price while saying you're just gonna buy it elsewhere. It's WB that decided to charge $60 for a port of a 4 year old game while leaving 2/3 of it off of the cart requiring a download. It sucks that Nintendo's allowed it but your post comes across as completely ignoring the real problem and wanting to just "stick it" to Nintendo. Which I found silly.

 

[shouamabane]

Media is picking up the news.

http://www.polygon.com/platform/amp...city-undercover-download-size-nintendo-switch

I don't mind paying extra for a cart. The LEGO City issue is worse to me.

 

[Undead Fantasy]

Media is picking up the news. Polygon also contacted WB.

http://www.polygon.com/platform/amp...city-undercover-download-size-nintendo-switch

Thank god. The Switch version deserves to flop hard.

 

[Gamezone]

So what's really going on here then?

Isn't it obvious? Low cartridge = cheaper. Make us download the rest. Make Switch collecting useless, and force us to buy more storage.

I was planning to buy my daughter a Switch, but I have to see if this becomes a trend before doing so.

 

[Weevilone]

Your post comes across as shifting the entirety of the blame on Nintendo. Even mentioning the price while saying you're just gonna buy it elsewhere. It's WB that decided to charge $60 for a port of a 4 year old game while leaving 2/3 of it off of the cart requiring a download. It sucks that Nintendo's allowed it but your post comes across as completely ignoring the real problem and wanting to just "stick it" to Nintendo. Which I found silly.

Whatever man, I just re-read my post and I don't see that at all. Sorry it wasn't clear, but no I don't think anyone should stick it to Nintendo. The Switch needs third party support.

I said Nintendo should stop that crap because they likely can prohibit 3rd parties from doing this. The price was irritating to begin with, so I mentioned it.

 

[Skyzard]

Nintendo certified this. Why wouldn't developers take advantage to cut costs.

 

[Seik]

Thank god. The Switch version deserves to flop hard.

Looking at your avatar...I hope Namco/Bandai won't choke like that when Xenoverse 2 will come out on Switch, I planned to buy this one as well. D:

 

[Seil]

Thank god. The Switch version deserves to flop hard.

The unfortunate thing, let's be honest, is that even if it did perform poorly they would just be deterred from supporting the Switch in the future. Because these companies never blame their own stupid decisions for lost sales.

 

[TheSkullPrince]

Isn't it obvious? Low cartridge = cheaper. Make us download the rest. Make Switch collecting useless, and force us to buy more storage.

I was planning to buy my daughter a Switch, but I have to see if this becomes a trend before doing so.

Oh damn. I really hope that isn't the case for anymore games.

 

[Seil]

Whatever man, I just re-read my post and I don't see that at all. Sorry it wasn't clear, but no I don't think anyone should stick it to Nintendo. The Switch needs third party support.

I said Nintendo should stop that crap because they likely can prohibit 3rd parties from doing this. The price was irritating to begin with, so I mentioned it.

When reading the post with your intention in mind, it makes sense. Without it, it can easily go either way since the Nintendo sentence can be read as saying Nintendo's pulling shit and they should stop. With no one else blamed for anything in the post, it's incredibly easy to read it as though it's focused on Nintendo.

 

[Undead Fantasy]

Looking at your avatar...I hope Namco/Bandai won't choke like that when Xenoverse 2 will come out on Switch, I planned to buy this one as well. D:

FUCK!!

I was looking forward to that version because it will include the DLC's but if they pull this shit I will just get it on PS4.

 

[BBboy20]

Passing the buck.

 

[hatchx]

Does the PS4/X1 version have a 13gb install I wonder?

 

[Gamezone]

Does the PS4/X1 version have a 13gb install I wonder?

The entire game is on there.

 

[Justified]

Does the PS4/X1 version have a 13gb install I wonder?

I'm sure the whole game is on the disc to install

 

[Saint Gregory]

Pretty unfortunate that this only came to light now, with a week left before launch there's nothing that can be done.

