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[Culex]

When/if OT returns, are we really not having political threads? Because I really enjoyed those threads!

 

[JordanN]

That sucks. Maybe Evilore can stabilize things but at the moment the gamergaters are taking root and they're being pretty blatant about it. Hopefully the pool of mods Evilore can choose from doesn't include them.

This place will never be GamerGate.

What's happening are the extremist voices of NeoGaf are voluntarily offing themselves from the forum.

But the more moderate voices are being brought forward.

I can now understand why the site is now returning to a Gaming pure format. People need to get a grip over themselves when finally talking about video games. No more hyperbole that twist themselves into intangible monsters.

Just start from the basics, and when people can finally discuss at least one topic peacefully without calling someone a Nazi, then I think we could see a return of the off-topic.

 

[ExVicis]

Glad you care about hypocrites huh. What a shitshow.

It's too fucking late now. The posters supporting him already made up their fucking minds. It's one groupthink for another. Damn.

I never fully made up my mind about that story. It sounds...plausible but I've never known Crossing Eden to bring in moderators, having even been on the other side of discussions from them.

But I began to suspect his story a little bit when I saw that it was clearly being talked about on one of those anti-GAF reddits in a thread.

 

[crazyturtle]

Man didn't know he really does hate bronies, whats up with that?

Im surprised i didn't get banned:

 

[RastaMentality]

Is gamergater a term you use for everyone you disagree with or is it a verbal tic you're seeking therapy for in the near future?

This is ableist. Find a better way to express disagreement with the member instead of resorting to ableism.

 

[ZeoVGM]

I have a theory that gamergaters just plain won't make for good gaming thread content.

These are people who destroy. They do not create.

Well said.

 

[Jeffolation]

I dunno, people say Neogaf is dead, but this thread sure feels like classic Neogaf to me.

It's like the ending of Brazil.

 

[Culex]

It's like the ending of Brazil.

Or the ending to Seinfeld where we are all arguing in a jail cell.

 

[Subpar Spatula]

Is gamergater a term you use for everyone you disagree with or is it a verbal tic you're seeking therapy for in the near future?

Naw, it's people who want their toxic views to be welcomed. Heck, they're so glad OT is gone because you weren't allowed dissenting opinions but guess what? Removing social and political discussions, ya know, removes dissenting opinions. They're not being straight with their logic because they only want to get back at the damn SJWs for ruining games.

Like, look at them coming en masse complaining about being banned for "just disagreeing". They even claim they're not like the one guy who attacked Anita's credibility and he still won't accept he did that. This is about normalizing and wanting to make their behavior OK on NeoGAF because it never was before. It's not wrong to call them out when they so blatantly participate in the gamergate rhetoric.

 

[AALLx]

I never fully made up my mind about that story. It sounds...plausible but I've never known Crossing Eden to bring in moderators, having even been on the other side of discussions from them.

But I began to suspect his story a little bit when I saw that it was clearly being talked about on one of those anti-GAF reddits in a thread.

That one part is me jumping to conclusions. Since CrossingEden stated that it wasn't the case, then I apologize for it. The other ones I stand by as how I interpreted the events.

 

[Jack The Nipper]

Put some money into the site, make some major changes, fresh look and some features that people want (such as mobile being better)

 

[nintendork666]

When/if OT returns, are we really not having political threads? Because I really enjoyed those threads!

You're not alone, my friend.

 

[Foffy]

This place will never be GamerGate.

What's happening are the extremist voices of NeoGaf are voluntarily offing themselves from the forum.

But the more moderate voices are being brought forward.

I can now understand why the site is now returning to a Gaming pure format. People need to get a grip over themselves when finally talking about video games. No more hyperbole that twist themselves into intangible monsters.

Just start from the basics, and when people can finally discuss at least one topic peacefully without calling someone a Nazi, then I think we could see a return of the off-topic.

So people upset with the admins history relating to this problem are all extremists?

You sound like the archetype of what people criticize NeoGAF about. Opposition is seem as extremism.

 

[ExVicis]

why is it that every member here claiming to be a victim of poor moderation is actually in the wrong

could it be that they simply lack self awareness

I gave mine but I never claimed to be a victim or that I really cared about it anymore. Just that it was a very flimsy reason for a ban.

 

[RastaMentality]

"Ableist? Me? My brother is wheelchair bound. Stop throwing around buzzwords and labeling people just because you disagree with them!"

