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[coachmcguirk91]

That first map they showed is roughly 1km x 0.6km and they put the chances of PVP encounters at 60% so I don't think it plays as fast as they want you to believe (for some reason).

If I'm correct on the above then proxy chat would have its place. I think most of the play testers said it was needed also.

Yeah, it's nowhere near as quick as some of the gameplay reveals showed. I think that's a good thing.


I wouldn't be too worried about proximity. They will surely add it if the community demands it, after launch

 

[Men_in_Boxes]

That first map they showed is roughly 1km x 0.6km and they put the chances of PVP encounters at 60% so I don't think it plays as fast as they want you to believe (for some reason).

If I'm correct on the above then proxy chat would have its place. I think most of the play testers said it was needed also.

I could be wrong here but...

I don't think it's so much about map size as it is about "safe areas" or "down moments" or "tense moments".

In Tarkov, you loot the top floor of a building...you hear the door open downstairs...at that point, both players have reasonable expectation that they're not going to get rushed. The two of you are alone in this interesting, high intensity scenario.

In Marathon, it just looks like the pace is too fast, movement abilities are too strong, the TTK is too slow.

You don't have this sense of "You come up those stairs I'll take your head off!" conversational possibility. Players are much more likely to flow like in Apex Legends where speed and skill decide outcomes.

If you take a look at the last two ARC Raiders trailers, both seem to feature proxy chat scenarios. It makes more sense there due to the corner peak, sneaking, hiding spots nature of the game.

I don't think Bungie wants to protect players as much as they know the proxy chat in their game is just going to lead to a high percentage of quick insults. I'm seeing this in Wildgate too. A bunch of people are clamoring for proxy chat because it reminds them of Sea of Thieves. Those devs reached the same conclusion. Quick bursts of short lived PvP doesn't lend itself to engaging proxy chat.

 

[clarky]

I could be wrong here but...

I don't think it's so much about map size as it is about "safe areas" or "down moments" or "tense moments".

In Tarkov, you loot the top floor of a building...you hear the door open downstairs...at that point, both players have reasonable expectation that they're not going to get rushed. The two of you are alone in this interesting, high intensity scenario.

In Marathon, it just looks like the pace is too fast, movement abilities are too strong, the TTK is too slow.

You don't have this sense of "You come up those stairs I'll take your head off!" conversational possibility. Players are much more likely to flow like in Apex Legends where speed and skill decide outcomes.

If you take a look at the last two ARC Raiders trailers, both seem to feature proxy chat scenarios. It makes more sense there due to the corner peak, sneaking, hiding spots nature of the game.

I don't think Bungie wants to protect players as much as they know the proxy chat in their game is just going to lead to a high percentage of quick insults. I'm seeing this in Wildgate too. A bunch of people are clamoring for proxy chat because it reminds them of Sea of Thieves. Those devs reached the same conclusion. Quick bursts of short lived PvP doesn't lend itself to engaging proxy chat.

Yeah, good points. It's difficult to gauge going off what little we know.

I'm expecting the Alpha to leak like the Titanic so I guess we should be able to judge better next month. I do think those expecting a Sci-fi Tarkov are going to be disappointed though.

Edit: Surely it has to contain some high tension moments? Thats what the genre its known for and excels at. It can't be all pewpew as that would get boring real fast.

All or nothing with this one I think, crushing disappointment or elation that they nailed it.

 

[HeisenbergFX4]

Yeah, good points. It's difficult to gauge going off what little we know.

I'm expecting the Alpha to leak like the Titanic so I guess we should be able to judge better next month. I do think those expecting a Sci-fi Tarkov are going to be disappointed though.

Edit: Surely it has to contain some high tension moments? Thats what the genre its known for and excels at. It can't be all pewpew as that would get boring real fast.

All or nothing with this one I think, crushing disappointment or elation that they nailed it.

Speaking of those leaks I think its an odd decision to have a reveal, announce an alpha but have it under NDA

I can see an NDA prior to reveal but like you said its going to leak like crazy and to me if feels odd to want to NDA it

 

[clarky]

Speaking of those leaks I think its an odd decision to have a reveal, announce an alpha but have it under NDA

I can see an NDA prior to reveal but like you said its going to leak like crazy and to me if feels odd to want to NDA it

Yeah I said as much the other day.

