The_Mike
I cry about SonyGaf from my chair in Redmond, WA
Yeah, top of the brand newend hardware, like my (2 years old 2070s) that spits 165+ Hz (locked fps cap) in 1440p everything on ultra without any problems.
Can I be honest here...I don’t think the Xbox Series S is going to last very long into the generation.
- Thread starter Derktron
- Start date
DarkMage619
$MSFT
If people are getting the same feature set as the high end model it isn't inferior. It simply doesn't have the same graphical horsepower. It also has a lower cost and is intended for budget conscious customers. Inferior would be comparing the X1 to the XSS. Seeing how the X1 can't even PLAY all the games the XSS has nor does it have current gen features.
Silent Viper
Banned
Devs are fully aware and im sure many devs and MS already working something similar to DLSS for Series S and X. Reconstruction methods and AI resolution scaling will be become main part of all nextgen only games soon for all consoles.
Concern trolling by people on message boards looks stupid coz we as consumers dont know shit about game development, most of such people who do such concern trolling get knowledge from Youtubers and Twitter..
Concern trolling by people on message boards looks stupid coz we as consumers dont know shit about game development, most of such people who do such concern trolling get knowledge from Youtubers and Twitter..
Silent Viper
Banned
Play on SS and then go back to One X, you will immediately notice horrible experience on One X. From Fluctuating frame-rate thanks to jaguar to long loadtimes thanks to laptop HDD will make you instantly regret playing on One X after playing SS.. Only thing u will get better on One X is lil bit of high resolution but general graphics details will be better on SS but at lower resolution, everything else will be better on SS
Vognerful
Member
Bro we both know that a 2070s is a beast even if it is not part of the new shiny toys.
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The_Mike
I cry about SonyGaf from my chair in Redmond, WA
Yeah. The graphic card alone did cost about the same as the new consoles, but you get what you pay for.
And high end cards lasts very long because they are being hold down from consoles to some extend.
Md Ray
Member
Lack of graphical horsepower and lack of memory makes the S inferior and it provides an inferior experience to the X, just like a 3060 (which lacks in gfx horsepower and memory) is inferior and provides an inferior experience compared to a 3090 system. There are no two ways about it.
We see devs omitting RT in some titles on the S, and 120fps in others whereas they're present on the X. Why? Because the S is inferior. It's as simple as that.
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RJMacready73
Simps for Amouranth
I personally think it's a class wee console and will probably pick one up to play ES6 and to compliment my Ps5 which I'm simply playing my PS+ back catalogue on
I have casual gamer friends who only play FIFA and they would still care about it not being 4K. Around the time we stop getting cross gen games 4K TVs will be the standard. And every single person I know when people who are not into tech would want something not drive there 4K TV. You can't even enter a store and get a HD TV these days.
Another issue with Series S is its digital only. Most casual gamers I know still buy physical games. Here in the UK the casuals by COD and FIFA as a physical copy and resell and by the next game. Also in the UK a physical game is much cheaper than Digital.
I think the price difference between Series S and PS5 Digital isn't big enough for the gimping of power. Someone who cannot afford a £350 system will still find a £250 system expensive, those folks usually game on tablets, phones or old used PS4s and Xbox One's.
I can't deny there is still a market for Series S, but what I'm saying is that market is very small, and isn't worth the extra QA for developers to do on another system. Multiplatform game development is already expensive and Microsoft just added an extra hurdle where I don't think it was worth it.
Riky
$MSFT
If casual players care about 4k then the PS4 and X1 wouldn't have constantly outsold the Pro and X1X after release, those people have been playing at lower resolution all this time regardless.
I'm in the UK the difference is actually £110 here if you can find a PS5 DE, that's a lot of money to some people in a country that looks like it is looking at big inflation in the short term. Also this Xmas what will actually be on the shelves? People going to buy a new console this festive season may be faced with just one choice due to shortages and that will be the more available Series S. Also not only is the PS5 DE £110 more expensive and not readily available but you are totally tied to that very expensive Sony store, with Series consoles third party keys are available at sometimes big discounts even undercutting disc copies, you can also get keys worldwide and activate them on your UK account making some serious savings, the cost difference between the two just grows from that £110. The only person I know with a PS5 DE told me he wished he had waited for the disc version as the store prices were just too much.
