NeverYouMind
Member
Same reason I hate RPG Maker and Roguelites. There is little reason to waste time on a generic imitation of something good when you can play something tailored for the genre desired.
Why The hell do so many gamers hate AI?
- Thread starter MagusMajul
- Start date
Laptop1991
Member
Yeah, IF it's done well and we have to go through 10 to 15 years of what, bad AI lol, i can't be bothered, i've been waiting far too long for new games from my favourite franchises anyway, i probably won't be here.
Magic Carpet
Gold Member
I'm wanting to watch a Youtube lets play of an AI playing a game created by a different AI.
FalsettoVibe
Member
But wouldn't all of that need to be processed on the hardware itself? That being the case, I'm not sure we are there yet. That would require each player to have an AI model running local which is super expensive computation and power wise. Unless we all gamed via cloud...
I think we are talking about AI being used in development, pre delivery. Not actively in the process of playing a game. Correct me if wrong.
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Tarnpanzer
Member
If done for minor refinement, AI is great. Using AI in my job every day.
If you want to built something from the ground up with AI this won´t work and is almost always "slop".
If you want to built something from the ground up with AI this won´t work and is almost always "slop".
BigBeauford
Member
Anyone who asks this question need only ponder for 1 minute what the ultimate goal of AI is.
AJUMP23
Parody of actual AJUMP23
Well like I have said in other threads AI is a tool, people use tools all the time, but I was explaining the Premise of the thread. People hate AI because they see it as reductive to the creative process. You did not spend 5 hours drawing that or writing that, you had a machine write or draw for you, you just gave some guidelines.
Zacfoldor
Gold Member
Hey OP, we live in a time when the promise of AI has reached us but the qualities and abilities of AI are still locked off from most users.
What is there that works really well is less interesting to individuals than corporations.
We have the pieces of AI and those pieces are super useful to corporations and to those individuals who are capable of unlocking it.
...but we as individuals need agentic software in order to fully appreciate it. We currently have "tools" but we need them packaged in a capable agentic LLM for the masses and nobody has pulled that off yet. With Gemini 3 google is closer than ever to making an AI worth using. Once that AI is empowered to do daily chores for us out of the box without much prompting then you will finally see large scale AI dependencies among normies. This is what the industry is counting on and if this happens it never was a bubble. They are trying hard to turn these current awesome AI models into companions that can actually do things for normies in real life without a ton of setup or prep work. They haven't pulled that off yet but AI money is banking on this happening very soon. AI needs to change in the eyes of normal people from a novelty to a service that actually shows time savings for the average bill paying 9-5 joe schmoe.
Like, for example, I should be able to take a photo of my w-2 and tell AI to "do my taxes as cheaply as possible on turbotax, complete the job, pay, and let me know when they have been submitted" and then AI needs to do all that and let me know when it is done. It COULD do that with some tweaks. They are working on that now.
What is there that works really well is less interesting to individuals than corporations.
We have the pieces of AI and those pieces are super useful to corporations and to those individuals who are capable of unlocking it.
...but we as individuals need agentic software in order to fully appreciate it. We currently have "tools" but we need them packaged in a capable agentic LLM for the masses and nobody has pulled that off yet. With Gemini 3 google is closer than ever to making an AI worth using. Once that AI is empowered to do daily chores for us out of the box without much prompting then you will finally see large scale AI dependencies among normies. This is what the industry is counting on and if this happens it never was a bubble. They are trying hard to turn these current awesome AI models into companions that can actually do things for normies in real life without a ton of setup or prep work. They haven't pulled that off yet but AI money is banking on this happening very soon. AI needs to change in the eyes of normal people from a novelty to a service that actually shows time savings for the average bill paying 9-5 joe schmoe.
Like, for example, I should be able to take a photo of my w-2 and tell AI to "do my taxes as cheaply as possible on turbotax, complete the job, pay, and let me know when they have been submitted" and then AI needs to do all that and let me know when it is done. It COULD do that with some tweaks. They are working on that now.
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phant0m
Member
Which is really funny because gamers constantly say "price? not worth. I'll wait til it's 50%+ off" or "should be f2p"
meanwhile gaming is one of the cheapest hobbies on the planet
I'm not judging everyone's personal financial situations but it's deeply fucking ironic that gamers rush to the defense of artists and voice actors while also refusing to actually pay for the products they make
you guys either want everything to made by people for living wages OR you want to never pay more than $20 for a game
yes those things are mutually exclusive
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If AI does get to that point most of those people won't have 9-5s and will have much bigger problems than chores lol.