I was going to pass anyway since P5 is out the same day but I may not even get this down the road. I want the game but this is pretty anti consumer. What happens down the road if the eShop delists the 13GB download? The cart is worthless?

 

[DAREALGUMMY]

How much is the game?

 

[Seil]

How much is the game?

$59.99

 

[Gamezone]

Pretty unfortunate that this only came to light now, with a week left before launch there's nothing that can be done.

I was going to pass anyway since P5 is out the same day but I may not even get this down the road. I want the game but this is pretty anti consumer. What happens down the road if the eShop delists the 13GB download? The cart is worthless?

We can at least prevent future publishers from doing this.

 

[Eusis]

I wonder if that data is for the video files, and they're trying to pull a Quantum Break here or something? You get shit quality or no cutscenes unless you download the video files?

 

[AmyS]

Media is picking up the news. Polygon also contacted WB.

http://www.polygon.com/platform/amp...city-undercover-download-size-nintendo-switch

Thank god. The Switch version deserves to flop hard.

Venturebeat picking up the news as well:

Lego City Undercover is the latest game to struggle with Nintendo Switch's publishing costs

https://venturebeat.com/2017/03/27/...uggle-with-nintendo-switchs-publishing-costs/

The Nintendo Switch comes with about 26GB of free storage space, and Lego City Undercover could use at least half of that — even if you buy it on a cartridge.

What's especially noteworthy here is that the Switch does not install carts on its flash memory, so Warner Bros. could've included the entire game on the game card without forcing you to use the space on your system. But instead, it only included 7.1GB. you'll have to download the rest and keep it on the included storage or on an SD card.

I've asked Warner Bros. if this means the game card won't work if you don't connect to the internet, and I'll update this story if the company returns my request for a comment. But for now, I'd make sure you have plenty of space on your Switch if you're planning to get this game.

Based on the fine print on the box for Lego City Undercover, it seems possible that it won't work without first downloading that data. The game's box says "internet required" right on the front. And on the back of the box, a warning reads, "Up to 13GB storage required for game download."

For WB, this could be a response to the manufacturing cost of Nintendo Switch game cards.

The metal that goes into making Switch game cards is generally affordable, but larger games need a lot more of it. So a 32GB game is a lot more expensive to make than an 8GB game. This means that a publisher can save money by selling you a piece of the game on the physical format and then force you to download the rest on your own. While Lego City Undercover is the first time a company has tried this, Switch owners have already noticed pricing oddities for certain other releases before. The puzzle adventure Rime sells for $40 on Switch while it goes for $30 on other systems. And because of Nintendo's rules regarding digital and physical price parity, it also goes for $40 on the Nintendo eShop

I've reached out to Nintendo for a comment on this story, but absent a statement from the publisher, publishers likely have a four options when it comes to publishing games on Switch:

1. Publishers could eat the cost of releasing a game on the Switch at the same price as other platforms with all the data included on the card.

2. They could release their games only on the eShop and avoid the costs of manufacturing while also missing out on the wider audience that purchases physical games.

3. They could raise the price of their games and release the game on Switch at the same price as other platforms.

4. Or they could keep their price the same as other platforms but only included a fiscally reasonable amount of data on the game cards.

 

[Stealthcobra]

Well, PS4 version it is then. Damn shame, because i looked forward to playing this on the switch :/

Yep me too... Will not support this practice

 

[Gamezone]

I wonder if that data is for the video files, and they're trying to pull a Quantum Break here or something? You get shit quality or no cutscenes unless you download the video files?

Quantum Break was also completely playable without the cutscenes. They weren't really necessary too. The in-game provides you with enough story.

 

[Astral Dog]

I wonder if that data is for the video files, and they're trying to pull a Quantum Break here or something? You get shit quality or no cutscenes unless you download the video files?

Internet required

 

[MemoryHumanity]

All my PS4 and XB1 physical games have massive installs and day one patches, too. Uncharted 4 takes up 50GB, even with the disc. I'm really not seeing the difference here. Why's this new? Why are people flipping out over this?