Switch 2 dock output is HDMI 2.1 not 2.0

LordOcidax

LordOcidax

Member
"To begin with, it's a Realtek RTD2175N, which confirms the rumors that had been circulating for months, it uses a DisplayPort v1.4 to HDMI 2.1 protocol converter.

This RTD2173 chipset supports video resolutions of 720p, 1080p, 4K30Hz, 4K60Hz, 4K120Hz (with DSC), 8K30Hz, and 8K60Hz (with DSC)"

So the possibilities of a future VRR in dock support via a firmware upgrade is possible.

www.hobbyconsolas.com

Desmontan el dock de Nintendo Switch 2 y dan con un importante hallazgo: jugar a 4K y 120 Hz es técnicamente posible

Un despiece al dock de Nintendo Switch 2 ofrece características técnicas que dejan claro una posible actualización futura para jugar a 4K y 120 Hz.
www.hobbyconsolas.com www.hobbyconsolas.com

The chipset in the dock is specifically the Realtek RTD2175N-CG. Unable to find this precise model on the web, but I assume the RTD2173 is a predecessor. It's being used in this adapter:
• ⁠Chipset: RTD2173
• ⁠Compliant with DisplayPort 1.4, HDMI HDCP 2.2/1.4, HDR 10
• ⁠Video resolution: 720p, 1080p, 4K30Hz, 4K60Hz,4K120Hz (w/DSC), 8K30Hz and 8K60Hz (w/DSC)
• ⁠Audio Support: 7.1-ch PCM
• ⁠Bandwidth: Up to 32.4Gbps

This is from Reddit:

"As stated by the Famiboards poster this chip doesn't seem to be listed anywhere on Realtek's site, so we don't have a datasheet"

But I did find a review for an ASRock Industrial UCFF PC, and it has this controller with the same capabilities (DP 1.4 to HDMI 2.1 conversion with 8K60Hz support with DSC and 4K60 support):

www.anandtech.com

ASRock Industrial 4X4 BOX-7735U UCFF PC Review: Zen 3+, RDNA2, and USB4 in a Potent Platform

www.anandtech.com www.anandtech.com

Edit: The RTD2175 is also used by some PS5 Slim models just the RTD2175P (P probably for PlayStation) variation. The Switch uses the RTD2175N (N probably for Nintendo).

"This encoder IC is compatible with all PS5 consoles so far except the PS5 slim with EDM-044 motherboard that has a RTD2175P HDMI encoder IC from Realtek"

PS5 HDMI IC MN864739 - Consoletronics

Brand new HDMI IC MN864739 for PS5 console. Still no display after HDMI port replacement ? It's the time to have this chip replaced ! Same day dispatch
consoletronics.com consoletronics.com
 
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gQj7G0SrF1DcZiPm.jpeg
It's waiting!!! Go Nintendo go
 
I'm so lost at this point. "It's 2.1 - No, it's 2.0 - No, 2.1 - No, 2.0 - 2.1! - 2.0!! - 2.1!!!"

I'll just look it up once I get an updated model in a year or two.
 
Mr Moose said:
Is there any new info on that chip? Otherwise this is just stuff we knew from last year (RTD2173 is not the same chip).
Click to expand...
They dissembled the dock to double check.

The chipset in the dock is specifically the Realtek RTD2175N-CG. Unable to find this precise model on the web, but I assume the RTD2173 is a predecessor. It's being used in this adapter:
• ⁠Chipset: RTD2173
• ⁠Compliant with DisplayPort 1.4, HDMI HDCP 2.2/1.4, HDR 10
• ⁠Video resolution: 720p, 1080p, 4K30Hz, 4K60Hz,4K120Hz (w/DSC), 8K30Hz and 8K60Hz (w/DSC)
• ⁠Audio Support: 7.1-ch PCM
• ⁠Bandwidth: Up to 32.4Gbps

This is from Reddit:

As stated by the Famiboards poster this chip doesn't seem to be listed anywhere on Realtek's site, so we don't have a datasheet.

But I did find a review for an ASRock Industrial UCFF PC, and it has this controller with the same capabilities (DP 1.4 to HDMI 2.1 conversion with 8K60Hz support with DSC and 4K60 support):

www.anandtech.com

ASRock Industrial 4X4 BOX-7735U UCFF PC Review: Zen 3+, RDNA2, and USB4 in a Potent Platform

www.anandtech.com www.anandtech.com
 
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Giallo Corsa said:
I can set 1440p on my LG C2 with a PS5 just fine, not so with a Switch 2 though, make it make sense...

This company is literally 10+ years behind every time
Click to expand...
The PS5 had to wait for certification for a long time for 1440p support. But that's strange, i can put that resolution on my tv without any issue with the Switch 2.
 
I do hope they CAN update it, and this isn't some limitation they ran into in the USB-C daisy chain of stuff going on, which would suck.

Just because the chipset itself is capable VRR, doesn't mean the bottleneck didn't crop up someplace else you'd only find in a Switch 2.

I'd be interested in anyone with USB-C video adapters your experiences trying to get VRR through them on a PC/laptop, from what I have heard it's not a good situation to begin with.
 