This is the kind of mindset I can't understand.

 

[autoduelist]

I'd like to hear some of these opinions and perspectives of yours that never made the final cut because of fear of banishment or persecution from other GAF members.

Let's see some of them and have an honest discussion since the shields are down, so to speak.

You don't get it, do you? See, even here, you subtly accuse me of being some closet Nazi.

Let's see. I've been promoting generally anarchist, anti-capitalistic ideals for decades. That said, I do understand some of the benefits of both hierarchy and capitalism... it's not a cut and dried issue, especially when you take the present state of humanity into consideration. I'm pro love, and support you loving whoever the hell you want to love. I support legalization, even though I don't do drugs. I support privacy. I think our criminal system is antiquated and broken, with a fair amount of racism baked in [coke vs crack, etc]. I think prisons themselves create more problems than they solve and that we need to find a better solution than breaking up families. I've supported some sort of universal basic income solution for decades before it became hip, though I recognize there are significant economic issues that would need to be resolved and it's not a simple solution. I think both major parties in the US are anti-people and pro-big business. I think my taxes support murder overseas, and it pains me to pay them. I don't care what your religion is [or anything else], I only care about our interactions. I believe in being kind. I believe in personal responsibility, though that doesn't mean I believe people shouldn't work together to help everyone. I believe in open borders [heck, I don't even like the concept of borders]. I don't care where you were born, or what language you speak. If I see someone in trouble, I will try to help them. I've been part of cooperatives, I try to shop local [except gaming], I am anti-violence and anti-war. I love cats.

How long of an essay do I need to write before I'm 'okay'. Did I pass your purity test yet?

Oh, by the way, remember when you already implied I was some sort of Nazi because I feel like I can't express my opinions? Have you noticed you embody exactly what I say the problem was? I spoke up... so I must be the enemy, right?

But let's see -- you asked to "hear some of these opinions" that people are afraid to discuss. Okay, that's easy. Mention free speech, get treated like a Nazi [in fact, that's what got me involved in this conversation thread]. Talk about presumption of innocence, and you're propagating rape culture. Ask a question, and you'll get a response like "Oh, just questions. Riiiight. I see through you." Criticize Clinton and you'll be called a white supremacist Trump supporter. Man, I've hated Trump and everything he stood for from before he was a celebrity. I despise Clinton, too, though.

No. I've been fighting the fight for decades. Longer than people in their twenties have been alive. But that doesn't mean I support the culture of accusation you clearly participate in.

You assume the worst. Oh, he's defending free speech? What awful things do you want to say? The only awful thing I want to say is that your style of attack is gross.

Discussion is important. Discussion allows me to talk about things important to me, like the problem with our prison systems. But what people do here is try to shut others down with accusations, subtle and not-so-subtle, just like you did. That's ugly. That doesn't encourage growth and debate, it shuts it down.

 

[Wolfgunblood Garopa]

So, what is the state of NeoGAF? All I can see is the more likable / progressive posters leaving en masse. You then have this silent group coming up and starting to lay the foundation to normalize their views by believing themselves to be victims of oppression. They clearly don't care about context or believe that their words carried harmful weight. You got all the key terms like, "safe place", "SFW", "wrong-think", "witch hunts", "disagreement bans". Like, they clearly only care about getting back at them damn SJWs *shakes fist in the air* and not dissent because avenues for dissent are being removed entirely. Is this the current and future state? That sucks. Maybe Evilore can stabilize things but at the moment the gamergaters are taking root and they're being pretty blatant about it. Hopefully the pool of mods Evilore can choose from doesn't include them.

I get where you're coming from, but that is a highly unlikely scenario. It's just weird right now. Things will settle down. New members will fill the void left by people leaving, and they'll make it great just like the members that are leaving did.

 

[valkyre]

You don't get it, do you? See, even here, you subtly accuse me of being some closet Nazi.

