Boone Hall Plantation..... I need to vent

Status
Not open for further replies.
S

sooperkool

Member
I'm going to share my thoughts here for those of you not on my G+ stream.


Here I am in home after returning from a trip to Boone Hall Plantation. This is the nations oldest continually running plantation having been started in the early 1700s. A beautiful and idyllic place full of lush open fields and a total absence of modern sounds save those we brought with us; the plantation can be quite the culture shock upon leaving a typical urban environment. There were the laughing adults and the playing children of any public park or historic area but therein begins the sort of quiet unease and disconnect that began to sit within me.

Boone Hall is and was a plantation, not a replica or a re-enactment such as Williamsburg; people lived , loved and died here right on these grounds where I stood. As an African-American this is equivalent to a trip to a concentration camp. Do people laugh when visiting Auschwitz or Treblinka? I of course know that the plantation does host things like weddings and festivals, as I have said; the site is still a working plantation. I did not know how unnerving it would be to see a young woman having wedding photos taken against the back wall of the slave houses. Who does that? There is not a single plant or brick on that plantation that is not a product of slave labor.Should I plan a wedding reception or a family reunion at Sobibor or Nanking? Even the sight of a Pepsi machine on the grounds outside upset me, I felt like Pepsi is making money off of the suffering of my ancestors to this day.


There are places such as the slave houses where thew aforementioned wedding photos were taking that were far too emotional for me to even enter. Not to speak ill or generalize all people not of color but I became quite angry at the gentleman whom I overheard saying that things for the slaves, “wasn’t so bad” when speaking of the living conditions. I did not know there were still people that ignorant of the struggles of African-Americans. I feel that in spite of my strong desire to burn the plantation to the ground and salt the earth where it stands that it NEEDS to remain open. I do think that it should not be privately held. I think the government needs to seize it and run it as a non-profit like a federal park. When next in Charleston I suggest that all of you, be you of color or not; take time to visit. Reflect, respect and learn more of the culture and history of your fellow Americans.
Click to expand...
 
I can't believe they have music there as well:

RXtm7.png


EDIT: Well scratch that, on not believing they had music, seems like they turned this place into a huge country fair grounds with shit like haunted fright nights, pumpkin patches, festivals, etc.


It is a beautiful site though (strictly speaking of the grounds, not the history) if the video on the website is any indication.
 
I won't go too far on the point but I don't think that plantations and concentration camps are comparable. That's just my personal opinion.

The points you raise are valid I guess though. Although you have to remember that different people have different reactions to different things.

edit: a more valid comparison could have been Nazi Labour Camps.
 
Meadows said:
I won't go too far on the point but I don't think that plantations and concentration camps are comparable. That's just my personal opinion.

The points you raise are valid I guess though. Although you have to remember that different people have different reactions to different things.

edit: a more valid comparison could have been Nazi Labour Camps.
Click to expand...

Yeah, I can understand that. Its more of an ideological point rather than a literal one. I was feeling pretty raw when I wrote that and just had to put it out there.
 
Yeah, concentration camps are extreme but I can still see where you're coming from. I sort of go both ways though about weddings and other events that happen. It's an interesting place filled with history. I can see why they did it but the comment about living conditions is ridiculous. That's just being ignorant.

And I can't blame kids for laughing but I'm sure that wasn't your point anyways.
 
I am literally 5 miles from there as I type this. I've toured it. The thing is that it is a museum now. People are desensitized to the events of the past, so they laugh and live their lives oblivious to what really happened. Walking down many Charleston streets and taking in the history, especially those events that led up to the Civil War, can be a humbling experience. But people don't relate. I see people standing outside of the old slave market laughing it up all the time. People of all races.
 
We Charlestonians look at it as a place to learn about history. Anyone who goes there understands the context in which the land was used and chooses on their own whether to respect it or not. There are many African American women who line the roadside going to the plantation with basket weaving stalls, but I don't think they are trying to cash in on the "attraction" - they are passing this amazing art on to visitors and future generations.

**The slave market itself has not been preserved as a historical site, even though you can feel the history with every step. It is purely commercial now and is no different than Bourbon Street in N'awlins in terms of what the goals for it are.
 
I think your comparison of Auschwitz to Boone Hall Plantation is rather silly but to each their own I guess. Its a beautiful setting full of American history, some of which is dark. Looks like the place has taken the high moral ground and created an exhibit on African American History from slavery all the way to current times.

I can't fault people for wanting to get married there. It's a beautiful place and has all the stereotypical charm of a southern mansion. Not everyone has to feel guilty for being white. Some people just want to have a happy moment in a beautiful setting. I don't know. I'm not black so I don't have the same connection so sorry if I'm being cold.
 
