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[BlownUpRich]

you know what, after the last gta6 trailer, the reveal of w4 doesn't look THAT impossible or impressive, am i going crazy??



Opinions?

Like it look more fake and pre-rendered than gta6 but at the same time, far from a generational difference...

I always felt about it like that since the day they revealed the trailer, it looks feasible, just lightly trim the obviously superior image quality, and that perfect-looking motion blur, and a few effects here & there, I'd argue even upgrading some stuff like the models, and yeah it could ship like that, GTA VI just gave us a much needed perspective on how games should look like, even though, what GTA is doing is something almost no other developer has, the expertise, the core tech direction, the engine, the budget, the time & the stupendous amount of developers working on it. AND the ambition.

 

[Kaiserstark]

gta6 turned the previous most impossible reveal into something feasible, lmao.

At this point the ball is in ND court, tlou3 is the next BIG reveal for all the graphic whores around the world.

Cd project-rockstar-ND the holy trinity.

Or guerrilla with horizon 3 on ps6 if ND lost all their talent.
Or remedy with control 2

If Intergalactic is really a 2027 game like Schreier said we are not getting Part 3 on this gen.

In a way, if Intergalactic is really planned for 2027, I have a hard time understanding why Naughty Dog unveiled the game so early, even though it's more interesting to show the game in-engine than with a CG teaser.

Because that means that by the end of 2024, the game was in the final stages of pre-production or at the beginning of full production, so there's a good chance that at this stage of development, quite a few things will change, both visually and technically.

 

[GooseMan69]

SkillUp claims there's a boss fight about 20 hours into Death Stranding 2 that is the most impressive visual sequence he's ever seen on a console. Very interested to see that for myself.

 

[SlimySnake]

Mafia does have some really nice looking locations

Nanite at its best. There are several shots like this in the gameplay overview. Just packed full of detail you can make out from a mile away.

Gorgeous lighting too.

Sadly the character faces have been downgraded since the last trailer. Or maybe its just different scenes in not so great lighting conditions. not sure why the characters needs to be downgraded during cutscenes.

This is from the first trailer.

 

[BlownUpRich]

Took some screenshots from the Matrix Awakens demo, it still looks unbelievable even to this day, my God does it look so good! The geometrical density, textures, draw distance & RTGI are out of this world!

 

[Jack Howitzer]

For mafia ,the overall asset quality and details are being improved a lot no kidding, definitely huge jump comparing to their past works. So as you can see the visual presentation is right there , next I'm gonna start my fav routine --lod nitpicking for now. Tldr-- Judging by what the video trying to sell, lod of world buildings looks kinda decent? But right behind these buildings, they still choose to fill the game world with these blurry mess close range terrain models for whatever reason. Now even a showcase youtube video can't hide them away, this is very worrying. You know they been saying it's not a city environment focused game by any means unlike previous titles, and I do want to enjoy the game without stuff like this ruinning the vibe nonstop .
Like guys, what is this? Does terrain in our world becoming like world class top tier Nitendo Wii U quality when barely walking off few yards away for now? And hey! Where is my good old buddy Grass going? That slippery bastard just running off the stage like this and everybody out here have to suffer for it? Come on now this ain't funny,we are shooting a serious gangster shit movie here ,not some 4 year old kindergarten cartoons people! Wake up!

And this one right here , what's her name? Oh it's that big tough Mountain milf right? Why does she always wearing that blurry mess whatever ugly clothes thing, like such a fatty asss clown? It's a miracle these little Tree dudes are still sticking around after all these years. Ah can't blame them too much , must be cheap as hell for a big booty like this to touch their peen weenie for the horny nights right?

Here we go again same type of shit, these terrains just lacking some basic details,

Idk guys no disrespect to the dev team, yeah they are doing casual interview right now about how amazing the game gonna be, how great the game gonna looks. But same as always,they been boosting the same style fancy words towards their track records(mafia DE, even mafia 3 as I remember) all the time. And well, we all know these titles are nowhere near graphically outstanding as they been trying to make it out to be. Which is fine, it's their own product to sell after all. But what some devs may feels enough are not the same deal for us graphics pimps. it's always better to just remain kinda of cautiously optimistic towards their graphical efforts.

