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Changed it just for you.

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And my love for Yuri

 

[Raxus]

I'm a noobie and it's actually pretty good in my experience. Much better than Starcraft 2 anyway, in that game I'd get bitched at if I lost for sucking and get bitched at if I won for being cheap.

I am happy to hear your at least having a good time. I think I just had a string of bad games. You can't play this game for too long or one bad game can sour the whole experience.

 

[Haly]

Dagger out into trees, or Haunt to a hero that may not be able to kill you, however, at a pro level they will probably just chain CC you, as they did to weaver.

Right. From my point of view, dagger is worse than blink as an escape in nearly all situations.

 

[shintoki]

Sad thing about this community is no one is willing to take constructive criticism in public games, lots of times I give people suggestions and they just end up getting mad even if I'm being 100% sincere.

It is hard to take criticism while playing. You have your own vibe going, and someone is bashing it(Even if it is being sincere and trying to help you play better). And I agree that it sucks.

But its also simply moving on to the next game. Airing your grievances out in the middle of the game does nothing but hurt your play and everyone elses on the team. If they can't take the hint, best not to continue it and try to make for their weakness. Still probably lose, but there are times were that 4v5 will work.

Also the big one. Never play another game right after you had one of those.
1. Those same players may have went right back into match making.
2. You are still riled up over the last game. It does effect play.

 

[jim-jam bongs]

I am happy to hear your at least having a good time. I think I just had a string of bad games. You can't play this game for too long or one bad game can sour the whole experience.

Maybe I'm just used to shitty communities, especially in games like this and WoW where it's a hybrid of PvP/PvE/co-op. In WoW the worst flaming comes from PUG dungeons and raids since there isn't even any cross-faction communication. I haven't copped much abuse personally, but I did see a guy repeatedly ganking another guy (who was admittedly pretty bad) and then goading him with his K/D/A in a match I was watching last night.

 

[Taborcarn]

Can you give an example?

If you're playing support, the reason there's a lot of "out of place items" is because supports aren't expected to get any kind of farm at all. So their "core items" really consists of whatever they can scrounge up in between warding, dusting, counterwarding and smoking. This usually means boots, stick and bracers since bracers are the cheapest way to get some much needed hp.

Well the playdota guides were tough enough to use since they had WC3 icons for the items without even tooltips for the names.

But i was able to google for other guides for CM that were a bit more descriptive. But they basically said branches and tangoes to start, bottle and dagger in the middle, and bkb and scepter for endgame. I know I should get wards and courier as a support as well, but is that all there is to it? Should I be looking for + stat items in between, or more items with active effects, or just stick with the guidelines? And the game's recommended starting items were bracers, which are + strength I think? Would I want to start with that on an int hero?

Also in response to another poster, as a new player I'm not sure why I wanted to get into this, but for some reason I really did. Something about the presentation + the mechanics really intrigues me. I played LoL in beta but not much since, I only got back into it recently to prepare for Dota 2. I don't care too much about being berated by other players, it's kind of funny. But I do want constructive criticism, this game is so deep and I want to learn the mechanics inside and out.

 

[jim-jam bongs]

I think the noob friendliness of the game will become more obvious when the matchmaking has a bigger pool to draw from. My matchmaking "range" (which is an amazingly clever way of depicting how broad the search is) is nearly always at full width by the time we have 10 players in the game, though admittedly I've only had a chance to play 4 or 5 games at this point.

Also as a complete noob, being able to watch hours of live matches from the player's perspective made finding a hero and learning what I should do with them early and mid-game substantially more straightforward than watching a 2 hour Lrn2DOTA video or something.

 

[x3r0123]

Could it just be you? All the comments are repeats, though slight variations from League ones occur. I don't encounter much of a problem with the player base, simply because I don't respond to it. I understand their will be games that I get outplayed it straight up. And wrecks on both sides. There will also be players who curse at the slightest provocation and you let it get to yourself.

Ignore them and continue playing. It only hurts your team responding and starting some shit fight. You can still win or recover.

2nd, you are going to have shitty teammates and shitty games yourself. Don't let it get you down. I'm not perfect either. I do respond and send a nasty comments occasionally(Though mine are pretty end at calling someone useless or a wanker one time, before I realize it was stupid to say anything at all).

fyi, i'm not new to dota. Though, i seen many cases where new people do horrible and start blaming the other players.

This is just from personal experience.

see above. Your experience with mine would probably vary by a long mile but naix isnt hard to play once you get used to him.

