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[Sirpopopop]

yeah but upper and middle class families' property taxes go towards poor urban school districts, that means the system is broken

Actually, it works in a different manner than what you just described. The upper and middle class families' property taxes go towards their own school systems.

So by heeding Christie's call they are hurting themselves.

The Abbott ruling, which you are referring to, requires the State to provide the funding:

http://www.edlawcenter.org/issues/school-funding.html

So technically, while you are correct that upper and middle class family taxes go towards poor urban school districts, it's not the taxes that they are complaining about. The taxes they are complaining about, go towards helping them.

 

[Puddles]

Anyone have a good repudiation of this birther claim:

1. Back in 1961 people of color were called 'Negroes.' So how can the Obama 'birth certificate' state he is 'African-American' when the term wasn't even used at that time?

2. The birth certificate that the White House released lists Obama's birth as August 4, 1961. It also lists Barack Hussein Obama as his father. No big deal, right? At the time of Obama's birth, it also shows that his father is aged 25 years old, and that Obama's father was born in "Kenya, East Africa ". This wouldn't seem like anything of concern, except the fact that Kenya did not even exist until 1963, two whole years after Obama's birth, and 27 years after his father's birth. How could Obama's father have been born in a country that did not yet exist? Up and until Kenya was formed in 1963, it was known as the "British East Africa Protectorate".

3. On the birth certificate released by the White House, the listed place of birth is "Kapi'olani Maternity & Gynecological Hospital". This cannot be, because the hospital(s) in question in 1961 were called "KauiKeolani Children's Hospital" and "Kapi'olani Maternity Home", respectively. The name did not change to Kapi'olani Maternity & Gynecological Hospital until 1978, when these two hospitals merged. How can this particular name of the hospital be on a birth certificate dated 1961 if this name had not yet been applied to it until 1978?
Resources: http://www.kapiolani.org/women-and-children/about-us/default.aspx Post-colonial history (from Wikipedia) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_Kenya http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kenya

?

Got some nutters forwarding me this junk. I'd like to shut them up.

 

[Measley]

It's just a theory. I haven't really seen much of anything from Obama to suggest he's some political mastermind, in fact I think he's pretty much made mistake after mistake since entering office. And nearly every mistake boils down to a child-like inability to recognize the other side wants nothing to do with him, period

The only way you could actually believe this is if you believe that Obama is some super-liberal with dictatorial powers. The man campaigned as a centrist, and he governs like a centrist. He even campaigned on reaching across the aisle and working with Republicans to solve problems. So the only conclusion here is that you just weren't paying attention to what he was saying while he was campaigning.

Considering the unified efforts of the right to derail his agenda, the man has done extremely well. You'd have to be living in a fantasy world to believe the country is worse off now than it was in January 2009 when he took office.

 

[gcubed]

Anyone have a good repudiation of this birther claim:



?

Got some nutters forwarding me this junk. I'd like to shut them up.

You are an idiot is a proper response

 

[Acheron]

Anyone have a good repudiation of this birther claim:



?

Got some nutters forwarding me this junk. I'd like to shut them up.

2) It was called the Colony and Protecorate of Kenya from 1920 to 1963. It was only British East Africa before 1920.

 

[ReBurn]

Anyone have a good repudiation of this birther claim:



?

Got some nutters forwarding me this junk. I'd like to shut them up.

Perhaps the birth certificate itself? Unless I'm blind it doesn't mention his race at all. It lists his father as African and his mother as Caucasian. Kenya existed before 1963. That's just when it became independent, and the hospital was named Kapiʻolani Maternity and Gynecological Hospital in 1931. There was also a Kauikeolani Children's Hospital at the Kapiolani Medical Center for Women and Children, but that's not where Obama was born.

 

[SpeedySwaf]

2) It was called the Colony and Protecorate of Kenya from 1920 to 1963. It was only British East Africa before 1920.

Additionally, and maybe I'm blind, I don't see "African-American" anywhere on the long-form. The closest thing is "African" for his father.