 

[Balducci30]

For mafia ,the overall asset quality and details are being improved a lot no kidding, definitely huge jump comparing to their past works. So as you can see the visual presentation is right there , next I'm gonna start my fav routine --lod nitpicking for now. Tldr-- Judging by what the video trying to sell, lod of world buildings looks kinda decent? But right behind these buildings, they still choose to fill the game world with these blurry mess close range terrain models for whatever reason. Now even a showcase youtube video can't hide them away, this is very worrying. You know they been saying it's not a city environment focused game by any means unlike previous titles, and I do want to enjoy the game without stuff like this ruinning the vibe nonstop .
Like guys, what is this? Does terrain in our world becoming like world class top tier Nitendo Wii U quality when barely walking off few yards away for now? And hey! Where is my good old buddy Grass going? That slippery bastard just running off the stage like this and everybody out here have to suffer for it? Come on now this ain't funny,we are shooting a serious gangster shit movie here ,not some 4 year old kindergarten cartoons people! Wake up!

And this one right here , what's her name? Oh it's that big tough Mountain milf right? Why does she always wearing that blurry mess whatever ugly clothes thing, like such a fatty asss clown? It's a miracle these little Tree dudes are still sticking around after all these years. Ah can't blame them too much , must be cheap as hell for a big booty like this to touch their peen weenie for the horny nights right?

Here we go again same type of shit, these terrains just lacking some basic details,

Idk guys no disrespect to the dev team, yeah they are doing casual interview right now about how amazing the game gonna be, how great the game gonna looks. But same as always,they been boosting the same style fancy words towards their track records(mafia DE, even mafia 3 as I remember) all the time. And well, we all know these titles are nowhere near graphically outstanding as they been trying to make it out to be. Which is fine, it's their own product to sell after all. But what some devs may feels enough are not the same deal for us graphics pimps. it's always better to just remain kinda of cautiously optimistic towards their graphical efforts.

Looking at the gameplay footage again, Mafia looks good but it's not mindblowing to me - seems on the level of the good looking games we have, better in some areas, worse in others. But perhaps my brain has been broken by GTA6

 

[rofif]

This is next gen.

This is ass

 

[mrMUR_96]

Am I the only one who think Mafia looks just ok? It's mostly decent looking, but it's nothing particularly impressive either. Looks it's using UE5 fine overall, but the assets, characters and overall quality isn't anything special. The animation looks pretty janky especially.

 

[GymWolf]

Am I the only one who think Mafia looks just ok? It's mostly decent looking, but it's nothing particularly impressive either. Looks it's using UE5 fine overall, but the assets, characters and overall quality isn't anything special.

Read the last 2 pages, you are not the only one.

 

[GymWolf]

This is ass

 

[Gonzito]

Am I the only one who think Mafia looks just ok? It's mostly decent looking, but it's nothing particularly impressive either. Looks it's using UE5 fine overall, but the assets, characters and overall quality isn't anything special.

I said so too but we can't criticize UE5 here because papi Slimmy is ready to use his whip against anyone who dares to say anything remotely negative

 

[alloush]

It's the enemy AI and animations that need an equal leap forward.

This!

I am anxiously waiting for the day we see huge leaps made in those two departments.

 

[PeteBull]

gta6 turned the previous most impossible reveal into something feasible, lmao.

At this point the ball is in ND court, tlou3 is the next BIG reveal for all the graphic whores around the world.

Cd project-rockstar-ND the holy trinity.

Or guerrilla with horizon 3 on ps6 if ND lost all their talent.
Or remedy with control 2

I wouldnt leave out santa monica, we didnt get anything from them after crossgen Ragnarok...

