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What makes a device a PC to you?

DenchDeckard

DenchDeckard

Moderated wildly
So, here we are. More and more news is ramping up for next gen and the biggest point of contention right now is " Is the next Xbox a PC?"

What makes a PC a PC to you?

For me, its really simple.

If it is PC hardware and I can format the hard drive and install which ever OS I want, its a PC. If it is a closed environment in any way. It is not a PC.

What do you think, Gaf. What makes a PC a PC to you?
 
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Yeah, whether its a closed enviroment or not. If i can format it, install whatever OS i want while still making full use of the hardware, its a pc.
 
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I'm probably a small % here, but my "gaming PC" is connected to my TV. I only game on it with a controller. I don't even have a mouse and keyboard for it. I use a handheld Wiimote style remote control that has a keyboard on the back of it.

So to me, it's a beast of a gaming console. If I could easily set it up where I can power it on from the controller and go straight into a game launcher…I would absolutely do that. Sometimes I prefer playing on PS5 Pro or Switch 2 for the sheer convenience of it.

I use Apple products in the rest of the house. At this point, I wouldn't buy a desktop PC with windows on it, which would be a true PC to me.
 
Well, let's say we are talking about Windows and Linux devices. When you see "mac vs pc" that's what they usually mean.

However....no not really.

To me a PC is kinda like a teraflop. It's a marketing term that helps people feel better about their computers.

A PC is a computer. So is a console. If you ask AI the difference between a PC and a computer you will get AN answer. Not a correct answer. So then it is undefined. In our history the term PC is completely unimportant. However the invention and propagation of the computer is quite an important part of human history. In a thousand years a computer will still be a computer. PC will stand for something else.

So like, let's say you sold your gaming PC to McDonalds so they could do work on it(create a terminal for self checkout on their own software)? Is it still a personal computer? Isn't it now a McDonalds Computer or even a public computer? The hardware didn't change. It's definitely a computer. It's okay we can just say computer. The problem is that PC is a marketing term now wrapped up in identity. People are "PC gamers" as their identity. So many convos around it will perhaps have some questionable logic.
 
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Mouse, keyboard, tower, monitor, can alt tab between work-gaming-pornhub, video card the size of an aircraft carrier.
 
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If it's able to run Steam games, and other PC store fronts, as well as running a gimped version of Windows 11 OS, with no special sauce. It sounds like a PC, albeit with heavy limitations, to me at least.
 
- Can I (reasonably) build it myself or, in the case of pre-built, upgrade/replace parts myself with little to no issue?

- Can I install or uninstall any software I want with little to no issue from the device? Meaning I don't need to "hack" the device to do so.

The second is required but the first is more fluid. Pre-builts (and laptops) muddy the waters when they have custom hardware or designs that aren't so easy to upgrade/replace yourself. The Steam Machine is a PC but will have set specs that can't really be changed (by a regular person) in the same way that pre-built PC from Wal-mart can.

It kinda comes down to "I know it when I see it".
 
I saw a PC in a museum once.
People would buy or build these big off white boxes with wires sticking out the back.
They went extinct when the entire industry put it's head in its own butt and stopped innovating new standards for how they were built.
My Grandpa once said they were a big thing in his time.
 
By definition any console, computer, phone, tablet etc. would fall under the characteristics of a "Personal Computer". At least to me.

For those specifying being able to install an OS of your choosing, would you consider PS3 before Sony removed OtherOS feature as a PC? Further more any device that has been hacked that now allows you to run Linux?
 
You guys are debating technicalities that will only lead to endless arguments.

Heed the advice of Supreme Court Justice Potter Stewart:
I shall not today attempt further to define the kinds of material I understand to be embraced within that shorthand description ["hard-core pornography personal computer"], and perhaps I could never succeed in intelligibly doing so. But I know it when I see it, and the motion picture Nintendo Switch involved in this case is not that.
Click to expand...
 
It's a Personal Computer. And that means I can choose the hardware and software to run it.
It's flexibility, personalization, customization.
 
This thread got me thinking how we used to have a dedicated spot in the house for a PC in the 90's that everyone would use lol

And trying to buy one at a "computer store" was like going to a car dealership.

RaT1wL.gif
 
Theres no "install whatever OS I want".

A PC limits you to PC architecture compatible OSs - suitable drivers, suitable BIOS etc.

So it's more than that.

The PS3 would famously let people install alternative OSs, that wasnt a PC.

PCs are multipurpose devices. Of course these days, gaming consoles can play other media so maybe they're even mutipurpose.

So I'm gonna go back to the classic porn argument - I can't define porn, but I know what it is when I see it. Same for a PC.
 
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ToadMan said:
Theres no "install whatever OS I want".

A PC limits you to PC architecture compatible OSs - suitable drivers, suitable BIOS etc.

So it's more than that.

The PS3 would famously let people install alternative OSs, that wasnt a PC.
Click to expand...

PS3 wasn't a PC because Sony allowed you to install alternative OSs. And later they took that option away. If it was a PC then it would never be up to Sony in the first place.
 