Zacfoldor
Gold Member
This may be true but I can't see any technological limitation why it could not become this way. The limitations would need to be artificial/regulatory.
We may have cooked ourselves when we made everything online.
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HRK69
Member
Yeah, agreed. The tech isn't there yet. I was probably thinking way ahead of where the tech actually is, but the future stuff is fun to imagine
yurinka
Member
People in general normally irrationally reject, fear and hate new things they don't know or understand. Basically they don't have any fucking idea what they are talking about.
When over time they know and understand what really is, sees that isn't dangerous and that has positive sides they get used to it and accept it.
It happened to any major innovation that highly changed society: the print, cars, trains, electricity, cinema, tv, computers, internet... all were demonized and rejected by many on their early days. In art, many artists hated and demonized new tech and techniques when introduced, like airbrush or o draw or paint.
In gaming, many gamers also demonized big innovations when introduced: game consoles instead of arcade, cds instead of cartridges, 3D visuals instead of 2D visuals, analog sticks instead of dpad, digital games instead of physical, online multiplayer instead of single player or local couch multiplayer, DLC or IAP instead of full game only, F2P games intead of paid games, mobile games instead of console or PC, VR instead of flat tv, etc.
Same happens with AI: it's just a tool that provides many benefits to the devs and the players and has potential to bring way more in the short, medium and long future. Sure, like any tool many people won't use it correctly specially in the early days, and some will use it to produce crap.
But most will give it a good usage. t's like a hammer, a car or a knife: you can use them to murder your neighbor, but most people don't use it for that. It would be retarded to ban hammers, knives and cars.
PlayStaytion
Member
Real AI is undoubtably a threat to humanity, if it's not then it's just another propaganda to sell junk products.
Itchy Tickles
Member
On a personal note, I hate big companies using it so they can spend less on making a game, but still charge us more to play it. It doesn't feel like technology advancing, just greedy companies getting an extremely undeserved bigger profit margin with a a tiny fraction of the effort. It also just feels soulless.
General side of things, people being forced to use A.I at their jobs, which helps train the A.I., which then replaces the workers. Creativity will die and I can't see many people spending years training in their field to just feed the A.I learning to then get tossed to the curb.
General side of things, people being forced to use A.I at their jobs, which helps train the A.I., which then replaces the workers. Creativity will die and I can't see many people spending years training in their field to just feed the A.I learning to then get tossed to the curb.
Felessan
Member
It does not steal, it learn.
Humans too learn from work of others and it takes years of experience (including work of others) to be a good creator.
AI do the same - it learns from existing to create something new by recombination. And if it's sufficiently different - it's not considered stealing.
Some of AI generated stuff I see is better than like 99% of human generated slop.
What's the difference between fake and some random women from hell know where?6. Why do you want to watch fake porn with fake women?
No problem with it
It just tools generally tweaked for people liking and most of that already invented.
You can tweak learning function to reward being different - and it'll create all sort of originality. Most of it will be shitty quality, same as with human creations.
AI core "thinks" in abstractions (same as human do) and with abstractions you can mix everything from style to concept visualization without issue, if given task to do so.
It'll be as usual - economic viability
If it's cost more to train AI for specific task than use humans for it - humans will get a job.
The more sophisticated job, the less dataset it has, the higher cost of AI to run it and thus humans are in better positions.
Radical_3d
Member
I won't discuss AI in this forum since many (most) of their members have the same opinion as the OP. So I won't elaborate my "fuck AI".
Topher
Identifies as young
As a software developer who uses AI daily to help with dev tasks, I see it as a huge benefit. I think most would agree that tools that help game developers do their job better is a good thing. I get the problem where generating the creative aspects of games (or movies, music, etc.) are not appealing, but I think we really have to separate that from overall benefits of AI.
AI will help gamers get games quicker and with better quality. If Monster Hunter Wilds were suddenly to be a highly optimized game, do we care if a person did the work to make that happen or if it were some embedded AI agent that ironed out the issues?
At the same time, am I going to care if a developer used AI to create some trees or NPCs if I can't tell the difference? Is ignorance truly bliss? Will gamers overall reject generated assets from AI? Same gamers who gobble up Fortnite? lol....probably not.
AI will help gamers get games quicker and with better quality. If Monster Hunter Wilds were suddenly to be a highly optimized game, do we care if a person did the work to make that happen or if it were some embedded AI agent that ironed out the issues?