Tapiozona said:
I think your comparison of Auschwitz to Boone Hall Plantation is rather silly but to each their own I guess. Its a beautiful setting full of American history, some of which is dark. Looks like the place has taken the high moral ground and created an exhibit on African American History from slavery all the way to current times.

I can't fault people for wanting to get married there. It's a beautiful place and has all the stereotypical charm of a southern mansion. Not everyone has to feel guilty for being white. Some people just want to have a happy moment in a beautiful setting. I don't know. I'm not black so I don't have the same connection so sorry if I'm being cold.
Click to expand...


Nah you're good. I'm venting and also hoping to hear the other perspectives as well. I'm not a white person so I have no idea how this place or my feelings on it affect you. I'm not looking for others to be as outraged as I was at the time, I just wanted some of you to understand what happened to me and to comment on how you felt if you had visited it yourself or not. None of us can get past the history if we don't talk about how we really feel and share those experiences and take time to accept the views ad perspectives of others.
 
it seems shortsighted to define this place by a relatively short part of its 300 year history, if you want to get an association stuck in your mind between southern american plantations and all that is wrong about the American slave trade, fine thats your business but its crazy as fuck to then take that opinion and start speaking out against how other people perceive this place.

personally i think its more than alittle suspect to single out plantations as an 'Auschwitz' as that seems like something done more out of convenience than for reverence to those who suffered during american slavery.
 
HephalumpsAndWoozles said:
OP, have you been to the Holocaust museum by any chance?
Click to expand...


Yes, I have always felt that the Holocaust is something that also should not be forgotten. That was also hard to visit but did not affect me quite as profoundly and it probably shouldn't.
 
As a black man, I don't know how I'd feel if I was there. You know slavery happened, but to actually be in a plantation where that was going on would have been something else. It's a great means of showing how the world was not too long ago.

"Not to speak ill or generalize all people not of color but I became quite angry at the gentleman whom I overheard saying that things for the slaves, “wasn’t so bad” when speaking of the living conditions."

Not sure how to comment on that. =(
 
Pandaman said:
it seems shortsighted to define this place by a relatively short part of its 300 year history, if you want to get an association stuck in your mind between southern american plantations and all that is wrong about the American slave trade, fine thats your business but its crazy as fuck to then take that opinion and start speaking out against how other people perceive this place.

personally i think its more than alittle suspect to single out plantations as an 'Auschwitz' as that seems like something done more out of convenience than for reverence to those who suffered during american slavery.
Click to expand...

Like I said, I was venting and the feelings were very raw at the time. I have no right to try to tell others how they should feel about the place and I won't I will however tell you how I felt at the time. Otherwise how else would you know? If this post makes makes you visit. Great. If it makes you a touch more reflective when you do... even better.
 
HephalumpsAndWoozles said:
Why shouldnt it?
Click to expand...

Just because I know that after what I felt at Boone Hall, I don't believe I can feel quite as strongly as a Jewish person when discussing or experiencing the Holocaust.
 
sooperkool said:
Just because I know that after what I felt at Boone Hall, I don't believe I can feel quite as strongly as a Jewish person when discussing or experiencing the Holocaust.
Click to expand...

Wow. I dont even know what to say. So if it had been blacks instead of jews murdered in the millions youd have stronger feelings. Thats a shame, and pathetic.
 
sooperkool said:
Just because I know that after what I felt at Boone Hall, I don't believe I can feel quite as strongly as a Jewish person when discussing or experiencing the Holocaust.
Click to expand...

Well, that's sad.
 
A concentration camp in Nazi germany's sole purpose was imprisonment and eventually murder of its occupants.

A plantation wasn't designed specifically for murdering its slave population.

Someone correct me if I'm wrong.
 
sooperkool said:
Even the sight of a Pepsi machine on the grounds outside upset me, I felt like Pepsi is making money off of the suffering of my ancestors to this day.
Click to expand...
The groan I let out when I read that line shattered 3 windows.
 
Personally I think there are enough differences between a plantation and a concentration camp that having something like a wedding there is not entirely offensive. The plantation manor was laid out to maximize its natural and architectural beauty, something fairly pleasing for a wedding. Meanwhile concentration camps were designed to make mass murder as efficient as possible, not to be nice to look at. Also while slavery made up a large part of a plantation it was not the sole focus, not to mention that the goal of slavery was not to wipe out an entire ethnic group (although it did use them for forced labor which is horrible in its own right).

Finally a lot of horrible things have happened at beautiful places in the past. We are probably far enough removed now in time due to there being no living former slaves or people who ever even born in the same century. On the other hand there are still living Holocaust survivors. Give it time and the same thing might happen at concentration camps (although you might be waiting a long time).