 

[A27_StarWolf]

So I feel like Newt Gingrich has a better chance against Obama than Mitt Romney. Maybe not by a whole lot, but Gingrich vs Obama in a debate? The man would rip him apart.

 

[RyanDG]

Anyone have a good repudiation of this birther claim:



?

Got some nutters forwarding me this junk. I'd like to shut them up.

#1 - A child's race isn't on the birth certificate.

#2 - Kenya was the common term for the area. While it was officially known as the British East Africa Protectorate/Colony of Kenya during different times in its history, most maps of the era will have it listed specifically as Kenya.

#3 - This has been repudiated in several sources, by comparing the information with other birth certificates released around the same time, from the same hospital showcasing the same spellings and names.

 

[The Librarian]

So I feel like Newt Gingrich has a better chance against Obama than Mitt Romney. Maybe not by a whole lot, but Gingrich vs Obama in a debate? The man would rip him apart.

Obama would call out Newt on his bullshit. None of the Republican candidates have been willing to do so; that's partially why he's so good at it.

 

[A27_StarWolf]

Here we go:


http://harndenblog.dailymail.co.uk/2012/01/newt-gingrich-declares.html

More at the link.

"Hey, guys--I'm not good enough to win this on my own, so you probably should drop out so I can get your voters."

What a slimeball Gingrich is.

I'm sorry, but Santorum faded away, and is awful at debating, and Perry twice as much.

Given the option every single one of you in PoliGAF would vote Newt over those two.

 

[Puddles]

Thanks guys!

 

[Joe Shlabotnik]

Anyone have a good repudiation of this birther claim:



?

Got some nutters forwarding me this junk. I'd like to shut them up.

From their own fucking source, the joined hospitals were re-named the Kapi'olani Medical Center For Women & Children in 1978, not the Kapi'olani Maternity and Gynecological Hospital. The only other information on the page is that the Kapi'olani Maternity Home was founded in 1890. I'm going to take a wild guess and say that at some point in the intervening 70 years it was re-named the Maternity And Gynecological Hospital until it was combined with the Children's Hospital in 1978.

Edit: Beaten like a rented mule

 

[Measley]

So I feel like Newt Gingrich has a better chance against Obama than Mitt Romney. Maybe not by a whole lot, but Gingrich vs Obama in a debate? The man would rip him apart.

No, he really wouldn't.

Exhibit A:

http://www.examiner.com/populist-in-national/obama-vs-house-gop-best-tv-ever

Exhibit B:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0SL2rK0DInQ

 

[KtSlime]

I'm sorry, but Santorum faded away, and is awful at debating, and Perry twice as much.

Given the option every single one of you in PoliGAF would vote Newt over those two.

Sure, because it's funny watching Newt tantrum against Romney, but certainly not because he is A) Smart B) Reasonable C) Moral D) Electable.*

*I'm assuming you mean voting for Republican Candidate, not President - only insane people would do that.

 

[speculawyer]

So I feel like Newt Gingrich has a better chance against Obama than Mitt Romney. Maybe not by a whole lot, but Gingrich vs Obama in a debate? The man would rip him apart.

The polls say otherwise. I tend to agree with those polls.

You are pretty young and don't have memory of Newt Gingrich in office. The older people (who make up most voters) remember Newt's reign in office. The Left obviously doesn't like him . . . but even the right doesn't like him. They were plotting a coup against him, he got nailed with ethics violations which your own party generally protects you from, and people came out to endorse Romney in droves when Newt had his surge.

I'd love to see Newt & Obama debate but I doubt the results would be as you seem to think. Even Romney deftly deflected Newt when Newt tried to score a cheap shot of "If he can't control his Super-Pac then . . . "

Romney has a decent chance of winning. I think it all depends on the economy. If it were held today, I think Obama would win. I think a combo of things is going to hurt Romney. (So plastic, Mr1% paying 15% tax rate, Mormon, flip-flopper extraordinaire, gaffes, out-of-touch, war-mongering, etc.) But Romney really is the GOP's best shot.

 

[RustyNails]

So I feel like Newt Gingrich has a better chance against Obama than Mitt Romney. Maybe not by a whole lot, but Gingrich vs Obama in a debate? The man would rip him apart.

