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Doctor Who Series 10 |OT| He's Back, and It's About Time

The Doctor believes he just failed to save Bill and Missy. He also failed to sacrifice himself on the floor. He survived and somehow ended up on the TARDIS. He's remembering his last two regenerations (I don't want to go and I'll always remember when The Doctor was me) and is reluctant to start over and go through all the motions again.

I'm sure the Christmas special will touch on it more.
 
iFirez said:
Interestingly, I had a long conversation with some friends the other day about another popular UK property - James Bond. I've always compared the two for being long running series which replace their titular characters actor - albeit in different ways. The Doctor is always, technically, the same character but changed his face in lieu of death; sacrificing who he is at that moment but continuing to do what the doctor does. While Bond is more ambiguous, different spies of different eras, given the same code (007) and I've always always assumed that they took on the moniker of 'James Bond' as their alias. But i suppose this is less likely and we're just seeing the same character (James Bond) played by different actors to tell unique stories and its not nearly as complex as my mind thought.
Click to expand...

Connery --> Lazenby --> Moore are all the same character in the same timeline.

Dalton & Brosnan had the same things happen to them, but presumably in an updated timeline (i.e. assume all the events of the 60s/70s/80s movies happened in the 80s for Brosnan) so that the continuity makes sense with the actors' ages.

Craig's Bond is a confirmed reboot.
 
Has anyone heard details on Series 11 beyond who the new Doctor is? I remember reading something about moving to a more serialized story line with a writing room.
 
Pattycakes said:
Has anyone heard details on Series 11 beyond who the new Doctor is? I remember reading something about moving to a more serialized story line with a writing room.
Click to expand...

We don't know when they're going to start shooting. We don't know much beyond that rumour with regards to the writing room, and Chibbers making a comment about how the BBC told him they want him to take risks and do something different.
 
plagiarize said:
We don't know when they're going to start shooting. We don't know much beyond that rumour with regards to the writing room, and Chibbers making a comment about how the BBC told him they want him to take risks and do something different.
Click to expand...

Please yes! Take risks and do something different! It's badly needed.
 
The Amy / Rory thing is nonsense anyway. The Doctor could have still gotten them and then went forward in time to create the gravestones for his past self to see. A closed loop.
 
Platy said:
11 could not go back to Amy and Rory because he saw their graves.

So saving them would change that part of his timeline
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Or he could go back in time and put fake gravestones there?

Napoleonthechimp said:
The Amy / Rory thing is nonsense anyway. The Doctor could have still gotten them and then went forward in time to create the gravestones for his past self to see. A closed loop.
Click to expand...

Exactly. It's all nonsense.
 
thefro said:
Connery --> Lazenby --> Moore are all the same character in the same timeline.
Click to expand...

Depends if you consider David Niven in Casino Royale canon or not.
Its an officially licenced adaptation of an Ian Fleming novel and has James Bond fighting SMERSH (which is closer to the source material than SPECTRE is)
 
If Clara can get pulled from her moment of death and then be allowed (potentially millions of) years to arse around across time and space in a TARDIS before going back to die then the Doctor can pull Amy and Rory from time and put them back years later.

So really... they just wanted to write the two of them out without much fuss.
 
Napoleonthechimp said:
If Clara can get pulled from her moment of death and then be allowed (potentially millions of years) to arse around across time and space in a TARDIS before going back to die then the Doctor can pull Amy and Rory from time and put them back years later.
Click to expand...

Now that I think about it, that's the last two companions that basically ended the same way, flying about/adventuring in space for forever basically. What happened to the pre-Amy/Rory companions? It's been so long since I went back and rewatched.
 
Pattycakes said:
Now that I think about it, that's the last two companions that basically ended the same way, flying about/adventuring in space for forever basically. What happened to the pre-Amy/Rory companions? It's been so long since I went back and rewatched.
Click to expand...

IIRC
Donna got mindwiped and re-integrated into her family.
Martha turned into a Torchwood badass.
Rose is in Pete's World with Handy Doc.

The classic series is another story.
 
LordRaptor said:
Depends if you consider David Niven in Casino Royale canon or not.
Its an officially licenced adaptation of an Ian Fleming novel and has James Bond fighting SMERSH (which is closer to the source material than SPECTRE is)
Click to expand...

If that's cannon, so is the TV version of Casino Royale with the American Jimmy Bond and his British connection, Clarence Leiter. So, no.

The books have both SMERSH and SPECTRE, for what it's worth.
 
Pattycakes said:
What would be an example of a risk or something different that they could do with the show?
Click to expand...