Anyone who might be negative on the game has nothing to lose by leaking the shit out of it, very odd.

 

[StreetsofBeige]

Speaking of those leaks I think its an odd decision to have a reveal, announce an alpha but have it under NDA

I can see an NDA prior to reveal but like you said its going to leak like crazy and to me if feels odd to want to NDA it

It's to create some kind of hype for the masses, so at least there's some news out there. Also, it gives gamers hope that with an alpha test months out, it'll be better than Concord which had almost no news about it and the beta test was only 2 weeks before launch. Putting under NDA (even though there will be leaks of course) is sign of little confidence. They dont want all the players approved for the alpha test to nail the game to the cross. They probably got some system in place where if a guy leaks info and Bungie finds out who it is and gamer profile, they'll probably be banned from the game and all Bungie games.

A lot of gamers probably wont care about any repercussions, but just like speeding signs, most people wont care and will drive over the limit. But if the gov puts the sign there, some people will listen to it.

 

[Men_in_Boxes]

Yeah, good points. It's difficult to gauge going off what little we know.

I'm expecting the Alpha to leak like the Titanic so I guess we should be able to judge better next month. I do think those expecting a Sci-fi Tarkov are going to be disappointed though.

Edit: Surely it has to contain some high tension moments? Thats what the genre its known for and excels at. It can't be all pewpew as that would get boring real fast.

All or nothing with this one I think, crushing disappointment or elation that they nailed it.

My obsession with this genre comes from the fact that I think it's the most capable of producing "movie moments". The stakes, the sandbox, the tools (not weapons), the proxy chat, the variety in objectives, the asymmetry...

To me, it's really pushing towards this Star Trek like future where two ships bump into each other, the captains call eachother on the viewscreen, and then they negotiate (or don't) high intensity scenarios. We're right at the precipice of including alliances, negotiation, betrayal, subterfuge etc. into these PvP games.

When I see Tarkov, I see the zygote of Star Trek.

When I see Marathon, I see Diablo...an action RPG.

If Marathon had those "movie moments", they would have shown them off at the big reveal. It won't have them. Maybe Map 4 will have them, but it seems clear the leveling up of your character (the bulk of the Marathon experience) is Bungie making the next evolution of Diablo, not Star Trek. Once I readjusted my expectations to "a better Diablo could be fun" it allowed the wounds of the reveal to begin healing.

 

[Men_in_Boxes]

Speaking of those leaks I think its an odd decision to have a reveal, announce an alpha but have it under NDA

I can see an NDA prior to reveal but like you said its going to leak like crazy and to me if feels odd to want to NDA it

Still probably a lot of data they need to collect to improve balance and I bet they're going to hype up the Map 4 event around launch to build mystery/excitement for the game.

The NDA prevents most people from leaking. They probably just don't want a mass of players ARGing the heck out of their big marketing tactic this far away from launch, especially with pre-orders not available.

 

[Ishma3L]

looks like apex

 

[Johnny Concrete]

My obsession with this genre comes from the fact that I think it's the most capable of producing "movie moments". The stakes, the sandbox, the tools (not weapons), the proxy chat, the variety in objectives, the asymmetry...

To me, it's really pushing towards this Star Trek like future where two ships bump into each other, the captains call eachother on the viewscreen, and then they negotiate (or don't) high intensity scenarios. We're right at the precipice of including alliances, negotiation, betrayal, subterfuge etc. into these PvP games.

When I see Tarkov, I see the zygote of Star Trek.

When I see Marathon, I see Diablo...an action RPG.

If Marathon had those "movie moments", they would have shown them off at the big reveal. It won't have them. Maybe Map 4 will have them, but it seems clear the leveling up of your character (the bulk of the Marathon experience) is Bungie making the next evolution of Diablo, not Star Trek. Once I readjusted my expectations to "a better Diablo could be fun" it allowed the wounds of the reveal to begin healing.

To have those experiences you need to have very big maps, slower gameplay and low TTK. Like Tarkov and Hunt.
This is clearly not what they are after with Marathon. They want every match to be filled with action. At first I rejected this design as well, but I start to see the appeal now.