Mostly because the decision making for a support is very cut and dry in a team fight situation, compare playing CM in a team fight to playing Storm Spirit for example. A lot of their stuff happens in the background, so it's not really noticed unless their doing it wrong.

well they are underleveled in many cases and can only do certain amount of damage before they die. Hence, why i said support doesnt shine as much as carry in spectator's view

Sad thing about this community is no one is willing to take constructive criticism in public games, lots of times I give people suggestions and they just end up getting mad even if I'm being 100% sincere.

see the second sentence of the first response . It's either the community or they love to troll

 

[Artanisix]

1.You don't pick Drow, a end game carry for the silence to stop solely for Ravage.
2.How does picking Drow stop them from pushing, its the same outcome as picking Spectre, in fact it would be feeding Spectre creeps closer to his base. Like Drow the hard carry kept getting ganked because she has no escape while Spectre has one of the best escapes in the game.

1. Drow is a midgame carry, not an endgame carry. Along with Slardar's amplify damage, she does tremendous damage. Silence stops PLENTY of their heroes in the AOE, but specifically it works well against Tidehunter, because Kraken Shell is triggered by damage, which can be triggered by chain stuns.

2. Drow lets them have power in the midgame. Spectre has nothing in the midgame and she would lose to pushes even harder. Dagger isn't that great for escaping and Haunt has a huge CD.

 

[Haly]

Your experience with mine would probably vary by a long mile but naix isnt hard to play once you get used to him.

Then it's clear most DOTA2 players haven't gotten used to him.

But i was able to google for other guides for CM that were a bit more descriptive. But they basically said branches and tangoes to start, bottle and dagger in the middle, and bkb and scepter for endgame.

I can't say Blink CM isn't effective, because it really is, but Blink is hard to farm on her and still leaves her squishy as hell. I can see the logic behind Blink + BKB but it's not a common way to play her (mostly because she really can't afford both Blink and BKB along with wards and such).

I know I should get wards and courier as a support as well, but is that all there is to it? Should I be looking for + stat items in between, or more items with active effects, or just stick with the guidelines? And the game's recommended starting items were bracers, which are + strength I think? Would I want to start with that on an int hero?

You get 19 points of hp for each point of STR, that's the main reason to get Bracers.
But no, you should never ever ever ever ever ever start out with one of the +6/+3/+3 stat items. Get the 150g +3 items, or the 185g +2/+2/+2, but never complete it until you really need the room and you have nothing else to buy. Since you will want at least 200g worth of HP regen, and courier/wards is another 200g, you'll be left with 200g for branches (+1 to all)
/gauntlets of ogre strength (+3 STR) /clarities (100 mana over 50 seconds).

Other items to consider as an INT hero:
Urn of Shadows.
Eul's Scepter of Divnity
Force Staff
Mekansm

Item choice, for supports, really comes down to what your team needs and what you can feasibly farm up without hurting your ward game.

 

[SamVimes]

I think i raged only once in this game. I got three people in Enigma's ult and Riki decided that he didn't want anything to do with that and just stayed behind me invisible TWO TIMES. At least i got a couple of laughs because the second times they had a gem of true sight and after Huskar (now with 1% hp because Riki doesn't feel like attacking) and CM killed me and Lich they just focused him down and destroyed him.

Even then i just told him in caps to do something.

 

[x3r0123]

Then it's clear most DOTA2 players haven't gotten used to him.

not sure about that. I have seen many naix players in dota2 with high skill variance.

 

[Haly]

Questions to ask yourself when buying items on support:

Is your team using a lot of mana:
Ring of Basilus, Arcane Boots

Is your team getting into lots of group fights or pushing as a team:
Mekansm, Khadgar's Pipe

Are you running around ganking constantly:
Urn of Shadows, Blink Dagger

Do you desperately need a larger HP/Mana pool:
Bracers, Null Talisman, Point Booster

Do you need to keep people off you or off your teammates:
Eul's, Force Staff, Guinsoo

Do you have a heal or an ally who can spam heals:
Soul Ring

Are you getting focused down before you can do anything:
Ghost Scepter, BKB

Of course, through all of this, you should be buying wards, sentries, dusts, tp scrolls, and smoke as needed.

 

[Taborcarn]

Thanks, this helps

 

[Sanjay]

against a push team what is a Spectre going to do to assist defending?