At the same time, am I going to care if a developer used AI to create some trees or NPCs if I can't tell the difference? Is ignorance truly bliss? Will gamers overall reject generated assets from AI? Same gamers who gobble up Fortnite? lol....probably not.
tylrdiablos
Member
-90% of the time it's low-effort crap
-It takes jobs from voice-actors, artists etc
-It drives up the price of components such as RAM and GPU's
-It takes jobs from voice-actors, artists etc
-It drives up the price of components such as RAM and GPU's
HerjansEagleFeeder
Member
Oh noble Sir OP, kindly depart, I pray,
Your absence, I'm sure, would brighten my day,
Do wander elsewhere, if you may.
Your grace is astounding — from very afar,
So distant, your charm's like a faint little star,
Please stay that distant — right where you are.
With utmost respect, and a courteous bow,
May fate escort you elsewhere, starting now.
Generated by ChatGPT
Your absence, I'm sure, would brighten my day,
Do wander elsewhere, if you may.
Your grace is astounding — from very afar,
So distant, your charm's like a faint little star,
Please stay that distant — right where you are.
With utmost respect, and a courteous bow,
May fate escort you elsewhere, starting now.
Generated by ChatGPT
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Hypereides
Member
Stick to what you know best, Felessan, spreadsheets and counting money. You clearly aren't in the expertise of creative fields. To you anything that looks like a cost-saving measure is probably a plus. Generic cost-saving visuals do not equate to quality. Perhaps to a CFO, they might. Its also pretty telling you do not actually do much creative recreation outside of your domain.
And an "AI core" is built on a net of statistical probability functions - it doesn't "think". It imitates the concept of it though. It regurgitates things already known. You're talking to someone whose both built/trained AI models from scratch and probed/breached them as well. As it stands, there's a glass ceiling on their capabilities.
Regarding, originality - we've had this conversation a few times prior. If we went by your logic, we'd still be stuck making caveman graffiti paintings since artistic originality doesn't exist as an evolutionary concept. I'd rather have people, such as yourself, scout out hardworking talented artists, encourage them to work for you, instead of relying on a generic model to produce low quality sludge for you.
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nemiroff
Member
Some people have no vision and don't know what tools are and how to use them. Shit in = Shit out. But there are always going to be clever people who know how to use these tools for the best, and that's why we will always have good games available among the all the other shit.. Much like it is right now.
Edit1: I mean, even when talking about AI chatbots, people don't even know there's a massive difference between LLM models... They used some free shit AI bot, asking what's 2+2, thinking this is all AI has to offer, but don't know about (or more importantly: How to use) something like Gemini Deep Think.
Edit2: Here's an example of bad AI use: Call of Duty Black Ops 6 and 7. Some of the artwork they generated and how they implemented it (slapped it in) is giving uncanny valley vibes, and it's definitely not good, so that's not the clever use I was talking about.
Edit1: I mean, even when talking about AI chatbots, people don't even know there's a massive difference between LLM models... They used some free shit AI bot, asking what's 2+2, thinking this is all AI has to offer, but don't know about (or more importantly: How to use) something like Gemini Deep Think.
Edit2: Here's an example of bad AI use: Call of Duty Black Ops 6 and 7. Some of the artwork they generated and how they implemented it (slapped it in) is giving uncanny valley vibes, and it's definitely not good, so that's not the clever use I was talking about.
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RSLAEV
Member
I don't really care about the "theft" angle or the fact that it will replace people, I hate that it's being rushed at so recklessly and being used by people with no talent to make worthless noise. I'm excited for what AI can do. I'm particularly looking forward to the day when AI can properly tween 2D art, and make 2D animation a lot easier and faster to make
AeonGaidenRaiden
Member
Because so far, the way it was used looks like they are just half assing it and preventing talented people doing their job. I mean when your game has a ton of reviews and mostly are negative because it was painfully obvious it was AI voiceover because they cheaped out....like what is even the point of AI then? If you gonna use it then make sure your characters sound like Denzel Washington. Why does a zombie on the COD cover have 6 fingers, a human would never make a mistake like that. If you gonna use AI then it better be the most detailed, oscar worthy looking fingers.
I mean we had procedurally generated maps since the 90s....so thats one way of creating a huge world without full human touch but someone has to go through that and make sure it works and adds on top of it. Recently, it really does seem like nobody double checks, they write the prompt and off to printing it goes. Thats why, because we are preventing talented people from creating something memorable and letting slop take over.