LordOcidax said:
The PS5 had to wait for certification for a long time for 1440p support.
Click to expand...

there was no certification involved. Sony didn't originally want to support 1440p because none of their TVs support it. so you had HDMI 2.0 Sony TVs that only supported 1080p 120hz and 4k 60hz. supporting 1440p 120hz would have meant supporting Samsung and LG TVs and making them look superior.

same with VRR. what a coincidence that the PS5 didn't support VRR on launch and only got support for it basically the moment they finally patched their TVs to support it.
once again, if the PS5 supported VRR on launch, PS5 users with Sony TVs would have been left in the dust, while Samsung and LG owners could have used the full feature set of the PS5.
 
BlackTron said:
I do hope they CAN update it, and this isn't some limitation they ran into in the USB-C daisy chain of stuff going on, which would suck.

Just because the chipset itself is capable VRR, doesn't mean the bottleneck didn't crop up someplace else you'd only find in a Switch 2.

I'd be interested in anyone with USB-C video adapters your experiences trying to get VRR through them on a PC/laptop, from what I have heard it's not a good situation to begin with.
Click to expand...
Steam deck uses USB-C and have VRR support that's not an issue… I am almost 100% sure this is all about certifications.
 
it doesn't matter if it supports the full HDMI 2.1 bandwidth or not. HDMI 2.0 also supports VRR. it's all about the chip used and if it supports VRR for DP over USB-C signals
 
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kevboard said:
there was no certification involved. Sony didn't originally want to support 1440p because none of their TVs support it. so you had HDMI 2.0 Sony TVs that only supported 1080p 120hz and 4k 60hz. supporting 1440p 120hz would have meant supporting Samsung and LG TVs and making them look superior.

same with VRR. what a coincidence that the PS5 didn't support VRR on launch and only got support for it basically the moment they finally patched their TVs to support it.
once again, if the PS5 supported VRR on launch, PS5 users with Sony TVs would have been left in the dust, while Samsung and LG owners could have used the full feature set of the PS5.
Click to expand...
That doesn't make any sense, Sony don't expect that all the possible PS5 buyers are going to have a Sony TV 🙄.
 
LordOcidax said:
That doesn't make any sense, Sony don't expect that all the possible PS5 buyers are going to have a Sony TV 🙄.
Click to expand...

so it's just a crazy coincidence that their TVs were the only ones without VRR, and it just so happens that their console got VRR at the same time as their TVs?

meanwhile the fucking Xbox One S supported HDMI VRR since 2018

isn't it weird that the PS5 just so happened to miss every feature their TVs also didn't support 🤔🤔🤔
 
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LordCBH said:
So it can support VRR docked and they choose to disable it.

Fucking.

WHY
Click to expand...
DP to HDMI is probably conflicting with VRR+HDR probably because VRR+HDR is for some reason conflicting with other devices or systems through HDMI for whatever reason. They are probably figuring it out, Sony just fixed VRR recently and it's been 4 years and a half since the PS5 came out
 
LordCBH said:
So it can support VRR docked and they choose to disable it.

Fucking.

WHY
Click to expand...

HDMI 2.0 also supports VRR, the HDMI version was never the issue. the fact that they only allow 1440p 120hz and not 4k 120hz probably means that the Display Port conversion chip simply has issues with certain HDMI features.
 
That's nice! That means I can use Switch 2 OD dock with future iterations of the console that do support VRR or like Sony and their TVs, perhaps they will patch this feature in later for all Switch 2s. Either way, feels good man. Good to know the hdmi cable isn't bandwidth limited no matter what they want to do over it.
 
Dorfdad said:
LG G2-G3 sets and they are greyed out on siwtch2.
Click to expand...

download the demo of Street Fighter 6.
set your Switch 2 to 4k, enable the 120hz option in the system settings.

start Street Fighter 6 and look which resolution and refresh rate your TV changes to.

on my Samsung S95B I can also not select 1440p and it's greyed out. but when a game forces 120hz (Like SF6) the Switch 2 goes into 1440p 120hz automatically.

someone said this didn't work on the LG C2, which apparently switches into 1440p 60hz when the console set to 4k, and 1080p 120hz when set to 1080p.
meanwhile someone with an LG C1 said it does switch to 1440p 120hz.
 
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kevboard said:
so it's just a crazy coincidence that their TVs were the only ones without VRR, and it just so happens that their console got VRR at the same time as their TVs?

meanwhile the fucking Xbox One S supported HDMI VRR since 2018

isn't it weird that the PS5 just so happened to miss every feature their TVs also didn't support 🤔🤔🤔
Click to expand...
The HDMI certification is a well known topic in tech forums, you are making an assumption and probably that was just a coincidence 🤷‍♂️.
 