- Female Doctor
- No companion
- Cut the weekly "the Doctor had a masterplan all along" crap
- Cut the weekly "oh no is the Doctor going to die?" crap
- Introduce frightening enemies that the Doctor can't easily get rid off
- Give these enemies understandable motives
- Don't be afraid to kill off important characters
- Introduce meaningful consequences to the Doctor's actions
- Have the Doctor express a wider range of emotions (let them cry from time to time)
- In general: Less cheese, more seriousness
 
Pattycakes said:
Has anyone heard details on Series 11 beyond who the new Doctor is? I remember reading something about moving to a more serialized story line with a writing room.
Click to expand...

We basically know the sum of bugger and all. There was a rumour that Chibnall wanted to move to a writer's room, which was fuelled further when Mathieson said in an AMA that he hadn't been approached about writing for the next series, possibly because Chibnall wants to work with the people he's worked with before. But that's not confirmed - probably because all of that is happening right now

It's not even been confirmed when they're filming but at this point it seems they are aiming for an autumn air date next year - Radio Times reckon they start filming early 2018. I believe someone said the approach they were taking is writing the scripts with their idea of a Doctor in mind and then casting an actor to fit that. Wouldn't put too much stock in any rumours we hear until we know they're having auditions.
 
takriel said:
- Female Doctor
- No companion
- Cut the weekly "the Doctor had a masterplan all along" crap
- Cut the weekly "oh no is the Doctor going to die?" crap
- Introduce frightening enemies that the Doctor can't easily get rid off
- Give these enemies understandable motives
- Don't be afraid to kill off important characters
- Introduce meaningful consequences to the Doctor's actions
- Have the Doctor express a wider range of emotions (let them cry from time to time)
- In general: Less cheese, more seriousness
Click to expand...

Those all sound like great changes, although the companion is kind of iconic.

tomtom94 said:
We basically know the sum of bugger and all. There was a rumour that Chibnall wanted to move to a writer's room, which was fuelled further when Mathieson said in an AMA that he hadn't been approached about writing for the next series, possibly because Chibnall wants to work with the people he's worked with before. But that's not confirmed - probably because all of that is happening right now

It's not even been confirmed when they're filming but at this point it seems they are aiming for an autumn air date next year - Radio Times reckon they start filming early 2018. I believe someone said the approach they were taking is writing the scripts with their idea of a Doctor in mind and then casting an actor to fit that. Wouldn't put too much stock in any rumours we hear until we know they're having auditions.
Click to expand...

Isn't the new Doctor supposed to be revealed at the Christmas special which AFAIK is already filming/filmed? Wouldn't they need to know who the new Doctor is already for that?
 
Pattycakes said:
What would be an example of a risk or something different that they could do with the show?
Click to expand...

Black Ginger Female Doctor with a Welsh accent.

TBH I am up for something new and I bet other are too. That makes Bills departure all the more upsetting. I really liked her character and to have her in and out in one series feels very short sighted.

I mean what was her character arc? Was it to learn to explore new things? She already had that at the start of the series. We just got to know her and bye bye.
 
Pattycakes said:
Isn't the new Doctor supposed to be revealed at the Christmas special which AFAIK is already filming/filmed? Wouldn't they need to know who the new Doctor is already for that?
Click to expand...

Bradley's scenes for Doctor Falls were filmed early last month, so strictly speaking they could wait until December. Although I suspect they'll lock it down a bit earlier so they can tinker with the scripts.
 
So apparently
a former companion
is returning for the Christmas Special.... it's
.......Clara.......
 
Pattycakes said:
What would be an example of a risk or something different that they could do with the show?
Click to expand...

Doctor Woof.

DrEvil said:
So apparently
a former companion
is returning for the Christmas Special.... it's
.......Clara.......
Click to expand...

This would not surprise me, since there's been a bit of a tradition of late for 'signature companions' being in some way around for the regeneration; I was already fully expecting it.
 
Pattycakes said:
Please no
Click to expand...


Yup. And
Bill and Nardole
too.



Bill is expected to appear “in some form” during the Christmas special along with Matt Lucas as Nardole but neither will return for the next series under new showrunner Chris Chibnall.

The source says: “Bill and Nardole are due to get brief appearances but they could be clips or flashbacks from earlier episodes.
 
takriel said:
- Female Doctor
- No companion
- Cut the weekly "the Doctor had a masterplan all along" crap
- Cut the weekly "oh no is the Doctor going to die?" crap
- Introduce frightening enemies that the Doctor can't easily get rid off
- Give these enemies understandable motives
- Don't be afraid to kill off important characters
- Introduce meaningful consequences to the Doctor's actions
- Have the Doctor express a wider range of emotions (let them cry from time to time)
- In general: Less cheese, more seriousness
Click to expand...

