The Librarian
Banned
Laregly agree with one notable exception: interior spaces. Halo 2 did interior combat much better than Halo: CE. Can anyone name a more awesome interior moment in Halo 1 than the brawl in the Mausoleum of the Arbiter in Halo 2?
Halo 4 Announced (MS Conf, 2012, Start Of New Trilogy)
- Thread starter Sanic
- Start date
Laregly agree with one notable exception: interior spaces. Halo 2 did interior combat much better than Halo: CE. Can anyone name a more awesome interior moment in Halo 1 than the brawl in the Mausoleum of the Arbiter in Halo 2?
Halo 2 had awesome dialog from all sides, but the story was doomed from the start due to the ad campaign that was run
From the trailers it seemed like earth was a sprawling mega metropolis -the covenant were throwing everything they had at us and master chief was our last great hope while humans make one crazy final last stand for survival while the flood was gone for good
What did we get? Covenant found us by mistake and basically destroyed earth with a small fleet. Master chief fucks off to some corner of the universe, earth is a mega slum and we are stuck with the arbiter and the flood... Which 99% of halo fans didn't really care for in the first place (as it was really just a nice distraction)
Basically took halo in all the wrong places...
Mind you I still liked the story, but it was such a disappointment with what they were making it out to be
From the trailers it seemed like earth was a sprawling mega metropolis -the covenant were throwing everything they had at us and master chief was our last great hope while humans make one crazy final last stand for survival while the flood was gone for good
What did we get? Covenant found us by mistake and basically destroyed earth with a small fleet. Master chief fucks off to some corner of the universe, earth is a mega slum and we are stuck with the arbiter and the flood... Which 99% of halo fans didn't really care for in the first place (as it was really just a nice distraction)
Basically took halo in all the wrong places...
Mind you I still liked the story, but it was such a disappointment with what they were making it out to be
Slightly Live
Dirty tag dodger
After replacing the word tentacle with testicle, I enjoyed the thought of this.
Demoncarnotaur
Member
You know, I do agree with this. Halo 2's main flaw was that it wasnt the game it was advertised to be. I mean, it was really good, just different than what people expected.
But yeah, ultimately I really hope Halo 4 can capture Halo 2's sense of scale in storytelling, even if the game itself has a way different tone.
The Xtortionist
Member
*arnoldbrofist.gif*
Been saying the same thing for a while. Perma-evade, for example, would allow for some great boss fights. MC is just too limited right now to allow for anything super-interesting. They could probably come up with some competent fights but that's about it. I definitely don't want any "shoot the giant immobile enemy's 3 glowing weak points". Sadly, I think either that or a melee-only boss (like Tartarus) are the only real options with Halo's current mechanics. More projectile-based encounters would turn into stop-and-pop due to lack of a dodge mechanic.
Halo 3 came close with the Scarabs, but it didn't really feel like an actual fight. More like the Scarab was just pissing about and I had to stop it. Some cool 1v1 encounters along the lines of the Omega Pirate, Ing Guardians, Gandrayda, and Dark Samus fights from the Metroid Prime series would be welcome.
Halo has excellent controls and gunplay as is, it just needs that single extra mechanic to allow for stuff like this.
Yeah I definitely agree with you guys on that one. Halo 2 did have the best interior levels, but unfortunately to me, Halo is about big battles in open sand-box areas. This is something that every other Halo game pulls off much better IMO. Just to clarify, I don't think Halo 2 is a horrible game, it was surely one of the best shooters at launch. I just allowed myself to get carried with the hype and was obviously let down by the end product.
I think the problem with giving the player too much freedom is it would make them too powerful.
If you look at Halo's design, you can see many of the mechanics are intentional. The slower pace of the player, for example, forces an added level of strategy in the game that we don't see in faster paced games like CoD or Crysis. I know that Reach introduced more movement options, but there are limits imposed on those options as well.
I guess if the designers were able to stack a huge number of smart enemies against the player, it could still provide a challenge, even if the player had a lot of mobility. I'm just not sure that would be true to Halo's core mechanics. Granted now that I have played the games to death this is no longer the case, but before even fighting one Elite on legendary used to be a fight for life and death due to Bungie's carefully chosen mechanics. IMO that's a quality that's rarely seen in games today.