Just because someone is embracing the beauty of a location does not mean that they wish to dishonor its past. I have a friend who is a wedding photographer and she has done a lot of shoots in places that some might second guess. Cemeteries, abandoned prisons, etc.
 
I get your point, but people arent taking wedding photos there because they want to rub shit in the face of anyone who suffered there. Same thing goes for laughing and having fun.

Its a very beautiful place.

And while our history shouldnt be forgotten, we do need to move on and not hold the actions of our fathers against anyone in current times(ignorants/racists aside).
 
sooperkool said:
Like I said, I was venting and the feelings were very raw at the time. I have no right to try to tell others how they should feel about the place and I won't I will however tell you how I felt at the time. Otherwise how else would you know? If this post makes makes you visit. Great. If it makes you a touch more reflective when you do... even better.
Click to expand...
thats great and all but then there's this part "I do think that it should not be privately held. I think the government needs to seize it" where difference of opinion isn't really an end anymore.

its private property, run legally and for the majority of its history without any slave labour. from what i can tell via wiki almost nothing left on the property even has much of a connection to its slave history. the original house was destroyed [the one now is a replica], the slave houses were converted to lodges for sharecropers, etc, etc.

its just a beautiful piece of land that encompasses southern tradition, thats why people are getting married there. its not some horrible testament to evil that needs to be forcibly taken by the government and i find the very suggestion of that to be worrisome. :/
 
Let me clarify. I didn't really go into as much detail about the wedding photos because I didn't want to belabor the point. The plantation is beautiful... an amazingly beautiful place. The taking of the photos didn't really bother me until they started being taking against the slave house. That's what troubled me so. I mean, hell the bride was maybe 2-25 years old. She was just taking wedding photos in a beautiful place. It just bugged me since some of the emotion there was powerful enough to bring me to tears. At the time I couldn't even enter the slave houses.
 
Pandaman said:
thats great and all but then there's this part "I do think that it should not be privately held. I think the government needs to seize it" where difference of opinion isn't really an end anymore.

its private property, run legally and for the majority of its history without any slave labour. from what i can tell via wiki almost nothing left on the property even has much of a connection to its slave history. the original house was destroyed [the one now is a replica], the slave houses were converted to lodges for sharecropers, etc, etc.

its just a beautiful piece of land that encompasses southern tradition, thats why people are getting married there. its not some horrible testament to evil that needs to be forcibly taken by the government and i find the very suggestion of that to be worrisome. :/
Click to expand...


They are and were original construction, they are the only ones that survived. The main house is not a replica but was rebuilt after a fire but the current owner at the time. I don't know where you are or where you will be in the future but if you are here in the USA I highly recommend that you visit. Wiki doesn't have all the answers and the experience for some of us can be quite powerful.
 
sooperkool said:
Let me clarify. I didn't really go into as much detail about the wedding photos because I didn't want to belabor the point. The plantation is beautiful... an amazingly beautiful place. The taking of the photos didn't really bother me until they started being taking against the slave house. That's what troubled me so. I mean, hell the bride was maybe 2-25 years old. She was just taking wedding photos in a beautiful place. It just bugged me since some of the emotion there was powerful enough to bring me to tears. At the time I couldn't even enter the slave houses.
Click to expand...

The South: still the south.

Emphasis mine.
 
sooperkool said:
Yes, I have always felt that the Holocaust is something that also should not be forgotten. That was also hard to visit but did not affect me quite as profoundly and it probably shouldn't.
Click to expand...
Well now you are just sounding hypocritical.
 
StMeph said:
So gauche. Who takes pictures of slave labor?

ZOILe.jpg


Totally devoid of cultural significance.
Click to expand...

The Pyramids were not constructed using slave labor. What is the point of this post?
 
Trojita said:
Well now you are just sounding hypocritical.
Click to expand...

FWIW i dont see why its a big deal that the Holocaust doesn't affect him as deeply as slavery. terrible incident indeed, but it has no historical relation to HIM.

I still remember my own visit to the Holocaust museum. It had very little effect on me personally, but I remember a few of my classmates were basically incapacitated by the heaviness of the occasion. Tragedies just dont hit everyone the same.
 
Sax Russel said:
I totally get that, man. I mean, come on, where's the fucking Coca Cola machine?!
Click to expand...


Later that evening I thought it was absurd that I also wondered where a Coke machine was. Its like when you see McDonalds and wonder why there's no Burger King nearby.
 
sooperkool said:
Later that evening I thought it was absurd that I also wondered where a Coke machine was. Its like when you see McDonalds and wonder why there's no Burger King nearby.
Click to expand...

Because like Coke, McDonalds is a superior product and you should only wonder where it is when you see a Burger King, not where the Burger King is when you see the McDonalds.
 
sooperkool said:
Later that evening I thought it was absurd that I also wondered where a Coke machine was. Its like when you see McDonalds and wonder why there's no Burger King nearby.
Click to expand...