 

[mrMUR_96]

I wouldnt leave out santa monica, we didnt get anything from them after crossgen Ragnarok...

Santa Monica's engine at least in Ragnarok seems heavily dated, I'm not holding out much hope for something properly next gen from them.

 

[PeteBull]

Took some screenshots from the Matrix Awakens demo, it still looks unbelievable even to this day, my God does it look so good! The geometrical density, textures, draw distance & RTGI are out of this world!

It was running at relatively low res and was far from holding even stable 30, and it was a demo w/o many basic game system implemented, like colision of cars with npc pedestarians, but yup, most impressive thing we ever saw so far, i say gta6 2nd trailer looks similary impressive tho. reswise for both ps5/xsx durning most impressive scenes aka black bars it wasnt even 1440p, it was 2560 x1055(coz blackbars werent rendered obviously, kinda like back on ps4 with the order 1866).
Timestamped:

As a funny anecdote later u get info about series s pixels counts, 1280x533 and 1555x648, its gpu is literally 3x worse from 12tf series x gpu so ofc inevitable had to happen, srs cuts in resolution on top of everywhere else too

TLDR: When it comes to consoles since its closed platform something gotta give- impressive visuals, 60fps or high resolutions, u can never have all 3, and for the peak pefromance in one of those 3, other 2 gotta be heavily neglected ;D

 

[coachmcguirk91]

If Intergalactic is really a 2027 game like Schreier said we are not getting Part 3 on this gen.

In a way, if Intergalactic is really planned for 2027, I have a hard time understanding why Naughty Dog unveiled the game so early, even though it's more interesting to show the game in-engine than with a CG teaser.

Because that means that by the end of 2024, the game was in the final stages of pre-production or at the beginning of full production, so there's a good chance that at this stage of development, quite a few things will change, both visually and technically.

I think they just needed people to get off their back about what their next project was. Druckmann pretty said the same thing in fewer words. ND has gotten terrible press this gen

 

[GymWolf]

The bike is so rounded with virtually zero rought edges, it looks almost fake\concept art.

 

[GymWolf]

I wouldnt leave out santa monica, we didnt get anything from them after crossgen Ragnarok...

Right now they are behind both nd and guerrilla, they have everything to prove.

 

[H . R . 2]

The bike is so rounded with virtually zero rought edges, it looks almost fake\concept art.

That is partly due to the ever so slight and variable blur effect that was present in every shot of the trailer
here the bike and the trees are all out of focus [to varying degrees] thus giving the impression that the image is too soft and lacks details

I actually very much like that effect, as I did in RDR2
it does take away details but makes the overall image much more [photo]realistic

 

[GymWolf]

That is partly due to the ever so slight and variable blur effect that was present in every shot of the trailer
here the bike and the trees are all out of focus [to varying degrees] thus giving the impression that the image is too soft and lacks details

I actually very much like that effect, as I did in RDR2
it does take away details but makes the overall image much more [photo]realistic

It doesn't look bluerred enough to hide the flaws that all videogames have with rounded surfaces tho...

Can't this be just rockastar having thousands of artist that make every asset perfect?

 

[coachmcguirk91]

Right now they are behind both nd and guerrilla, they have everything to prove.

GOW 2018s graphics and presentation is legendary for its time. From a technical perspective, HFW was a bigger upgrade than Ragnarok, I concede, but they dont have "everything to prove". They are side by side with Naughty Dog as Playstation's best studio. Both GOW games still look fantastic

 

[xxDeadlockxx]

Speaking of what it might look like on the Series S,

Do you think R* will remove global illumination and all reflections for RT, or is it something too central to the game's design and conception to be removed?

It's not a good example probably because it doesn't reach the quality levels of GTA 6, really, no current game does, but Massive in both Avatar and Outlaws maintains these things even in the Series S version, and in my opinion a very good job was done.

We already know how hated this console is, but please try to forget about that and focus on the question.