...rip him apart on what exactly? Food stamp president stuff?

 

[Frank the Great]

Actually, it works in a different manner than what you just described. The upper and middle class families' property taxes go towards their own school systems.

So by heeding Christie's call they are hurting themselves.

The Abbott ruling, which you are referring to, requires the State to provide the funding:

http://www.edlawcenter.org/issues/school-funding.html

So technically, while you are correct that upper and middle class family taxes go towards poor urban school districts, it's not the taxes that they are complaining about. The taxes they are complaining about, go towards helping them.

lol wow, the conservative radio shows here are so fucking misleading. thanks for clearing that up.

 

[A27_StarWolf]

...rip him apart on what exactly? Food stamp president stuff?

It's times like this where I say, you know what, I should go into more detail.

I think Newt is probably the smartest man in the race currently. I think he has some great ideas on the environment as well.

So guys we watched a 1 and a half hour ethics pbs video. It was about ethics in the military, and Newt Gingrich was one of the people on the panel. I liked almost everything he said, and it made a lot of sense to me. He clicks with me, I kind of like that fire he gets some time. We haven't had one of those presidents in a while.

I thought that was going to be Obama, but then he got elected. I'm not talking about policy, he is just... idk not enthusiastic.

 

[KingK]

No, he really wouldn't.

Exhibit A:

http://www.examiner.com/populist-in-national/obama-vs-house-gop-best-tv-ever

Exhibit B:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0SL2rK0DInQ

This reminds me, is there a reason there haven't been more of these public debates between Obama and congressional Republicans? Watching Obama take on, and completely obliterate, the entire GOP in a debate was incredibly entertaining.

I'm guessing the Republicans are extremely reluctant to have any televised debate again after that, but the White House should be pushing for more of this. And when Republicans refuse, they can just mention how they keep trying to have a public dialogue but the GOP shuts them down.

 

[RustyNails]

It's times like this where I say, you know what, I should go into more detail.

I think Newt is probably the smartest man in the race currently. I think he has some great ideas on the environment as well.

Do you also like Newt's idea that Muslim running for president should "publicly denounce Shariah"?

 

[Clevinger]

So I feel like Newt Gingrich has a better chance against Obama than Mitt Romney. Maybe not by a whole lot, but Gingrich vs Obama in a debate? The man would rip him apart.

Gingrich would probably do better, but you're both overrating how good he'd do and how much debates matter. What's much more important than either of those things is how Gingrich would make independents/undecideds flock to Obama in droves.

 

[The Librarian]

I just learned that Chris Dodd is the CEO of the MPAA.

What a shithead. I'm glad he's gone.

 

[RustyNails]

No, he really wouldn't.

Exhibit A:

http://www.examiner.com/populist-in-national/obama-vs-house-gop-best-tv-ever

Exhibit B:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0SL2rK0DInQ

Best part of the Health Care Summit:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AuygCN_tq8k

so good

 

[Kosmo]

I just learned that Chris Dodd is the CEO of the MPAA.

What a shithead. I'm glad he's gone.

And yet, he's never really left (SOPA/PIPA).

 

[Stinkles]

Obama would call out Newt on his bullshit. None of the Republican candidates have been willing to do so; that's partially why he's so good at it.

Sadly, part of the reason is that they know Newt is smarter than they are and so they don't dare fight on level playing fields. Any intellectual on either side of the aisle would easily dismantle Newt on fact or substance. There are however, precious few and it is SHAMEFUL that not one of the other candidates even pretends to have a grasp of any substantitive issue beyond "I ran a business. And Jesus is magic."

 

[Cyan]

I think Newt is probably the smartest man in the race currently.

Hmm. I dunno. Much as I disagree with most of his ideas, Ron Paul strikes me as pretty smart.

 

[maximum360]

It's just a theory. I haven't really seen much of anything from Obama to suggest he's some political mastermind, in fact I think he's pretty much made mistake after mistake since entering office. And nearly every mistake boils down to a child-like inability to recognize the other side wants nothing to do with him, period

PD, I give you credit as being the most masterful hater in the history of Poligaf.