I mean we had procedurally generated maps since the 90s....so thats one way of creating a huge world without full human touch but someone has to go through that and make sure it works and adds on top of it. Recently, it really does seem like nobody double checks, they write the prompt and off to printing it goes. Thats why, because we are preventing talented people from creating something memorable and letting slop take over.
cireza
Member
I personally don't like AI because I can fully appreciate the hard work of people creating manually the visual and audio assets in their games.
And I am not looking forward to these people, who are artists, and who give their identity to their games through hours of hard work, being replaced by computers that do nothing but to make a weird blend off already existing art-styles, copying them in the process.
However, I do like AI for other purposes. But certainly NOT to replace artists. And definitely NOT to replace people when taking decisions THAT DO NOT ALLOW any kind of possible error. So that's basically code for the software world. And code is everywhere. It NEEDS to be validated and written by competent people, it is absolutely vital. Otherwise, we WILL be killed by code written by AI.
And I am not looking forward to these people, who are artists, and who give their identity to their games through hours of hard work, being replaced by computers that do nothing but to make a weird blend off already existing art-styles, copying them in the process.
However, I do like AI for other purposes. But certainly NOT to replace artists. And definitely NOT to replace people when taking decisions THAT DO NOT ALLOW any kind of possible error. So that's basically code for the software world. And code is everywhere. It NEEDS to be validated and written by competent people, it is absolutely vital. Otherwise, we WILL be killed by code written by AI.
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nemiroff
Member
This should be a major concern for everyone, even for those who believe AI has a positive place as a toolset. Hating on it won't change anything though, the only real option is to put pressure on our governments to make a plan to ensure that everyone on this planet is cared for when there are no jobs anymore. We can btw start at the top with dismantling the concept of billionaires and soon, potentially trillionaires if Musk gets his way
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Ribi
Member
Nice ai generated image. Proves my pointThis is you:
Felessan
Member
Big money is very creative field, you know
Better stick to your "creative blablabla" as it's clearly you don't understand a shit about how AI operates.
The math basis for AI is that NN can fit unseen function - i.e. any causal relationship, for example "this is unusual", "this is beautiful" etc. can be aproximated by NN.
AI doesn't ~copy~, it ~approximate~ reality. If there is unseen dependancy - AI will try to find it (same as humans do). And as board games shown - AI CAN go further than humans and actually invent something that was not known.
I read quite a bit of books about cognitive psychology, neurobiology, AI and stuff to know that the way human brain operates is not that much different from how AI operates (modern AI is just weaker, somewhat on a cat level, and lack some components like frontal lobes stuff).
Humans also learn by example and compiling others experience, and the most creativity comes from "be the same, but a bit different" - we see it in practically everywhere, games included, where at least 90% of work existed prior and was copypasted in clever way. E33 - copypasted, Balatro - copypasted etc - they all "got inspired" (aka copied) by several previous concepts and what make them good is not they are entirely original, but rather they did an interesting and original blend of what existed before them. And as it's people define learning rules - there is no problem to tune reward/punishment function of AI learning for the same result.
And for truly "original" stuff people find it repulsive and ugly as it doesn't match with their prior experience and knowledge and unknown cause disgust (not even fear, humans tends to fear something that resembles what we know in unusual way)
IlGialloMondadori
Member
Ai generated image? wtf are you talking about lol? Is your brain that damaged from slop? It's from SNL.
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MiguelItUp
Member
A lot of people are upset with the use of generative AI for a variety of reasons, which I can totally understand to a degree. It can reuse/steal people's work, it reduces the amount of potential jobs for others, and it's void of any passion.
Referring to generative AI, I obviously can't speak for everyone, but I feel like people are less upset when it's used by a single dev with no or an extremely limited budget, for obvious reasons. But when it's a AAA (or similar) studio with a huge budget using generative AI for something they could easily pay someone to do it just kind of looks and sounds gross, lol.
I think AI is a great tool that every industry could utilize to some degree. But it's how it's implemented and used is the kicker.
Referring to generative AI, I obviously can't speak for everyone, but I feel like people are less upset when it's used by a single dev with no or an extremely limited budget, for obvious reasons. But when it's a AAA (or similar) studio with a huge budget using generative AI for something they could easily pay someone to do it just kind of looks and sounds gross, lol.
I think AI is a great tool that every industry could utilize to some degree. But it's how it's implemented and used is the kicker.