As for playing on last gen machines, if you read my post I said when the big hitters stop being available for last gen machines, will GTA VI be on PS4 or X1, I think not so that's the point people will move on.
As for developers, we've covered this numerous times, Series S just fits into the GDK now and looking at the lowest PC specs for releases this year it will be a very long time before Series S is down there at 1080p, so that's a non issue.
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Mr Reasonable
Completely Unreasonable
Your position is that it's not selling. My position (with proof) is that it's selling better than everything available* aside from 7 other things.
Believe what you like mate.
*in the video games section on Amazon.co.uk.
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TBiddy
Member
No they wouldn't. Very few people are able to tell if a game runs 4k, 1800p or 1080p, unless people tell them.
Fair enough. But you'll never see anyone silly enough to go on a discussion forum and go "hmm, I wonder why anyone buys the 3060 when they can just buy the 3090"
You'll also never see anyone crazy enough to claim that it was a bad idea for Nvidia to make the 3060 because it would 'hold back' 3090 and 3080 owners.
The thread title is hand wringing about whether the Series S would last the gen. 120 FPS and low end Ray Tracing isn't a necessity for next gen gaming.
It's not available on Amazon or any other US retailer at the moment.
Lets not say untruths because of video games.
PS4 Pro and One X were not proper next gen systems just upgrades. Also since the release of those systems we now have even more 4K TV owners.
You said Series S will be a factor once we have cross gen games stopped with no GTA6 and next COD on previous consoles. Well that could be a very long time away I'm talking 2023/2024. This generation is unique where we have the same architecture so cross gen is here for a very long time. And buy the time we stop getting cross gen games we will get better bundles and deals on Series X and PS5.
£110 is still not as significant for having such a gimped system. We know this because Sony are selling PS5 Digital at a bigger loss and Microsoft didn't go for the Series X Ditial route as they don't want to take that loss. And like I said most casual gamers prefer physical games. Casual gamers are not savvy enough to go to key website to find deals. And you can easily make different region PSN accounts and play them on your main PSN account. I have 4 different region PSN accounts I where I buy games for much cheaper. But again this isn't a big deal in the grand scheme of things as this don't something casual gamers are aware of.
There is a reason Series X and PS5 Disk are constantly sold out as they are the most desirable systems, a proper next gen 4K system with a disk drive. It's not comparable to PS4 Vs PS4 Pro, as Pro was just a update.
As for it being way for Devs we can't deny there will still be QA involved for Series S. They will have to test how the game will run on a Series S. With PC most of it is just brute forced and even still we have broken games on PC, but on PC you can get away with that. On a console you need to target for Series S. This is still a nuisance for developers in fact some have already stated this.
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Wish I could see your face when you eventually realize you're actually arguing their point.
The PS5 is that much higher than the Xbox consoles because we've just had a big PS5 restock on Amazon recently.
According to Nowinstock, Amazon hasn't had the Series S in stock since late August. Earlier than that for the Series X.
The budget difference between Series S and X is nothing compared to 3060 vs 3090, and the console market is different than the desktop GPU one.
The 3060 is inferior to the 3090 due to the power difference. There may be games the 3060 can't play that the 3090 will one day due to the power difference, even if they do have the same features. Now to be fair, unless MS allows Series X exclusives this will never happen to the S.
Riky
$MSFT
I never said 1X and Pro were next gen, point is if casuals cared about resolutions like you claimed and price difference isn't an issue like you claimed then those next gen refreshes would have outsold the original systems when they released, they didn't not by a long shot.
You keep using the word "gimped" I presume as some sort of troll, it's just a less powerful cheaper, smaller less power hungry system. The difference of £110 might not be significant to you but that's not the case for a lot of people and availability is an issue you seem to have ignored.
