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Jim Sterling: Microsoft, You Greedy Wankers! Let's Talk Forza 7...

This isn't an across-the-board dismissal of the criticisms (I WANT this sort of pressure against publishers), but I always raise an eyebrow when a game getting criticized for its publisher removing and selling back content is the one with the most "core" content in basically a whole genre.
 
TrumanBurbank said:
Love how you ran to this post and posted super fast to get in your hate.

Master troll.
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Not really in just don't think one persons opinion is any sort of definitive answer. And he did try to say it would be great possibly before release, point being it's still just his idea.

I guess you are trolling me with this.
 
chronic_archaic said:
I can't remember if I'm out of touch with Jim or he always did videos on AAA bullshit or indie game scandal bullshit every damn week.
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What's wrong with that if the issues keep coming up. Ignore, check out his other stuff, someone else's stuff. He isn't beating a dead horse here, gaming is going down the drain with this crap and it's getting worse with each passing month, year.
 
Feels like loot boxes will be in every game soon.

Some of the ideas in that loot box idea thread we had last week even sound reasonable/plausible at this point.
 
where's the guy with the crying microsoft fanboy avatar to tell us how we're all wrong and we need to stop bullying microsoft
 
I earn 100,000CR a race and clicking “Quick Mod”.

Also, you don’t use Mods to change time of day.

Gestault said:
This isn't an across-the-board dismissal of the criticisms (I WANT this sort of pressure against publishers), but I always raise an eyebrow when a game getting criticized for its publisher removing and selling back content is the one with the most "core" content in basically a whole genre.
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That’s true...sadly.
 
In a way, the exact same thing is happening with Metroid: Samus Returns / Nintendo.

Unlocking a difficulty and art gallery ? Buy an amiibo (four if you want the complete galleries). Remember when you could unlock Hypermode in Metroid Prime 3: Corruption ? Complete the game on Hard. Don't buy an amiibo.
 
Jack The Nipper said:
Not really in just don't think one persons opinion is any sort of definitive answer. And he did try to say it would be great possibly before release, point being it's still just his idea.

I guess you are trolling me with this.
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Jim speaks for a lot of us. And we gladly lend our voice to him, because we know his voice travels far enough for our concerns to be heard.
 
But how will this ever stop? Reviewers stepping up and lowering scores on full-priced games with Microtransactions? Hmm, maybe that might make a dent but it's so unlikely to occur it's almost not worth mentioning.

The real stopping force would be people not buying the game, and also somehow communicating that they AREN'T buying the game because of these shit practices. And I'm ashamed to say there's some Microtransaction apologists on GAF, but even for us fighting the good fight, I don't think it's enough.
 
Golgo 13 said:
But how will this ever stop? Reviewers stepping up and lowering scores on full-priced games with Microtransactions? Hmm, maybe that might make a dent but it's so unlikely to occur it's almost not worth mentioning.

The real stopping force would be people not buying the game, and also somehow communicating that they AREN'T buying the game because of these shit practices. And I'm ashamed to say there's some Microtransaction apologists on GAF, but even for us fighting the good fight, I don't think it's enough.
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I’d like Fifa to get less points cuz of FUT...but no-one will.
 
I was just about to post this. I don't usually like Jim's stuff but I think he gets several points across well in this video.

Basically the whole career mode is geared around opening a lootboxes to get items that enable you to earn more credits in order to get another loot box ∞

People saying "oh well I'm having no problem getting credits" are failing to realise that it's because they are trapped in the system exactly as they intended you to be. The moment you loop out and stop opening the loot boxes is the moment credits start becoming harder to come by. That's bullshit. Especially considering they took away the risk/reward bonus system (with the assists) that enabled you to earn more credits simply through pushing yourself and by getting better at the game (as it should be!).

Sure, you can earn decent credits by doing longer races and by increasing the difficulty up to one of the top two options but not everybody has the skill or the time (or both) to do that, and they know it.

In this system nobody wins.

And that's not even getting into the whole driver gear rubbish which is entirely pointless and only exists to sell lootboxes/microtransactions. Oh and there happens to be an achievement attached to them as well.

MouldyK said:
I earn 100,000CR a race and clicking “Quick Mod”.

Also, you don’t use Mods to change time of day.



That’s true...sadly.
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I've got one that can turn a day race into a night race sitting in my current mods list.
 
Oh man he didn't hold back. Scummy move. Funny thing is, GT used to do it and have stopped doing it after the backlash. For Turn 10 to do the opposite is stupid af.
 
Here we go. Thanks in advance Jim, just about to watch as I'm currently posting in a Forza VIP topic...

edit: Decent bashing of Turn 10. He did surprisingly forget to point out the VIP bait and switch, only mentioned assists.
 
Golgo 13 said:
But how will this ever stop? Reviewers stepping up and lowering scores on full-priced games with Microtransactions? Hmm, maybe that might make a dent but it's so unlikely to occur it's almost not worth mentioning.

The real stopping force would be people not buying the game, and also somehow communicating that they AREN'T buying the game because of these shit practices. And I'm ashamed to say there's some Microtransaction apologists on GAF, but even for us fighting the good fight, I don't think it's enough.
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It won't stop because the general public buy this stuff. They wouldn't be putting it in games if people didn't buy it. And quite honestly it doesn't seem to both the general public.
 
Oh good Jim did a video about this, gonna watch it at lunch lol.

I refunded my Ultimate edition copy this morning coz of this bullshit.