Let's see. I've been promoting generally anarchist, anti-capitalistic ideals for decades. That said, I do understand some of the benefits of both hierarchy and capitalism... it's not a cut and dried issue, especially when you take the present state of humanity into consideration. I'm pro love, and support you loving whoever the hell you want to love. I support legalization, even though I don't do drugs. I support privacy. I think our criminal system is antiquated and broken, with a fair amount of racism baked in [coke vs crack, etc]. I think prisons themselves create more problems than they solve and that we need to find a better solution than breaking up families. I've supported some sort of universal basic income solution for decades before it became hip, though I recognize there are significant economic issues that would need to be resolved and it's not a simple solution. I think both major parties in the US are anti-people and pro-big business. I think my taxes support murder overseas, and it pains me to pay them. I don't care what your religion is [or anything else], I only care about our interactions. I believe in being kind. I believe in personal responsibility, though that doesn't mean I believe people shouldn't work together to help everyone. I've been part of cooperatives, I try to shop local [except gaming], I am anti-violence and anti-war. I love cats.

How long of an essay do I need to write before I'm 'okay'. Did I pass your purity test yet?

Oh, by the way, remember when you already implied I was some sort of Nazi because I feel like I can't express my opinions? Have you noticed you embody exactly what I say the problem was? I spoke up... so I must be the enemy, right?

But let's see -- you asked to "hear some of these opinions" that people are afraid to discuss. Okay, that's easy. Mention free speech, get treated like a Nazi [in fact, that's what got me involved in this conversation thread]. Talk about presumption of innocence, and you're propagating rape culture. Ask a question, and you'll get a response like "Oh, just questions. Riiiight. I see through you." Criticize Clinton and you'll be called a white supremacist Trump supporter. Man, I've hated Trump and everything he stood for from before he was a celebrity. I despise Clinton, too, though.

No. I've been fighting the fight for decades. Longer than people in their twenties have been alive. But that doesn't mean I support the culture of accusation you clearly participate in.

You assume the worst. Oh, he's defending free speech? What awful things do you want to say? The only awful thing I want to say is that your style of attack is gross.

I salute you.

 

[Tinfoilhatsron]

This place will never be GamerGate.

What's happening are the extremist voices of NeoGaf are voluntarily offing themselves from the forum.

But the more moderate voices are being brought forward.

I can now understand why the site is now returning to a Gaming pure format. People need to get a grip over themselves when finally talking about video games. No more hyperbole that twist themselves into intangible monsters.

Just start from the basics, and when people can finally discuss at least one topic peacefully without calling someone a Nazi, then I think we could see a return of the off-topic.

I legit cannot believe that you don't see the irony. Several account suiciders didn't give a fuck about the new site. Just Tyler. Including prominent OT makers and Game Devs themselves.

Even in this fucking post exists hyperbole. And you want to control the discussion?

 

[Necron]

It's sad to see so many longtime members go like this...

 

[JordanN]

So people upset with the admins history relating to this problem are all extremists?

You sound like the archetype of what people criticize NeoGAF about. Opposition is seem as extremism.

At the moment, I have more grief with the suicides then the site.

It's like watching your co-workers behave unprofessional at an allegation made at the company that still is being investigated.

You don't start pissing on the floor and thrash property while claiming "this isn't right!".

It tells me what kind of people have I really been working alongside all this time. That they can't work under pressure and must relegate themselves to complete chaos.

 

[ExVicis]

That one part is me jumping to conclusions. Since CrossingEden stated that it wasn't the case, then I apologize for it. The other ones I stand by as how I interpreted the events.

Well if you at least can admit it that's something. Whatever problems Crossing Eden may apparently cause, I've never known them to do that. I might be wrong but I can at least say I've never seen it it happen.

 

[iPaul93]

Someone probably banned LostDonkey by mistake.You should take a look :
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1454437

 

[blankempathy]

At the moment, I have more grief with the suicides then the site.

It's like watching your co-workers behave unprofessional at an allegation made at the company that still is being investigated.

You don't start pissing on the floor and thrash property while claiming "this isn't right!".

It tells me what kind of people have I really been working alongside all this time. That they can't work under pressure and must relegate themselves to complete chaos.

Another allegation on top of past behavior involving sexual misconduct. Its natural that people aren't giving him the benefit of the doubt. Especially after his official statement.

 

[dolabla]

Naw, it's people who want their toxic views to be welcomed.

But toxic views to you are just people you disagree with. That's the difference.

It's alright, you can go ahead admit you want anybody whom you disagree with to be silenced. That's why you're begging EvilLore. You want that echo chamber back.

 

[cicero]

I have a theory that gamergaters just plain won't make for good gaming thread content.

These are people who destroy. They do not create.