 

[analog_future]

This is ass

 

[blastprocessor]

Wow that's a seriously impressive custom engine, the water, interactive volumetric fog, physics, particles are all punching.

 

[Msamy]

I felt there something wrong with ds2 gameplay from previous clearly trailers looks better than previous gameplay videos so I can searched then found this one with closest quality to the trailer, so still not in same league as mafia, maybe as good as HFW at best

 

[Schmendrick]

edit: AI Fake....
*sigh*

similar and unfortunately real garbage:

 

[Kikorin]

Am I the only one who think Mafia looks just ok? It's mostly decent looking, but it's nothing particularly impressive either. Looks it's using UE5 fine overall, but the assets, characters and overall quality isn't anything special. The animation looks pretty janky especially.

Looks like UE5 "the game". Like UE3, this engine is starting to give a really distinctive looks at these realistic games made with it.

It looks good tho, on the level of good looking games we already have if I've to judge from my phone.

 

[DanielG165]

Maybe I was too harsh to people using the "looks like CGI" phrase..... this.....this is current date TV CGI from a billion dollar studio.

.....
...
...

That's what happens when the Disney overlords don't give their VFX artists any time to do their work. Marvel CGI has been garbage for years now.

 

[DanielG165]

It's the enemy AI and animations that need an equal leap forward. It's going to be so offputting if an NPC just stands there in the open firing at you and not running for cover when he see's his mate get slaughtered 5 feet from him.

I've heard and read that making hyper advanced AI is extremely tough and resource-heavy to do, which is why most games either don't bother, or will only have one incredibly smart AI like Alien: Isolation. That said, most games, especially open world ones, do have NPCs with actual schedules and "lives", and they will interact to fights breaking out, weapons being drawn, shootouts etc. I believe Watch Dogs 2 even has NPCs where each of them have an actual name, a routine that you can follow them on, and a life. RDR2 is another great example of this, as well as even something like Oblivion/Bethesda games as a whole.

Even the Arkham games have enemy AI that start to get worried when one of their own gets taken out by Batman, to outright terrified as more and more get knocked out, and their animations change accordingly. I'd say that, as a whole, we're honestly at a good place with video game AI and animation as a whole. Games that have great AI and animation outweigh those that don't these days.

 

[mrMUR_96]

GOW 2018s graphics and presentation is legendary for its time. From a technical perspective, HFW was a bigger upgrade than Ragnarok, I concede, but they dont have "everything to prove". They are side by side with Naughty Dog as Playstation's best studio. Both GOW games still look fantastic

I genuinely disagree, GOW2018 looked great but was the only thing they put out the whole generation, while even Naughty Dog put out more games on PS4 and they were better looking (especially TLOU2). Ragnarok was barely an upgrade visually, the art style was good and the production clearly had a high budget that shows in animation, camera work and polish, but the engine is clearly very last gen.

 

[GymWolf]

GOW 2018s graphics and presentation is legendary for its time. From a technical perspective, HFW was a bigger upgrade than Ragnarok, I concede, but they dont have "everything to prove". They are side by side with Naughty Dog as Playstation's best studio. Both GOW games still look fantastic

And that's your opinion dude.

For me they are noticeably behind guerrilla and nd for now.

 

[SlimySnake]

The bike is so rounded with virtually zero rought edges, it looks almost fake\concept art.

thats because it is. There are some shots on the website that are literally bullshots.

this is my favorite one. Clearly they had her sitting there in that pose looking at the camera.

 

[SlimySnake]

lol The cope is real.

 

[Bojji]

lol The cope is real.

 

[SlimySnake]

That's what happens when the Disney overlords don't give their VFX artists any time to do their work. Marvel CGI has been garbage for years now.

Yeah, this is all because of how overworked these cg houses are. They dont get the time they need to fix the CG. This isnt just a tv issue either.

Disney's ILM is the sole exception. WB had great CG up until BvS after which they trailed off too. that was almost 10 years ago.