Lots of fast food wait for McDonalds to do site research to figure out the best place to put their franchise. Then they just build nearby and save millions of dollars.

See: Wallgreens and CVS
 
Vague said:
The Pyramids were not constructed using slave labor. What is the point of this post?
Click to expand...

Thousands of people werent shuttled into Boone Hall for the sole purpose of exterminating them either, but that didnt stop the OP from making the comparisons...
 
HephalumpsAndWoozles said:
Thousands of people werent shuttled into Boone Hall for the sole purpose of exterminating them either, but that didnt stop the OP from making the comparisons...
Click to expand...

If we're being pointlessly pedantic, not all concentration camps were extermination camps, so your objection misses the mark.
 
I hate to sound insensitive, but we really do need to move past all these grievances over slavery. No American alive today has been a slave or a slave owner. We all live by the same rules and regulations. There has to be a level of forgiveness for the past in order for us to move forward together.
 
Dude Abides said:
If we're being pointlessly pedantic, not all concentration camps were extermination camps, so your objection misses the mark.
Click to expand...

What of those mentioned in the OP?

Also I didnt know all plantations treated their slaves like they were in concentration camps...

Kind of like when the OP got bent out of shape over someone (not of color) saying the living conditions "werent so bad"...

Well they werent so bad in comparison to what? I wonder if the OP assumed he was referring to the slave masters quarters and perhaps not other plantations?

Or how about this hyperbole
There is not a single plant or brick on that plantation that is not a product of slave labor
Click to expand...

Its funny, because when I was there people were working in the flower gardens, and they didnt appear to be slaves.
 
HephalumpsAndWoozles said:
Wow. I dont even know what to say. So if it had been blacks instead of jews murdered in the millions youd have stronger feelings. Thats a shame, and pathetic.
Click to expand...

Why would a black person give the same amount of fuck about the Holocaust as he would slavery?

Calm that BS down.
 
speedline said:
I hate to sound insensitive, but we really do need to move past all these grievances over slavery. No American alive today has been a slave or a slave owner. We all live by the same rules and regulations. There has to be a level of forgiveness for the past in order for us to move forward together.
Click to expand...


you can imagine that 30 years from now people will say the same things about the Holocaust and how dumb that sentiment would be. you cant really "forgive" (or forget) these black marks on our history.
 
DominoKid said:
you can imagine that 30 years from now people will say the same things about the Holocaust and how dumb that sentiment would be. you cant really "forgive" (or forget) these black marks on our history.
Click to expand...

Dont hold it against people who had absolutely nothing to do with it other than skin color.

But then again thats probably the main reason why you refuse to forgive, so I wouldnt expect any less.


supabrett said:
Why would a black person give the same amount of fuck about the Holocaust as he would slavery?

Calm that BS down.
Click to expand...

By this logic, the OP should calm his BS down, because why would any white person give the same amount of fuck about slavery as the holocaust?

Oh wait, its because some are capable of looking past the color of ones skin and into their actual plight.
 
DominoKid said:
you can imagine that 30 years from now people will say the same things about the Holocaust and how dumb that sentiment would be. you cant really "forgive" (or forget) these black marks on our history.
Click to expand...

Moving past things that happened to your culture or ethnic group before you were even born is stupid? Sounds healthy to me.
 
Pandaman said:
thats great and all but then there's this part "I do think that it should not be privately held. I think the government needs to seize it" where difference of opinion isn't really an end anymore.

its private property, run legally and for the majority of its history without any slave labour. from what i can tell via wiki almost nothing left on the property even has much of a connection to its slave history. the original house was destroyed [the one now is a replica], the slave houses were converted to lodges for sharecropers, etc, etc.

its just a beautiful piece of land that encompasses southern tradition, thats why people are getting married there. its not some horrible testament to evil that needs to be forcibly taken by the government and i find the very suggestion of that to be worrisome. :/
Click to expand...
yea, I was pretty insulted by that part. The fact that he thinks the government even has the right to do such a thing let alone that they should actually do it is just insulting.

Moving past things that happened to your culture or ethnic group before you were even born is stupid? Sounds healthy to me.
Click to expand...
this.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Similar threads

Anyone live in Seattle? I need to kill 9 hours after my flight
26
943
Ristifer replied
I need a new laptop. Care to help?
21
2K
GoldenEye Samurai replied
Things have gotten out of hand we need to forgive each other and find common ground.
2
89
148
Ironbunny replied
Problem connecting LG 95TR soundbar to Wi-Fi (I need help!)
9
2K
Lagspike_exe replied
I need cultural research help
35
2K
finalflame replied
Top Bottom