It’s a damn shame too coz there is a fun game underneath it... but it ain’t worth it right now. Maybe when the game is a tenner, especially if they decide to keep the bullshit.
 
Great video by Jim as always. The kicking your hat analogy was rather apt. AAA devs don't need this to make money, they need it to make MORE money. The more money they make, the more they pour into crap like this. The more microtransactions they push, the more money they make, so they cut more things out and sell them back to you...to make even more money.
 
GHG said:
I I've got one that can turn a night race into a day race sitting in my current mods list.
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It does not...it gives you more CR if it’s a Night Race.

I use a few “Rain in the Rain” ones as the game recommends it...only for it to start wet and not rain...so I get no extra CR.

sems4arsenal said:
Oh man he didn't hold back. Scummy move. Funny thing is, GT used to do it and have stopped doing it after the backlash. For Turn 10 to do the opposite is stupid af.
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Or they didn’t do it for GT because you can’t do it with 200 cars without looking worse haha.

Though the Backgrounds you put cars in could be Loot Boxes if they wanted....
 
Golgo 13 said:
But how will this ever stop? Reviewers stepping up and lowering scores on full-priced games with Microtransactions? Hmm, maybe that might make a dent but it's so unlikely to occur it's almost not worth mentioning.

The real stopping force would be people not buying the game, and also somehow communicating that they AREN'T buying the game because of these shit practices. And I'm ashamed to say there's some Microtransaction apologists on GAF, but even for us fighting the good fight, I don't think it's enough.
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There might be merit to the reviewer thing though, 2k contacted a very very small website (The Six Axis?) whose reach is nooooo where near the likes of IGN, Gamespot or I'll hazard a guess and say not even Jim Sterling yet when they fucked up that Metacritic score it bothered the publisher enough to react.
 
LastGamer84 said:
Great video by Jim as always. The kicking your hat analogy was rather apt. AAA devs don't need this to make money, they need it to make MORE money. The more money they make, the more they pour into crap like this. The more microtransactions they push, the more money they make, so they cut more things out and sell them back to you...to make even more money.
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They decided to spend money on bringing people in (or hiring consultants) to fine tune this loot crate system they have instead of hiring people to improve the AI or to make the weather/TOD system extend across all tracks. How about do some animated pit stops instead of this loot crate stuff you've put so much effort into? That would be nice as well...

https://youtu.be/JPlpJaY6zpg
 
I think he missed a few points, but the sentiment is the same. The one thing that really got to me was how car progression has been gated and just how egregious they are with the changes to the game's economy. There are a lot of things from previous Forza games that Turn 10 decided to change and or remove entirely from the game just to make their prize packs. Want that awesome car and have the credits for it? Too bad you've not collected enough cars to level up your collection to get the opportunity to buy that car. But if you use those credits on a lucky prize pack you might have the opportunity to get it. So what will it be, you either take a chance or you wait and continue to spend more time in the games loop. There is no winning with this game, even the driver levels have car unlocks that don't give you the cars but rather give you discounts. It's little changes like that which have made me so sour, and that's before I even get into the VIP stuff.
 
BeardyChan said:
I think he missed a few points, but the sentiment is the same. The one thing that really got to me was how car progression has been gated and just how egregious they are with the changes to the game's economy. There are a lot of things from previous Forza games that Turn 10 decided to change and or remove entirely from the game just to make their prize packs. Want that awesome car and have the credits for it? Too bad you've not collected enough cars to level up your collection to get the opportunity to buy that car. But if you use those credits on a lucky prize pack you might have the opportunity to get it. So what will it be, you either take a chance or you wait and continue to spend more time in the games loop. There is no winning with this game, even the driver levels have car unlocks that don't give you the cars but rather give you discounts. It's little changes like that which have made me so sour, and that's before I even get into the VIP stuff.
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Holy shit I've just worked out what you are saying about how the tier system fits into the loot boxes.

This is a finely tuned machine that always loops you back to the loot boxes.
 
Completely agree with him. If they didn't make VIP status a consumable and remove the credit bonuses you get for raising the difficulty, I wouldn't be so bothered by this. I wouldn't have even taken advantage of the VIP boost and I'm still bothered by it.
 
Great episode, Jim.

I'd actually completely forgotten that Robin Williams Popeye movie existed... but yeah, on point some of what I've been reading on here about this game's cash grabbing has been pretty awful and also the amount of blinkered defense forcing such practices seems to be attracting kind of appalling (If totally unsurprising from certain gaffers of course), but I didn't quite realise it was quite as bad as what was described in this video. Just glad I've always found the Forza series to be pretty boring and never bothered too much with it.
 
I agree with him and everyone the loot boxes in Forza 7 are terrible, but they were in Forza 6 as well. They weren’t as terrible, but there were definitely loot boxes in Forza 6.
 
Lutherian said:
In a way, the exact same thing is happening with Metroid: Samus Returns / Nintendo.

Unlocking a difficulty and art gallery ? Buy an amiibo (four if you want the complete galleries). Remember when you could unlock Hypermode in Metroid Prime 3: Corruption ? Complete the game on Hard. Don't buy an amiibo.
Click to expand...
We didnt had a real metroid game for a long time so i am ok with it.
 
GHG said:
Holy shit I've just worked out what you are saying about how the tier system fits into the loot boxes.

This is a finely tuned machine that always loops you back to the loot boxes.
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Yup, perfect player retention, but that's what people seem to want these days, I guess it keeps people engaged.
 
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