The downside is; you'll have less variation in your matches. Other extraction shooters can have matches where you don't see a soul. Maybe a distant gunshot. And there goes 20/30 minutes without even pulling the trigger. The next match you are in multiple gunfights, fighting to survive. You just never know what you'll get.
In Marathon, you will know what you get: PvP action, always.
Maybe that gets boring real fast. But hey, we played arena shooters back in the day on the same fucking maps for years. And it was fun.

So it is the most casual extraction shooter ever. Who watched the reveal? Extraction shooter enthusiasts, which come from Tarkov mostly. And they hated everything about it, because it's the anti-Tarkov.
So who is this for? Probably the casual PvP shooter fans, who did not watch the reveal, because it's an extraction shooter...

There will be an Open Beta at some point and I think that will be the big metric whether this will become a success or not.

 

[clarky]

looks like apex

Why do you think it looks like that title? I'm not seeing it.

 

[Men_in_Boxes]

To have those experiences you need to have very big maps, slower gameplay and low TTK. Like Tarkov and Hunt.
This is clearly not what they are after with Marathon. They want every match to be filled with action. At first I rejected this design as well, but I start to see the appeal now.

 

[danklord]

It's a Destiny Roguelike... as long as they keep it priced at $40 it's going to be a massive hit. The hype and push from Sony will be immense.

 

[coachmcguirk91]

To have those experiences you need to have very big maps, slower gameplay and low TTK. Like Tarkov and Hunt.
This is clearly not what they are after with Marathon. They want every match to be filled with action. At first I rejected this design as well, but I start to see the appeal now.

The downside is; you'll have less variation in your matches. Other extraction shooters can have matches where you don't see a soul. Maybe a distant gunshot. And there goes 20/30 minutes without even pulling the trigger. The next match you are in multiple gunfights, fighting to survive. You just never know what you'll get.
In Marathon, you will know what you get: PvP action, always.
Maybe that gets boring real fast. But hey, we played arena shooters back in the day on the same fucking maps for years. And it was fun.

So it is the most casual extraction shooter ever. Who watched the reveal? Extraction shooter enthusiasts, which come from Tarkov mostly. And they hated everything about it, because it's the anti-Tarkov.
So who is this for? Probably the casual PvP shooter fans, who did not watch the reveal, because it's an extraction shooter...

There will be an Open Beta at some point and I think that will be the big metric whether this will become a success or not.

Yeah, it was a combination of the game being different than every other extraction shooter yet too similar to other types of gaas games(Apex, Warzone) that turned off a lot of people. Not to mention, a large portion of Destiny players are not interested in a PvPvE game. If Marathon was not developed by Bungie, I believe the reception would have been vastly different. The expectations are so high

The biggest hurdle that Bungie needs to navigate is the competitive vs casual gamers. It seems like Bungie is really leaning into the hardcore PC audience that plays extraction shooters. Given how streamlined Marathon's systems are compared to a game like Tarkov, I'm not sure the overlap is as great as they think it is

 

[James Sawyer Ford]

My obsession with this genre comes from the fact that I think it's the most capable of producing "movie moments". The stakes, the sandbox, the tools (not weapons), the proxy chat, the variety in objectives, the asymmetry...

To me, it's really pushing towards this Star Trek like future where two ships bump into each other, the captains call eachother on the viewscreen, and then they negotiate (or don't) high intensity scenarios. We're right at the precipice of including alliances, negotiation, betrayal, subterfuge etc. into these PvP games.

When I see Tarkov, I see the zygote of Star Trek.

When I see Marathon, I see Diablo...an action RPG.

If Marathon had those "movie moments", they would have shown them off at the big reveal. It won't have them. Maybe Map 4 will have them, but it seems clear the leveling up of your character (the bulk of the Marathon experience) is Bungie making the next evolution of Diablo, not Star Trek. Once I readjusted my expectations to "a better Diablo could be fun" it allowed the wounds of the reveal to begin healing.

Anyone who has played a PvP game competitively by Bungie, like Halo, knows you have those moments

Have you ever played halo 1, 2 or 3?

 

[clarky]

It's a Destiny Roguelike... as long as they keep it priced at $40 it's going to be a massive hit. The hype and push from Sony will be immense.

I see why you would say that but I would not classify an extraction Shooter as a Rouguelike, nor Marathon anything like Destiny.

 

[Men_in_Boxes]

Anyone who has played a PvP game competitively by Bungie, like Halo, knows you have those moments

Have you ever played halo 1, 2 or 3?