Nothing, which was my point that both Drow and Spectre can't do anything. It was Artanisix who said "2. Picking Spectre against a push lineup is suicide." which insinuates to me he thinks that Drow is good against a push lineup? both would be useless in defending a push line-up so I doubt that was a reasoning for not picking Spectre. With Spectre you can at least farm another lane and let your team defend as hard as possible then Hit R to come.

Dagger out into trees, or Haunt to a hero that may not be able to kill you, however, at a pro level they will probably just chain CC you, as they did to weaver.

Weaver was not in this game, it was Nature's prophet (picked first) who kept ganking Drow (picked fourth).

Right. From my point of view, dagger is worse than blink as an escape in nearly all situations.

It's ONE of the best escapes in the game, not the best. A blink would always be the best escape but only one agility hero has one in the game, Anti-mage.

1. Drow is a midgame carry, not an endgame carry.

Drow comes off as a hard carry to me.

Along with Slardar's amplify damage, she does tremendous damage.

Moot point. Anything does extra damage with Slardar minus armour ulti.

Silence stops PLENTY of their heroes in the AOE, but specifically it works well against Tidehunter, because Kraken Shell is triggered by damage, which can be triggered by chain stuns.

Your never going to get your silence off and even if you do, your still dead from the other teams CC's and nukes. They picked Drow like 4th so it was really a bad pick.

2. Drow lets them have power in the midgame.

What power? silence, slow then die? what items would she have at mid game that would make her not die in a team fight.

Spectre has nothing in the midgame and she would lose to pushes even harder. Dagger isn't that great for escaping and Haunt has a huge CD.

Spectre is ideal for a push team this way he gets free farm while its 4v5 and you can jump in when ever, then run away with Dagger. How is Dagger not good for escaping? you try ganking a Spectre with a Vanguard and see what two fucks he gives.

 

[Haly]

It's ONE of the best escapes in the game, not the best. A blink would always be the best escape but only one agility hero has one in the game, Anti-mage.

Void, POTM, Morphling.

And I consider stealth and blink strikes to be better escapes than spectral dagger. Stealth because it requires an investment on the other team to counter (and stealth abilities often have an additional movespeed increase), blink strikes because they're instant.

As an escape, Spectral Dagger is only above average.

 

[Artanisix]

Drow comes off as a hard carry to me.

She's a midgame carry. She doesn't really have any scaling skills. Her ultimate gives her huge damage come midgame -- when late game rolls around, hard carries will beat her if they've gotten appropriate farm to match Drow.

Moot point. Anything does extra damage with Slardar minus armour ulti.

Not a moot point. A CM or WR or Spectre attacking a target with Amplify Damage comes nowhere CLOSE to the damage output Drow can do with Slardar's ulti.

Your never going to get your silence off and even if you do, your still dead from the other teams CC's and nukes. They picked Drow like 4th so it was really a bad pick.

Strange, Drow actually got her silence off in a lot of Na'Vi's fights and delayed Tide's Ravage quite a few times. The problem wasn't Drow, it was The Retry's flawless play and big Furion gangs. Spectre would do no better in that scenario. And with Slardar chosen, what lane are you going to put Spectre in? Drow was the mid solo.

What power? silence, slow then die? what items would she have at mid game that would make her not die in a team fight.

The free +30 agility amplified by the 28% trueshot aura. Free damage, free attackspeed. She does beastly damage at a gigantic range. Treads, HotD, BKB [possibly Manta] midgame are all she needs. Unfortunately she couldn't get her BKB soon enough because of the ganks.

Spectre is ideal for a push team this way he gets free farm while its 4v5 and you can jump in when ever, then run away with Dagger. How is Dagger not good for escaping? you try ganking a Spectre with a Vanguard and see what two fucks he gives.

Spectre is not ideal to play against a push team. She's ideal against 1. a farm team with a weaker carry, or 2. a gank team that can't break her team's turtle effectively. Pick Spectre against pushers like Syllabear or Lycan and you can expect to never get your Radiance in time for it to matter.

 

[Archie]

New hero responses (no voice files):

Spirit Breaker

Invoker

Fuzzy Wuzzy

One thing I noticed is that Ursa actually has allied hero responses. I can't recall any other heroes that have those.

 

[Haly]

None can rival Invoker it seems.

(FUZZY WUZZY YESSSSSSSSSS)

 

[Sanic]

Just got into the beta.

I've been playing Super MNC and LoL recently so i'll hopefully not be totally useless when I jump online.

 

[Sanjay]

Void, POTM, Morphling.