Blanket label to cover everyone you disagree with on certain topics, which immediately denigrates them and removes legitimacy based on the label alone. Which is really the whole point of using it for so many people. Instantly force people to prove that they aren't something that you have defined them as being, with a vague label that is never clearly defined, covering differing groups of people, while only attributing bad behavior or activities to the group as a whole.

Bravo. A brilliant example of typical Before the Fall of Malka kneejerk groupthink. Time will only tell if it is Post Fall of Malka as well.

Also, it is amusing to see another person feebly make their way through a horribly infantile argument that any disagreement with Social Justice or Identity politics being injected throughout their gaming hobby somehow makes them, as an entire group, unable to do something as pathetically easy as provide "good gaming thread content". Or that they are nothing but "destroyers"....

Am I missing obvious sarcasm here? Are you the proverbial joke poster of this thread? Your logic certainly is laughable.

 

[Acerac]

At the moment, I have more grief with the suicides then the site.

It's like watching your co-workers behave unprofessional at an allegation made at the company that still is being investigated.

You don't start pissing on the floor and thrash property while claiming "this isn't right!".

It tells me what kind of people have I really been working alongside all this time. That they can't work under pressure and must relegate themselves to complete chaos.

I'd imagine many are reacting to the posts made by Lore himself. While I agree that no allegations are proven, I can not blame those who would believe the admin when he makes statements.

 

[Viruz]

... I love cats...

You are a great person

 

[HStallion]

This place will never be GamerGate.

What's happening are the extremist voices of NeoGaf are voluntarily offing themselves from the forum.

But the more moderate voices are being brought forward.

I can now understand why the site is now returning to a Gaming pure format. People need to get a grip over themselves when finally talking about video games. No more hyperbole that twist themselves into intangible monsters.

Just start from the basics, and when people can finally discuss at least one topic peacefully without calling someone a Nazi, then I think we could see a return of the off-topic.

Never? This place always had issues with VOAT, GG, the Alt Right, etc. but the moderation team cleaned them out pretty thoroughly. Every Anita Sarkesian thread was basically a wood chipper for shitty posters who wanted to repeat the same couple of tired talking points and ignoring anyone shooting their argument full or more holes than Swiss cheese.

I seriously wonder what GAF some of you visited all these years.

 

[RastaMentality]

At the moment, I have more grief with the suicides then the site.

It's like watching your co-workers behave unprofessional at an allegation made at the company that still is being investigated.

You don't start pissing on the floor and thrash property while claiming "this isn't right!".

It tells me what kind of people have I really been working alongside all this time. That they can't work under pressure and must relegate themselves to complete chaos.

So what's the closing of the off topic sections in this little analogy?

 

[EverydayBeast]

Plenty of companies, sports clubs have shitty owners yet those workers don’t quit. Ex: look at LeBron, he hates Dan Gilbert.

 

[remist]

Naw, it's people who want their toxic views to be welcomed. Heck, they're so glad OT is gone because you weren't allowed dissenting opinions but guess what? Removing social and political discussions, ya know, removes dissenting opinions. They're not being straight with their logic because they only want to get back at the damn SJWs for ruining games.

Like, look at them coming en masse complaining about being banned for "just disagreeing". They even claim they're not like the one guy who attacked Anita's credibility and he still won't accept he did that. This is about normalizing and wanting to make their behavior OK on NeoGAF because it never was before. It's not wrong to call them out when they so blatantly participate in the gamergate rhetoric.

Are you still claiming that asking if Anita has publicly defended her views in a debate is attacking her credibility? That only makes sense if you make spurious assumptions, which you continue to do without shame.

 

[ExVicis]

So what's the closing of the off topic sections in this little analogy?

Burning down the second company office building because the investigation was there?

 

[Foffy]

Plenty of companies, sports clubs have shitty owners yet those workers don’t quit. Ex: look at LeBron, he hates Dan Gilbert.

They have a job.

Did you just compare people posting on a forum with workers? In a sense they are; they're what helps Tyler get money.

How fitting they've started a proletariat revolt.

 

[RastaMentality]

Burning Down the Second Office because the investigation was there?

That's what I was thinking.

His wasn't an honest framing of the events.

 

[Acerac]

Plenty of companies, sports clubs have shitty owners yet those workers don’t quit. Ex: look at LeBron, he hates Dan Gilbert.

People replied to your last post perhaps you should answer them instead of going off on another tangent.