 

[GymWolf]

I've heard and read that making hyper advanced AI is extremely tough and resource-heavy to do, which is why most games either don't bother, or will only have one incredibly smart AI like Alien: Isolation. That said, most games, especially open world ones, do have NPCs with actual schedules and "lives", and they will interact to fights breaking out, weapons being drawn, shootouts etc. I believe Watch Dogs 2 even has NPCs where each of them have an actual name, a routine that you can follow them on, and a life. RDR2 is another great example of this, as well as even something like Oblivion/Bethesda games as a whole.

Even the Arkham games have enemy AI that start to get worried when one of their own gets taken out by Batman, to outright terrified as more and more get knocked out, and their animations change accordingly. I'd say that, as a whole, we're honestly at a good place with video game AI and animation as a whole. Games that have great AI and animation outweigh those that don't these days.

I extensively tested the ai of wd2 and it was random as fuck.

Gta6 need to have a leap in how npcs are gonna react to the most various external stimulus, this is gonna be what make it or break it the immersion, the ai system in rdr2 is NOT ENOUGH.

 

[SlimySnake]

Twitter has been brutal today.



Cant believe we had people in this thread defending this trash.

 

[BlownUpRich]

It was running at relatively low res and was far from holding even stable 30, and it was a demo w/o many basic game system implemented, like colision of cars with npc pedestarians, but yup, most impressive thing we ever saw so far, i say gta6 2nd trailer looks similary impressive tho. reswise for both ps5/xsx durning most impressive scenes aka black bars it wasnt even 1440p, it was 2560 x1055(coz blackbars werent rendered obviously, kinda like back on ps4 with the order 1866).
Timestamped:

As a funny anecdote later u get info about series s pixels counts, 1280x533 and 1555x648, its gpu is literally 3x worse from 12tf series x gpu so ofc inevitable had to happen, srs cuts in resolution on top of everywhere else too

TLDR: When it comes to consoles since its closed platform something gotta give- impressive visuals, 60fps or high resolutions, u can never have all 3, and for the peak pefromance in one of those 3, other 2 gotta be heavily neglected ;D

I agree, though it's be really cool to see this same demo running on UE 5.5 because according to DF, they ran this city sample, looks better with the RT & is much lighter on CPU by 35% & on GPU by %20, they even tested it on PCs that resemble the PS5 & XSX.

Something to think about I guess.

 

[SlimySnake]

I agree, though it's be really cool to see this same demo running on UE 5.5 because according to DF, they ran this city sample, looks better with the RT & is much lighter on CPU by 35% & on GPU by %20, they even tested it on PCs that resemble the PS5 & XSX.

Something to think about I guess.

Yep. they ran it with 5.4 which fixed the CPU bottlenecks and the game ran fine. the drops on the PS5 and XSX were all CPU bound, you could turn off the traffic, npcs and parked cars and have a smooth 30 fps experience.

The resolution is definitely around 1440p too. No 1080p game reconstructed to 4k using TSR looks this clean. maybe DLSS, but this was using a very early version of TSR on consoles. Also, The black bars were only during cutscenes. the game's pixel counts were consistenly around 1440p or 1404p according to VGtech and Elanaldebits. that would make it closer to TSR 4k quality than performance.

 

[BlownUpRich]

It doesn't look bluerred enough to hide the flaws that all videogames have with rounded surfaces tho...

Can't this be just rockastar having thousands of artist that make every asset perfect?

That's what blew my mind, I tried to look for rough polygonal edges on the cars in the trailer and there was basically none. It's mind boggling!

 

[GymWolf]

thats because it is. There are some shots on the website that are literally bullshots.

this is my favorite one. Clearly they had her sitting there in that pose looking at the camera.

I don't get it, if you think they are bullshot why were you so excited when you saw the pics on the site?

 

[SlimySnake]

Naughty Dog: Makes their lead actor shave her head because they dont want to invest in hair physics.
Rockstar: Gives hair strands and applies proper hair physics to every single NPC, animal, adds arm hair, and dozens of different hair styles for playable characters.