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LordOcidax said:
The HDMI certification is an well known topic in tech forums, you are making an assumption and probably that was just coincidence 🤷‍♂️.
Click to expand...

very weird coincidence then... very, VERY weird coincidence.

a coincidence that, if it didn't happen, would have allowed Samsung 2018 TVs with HDMI 2.0 to use 1440p 120hz VRR on PS5, while Sony TV users with brand new 2021 model TVs would have needed to wait for months to do the same.

just a very fortuitous coincidence that Sony TVs got VRR support just in time with the PS5, which meant their console didn't have to make their TVs look bad... lucky lucky Sony
 
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The fact this is so difficult to figure out to begin with ridiculous. It's a failure of the consortium and their standard spec, and a failure of Nintendo to provide an understanding of the hardware they use and its capabilities.
 
LavitzSlambert said:
The fact this is so difficult to figure out to begin with ridiculous. It's a failure of the consortium and their standard spec, and a failure of Nintendo to provide an understanding of the hardware they use and its capabilities.
Click to expand...
We had to wait for almost two years for the VRR support on the PS5, the same for the Deck, probably there are some technical things that the manufacturer have no control over.
 
LavitzSlambert said:
The fact this is so difficult to figure out to begin with ridiculous. It's a failure of the consortium and their standard spec, and a failure of Nintendo to provide an understanding of the hardware they use and its capabilities.
Click to expand...

well, not sure if this is an issue with the HDMI forum. this chip could simply not work properly with some HDMI features. they are converting Display Port over USB to HDMI.

the HDMI Forum is a shitshow, no doubt, but this could legit just be a hardware issue due to a cheap converter chip.

the bigger issue with the HDMI Forum is the convoluted messaging about HDMI 2.1 and its features + the fact that they retroactively wiped 2.0 from existence. HDMI 2.0 does officially not exist anymore, it's all part of 2.1 now. but of course basically noone follows the HDMI Forum definition and just continues to use the HDMI 2.0 name. this now leads to confusion about VRR, ALLM and other features.

many people still think you need HDMI 2.1 to support VRR, which is not true. the Xbox One S (and One X) supports VRR and is an HDMI 2.0 device. many PC monitors with 2.0 also support it, as well as some Samsung 2.0 TVs from 2018.
(and no I'm not talking about FreeSync, you can manually turn freesync off and HDMI VRR on on LG TVs and still use the One S with VRR, confirming it supports it)
 
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kevboard said:
very weird coincidence then... very, VERY weird coincidence.

a coincidence that, if it didn't happen, would have allowed Samsung 2018 TVs with HDMI 2.0 to use 1440p 120hz VRR on PS5, while Sony TV users with brand new 2021 model TVs would have needed to wait for months to do the same.

just a very fortuitous coincidence that Sony TVs got VRR support just in time with the PS5, which meant their console didn't have to make their TVs look bad... lucky lucky Sony
Click to expand...
Well yeah they fucked the bucket on the Sony x900 ports, taking them over a year to shoehorn it in.
 
kevboard said:
well, not sure if this is an issue with the HDMI forum. this chip could simply not work properly with some HDMI features. they are converting Display Port over USB to HDMI.

the HDMI Forum is a shitshow, no doubt, but this could legit just be a hardware issue due to a cheap converter chip.

the bigger issue with the HDMI Forum is the convoluted messaging about HDMI 2.1 and its features + the fact that they retroactively wiped 2.0 from existence. HDMI 2.0 does officially not exist anymore, it's all part of 2.1 now. but of course basically noone follows the HDMI Forum definition and just continues to use the HDMI 2.0 name. this now leads to confusion about VRR, ALLM and other features.

many people still think you need HDMI 2.1 to support VRR, which is not true. the Xbox One S (and One X) supports VRR and is an HDMI 2.0 device. many PC monitors with 2.0 also support it, as well as some Samsung 2.0 TVs from 2018.
(and no I'm not talking about FreeSync, you can manually turn freesync off and HDMI VRR on on LG TVs and still use the One S with VRR, confirming it supports it)
Click to expand...
PS5, Switch 2 and the Steam deck having similar issues just indicates that this is all about HDMI forum problems… Like you said, is a shitshow.
 
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LordOcidax said:
PS5, Switch 2 and the Steam deck having similar issues just indicates that this is all about HDMI forum problems… Like you said, is a shitshow.
Click to expand...

the Xbox One S supporting VRR since 2018, when it literally just was released as a standard, indicates that this isn't an issue with certification. the Deck is in a similar situation as the Switch 2. it has to convert Display Port through a USB port to HDMI. also, does the Deck even support HDMI VRR? or does it use Freesync?

the PS5 doesn't have to go through these conversion steps... it's just an AMD APU and an HDMI chip, just like the Xbox One S, One X, Series S and Series X.

every modern Nvidia GPU also supports HDMI VRR btw., this is how TVs are "G-Sync Compatible". which is why on LG TVs the setting for HDMI VRR and Gsync are combined, while Freesync is separate.

Sony simply didn't support VRR on launch because their TVs had technical issues with a shitty chipset, and they didn't want to make them look bad. simple as that.
we know their TVs had tech issues because they had to release multiple firmware patches until it finally worked properly... and mysteriously, shortly after it worked fine on their backwards ass TVs the console got a firmware update to support it. again, what fortuitous timing!
 
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