That is, unless your goal is less one of understanding and more just rabble rousing. If that's the case, by all means, proceed.

 

[Culex]

Do we have a Lionel Mandrake response yet?

 

[RawkHawk2010]

So what's the closing of the off topic sections in this little analogy?

Cutting business trips from the budget because they always went horribly wrong.

 

[Subpar Spatula]

But toxic views to you are just people you disagree with. That's the difference.

It's alright, you can go ahead admit you want anybody whom you disagree with to be silenced. That's why you're begging EvilLore. You want that echo chamber back.

See, this is where you're being too binary and will not care about context but I'm a try to educate you.

You can disagree. You can support Trump for all I care. Bring something of value that isn't hurtful, racist, misogynistic, bigoted, etc.

Like, you don't even realize no one was banned for simply disagreeing unless the mod power tripped and those bans are extremely rare in the sea of bans that have occurred on NeoGAF.

Keeping hateful views out isn't toxic. Hopefully you will understand this.

Are you still claiming that asking if Anita has publicly defended her views in a debate is attacking her credibility? That only makes sense if you make spurious assumptions, which you continue to do without shame.

Why would someone go to a thread and ask if Anita has defended her views publicly? The thread was about her views already. What purpose is there to ask if she goes around and debates those points to other? There is none. He wanted to throw a barb to show that she isn't willing to stand up with her views in a public setting because she would be countered so easily.

We all get what what he was saying.

If you don't care then that's on you but the only people who seem to have a problem with that particular case seem to have dubious posting histories where they strongly distaste being banned for just being in disagreement. In reality, those cases are super fucking rare because they almost never happened. Articulate your position without being hateful and you will have zero problems.

 

[Tinfoilhatsron]

Do we have a Lionel Mandrake response yet?

Was he not demodded and banned?

 

[Crossing Eden]

That one part is me jumping to conclusions. Since CrossingEden stated that it wasn't the case, then I apologize for it. The other ones I stand by as how I interpreted the events.

You should've checked back at the thread because at worst everything you said happened were straight up lies about me.

 

[Culex]

Was he not demodded and banned?

I have no idea.

 

[Imp the Dimp]

I've seen more GG slurs on GAF today than in the past 3 years since Gamergate combined.

 

[ExVicis]

Do we have a Lionel Mandrake response yet?

I haven't seen that name in a list of people who left so who knows if we'll get that.

Godammitt, we're never going to get another "Lionel Mandrake summarizes another shitty Christian based movie" thread again are we? Fuck I loved those. This really sucks.

 

[AALLx]

And no, I didn't contact Besada

I apologize for that, that was a mistake on my part for assuming it and stating it as fact.

 

[HStallion]

I contacted Besada and told him to give you a purple nurple

 

[Rentahamster]

A casual observation: In an effort to criticize perceived past efforts of unfair dogpiling, let's try not to dogpile others like Spatula in response. I'm not saying that it's happening now; just saying that it's a rabbit hole we should all be aware of, since it's so easy to fall into without even noticing.

I post in ways that make people think I am contrarian for the sake of contrarian. Pretty sure a lot of people find me straight up obnoxious. I'm still here somehow. I don't even know any mods.

*brofist*

 

[ExVicis]

I contacted Besada and told him to give you a purple nurple

That was you?! I ended up get that nurple! Mod abuse and favoritism at it's finest everyone!

 

[Subpar Spatula]

A casual observation: In an effort to criticize perceived past efforts of unfair dogpiling, let's try not to dogpile others like Spatula in response. I'm not saying that it's happening now; just saying that it's a rabbit hole we should all be aware of, since it's so easy to fall into without even noticing.


*brofist*

Whatcha talking about? They're not dog-piling. That'd be hypocritical. :/

 

[JordanN]

I

Even in this fucking post exists hyperbole. And you want to control the discussion?

There are plenty of threads in Gaming right now that are open to expressing these issues and as long as they are civil/don't break no rules, I'm ok with that. That's what GAF should be here for.

But when I come back 5 hours later after visiting the forum and I'm still seeing "Bla bla just permaban me" that makes me angry. These are Gaffers who just have no self respect anymore and makes me wonder how was I ever suppose to take them serious in the first place.

Like I mentioned in a post earlier, what's the sense in adults getting angry over a message board? I sometimes joke, it's all just words hanging over a computer monitor. In 80 years, it wont matter.