You are right...to an extent. Bungie does make sandbox type multiplayer.

I got sniped jumping out of the warthog, a mere 30ft from scoring, while carrying the flag back back to base in Blood Gulch a hundred times back in the day. Those were laughter filled moments.

Apex Legends and The Finals also have fun "action combat sandboxes" like I'm sure Marathon will. Marathons progression will make it much more appealing to me than those aforementioned titles.

But it's not Escape from Tarkov level sandbox. That game leans into "movie moments" much more than Marathon, Apex Legends, or The Finals. Tarkov is a deep red wine of Star Trek type experience.

That's what I was hoping Bungie was going to pursue. Instead, they went with "What if we made a Diablo inspired extraction shooter" which forces them to limit their sandbox. Now I pin my hopes on ARC RAIDERS for the burgundy voluminous red wine of experience.

Still excited for Marathon but it has been relegated to delicious burger status. I love burgers but I'm looking out for the cornicopia of flavor.

 

[James Sawyer Ford]

You are right...to an extent. Bungie does make sandbox type multiplayer.

I got sniped jumping out of the warthog, a mere 30ft from scoring, while carrying the flag back back to base in Blood Gulch a hundred times back in the day. Those were laughter filled moments.

Apex Legends and The Finals also have fun "action combat sandboxes" like I'm sure Marathon will. Marathons progression will make it much more appealing to me than those aforementioned titles.

But it's not Escape from Tarkov level sandbox. That game leans into "movie moments" much more than Marathon, Apex Legends, or The Finals. Tarkov is a deep red wine of Star Trek type experience.

That's what I was hoping Bungie was going to pursue. Instead, they went with "What if we made a Diablo inspired extraction shooter" which forces them to limit their sandbox. Now I pin my hopes on ARC RAIDERS for the burgundy voluminous red wine of experience.

Still excited for Marathon but it has been relegated to delicious burger status. I love burgers but I'm looking out for the cornicopia of flavor.

I have zero clue what you're trying to articulate. How is tarkov a sandbox but marathon not a sandbox?

 

[Men_in_Boxes]

I'm have zero clue what you're trying to articulate. How is tarkov a sandbox but marathon not a sandbox?

They are both sandboxes.

One sandbox is significantly better at facilitating "movie moments".

Escape from Tarkov is the highwater mark here. Bungie aimed lower for whatever reason.

 

[James Sawyer Ford]

They are both sandboxes.

One sandbox is significantly better at facilitating "movie moments".

Escape from Tarkov is the highwater mark here. Bungie aimed lower for whatever reason.

Examples of what you mean, please

 

[Men_in_Boxes]

Examples of what you mean, please

Think of all the examples in this thread of how proxy chat can lean into really unique, tense experiences.

Bungie didn't design around proxy chat because Marathon is a "boom boom" action game. They didn't build around slow, tense moments of negotiation, coms, and strategy. You're supposed to "feel" where your teammates are because speed is the name of the game. In Tarkov, you're supposed to tell teammates where to set up so you can watch a target for 10 minutes that may never come.

James Sawyer Ford , this genre has a much higher ceiling than you currently see. Open thine eyes friend!

 

[James Sawyer Ford]

Think of all the examples in this thread of how proxy chat can lean into really unique, tense experiences.

Bungie didn't design around proxy chat because Marathon is a "boom boom" action game. They didn't build around slow, tense moments of negotiation, coms, and strategy. You're supposed to "feel" where your teammates are because speed is the name of the game. In Tarkov, you're supposed to tell teammates where to set up so you can watch a target for 10 minutes that may never come.

James Sawyer Ford , this genre has a much higher ceiling than you currently see. Open thine eyes friend!

I asked for examples, you give me proxy chat instead

 

[Men_in_Boxes]

I asked for examples, you give me proxy chat instead

You don't see how proxy chat, or vehicles, or interesting gadgets, or map interactivity, or different AI behavior can lead to emergent gameplay experiences? To movie moments?

 

[James Sawyer Ford]

You don't see how proxy chat, or vehicles, or interesting gadgets, or map interactivity, or different AI behavior can lead to emergent gameplay experiences? To movie moments?

What makes you think Marathon doesn't have most of those features already?