Yes you can set up several PSN accounts with different regions, but I can just use my main account on Xbox, that's a lot easier and even a casual can type CDKeys into Google and search FIFA or Call Of Duty, saving money is worth the small effort.
We are still in the expensive core gamer stage of these consoles and Spencer said quite clearly he expected the Series X to sell better at first, that's probably why there seems to be about a 60/40 split on sales of Series consoles but it might be 2/3 years into a 9 year cycle before we see that change, like I said when GTA and COD are next gen only.
Also a lot of people especially youngsters will be playing in their bedrooms at more likely 1080p still, Series S is perfect for that situation or as a second Xbox in your house when main TV is in use.
T-Cake
Member
But then that doesn't explain why everyone didn't immediately sell their PS4 and buy a PS4 Pro? Exactly the same with Xbox One (X)?
I own a series X and a series S. Use both, love both. Series S is in the family room, wife will be using it for Back4Blood coop. Frame rates, ray tracing, and pixel counts do not matter to her. Getting out of bed and checking message boards to pick apart console performance comparisons and game technical compromises just… it isn't even a spec of cosmic dust in her universe if that makes sense.
The console is perfect for her. And perfect for me on nights I don't want to (or can't be) down in the recroom.
The console is perfect for her. And perfect for me on nights I don't want to (or can't be) down in the recroom.
Javthusiast
Banned
Perfectly happy with my S and game pass. If that thing will do it's fine work for 3 to 4 years then it was totally worth it.
wOs
Member
With the way some people hold on to GPUs amd CPUs and still have a passable experience on PC I don't see it happening. They'll just adjust the graphics settings, won't have rtx, and might even be dynamic 1080p, but that's what people buying them expect. Not that it will play the lates games at the highest fidelity.
VolticArchangel
Member
- GAF hated the Switch reveal and throughout it's first year.
- Switch sold 90 million+ consoles in less than 4.5 years.
- GAF hated the Series S reveal and is constantly shitposting about the console in it's first year.
- Congrats to Microsoft on Series S becoming the best selling Xbox console of all-time.
- Switch sold 90 million+ consoles in less than 4.5 years.
- GAF hated the Series S reveal and is constantly shitposting about the console in it's first year.
- Congrats to Microsoft on Series S becoming the best selling Xbox console of all-time.
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ReBurn
Gold Member
Amazon here hasn't had sustained Series S availability since launch. They're still going for at least 25% to 30% markup from third party sellers. Best Buy doesn't have any near me and hasn't within 250 miles of me for some time. They may not be sold out where you are but they're certainly sold out here.
DarkMage619
$MSFT
Inferior for who? The customers who want a budget console? Just because you don't want to spend $1500 for an RTX 3090 does not make the RTX 3060 inferior. The inferior device you are claiming has MORE 120fps titles and has more features than a console that costs even more. Does that make the more expensive device inferior? Missing RT isn't significant. Missing quick resume is. I don't see logic in what you are saying.
Inferior for anyone who purchases it. The 3060 is inferior to the 3090. There's literally nothing it does that the 3090 doesn't do better. That's why it's cheaper.
And again, you can't compare GPU to a console with bespoke hardware. (And for the record, I can hook a console up to a TV and play. I can't hook a GPU up to a TV and play without the rest of the computer - so in the end even with a 3060 I'm paying a lot more than a console).
Granted, laptops are more expensive than desktops for comparable power, but I went out a few weeks ago and looked, since someone claimed $500 laptops could match the PS5/Series X. For $500, the laptops I would get struggle to be competitive with the Switch graphically - much less the Series S or X.
dcmk7
Banned
Don't see the logic? He makes a very good point with lots of developers removing features for XSS. Can only conclude the Series S isn't capable of running them for their titles. Otherwise they would be there.
It's just a shame gamers miss out.
DarkMage619
$MSFT
But that's the thing. The XSS CAN do things more expensive consoles cannot and it has the SAME feature set as the XSX. How can you argue the XSS is inferior when it can do things more expensive consoles can't? Lower graphical detail != inferior.