 

[AlteredBeast]

Newt really is a great debater, but part of the reason he does so well is that he talks in front of a tailored audience. Think telling a room full of moderates and democrats that he wants to tell poor people to make their kids clean toilets to learn respect is going to get a standing ovation? Think again.

 

[maximum360]

I just learned that Chris Dodd is the CEO of the MPAA.

What a shithead. I'm glad he's gone.

This.

 

[Invisible_Insane]

Hmm. I dunno. Much as I disagree with most of his ideas, Ron Paul strikes me as pretty smart.

He's pretty profoundly inarticulate, particularly when he gets agitated.

I don't really agree with the idea that Newt is all that great a debater. He excels at generating one-liners that appeal to an audience favorably disposed to cheer for him, but the tone at presidential debates is likely to be considerably more subdued, and I think Obama should be capable of pushing back against the applause lines that play well in conservative rooms.

 

[Divvy]

I think Newt is pretty book smart, but unable to apply that properly to real-life situations. He understands problems, but his solutions are direct straight lines without any nuance.

Hmm. I dunno. Much as I disagree with most of his ideas, Ron Paul strikes me as pretty smart.

He is a doctor that doesn't believe in evolution, wat?

 

[teh_pwn]

He's pretty profoundly inarticulate, particularly when he gets agitated.

Ron is getting older. He used to be faster and coherent. Some times Ron still is sharp, but last night he seemed slower than usual, or maybe taken off guard by the boos.

Here's Ron Paul in the 1980s. He's certainly gotten slower.

Gingrich on the other hand has always sounded like a condescending person at some middle age party with a martini in his hand.

 

[Zabka]

So guys we watched a 1 and a half hour ethics pbs video. It was about ethics in the military, and Newt Gingrich was one of the people on the panel. I liked almost everything he said, and it made a lot of sense to me. He clicks with me, I kind of like that fire he gets some time. We haven't had one of those presidents in a while.

Newt Gingrich was fined $300,000 for ethics violations by his own party while he was Speaker of the House. He's a bullshitter who doesn't give a shit about ethics.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/politics/govt/leadership/stories/012297.htm

Not to mention his personal life. The smartest thing he's done is use this weak Republican field to try to legitimize himself.

 

[Dan]

I can't believe all the stuff with Gingrich and the audience actually happened in last night's debate. That shit is insane. David Brooks said "I sometimes wonder if the Republican Party has become the receding roar of white America as it pines for a way of life that will never return." I'm not sure how there's even any pretense about it, that is the Republican Party and its base. Not all Republicans or anything, but it's clear that's what the core is composed of at this point.

The way Newt Gingrich is going, I'm just waiting for him to hold an event inspired by the Flesh Fair from Artificial Intelligence. He'll trot out minorities and poor people, make a couple zingers, then sit back as his audience boos and stones the 'guests'.

 

[teh_pwn]

He is a doctor that doesn't believe in evolution, wat?

This speaks more of the times he grew up in. Even today as an engineer in a liberal city I know of at least a few coworkers that don't believe in evolution. I quickly learned that it's a political/religious issue that crosses the boundaries of work discussion. Plenty of smart people are religious, and putting a check box next to "I believe in evolution" doesn't make you good at science.

Not many politicians would make half decent scientists because a good scientist masters the human error of selection and confirmation bias, which is something that's as heavy in modern politics as sports.

Are there any good candidates for science? With NASA and research getting cut while Bush's tax cuts expire and we continue murdering tens of thousands of people in the Middle East along with thousands of suspected terrorists - is science a priority? It should be.

I can't believe all the stuff with Gingrich and the audience actually happened in last night's debate. That shit is insane. David Brooks said "I sometimes wonder if the Republican Party has become the receding roar of white America as it pines for a way of life that will never return." I'm not sure how there's even any pretense about it, that is the Republican Party and its base. Not all Republicans or anything, but it's clear that's what the core is composed of at this point.