The only aspect that may be off the table is vehicles. Proxy chat probably gets added

 

[Men_in_Boxes]

What makes you think Marathon doesn't have most of those features already?

The only aspect that may be off the table is vehicles. Proxy chat probably gets added

Because in order to believe they do, you'd have to believe they were hiding massive, exciting portions of the core gameplay. Dead Marsh is a farm map in which the majority of our playtime will be spent. They wanted to show that map off in the best possible light. They did not want people to be bringing up Concord after the show. That's bad for business.

All the AI either shot at the player or rushed the player.

The maps were way too small to feature interesting vehicle gameplay.

The map interactivity (unlockable doors, gas rooms, closeable windows) was too muted to significantly improve.

All gadgets seem to be tied to shell classes rather than loot. All the impressions I saw said "Shell abilities were not a significant part of the gameplay".

The game moved too fast to feature proxy chat. Bungie developers gave the political answer ("We're still exploring all our options internally") because they know how gamer brains react to being told "No."

Those things require years of work to implement. Map 4 will be an exciting carrot they dangle closer to launch / price reveal to build hype. But the idea they had all the exciting Dead Marsh mechanics hiding just behind the curtain makes no sense.

Marathon is an action based Extraction Shooter. Bungie pushed their chips into speed, flow, and shooting. That philosophy is going to come at the expense of other gameplay experiences.

This might be the right call commercially. Lots of people like action. It's just not leveraging player choice and emergent gameplay as much as the genre can.

 

[James Sawyer Ford]

Because in order to believe they do, you'd have to believe they were hiding massive, exciting portions of the core gameplay. Dead Marsh is a farm map in which the majority of our playtime will be spent. They wanted to show that map off in the best possible light. They did not want people to be bringing up Concord after the show. That's bad for business.

All the AI either shot at the player or rushed the player.

The maps were way too small to feature interesting vehicle gameplay.

The map interactivity (unlockable doors, gas rooms, closeable windows) was too muted to significantly improve.

All gadgets seem to be tied to shell classes rather than loot. All the impressions I saw said "Shell abilities were not a significant part of the gameplay".

The game moved too fast to feature proxy chat. Bungie developers gave the political answer ("We're still exploring all our options internally") because they know how gamer brains react to being told "No."

Those things require years of work to implement. Map 4 will be an exciting carrot they dangle closer to launch / price reveal to build hype. But the idea they had all the exciting Dead Marsh mechanics hiding just behind the curtain makes no sense.

Marathon is an action based Extraction Shooter. Bungie pushed their chips into speed, flow, and shooting. That philosophy is going to come at the expense of other gameplay experiences.

This might be the right call commercially. Lots of people like action. It's just not leveraging player choice and emergent gameplay as much as the genre can.

You still haven't explained why tarkov is better

Or why it's a problem that a PvPvE game basically boils down to the actual intensity of the combat itself, as if that's a bad thing

 

[near]

Hmmm not getting my juices flowing if I'm honest, doesn't exactly sound like either a raid nor "never been done before"

Really hope they don't do down the Destiny route with the mechanic's. I really enjoyed the earlier raids but the "mechanic creep" (for want of a better term) was a right turn off for me and made the later D2 raids near impenetrable.

It's really difficult to guess what route they'll take with it, because the overall game design here doesn't lend itself well to having a raid similar to what we see in Destiny. Dealing with PvP encounters alongside tough enemy AI, while solving puzzles that require trial and error, patience, and team coordination, in a timed instance where you can get third-partied by another team and lose all your high-tier gear sounds very frustrating. So, I guess the puzzles would need to be simple enough to solve while working against the odds. I'd imagine they'd also reduce the player count significantly in this map, maybe three teams max instead of six and increase the instance duration from 25 minutes to 40? Who knows. I'm definitely intrigued.

 

[James Sawyer Ford]

It's really difficult to guess what route they'll take with it, because the overall game design here doesn't lend itself well to having a raid similar to what we see in Destiny. Dealing with PvP encounters alongside tough enemy AI, while solving puzzles that require trial and error, patience, and team coordination, in a timed instance where you can get third-partied by another team and lose all your high-tier gear sounds very frustrating. So, I guess the puzzles would need to be simple enough to solve while working against the odds. I'd imagine they'd also reduce the player count significantly in this map, maybe three teams max instead of six and increase the instance duration from 25 minutes to 40? Who knows. I'm definitely intrigued.