The unfortunate part is that is extremely common across all modern topics. People suddenly forgot how to do their own research and just fully believe everything they read/hear no matter the source. It's horrifying, lol.
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Quantum253
Gold Member
Gamers have been railing against AI for decades. However, it was usually always referring to the simplistic or sloppy npcs or enemy awareness/movements.
I get the new concerns. You're paying top dollar for a product developed by artists, directors, programmers that add distinction and nuances only a human can add. When you dilute that work, its like going from a hand-crafted piece to a dollar store plastic toy.
I get the new concerns. You're paying top dollar for a product developed by artists, directors, programmers that add distinction and nuances only a human can add. When you dilute that work, its like going from a hand-crafted piece to a dollar store plastic toy.
Ribi
Member
Even AI slop is better than SNL
IlGialloMondadori
Member
IlGialloMondadori
Member
I never thought I'd see something as pathetic as people cheering the Microsoft / Activision merger again, but now, here we are, with morons shilling for AI companies because they want to be fed their slop faster, no matter the cost.
Thankfully, then, as now, it seems like the majority are sane.
Thankfully, then, as now, it seems like the majority are sane.
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LazyParrot
Member
If they remove text boxes I'll stop gaming lol. I read like 10 times faster than characters talk, no way I'm sitting through all that shit.
HRK69
Member
I don't think text boxes will disappear, but I really hope they're paired with actual voice lines to make the experience more immersive
Take recent CRPGs like Rogue Trader. They have voiced content, but the bulk of it is still just text. I'd like to see that evolve into a blend of text and speech, where the majority of the dialogue is voiced, not just a small part
daninthemix
Member
Because it's making us all poorer.
StueyDuck
Member
like most reasons people hate things, because they don't understand it.
Their vision of AI is the absolute worst dog shit asset flip style no effort game you'd see on steam.
The truth is AI can greatly speed up the process of development, doesn't mean the artists and developers have literally 0 input or influence.
but we all want to look at the absolute worst case scenario, some loser in his room typing "Chatgpt, give me sydney sweeney boobie game" and an absolute atrocitiy of a product is produced then dropped on steam for 5 bucks.
Their vision of AI is the absolute worst dog shit asset flip style no effort game you'd see on steam.
The truth is AI can greatly speed up the process of development, doesn't mean the artists and developers have literally 0 input or influence.
but we all want to look at the absolute worst case scenario, some loser in his room typing "Chatgpt, give me sydney sweeney boobie game" and an absolute atrocitiy of a product is produced then dropped on steam for 5 bucks.
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raduque
Member
There's a couple of games out there that use AI LLMs to generate responses in real-time during gameplay.
Here's a hilarious play-through of one:
I'm pretty sure they go online to a server to run the models.
Hypereides
Member
Whatever you tell yourself, Jack Welch Jr. . Keep cutting corners, I'm sure things will work out great for you in the long run.Big money is very creative field, you know
Better stick to your "creative blablabla" as it's clearly you don't understand a shit about how AI operates.
The math basis for AI is that NN can fit unseen function - i.e. any causal relationship, for example "this is unusual", "this is beautiful" etc. can be aproximated by NN.
AI doesn't ~copy~, it ~approximate~ reality. If there is unseen dependancy - AI will try to find it (same as humans do). And as board games shown - AI CAN go further than humans and actually invent something that was not known.
I read quite a bit of books about cognitive psychology, neurobiology, AI and stuff to know that the way human brain operates is not that much different from how AI operates (modern AI is just weaker, somewhat on a cat level, and lack some components like frontal lobes stuff).
Humans also learn by example and compiling others experience, and the most creativity comes from "be the same, but a bit different" - we see it in practically everywhere, games included, where at least 90% of work existed prior and was copypasted in clever way. E33 - copypasted, Balatro - copypasted etc - they all "got inspired" (aka copied) by several previous concepts and what make them good is not they are entirely original, but rather they did an interesting and original blend of what existed before them. And as it's people define learning rules - there is no problem to tune reward/punishment function of AI learning for the same result.
And for truly "original" stuff people find it repulsive and ugly as it doesn't match with their prior experience and knowledge and unknown cause disgust (not even fear, humans tends to fear something that resembles what we know in unusual way)
Also, sorry, mate. But, you have to find yourself another buyer for all your rambling nonsense. You're obviously not a SME with a tech professional background nor creative despite wanting to act like one.
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