AdventureRacing
Member
Heh for me it would probably go halo 2 > halo CE > halo 3 > ODST >>>> Reach. I actually enjoy the level design and encounters in halo 2 alot more than the people in this thread seemed too. The story really just puts it at the top of my list for halo games.
In terms of which games i've replayed the most. I have played CE and halo 2 countless times. I have won halo 3 maybe 2 or 3 times and about the same with ODST. Reach i could only just bring myself to finish. It's the first time i've played a halo game and felt as though it would have been better if i had just spent my time on some other game.
I'm talking about wht we were talking about that is to say ideas ideas to replace the miserable confrontation with 343GS and the poor cinematcdeath of Truth.
I don't think Halo offers competent and litteral Boss fights but some encounters are designed in such a way as to serve as milestones, which Bosses in japanese games did too.
I don't care for Boss fights, but from my Contra days, or Megaman days, I still recall Boss fights as enabling good fun.
Plus no Boss fight means you got to have your surprises elswhere, it's less conventionnal whic is good.
I'm totally okay with fighting scarabs>a Super Flooded Prophet and found inspiration for the name remembering Dragon Ball and its excessive use of transformations to justify longer fights.
What I hope someone like the ME guy can bring is visual flair and an eye for imagining impactful action sequences.
Having Truth hiding in a Scarab and taking it down is a midle ground between action set and story development I can be happy with.
For example, I would have liked 343GS to trail after me during Halo3 warthog escape to add some spice to the falling around me, rather than rocket him like in a poorly done COD (I want nothing COD in my Halo except if it is gigatons better).
I find the complaints about Halo 2's level design surprising.
I found it improved on the original's identical indistinguishable hallways a fair bit (which was really my only real complaint about the first game; I still have a hard time believing that Bungie didn't see any problem with those identical hallways).
Plot-wise was a little disappointing to immediately return to another Ring and go through the whole releasing the Flood routine again (still seems like an incredibly stupid decision on the part of the Forerunners to keep ANY Flood specimens around).
Halo 3's level design was even more varied and progress was even clearer, I found, though I didn't like the more restrictive vehicle use.
Yeah, the first game had some decent wide open arenas on the Ring made to look like forests and stuff, but I'd hardly rate Halo 2 last.
So far, having played the 3 numbered titles, about halfway way through ODST, and not having played Reach I'd place ODST at the bottom.
Curious to see what a brand new Bungie-less Halo will be like.
I found it improved on the original's identical indistinguishable hallways a fair bit (which was really my only real complaint about the first game; I still have a hard time believing that Bungie didn't see any problem with those identical hallways).
Plot-wise was a little disappointing to immediately return to another Ring and go through the whole releasing the Flood routine again (still seems like an incredibly stupid decision on the part of the Forerunners to keep ANY Flood specimens around).
Halo 3's level design was even more varied and progress was even clearer, I found, though I didn't like the more restrictive vehicle use.
Yeah, the first game had some decent wide open arenas on the Ring made to look like forests and stuff, but I'd hardly rate Halo 2 last.
So far, having played the 3 numbered titles, about halfway way through ODST, and not having played Reach I'd place ODST at the bottom.
Curious to see what a brand new Bungie-less Halo will be like.
THIS!! These are also why I love Reach so much. I gave me all of this and more!
It's odd, I was never bothered by the repeating levels in Halo CE. I thought they did a decent enough job allowing you to explore different areas of the same levels and also brought a level of continuity to the world. The copy and paste interior areas were sorely lacking, there's no doubt there. Thankfully the remake brought some variety to the drab art of the interior sections.
I also think it makes perfect sense that the forerunners kept some flood samples to hopefully find a cure.
The Librarian
Banned
Perplexed! Halo 3 didn't have "restrictive vehicle use" by any means.
Let me make one thing clear: Out of the trilogy, Halo 2 did not have the best interior levels. That distinction belongs to Halo 3. The Brute Pack hallway, barracks, and command center in Crow's Nest, the storage facility in The Storm, the Cartographer in the Ark, and the citadel towers in The Covenant.
100% Halo. but tonally a bit different if what Frankie sad about the artworks is any indication of where the game is going. (supposedly artworks should indicate where the game is going, no?)