Frustrating is part of the fun, that's why Souls games are popular, and why Raids are popular.

"We do these things not because they are easy, but because they are hard".

 

[ChorizoPicozo]

 

[Men_in_Boxes]

Or why it's a problem that a PvPvE game basically boils down to the actual intensity of the combat itself, as if that's a bad thing

All gamers look at a game and ask the same question...

"What can I do in that world?"

Marathon is going to be great for people who like to mess with character builds, great for players who have 2 friends they always game with, great for people who like to sprint around and DPS lower skill players. It'll be great for players who like to solve raid like puzzles in Map 4.

It won't be great for people who like to hide in houses and joke around in proxy chat. It won't be great for solo players. It won't be great for non combative focused players.

A lot of people looked at Marathon and said "That game isn't interested in the way I play."

The genre can cater to more players than what Marathon went for. When you have different player types bumping into each other in different scenarios you get a wider gamut of experiences.

Now let me ask you...Are you interested in the genre or Bungie? What's interesting about Marathon to you?

 

[near]

Frustrating is part of the fun, that's why Souls games are popular, and why Raids are popular.

"We do these things not because they are easy, but because they are hard".

You're not wrong, but souls games are balanced in so far as how punishing they are. I'd have to hope that Bungie balance the 4th map so that it isn't brutally punishing. Like, imagine having to grind for high tier loot and knocking out contracts for 50-60 hours to prep for the end game content, then dying extensively and loosing the vast majority of that gear and having to grind another 15-20 hours on the other maps to be able to challenge again on the end game map. It wouldn't be a pleasant experience overall.

 

[clarky]

Nobody gives a shit mate.

 

[James Sawyer Ford]

Now let me ask you...Are you interested in the genre or Bungie? What's interesting about Marathon to you?

I'm a Bungie and Halo fan.

I love their PvP games because it's all about great gunplay, combat mechanics, traversal, higher TTK, and these really chaotic cat and mouse battles

I have not played Tarkov but all the footage I see looks absolutely boring. Tons of nothing happening most of the time. Generic mil-sim aesthetic. Boring gunplay.

It sounds like we just like different things, which is fine, but I want to play a PvP shooter to actually engage in PvP rather than boring prep work

 

[ResilientBanana]

Visually, I'm underwhelmed. Gameplay looks rather decent, I'd like to at least try it.

 

[Men_in_Boxes]

I'm a Bungie and Halo fan.

I love their PvP games because it's all about great gunplay, combat mechanics, traversal, higher TTK, and these really chaotic cat and mouse battles.

So did you try out Apex Legends and The Finals? Your description nails those games to a tee.

I wonder if some people are more fans of companies than I am.

I have not played Tarkov but all the footage I see looks absolutely boring. Tons of nothing happening most of the time. Generic mil-sim aesthetic. Boring gunplay.

Valid. Tarkov has tons of issues. I didn't buy Shrouds idea that removing friction leads to a worse game.

It sounds like we just like different things, which is fine, but I want to play a PvP shooter to actually engage in PvP rather than boring prep work.

Definitely. I spent 99% of my playtime camping in Fortnite. Each season gave you new tools to figure out the best trap. The draw there for me was talking to my partner brainstorming ideas on how to improve on our invention. The run and gun shooting, which the game forced you into, was only "good" imo.

 

[Men_in_Boxes]

You degrade yourself with "Bellular News". Ragebait YouTube channels lead to moral decay. Find God Chorizo, before it's too late.

 

[James Sawyer Ford]

So did you try out Apex Legends and The Finals? Your description nails those games to a tee.

I wonder if some people are more fans of companies than I am.

that's a completely different style of play and not like Bungie gameplay at all, a little too fast and the weapons aren't anywhere near as compelling

Classic Bungie gameplay is a lot more tactical

Hard to describe but I haven't found a good PvP game to play since older halo titles. Infinite isn't too bad either but it was just barebones so no longevity

Marathon is looking like the perfect PvP title that checks many boxes I have and introduces interesting elements I haven't played before in a PvP game (loot, extraction, etc). I also love the artistic vibe of that game, Bungie has awesome art and lore that no other game competes with in the live service space

 

[Men_in_Boxes]

that's a completely different style of play and not like Bungie gameplay at all, a little too fast and the weapons aren't anywhere near as compelling

This is walking up to a guy with a Nirvana shirt on, finding out he loves all their music and going "Oh so you must like Soundgarden, Alice in Chains, and Pearl Jam."