Yeah, that smacked of racism at worst, at best economic discrimination against poor kids' education and right not to eat urine stains.

We'll get a better idea after the SC turnout, but if it matches Iowa/NH such that the turnout is the same but 20% less if you omit the growing libertarian wing, then the party is shrinking/changing.

 

[KidA Seven]

Here's Ron Paul in the 1980s.

owned

 

[Puddles]

I would like to see more investment in the sciences.

I don't think the free market is ideal for all technological development because of the lengthy development pipeline. I favor the government making prudent investments now before market forces demand technology-driven solutions to our problems.

 

[LOCK]

I live close to South Carolina (North Carolinian) and can catch those local channels. Some of the ads that are running are just so embarrassing. A few make you want to just give up on humanity.

 

[Byakuya769]

So I feel like Newt Gingrich has a better chance against Obama than Mitt Romney. Maybe not by a whole lot, but Gingrich vs Obama in a debate? The man would rip him apart.

You're like the anti-Aaron Strife, except Mr. Strife is correct sometimes.

 

[Byakuya769]

He is a doctor that doesn't believe in evolution, wat?

You must not know many doctors. : (

 

[Oblivion]

Once again, people (that means you, AZ_Starwolf), don't confuse the ability to speak in complete sentences with a tremendous amount of smugness and confidence with actually being a good debater. A flat earther with a PhD in geology is still a flat earther.



Also, question. This is my first primary that I've ever watched, so I'm still not clear on exactly how this works. So this may sound dumb, but do all 50 states get to vote to select the nominee, or is it just a hanful of them (hence why we mainly hear of Iowa, NH, South Carolina and FLorida)?

 

[Baraka in the White House]

I'm sorry but I can't help but laugh at the suggestion of Gingrich as a threat. He's a washed-up relic with a thirst for attention and the very image of career politics who falls apart when others ignore his bombast and call his bluff. He had his chance in the spotlight under Clinton and he completely shit the bed, the only reason he's popped back up now is because an ego like Gingrich's isn't easily bruised.

 

[Byakuya769]

PD, I give you credit as being the most masterful hater in the history of Poligaf.

PD (Obama/Jay-z) > Shogmaster (apple) > Charlequin (death of handhelds)

 

[Puddles]

Puddles (LeBron) > PD (Obama/Jay-z) > Shogmaster (apple) > Charlequin (death of handhelds)

I agree with this.

 

[Miletius]

Once again, people (that means you, AZ_Starwolf), don't confuse the ability to speak in complete sentences with a tremendous amount of smugness and confidence with actually being a good debater. A flat earther with a PhD in geology is still a flat earther.



Also, question. This is my first primary that I've ever watched, so I'm still not clear on exactly how this works. So this may sound dumb, but do all 50 states get to vote to select the nominee, or is it just a hanful of them (hence why we mainly hear of Iowa, NH, South Carolina and FLorida)?

All States hold some sort of contest but the earlier ones have a disproportionate effect on the narrative (or 'momentum') of the contest and are thus given more attention.

 

[KtSlime]

PD (Obama/Jay-z) > Shogmaster (apple) > Charlequin (death of handhelds)

Wow. This is amazingly accurate.

 

[ShockingAlberto]

Newt has specifically said he believes himself to be a man of history, like FDR or Washington.

That ego definitely shines through. It's coupled with an exceptionally short fuse and, when that fuse is up, he loses perspective. He is someone who did not realize that complaining about seating on Air Force One makes him look like a giant baby (not physically, of course....well, I mean he does, but the complaining didn't do that).

Newt being an experienced politician takes nothing away from his ability to throw that all way and be Newt.

 

[Dude Abides]

I think an Obama-Newt debate would probably be a push on substance. Newt's douchey arrogance (of all the people to talk about pious baloney) would come through and turn a lot of people off, women in particular.

 

[speculawyer]

Hmm. I dunno. Much as I disagree with most of his ideas, Ron Paul strikes me as pretty smart.

He is a doctor that doesn't believe in evolution. He believes in wide variety of crazy conspiracy theories. He is certainly not an idiot but he lacks critical thinking skills.