 

[BlownUpRich]

Speaking of what it might look like on the Series S,

Do you think R* will remove global illumination and all reflections for RT, or is it something too central to the game's design and conception to be removed?

It's not a good example probably because it doesn't reach the quality levels of GTA 6, really, no current game does, but Massive in both Avatar and Outlaws maintains these things even in the Series S version, and in my opinion a very good job was done.

We already know how hated this console is, but please try to forget about that and focus on the question.

I think they'll reduce the quality of RT effects, reduce resolution down to 720p or even lower based on load, reduce shadow quality & draw distance by a significant margin, ending up as a blurry mess & downgraded image, that's all I can see getting reduced.

 

[SlimySnake]

I don't get it, if you think they are bullshot why were you so excited when you saw the pics on the site?

Because only some of the shots are bullshots. the rest are clearly taken from cutscenes. Especially the gifs on the website like these below.

 

[GymWolf]

Because only some of the shots are bullshots. the rest are clearly taken from cutscenes. Especially the gifs on the website like these below.

I don't understand why even bothering with putting bullshot mixed with real pics in their site.

 

[GymWolf]

Naughty Dog: Makes their lead actor shave her head because they dont want to invest in hair physics.
Rockstar: Gives hair strands and applies proper hair physics to every single NPC, animal, adds arm hair, and dozens of different hair styles for playable characters.

We still don't know that yet unless you mean npcs in cutscenes.

It's gonna be hard to have good hairs for every insignificant nocs on the streets.

How are those cpus not melting?

 

[Msamy]

Naughty Dog: Makes their lead actor shave her head because they dont want to invest in hair physics.
Rockstar: Gives hair strands and applies proper hair physics to every single NPC, animal, adds arm hair, and dozens of different hair styles for playable characters.

Sony invest money in bullshit remasters and live service games they don't invest in their studios tech. And even their neglect their best game engine and transfer guerilla to live service studio (as per their producer LinkedIn profile) truly fuc. sony.

 

[SlimySnake]

We still don't know that yet unless you mean npcs in cutscenes.

In the very first trailer, all NPCs on the beach had the same hair physics.

It's gonna be hard to have good hairs for every insignificant nocs on the streets.

How are those cpus not melting?

Oh they will melt. Dragon Age hair was destroying my CPU like nothing else has before. It was in the mid 70s in temperature when in almost every other game it stays around 55-60 degrees. Apparently like 20% of their frametime budget went into hair according to the latest DF direct when they were comparing GTA hair to Dragon Age's hair.

But then again, i was running it at 60 fps so the CPU was working overtime. if they target 30 fps it should be fine. but we dont know if their hair physics are mostly done on CPU or GPU. There are various different ways of doing this. treesFX was mostly doing it on the GPU.

Edit: AC shadows also has a setting for NPC hair physics. Its mostly a GPU hit though. like around 10% in cities iirc.

 

[DanielG165]

Speaking of what it might look like on the Series S,

Do you think R* will remove global illumination and all reflections for RT, or is it something too central to the game's design and conception to be removed?

It's not a good example probably because it doesn't reach the quality levels of GTA 6, really, no current game does, but Massive in both Avatar and Outlaws maintains these things even in the Series S version, and in my opinion a very good job was done.

We already know how hated this console is, but please try to forget about that and focus on the question.

Resolution will be heavily reduced, likely targeting 700-800p range at most. If RTGI is, "baked" into GTA 6, which it likely is, then the effect will be drastically reduced on Series S as well, if not removed entirely to sustain a 30 fps lock. Overall, I can see the Series S version still being solid enough and especially for the more casual audience who just want to play GTA 6, but it will be a significant step back from the premium consoles.

Rockstar will/have tried their best, however. They aren't like CDPR where they release a version of the game that is essentially unplayable (8th gen port of 2077).