HeisenbergFX4
Gold Member
If you are playing on a 720p 43" screen you are correct
If you are playing on a 4k display I can assure this statement is wrong
What are these more expensive consoles?
It can run Halo and ES6 and the PS5 won't be able to. That's the only scenario I can think of.
EDIT: I can also run disks on the Series X. Can I do that on the Series S?
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ÆMNE22A!C
Banned
How's that?
HeisenbergFX4
Gold Member
Not getting into a debate on why the more powerful system performs better than its weaker and cheaper little brother
I know a few people now that has upgraded the launch day xbox ones to the Series S and are quite thrilled with it.
So at least we've moved from the 'Xbox Series S won't last the generation' concern to "it will last the generation but it won't have ray tracing in every title and might not have 120fps modes".
Progress!
Lmao, those are concessions the people who buy the cheaper, $299 box consciously and willingly make.
whining about it now is the same as saying it's a shame that RTX 3060 buyers won't be able to run all AAA games at 4K 60fps Ultra settings.
Mr Reasonable
Completely Unreasonable
ÆMNE22A!C
Banned
Oh my lol.
Games get played on different hardware specs. If you want, you can say that playing on anything but the highest spec pc with a giant screen means "gamers miss out."
Pray for gamers.
Lol indeed, imagine saying that non ironically..
They're out there
ÆMNE22A!C
Banned
What's wrong with you?
BigLee74
Member
Cry us a river?
Trimesh
Banned
I suspect the people screeching about XSS in this thread are the same ones that are shocked and horrified by the success of the Nintendo Switch and simply can't understand that a platform that most of the time can't even hit 1080p could be so successful.
The basic problem is that graphics whores have this cognitive block that prevents them from realizing that many people simply don't care about the things they do.
The basic problem is that graphics whores have this cognitive block that prevents them from realizing that many people simply don't care about the things they do.
DarkMage619
$MSFT
The XSS has more 120fps titles, VRR, and also emulation. Not being able to play exclusive games on other platforms does not make a console inferior. Not having a blu-ray drive also doesn't mean much when we are in a digital era. If you are comfortable calling more expensive consoles inferior because they lack features the XSS has then fine otherwise it is simply a preference for 4k gaming over 1080p.
So, more 120fps titles than what?
Emulation doesn't count as a real feature here.
I prefer physical media, and even if I did not, the fact that the Series S doesn't offer it and the Series X does makes the Series S inferior.
Again, what are these more expensive consoles that do less than the Series S?
The Series S is inferior to the Series X. Period. If you enjoy playing on it, that's fine, more power to you, MS created it for that reason. If you don't need what the X offers, that's fine. But don't try to argue that it's somehow equal to or superior to the Series X, that's nonsense.
dcmk7
Banned
Gamers on XSS do ultimately miss out on some next gen features that XSX users have. Not sure why that is a bone of contention.. or why it's so shocking. It's just a simple fact.
It's been happening with first party and third party titles and will very likely continue to happen. And it goes against the pre-release marketing.
I'm sure it's partly the reason why this very thread exists.
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DarkMage619
$MSFT
It is equal to the XSX in terms of features. It is superior to other consoles in terms of features. Just because YOU don't value a feature doesn't mean that it isn't still an advantage over another platform.
You are in the minority when it comes to physical media. There are people who prefer records over digital streaming. That doesn't make streaming inferior. It clear some people are willing to spend more money on gaming than others but that in no way means the cheaper system is inferior especially if you care about how much you spend.
dcmk7
Banned
What features?
Fat Frog
I advertised for Google Stadia
He is not that wrong. Nobody in my family has a 4K screen (only 1080TVs and one old 720p 21 inch screen...
Yeah, they all have 4K TVs but when ? 2023 ? 2025 ?(they are all fine with netflix image quality) I'm the only one with a brand new 34 inch curved ultra wide 1440P.(i thought 4K was not mandatory until 2025)
Hard to say Microsoft was wrong. Casual, kids, many girls don't give a shit about resolution, FPS.
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