So close to a pitch-perfect list in my eyes.
 
takriel said:
That "I don't want to go" mentality came out of nowhere and doesn't really make sense considering what we know about Capaldi's Doctor.
Click to expand...

He had a really rough time establishing his identity this incarnation. Basically the whole of series 8 was him trying to figure it out, when usually it takes a Doctor a couple episodes. I totally buy him not wanting to go through it again considering how much he struggled with his identity after his last regeneration.

And I love the angle with the first Doctor. Takes me back to when this Doctor was wondering if he even was the Doctor anymore after regenerating so many times. No better way to discuss that problem than with the original Doctor that had to come to terms with it. They'll both be helping each other with it together probably.

DrEvil said:
So apparently
a former companion
is returning for the Christmas Special.... it's
.......Clara.......
Click to expand...

If that's true then just shoot me now.
 
Isn't Moffat also writing the Xmas Special though? So he still has one more ep to do, basically.


I'm sure we will get more insanity out of that since he gets to pen and shoot the regeneration et al.
 
I'm surprised to see this getting such positive reception, I didn't like it as a send off for Bill and I don't really like it it's a standoff for the Capaldi's Doctor or the Master either, even though he has a Christmas special still.

Is another example of a great first half that has some cool ideas to get ultimately squandered or underused in the second
 
DrEvil said:
So apparently
a former companion
is returning for the Christmas Special.... it's
.......Clara.......
Click to expand...

This is according to the Mirror, for the curious. They have got some stuff right but some stuff wrong in the past. I can't remember if the Marshall rumour - which now seems to be at least partially incorrect given he was supposed to appear in series 10 - started with them or not.

EDIT: Considering Bradley filmed his scenes earlier this month to throw people off the scent, I wonder if the Marshall rumour was deliberate misdirection by the BBC. If it is then that's pretty funny.
 
My only wishlist item for S11 is to bring back Confidential! I was not a huge fan of RTD's run but I loved that he had that companion show around, and was always (or nearly always) available for each of those episodes to talk through that week's Who. There was a particularly great one they did for Blink, which had basically nothing to do with Blink, and was just 30-40 minutes of Tennant, RTD, and someone else (I think Moffat?) reminiscing about their Who memories and how they got into the show.
 
takriel said:
- Female Doctor
- No companion
- Cut the weekly "the Doctor had a masterplan all along" crap
- Cut the weekly "oh no is the Doctor going to die?" crap
- Introduce frightening enemies that the Doctor can't easily get rid off
- Give these enemies understandable motives
- Don't be afraid to kill off important characters
- Introduce meaningful consequences to the Doctor's actions
- Have the Doctor express a wider range of emotions (let them cry from time to time)
- In general: Less cheese, more seriousness
Click to expand...

I hope they look at this list, print it, frame it and then LAUGH at it for the next 10 years. The last point in particular.
 
takriel said:
- Female Doctor
- No companion
- Cut the weekly "the Doctor had a masterplan all along" crap
- Cut the weekly "oh no is the Doctor going to die?" crap
- Introduce frightening enemies that the Doctor can't easily get rid off
- Give these enemies understandable motives
- Don't be afraid to kill off important characters
- Introduce meaningful consequences to the Doctor's actions
- Have the Doctor express a wider range of emotions (let them cry from time to time)
- In general: Less cheese, more seriousness
Click to expand...

Well aside from "no companion" you described the 9th Doctor's run.

So yes, more of that please.
 
Blader said:
My only wishlist item for S11 is to bring back Confidential! I was not a huge fan of RTD's run but I loved that he had that companion show around, and was always (or nearly always) available for each of those episodes to talk through that week's Who. There was a particularly great one they did for Blink, which had basically nothing to do with Blink, and was just 30-40 minutes of Tennant, RTD, and someone else (I think Moffat?) reminiscing about their Who memories and how they got into the show.
Click to expand...

They should just promote the Doctor Who Fan Show a bit more and expand it appropriately.
 
I don't think emotional range has ever really been a problem for the Doctor, so I think that's an odd request for a change. The companion thing would be interesting, but I doubt they'd dump it. The Doctor-Companion dynamic is one of the cornerstones of the series.

The rest of that list is sound though.
 