And I consider stealth and blink strikes to be better escapes than spectral dagger. Stealth because it requires an investment on the other team to counter (and stealth abilities often have an additional movespeed increase), blink strikes because they're instant.

As an escape, Spectral Dagger is only above average.

Spectral Dagger into trees where they can't follow you, easy. But the heroes you mentioned have good escapes to but all have long cool downs and can only be cast once and if you use your escape into trees, your stuck and forced to TP out costing gold. Now if you take the risky approach and use your escape backwards, if facing a good team or with Nature's Prophet your still getting caught when they split gank.

She's a midgame carry. She doesn't really have any scaling skills. Her ultimate gives her huge damage come midgame -- when late game rolls around, hard carries will beat her if they've gotten appropriate farm to match Drow.

I disagree. 28% Damage Bonus is a scaling skill & Free 45 agility. Get the right items and you dps will be crazy come end game.

Strange, Drow actually got her silence off in a lot of Na'Vi's fights and delayed Tide's Ravage quite a few times. The problem wasn't Drow, it was The Retry's flawless play and big Furion gangs. Spectre would do no better in that scenario. And with Slardar chosen, what lane are you going to put Spectre in? Drow was the mid solo.

You can Spectre mid against Zeus and if that's to hard you can babysit with CM and stop Zeus's strong early game. They had two other good solo's Venomancer & Windrunner so sending CM with Spectre would have been viable.

Spectre is not ideal to play against a push team. She's ideal against 1. a farm team with a weaker carry, or 2. a gank team that can't break her team's turtle effectively. Pick Spectre against pushers like Syllabear or Lycan and you can expect to never get your Radiance in time for it to matter.

And Drow is effective against a push team?

And I don't even think they had a push team, all they had was Nature's Prophet and some help with VS minus armour but that was about it. The other team did have Venomancer & Windrunner who are also good pushers/anti-pushers.

But I guess you could include Razor in that list for the other team, first time I've seen that hero go Aghanim's Scepter so his ulti hits buildings, seemed op as hell.

 

[Card Boy]

Taken from Daves steam, legendary match from Artanisix (Aka The Milkman)

28-1-5, there are no words.

 

[jim-jam bongs]

Damn. I want to try Pudge, but I'm betting I'll piss any teams I'm in off for quite a while until I get the hang of the hook.

 

[The_Player]

Damn. I want to try Pudge, but I'm betting I'll piss any teams I'm in off for quite a while until I get the hang of the hook.

Practice then. It's ok to lost while practicing, everyone should understand this.

 

[Davidion]

Taken from Daves steam, legendary match from Artanisix (Aka The Milkman)

28-1-5, there are no words.

My response to that last comment by kung fu treachery in the picture was: "Yeah so did the rest of us". lol

 

[shintoki]

Damn. I want to try Pudge, but I'm betting I'll piss any teams I'm in off for quite a while until I get the hang of the hook.

Don't worry about failing your team. Its why I use ignore and report.


You can just tell my expertise with random pug in DOTA.

 

[Drkirby]

New hero responses (no voice files):

Spirit Breaker

Invoker

Fuzzy Wuzzy

One thing I noticed is that Ursa actually has allied hero responses. I can't recall any other heroes that have those.

Necrolyte has several, all relating to Pudge.

 

[Lactose_Intolerant]

Taken from Daves steam, legendary match from Artanisix (Aka The Milkman)

28-1-5, there are no words.

I have an arch rival it seems.

 

[Sibylus]

Invoker confirmed, Thursdayton!

 

[Metroid]

Probably asked already, but is there a GAF channel so I can play with you? Would be fun.

 

[The_Player]

Probably asked already, but is there a GAF channel so I can play with you? Would be fun.

You won't believe how it's called.

 

[Metroid]

You won't believe how it's called.

Found it. Couldn't see it first. Anyone up for a game?

 

[The_Player]

Found it. Couldn't see it first. Anyone up for a game?

omw o4zloiroman

 

[Haly]

I hope Fuzzy Wuzzy is the thursday after Invoker. Not a fan of Spiritbreaker.

 

[Artanisix]

Where is it confirmed invoker for thurs?

 

[Soule]

Don't worry about failing your team. Its why I use ignore and report.


You can just tell my expertise with random pug in DOTA.

How do you ignore?

 

[krameriffic]

Sad thing about this community is no one is willing to take constructive criticism in public games, lots of times I give people suggestions and they just end up getting mad even if I'm being 100% sincere.