"No, they are a completely different style of play and not like Nirvana at all."

There's so much Halo DNA in both titles it's crazy. Still, you feel what you feel and I can't knock it.

Classic Bungie gameplay is a lot more tactical

It's not. Those titles are much more tactical because they both built off the back of Halo.

Hard to describe but I haven't found a good PvP gene to play since older halo titles. Infinite isn't too bad either but it was just barebones so no longevity

It's going to be really interesting to see how you hang on with Marathon. If you haven't found a good multiplayer game since the old Halo titles, you might not be a multiplayer gamer.

Marathon is looking like the perfect PvP title that checks many boxes I have and introduces interesting elements I haven't played before in a PvP game (loot, extraction, etc). I also love the artistic vibe of that game, Bungie has awesome art Abe lore that no other game competes with in the live service space

"Artistic vibe", "art and lore".

Prediction: You'll bounce off Marathon before S1 ends. I talk with a lot of multiplayer gamers on voice chat. No one has ever talked about the art or lore at any time...ever.

I look forward to hearing how this goes. Hope you dig it.

 

[James Sawyer Ford]

It's going to be really interesting to see how you hang on with Marathon. If you haven't found a good multiplayer game since the old Halo titles, you might not be a multiplayer gamer.

I've found plenty of online games to play, but they're all PVE focused. I loved Destiny and Helldivers 2

But in terms of PVP? Nah, not really, if you can't see the difference between halo and apex you're not well versed in this space.

I'm not into generic mil sims with low TTK which the market is flooded with. I'm not into BR games. I'm not into kiddy Fortnite or Overwatch aesthetics

Titanfall was cool, enjoyed that. Killzone 2 was pretty incredible. But when Bungie left PVP it was like a void that couldn't be filled

 

[James Sawyer Ford]

No one has ever talked about the art or lore at any time...ever.

And that's why you don't get it. Enjoy your generic trash live service games instead.

 

[Men_in_Boxes]

I've found plenty of online games to play, but they're all PVE focused. I loved Destiny and Helldivers 2

But in terms of PVP? Nah, not really, if you can't see the difference between halo and apex you're not well versed in this space.

I'm not into generic mil sims with low TTK which the market is flooded with. I'm not into BR games. I'm not into kiddy Fortnite or Overwatch aesthetics

Titanfall was cool, enjoyed that. Killzone 2 was pretty incredible. But when Bungie left PVP it was like a void that couldn't be filled

Fair. As a PvP player, I can't imagine going that long without playing a PvP game. Going to be interesting to see how sticky Marathon is for you. I have my doubts but I've been wrong before.

 

[The Fartist]

I might give it a try, but it's not for me. I hope it succeeds and people enjoy it.

 

[HeisenbergFX4]

I might give it a try, but it's not for me. I hope it succeeds and people enjoy it.

It will find an audience

I personally don't think its going to be a massive hit but its not shut down in a week and refund everyone material either

 

[James Sawyer Ford]

Fair. As a PvP player, I can't imagine going that long without playing a PvP game. Going to be interesting to see how sticky Marathon is for you. I have my doubts but I've been wrong before.

I don't know how long I'll stick with it, honestly my expectations are to play through a season and go from there

It's only $40 and looks right up my alley, I don't see why I need to continue playing a game for years to mean that it's a waste otherwise.

The reason I left Destiny was due to the time sink and huge hurdle of getting back in

With marathon, it's easier to bounce in and out in occasion without committing yourself to something massive, that's part of the appeal

 

[Men_in_Boxes]

Four people who work in the business side of games give their take on Marathon. There's some interesting, if brief, talking points here.

 

[8BiTw0LF]

 

[ChorizoPicozo]

 

[ChorizoPicozo]

You degrade yourself with "Bellular News". Ragebait YouTube channels lead to moral decay. Find God Chorizo, before it's too late.

this then? :

 

[ChorizoPicozo]

Nobody gives a shit mate.

you gave enough to reply

 

[James Sawyer Ford]

Lots of cool details I hadn't seen pointed out anywhere else

Men_in_Boxes