I hope the big changes that have been planned for the upcoming series results to more than just having The Doctor be of a different gender or ethnicity. I know that would be big to some people, but to me, changes like those would feel very insignificant.

Takriel's list has some pretty interesting suggestions.
 
DrEvil said:
So apparently
a former companion
is returning for the Christmas Special.... it's
.......Clara.......
Click to expand...

This is only acceptable if she fucks off and dies. Painfully. Go away Clara and stay away. It's going to be her when she was going through all his lives in that stream.
 
Blader said:
uhh, the Ninth Doctor's run was less cheese? It was probably the worst offender in all of modern Who on that front.
Click to expand...

Nah, excluding the farting aliens and the burping bin, it was probably the most darkest and most grounded for me.

What a sentence I just typed.
 
Podge293 said:
However the interaction between missy and the master I felt heavily indicated the next doctor would be female. Could just be my imagination tho
Click to expand...

Nah, this finale definitely had hints dropped.

But then you balance that against Chibnall's comments where he used the word "Gimmick" (or a variation on it) in response to a question about making the Doctor a woman, and it starts to seem unlikely again.
 
SpaceWolf said:
Nah, excluding the farting aliens and the burping bin, it was probably the most darkest and most grounded for me.

What a sentence I just typed.
Click to expand...

I've been rewatching it, and it other than some odd comic stuff (bins, farts, Cassandra) it is pretty grounded. I'm surprised by how good it is.

Worth noting that I can zero for production values if the story and actors are compelling. Because the effects are pretty terrible.
 
Ignatz Mouse said:
I've been rewatching it, and it other than some odd comic stuff (bins, farts, Cassandra) it is pretty grounded. I'm surprised by how good it is.

Worth noting that I can zero for production values if the story and actors are compelling. Because the effects are pretty terrible.
Click to expand...

It is a well-known fact at this point that the director for the first production block (which included Rose and the Slitheen episodes) was something of a hack with ideas above his station and an obsession with slapstick and physical comedy.
 
Podge293 said:
For some reason I thought it was confirmed a female doctor would be next. Doesn't seem like it was.


However the interaction between missy and the master I felt heavily indicated the next doctor would be female. Could just be my imagination tho
Click to expand...

Probably Moffat leaving a mark and steering the ship in the direction he'd like it to go before someone else takes the wheel, though that's not necessarily where the next Captain will take it. He crafted the door and then he opened it so that it would be easier for someone to walk through it in the future (but not necessarily the near future) .

That's my theory, anyway. I don't think a female 13th Doctor is a sure thing, even with how much it's been hinted at. That's up to Chib, not Moff.
 
Mixed feelings about the finale 2-parter.

+ Not a world/universe ending finale. Technically the colony ship is kind of a world, but it feels more like a regular save the day adventure (even if we are left not really saving the day).
+ Best version of Moffat's "I waited for X years" trope. Rory's Last Centurion probably paid off more emotionally, but I really appreciated the black whole being the justification for this one.
+ I like the Doctor's angry regeneration, but it's difficult for me to justify why he's so against it
+ Missy's waffling was really believable to me, much moreso than if she had straight up on the Doctor's side. She doesn't know whose side she is on or what she is doing.
+ Missy pretending to be The Doctor for a while was hilarious but...

- indulgent. The episode felt very indulgent from Missy calling the companions exposition and comic relief to The Doctor saying 9-11s regeneration lines.
- Very much an episode you can't think too much about. For example, why did the crew members who went down to reverse the engines start living down there? And are we really to believe none of them understood black holes enough to predict the time dilation?
- Pacing was very messy in the second part.
- Water girl payoff for me was somewhat unearned. I didn't like the premier much as a story, and water girl's magic powers feel very much like deux ex Moffina. But I guess that's a fitting way to close out Moffat's run.

Anyway, overall I liked this series very much tonally and a little less so week-to-week. I was weirdly proud of Moffat being able to "walk it back" in terms of the grandstanding and end-of-the-universe stuff and do some more personal stories. Everything came back to people this time around, whether The Doctor, Bill or Missy, and that was to the better.
 
My one request is to not have a young working class modern day British girl as the companion. I mean, Rose, Martha, Amy, Clara, Bill, it's a bit too much of a pattern (Donna was a little different in how she was presented). Try something new. Bill being the first one not in love with the Doctor was refreshing but still, cut from the same cloth.
Someone like Nardole as the main companion would be fresh and fun.

I get the "audience surrogate for the Doctor to explain things to" but you gotta change things up some time.
 
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