A lot of people don't like playing support classes in particular the way they are supposed to be played. Everyone wants to be the carry. Everyone wants the CS and the XP. No one wants to buy wards, smoke or couriers, even if they picked the hero that should be doing that stuff.

 

[jim-jam bongs]

Don't worry about failing your team. Its why I use ignore and report.

I can't help myself, I'm just a team kinda guy. I've actually been spending a bit of time assessing support heroes for that reason.

 

[Togglesworlh]

Had nothing but had games since I started playing again after the semester ended. (That is, the past two days.)

Best so far? I just finished. 4-3-27.

Support Weaver, fuck yeah?

Zeus, Lich, Nightstalker, Ancient Apparition taking all my kills. Well, not so much the last one, but definitely the other three. U:

O WOE

Oh well.

 

[Stahsky]

It's hard to queue in as a support and expect to take a win with these pub carries being so silly.


Everyone is so up in arms over K/D in this game. Had a Zeus running around with the highest kills and talking up some shit, but never participating in any team fights. Spoiler: We lost and he still thought he was MVP.

 

[Togglesworlh]

ZEUS. I have had a Zeus on my team four games in a row today.

Although this last one was actually legitimately skilled, bar the blatant kill-stealing.

 

[dimb]

It's hard to queue in as a support and expect to take a win with these pub carries being so silly.


Everyone is so up in arms over K/D in this game. Had a Zeus running around with the highest kills and talking up some shit, but never participating in any team fights. Spoiler: We lost and he still thought he was MVP.

Actually the biggest problem I have with teams right now in the beta is people initiating/pushing when they're clearly outnumbered. It's like people can't predict what's going to happen when they push the towers at the base wall and they have three people there when the whole enemy team isn't anywhere on the map. Obviously I'm not in your game or anything, but the question becomes why are you getting into team fights if the biggest threat on your team isn't around?

My team can be down by ten kills and they will still push with three when all five enemies are in the base or missing. This happens all the time and it irks me so much.

 

[Stahsky]

i had a spectre ult into 4 of them and die

i asked him why he did that, and he told me to stfu

Actually the biggest problem I have with teams right now in the beta is people initiating/pushing when they're clearly outnumbered. It's like people can't predict what's going to happen when they push the towers at the base wall and they have three people there when the whole enemy team isn't anywhere on the map. Obviously I'm not in your game or anything, but the question becomes why are you getting into team fights if the biggest threat on your team isn't around?

Rarely do I see people get ballsy in my matches. Most are too afraid to start a fight.


and no, he was with us, he just decided it was better if he left when each fight started

 

[Togglesworlh]

That has been my experience all day. I mean, I haven't exactly been playing my best, but the people I'm teamed up with are just so awful, and such assholes. Except, again, that last game. We destroyed the other team. Well, they did. *sobs*

 

[Drkirby]

Had nothing but had games since I started playing again after the semester ended. (That is, the past two days.)

Best so far? I just finished. 4-3-27.

Support Weaver, fuck yeah?

Zeus, Lich, Nightstalker, Ancient Apparition taking all my kills. Well, not so much the last one, but definitely the other three. U:

O WOE

Oh well.

I don't know how AA ended up with the most kills.

I liked how they continued to stay bunched up as they ran away after I got the Invis Run. Just followed them for a bit, wait for others to get into position, and ult. Killed 1 flat out, Zeus finished off the 2nd, and we chased down the third. They really never learned to spread out when they got hit by my ult.

 

[Drkirby]

ZEUS. I have had a Zeus on my team four games in a row today.

Although this last one was actually legitimately skilled, bar the blatant kill-stealing.

I still say it is because your user name is 'SORBULES, SON OF ZEUS ' right now.

Also, the game before last had Zeus on the OTHER team.

 

[Sibylus]

Where is it confirmed invoker for thurs?

Top men.

 

[Balehead]

Just lost an easy game from like 30-12 lead in kills, our Pudge had to go and over-confident carries started soloin' shit. Chasing dudes around the map and getting killed by a whole team. Ended up having farmed AM + NP pushing our lanes in and our carries were in 20s.

Was level 19 Vengeful Spirit myself, cool hero but a bit tricky with his ultimate. Straight up killed myself with it twice.

 

[Togglesworlh]

I still say it is because your user name is 'SORBULES, SON OF ZEUS ' right now.

You're still saying nonsense.

Also, the game before last had Zeus on the OTHER team.

Was he? Well okay. It's all a blur of shit-stained misery to me.

 

[Swag]

Neki best VS on GAF