Honestly I saw someone put Doom on a Samsung fridge, so ttttt technically its a pc. As long as you can interface with it beyond the touch screen.
 
I agree, the main part for PC is "Personal" - Personal computer.

If you can use the hardware to do what you want, run various programs from design, to music production, CAD etc. Its a personal computer.
 
DarkShadowXI said:
I'm probably a small % here, but my "gaming PC" is connected to my TV. I only game on it with a controller. I don't even have a mouse and keyboard for it.
Click to expand...

Ditto, other than I also I have the Logitech G915 lightspeed keyboard and the Logitech G502X lightspeed mouse. But I sit in my recliner loveseat (electronic, of course) with my mouse beside me on a nightstand and my keyboard in my lap or to my left on the middle console. But for games, I use my Razer Wolverine V3 Pro 8K controller. I play on my 77" Samsung S90C, with the Samsung Q990D surround sound setup. It's buh-dass!

EDIT: I re-read this and it feels like I'm just peddling products. I'm not doing that or shilling for any companies. I just love my setup.
 
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winjer said:
It's a Personal Computer. And that means I can choose the hardware and software to run it.
It's flexibility, personalization, customization.
Click to expand...

Yep. To me, if I have to circumvent a corporation's encryption then it just isn't a PC. That is the essential difference between a Steam Deck/Steam Machine and a PS5 or Xbox Series console
 
Topher said:
PS3 wasn't a PC because Sony allowed you to install alternative OSs. And later they took that option away. If it was a PC then it would never be up to Sony in the first place.
Click to expand...

Yeah there's a legality argument to it, but that's not quite the whole picture to my mind given the long history of what these days people refer to as a "PC".

But I think I'm too tired to go into it all right now.

I'll stick with my porn analogy :D
 
I don't think access to the boot partition or full ability to format the drive is necessary to call something a PC.

Certainly wouldn't suddenly become a console if a machine has full blown windows but locked out formatting.
 
Topher said:
Yep. To me, if I have to circumvent a corporation's encryption then it just isn't a PC. That is the essential difference between a Steam Deck/Steam Machine and a PS5 or Xbox Series console
Click to expand...

I have a rooted android phone, with Lineage OS installed. Just like you, I don't consider it a PC.
 
If I can do Excel spreadsheets or a Word document, it's a PC.
And, no. The mobile versions don't count. They suck new and exciting kind of dick.
 
I think it's just any computer you do "work" on. It used to be a synonym for a windows computer. But obviously that can also be a Mac or Linux. And nowadays most people's "PC" is their smartphone.

So it really just comes down to the operating system and applications available for it, and not the underlying hardware.
 
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ideally: total control over my hardware/software so i can freely upgrade the hardware and pick what OS/software to run on it. must be useful for all sorts of tasks and not just gaming.

so to me that's a traditional desktop PC with modular parts and x86 architecture like the custom PC i have right now.

but could also be a MacBook/iMac but of course they lack hardware upgrades (like RAM/SSD) and to run a difference OS it needs to be run in a VM.

Closest console to that definition would be the Steam Deck as it allows you to run desktop UI of Linux and easily use a monitor/keyboard/mouse but lacks the software/hardware freedom of choice.
 
Installing windows or linux. Playstation was always a huge value add for me. CD player, DVD player, Blu-Ray player, and then it just stopped. Now they're selling you a multipurpose APU that they put great effort into restricting your ability to use. Now I kinda build my own consoles with PC parts to get the same digital swiss army knife usage out of that I always have. My latest has a standalone FiiO R2R DAC+CD drive that I output my digital music to from my PC to a nice headphone amp or 2.1 nearfield desk setup, and I even took a flier on a Wifi card and holy shit did that end up paying off (check your speeds onboard wifi gang). I've been doing horizontal builds for probably a decade plus now and until recently used mainly in my living room on the couch.
 
Anything that's not a closed environment running a specifically designed system (even if it's based on Windows or Linux). It is a PC if it's running the same Windows just with an overlay and with all the driver and compatibility headaches that come with being a Windows user.
 
xrnzaaas said:
Anything that's not a closed environment running a specifically designed system (even if it's based on Windows or Linux). It is a PC if it's running the same Windows just with an overlay and with all the driver and compatibility headaches that come with being a Windows user.
Click to expand...
I think what Helix is doing is giving people a PC with Xbox branded accessories that follow the console tradition of giving people a way to buy themselves out of having to figure out how to install drivers. For stuff like storage expansion you could buy the Xbox branded drive for 2.5x the going rate of SSDs and you won't have to potentially google a guide to format and initialize it.
 
Thinking about it it's surprisingly hard to make an exact definition.
But I guess key feature is that it's an "open" computing platform.
"Open" for consumers in the sense that it offers a high degree of customization and allows them to buy/obtain software and peripherals from multiple sources.
"Open" for developers in the sense that anyone can develop and release/sell software and peripherals for it without having to go through the Hardware and OS maker.
 
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