About three of the levels in Halo 2 were fun to play. Despite the story being completely canabalised, most of the levels in Halo 3 were well designed and engaging, and the game actually has some of the best levels in the series (The Covenant, The Ark, The Storm, Floodgate, Siera 117 and Halo were all great. Even cortana, as annoying as it was from a gameplay perspective, was extremely atmospheric and moody.)
I actually preferred the Brutes in Halo 3 to the Elites in Halo: Reach as well.... just sayin.
For my money, it's (campaign wise only):
Halo: CE >>>> Halo 3 > Halo 3: ODST >>>> Halo: Reach > Halo 2
dragonelite
Member
Every time i see this thread back up on page 1 i always expect something about future games in halo franchise. But no you guys keep on talking about past games. :'(
After seeing, and enjoying (surprise) the RE6 trailer, I wonder if post Halo 4, 343i would dare building a game with a set of protagonists.
Don't hate, I remember Halo 2.
But Capcom had trouble with the Resident Evil franchise in terms of which direction was the best, and from the trailer I get the feeling that although each protagonist (Leon, Chris, Random bald dude) share to some extent the same capabilities, each may have his own "tricks" and the level design (and probably the weapons selection/management) will be different for each offering different takes on the RE formula in the same game.
To be honest, these days I could have sex with the Didact without even knowing if he's as buldgy as the new Chief, but having an adventure with Chief, the Didact, and maybe an AI/ODST/? all in the same game is something I find attractive. I would have to be sold on it of course.
I would love to control someone using Forerunner tech and weapons, and i just think ther is potentially more backlash in having The Chief fitted in Forerunner armor rather than letting the players be a Forerunner.
Playing an ODST could be a next-gen Halo 3 : ODST
Or I could play as an AI, with a totally crazy gamesetting and game mechanic.
If I bothered you with my non-sense, know that I've split my wrists open and spread blood on the keayboard as an offering to the Gods to receive real Halo 4 news.
I'm fainti..
Don't hate, I remember Halo 2.
But Capcom had trouble with the Resident Evil franchise in terms of which direction was the best, and from the trailer I get the feeling that although each protagonist (Leon, Chris, Random bald dude) share to some extent the same capabilities, each may have his own "tricks" and the level design (and probably the weapons selection/management) will be different for each offering different takes on the RE formula in the same game.
To be honest, these days I could have sex with the Didact without even knowing if he's as buldgy as the new Chief, but having an adventure with Chief, the Didact, and maybe an AI/ODST/? all in the same game is something I find attractive. I would have to be sold on it of course.
I would love to control someone using Forerunner tech and weapons, and i just think ther is potentially more backlash in having The Chief fitted in Forerunner armor rather than letting the players be a Forerunner.
Playing an ODST could be a next-gen Halo 3 : ODST
Or I could play as an AI, with a totally crazy gamesetting and game mechanic.
If I bothered you with my non-sense, know that I've split my wrists open and spread blood on the keayboard as an offering to the Gods to receive real Halo 4 news.
I'm fainti..
AdventureRacing
Member
The seperate story line for the chief and the arbiter and getting to play from both persepctives was the best thing to ever happen to halo. That's one of the big reasons halo 3 was a disappointment to me.
If they could achieve something like that i wouldn't care. Although i also wouldn't mind if it's just all chief with a similar style/atmosphere to halo 1.
If they could achieve something like that i wouldn't care. Although i also wouldn't mind if it's just all chief with a similar style/atmosphere to halo 1.
dragonelite
Member
I rather have something like Alien vs predator with x amount of seperate campaign.
Not something like call of duty where you jump between teams every mission.
Hiro_Kunimi_80
Member
Clearly I'm talking Halo 5 and beyond.
But 343i is playing the back to the roots card with halo 4.
They could get away with the same formula applied to a next-gen Halo.
All in all, the title Reclaimer Tirlogy says it all. The Chief.
On the other end, i'm happy with Halo and would want other experiences too.
Only a strong story can make me switch character in game, with a very good reason to do so.
Introducing new playable characters is the best way to get innovation on the MP side as is it seems fairer to pick an Elite to getevasion skills, a Spartan with thrusters, a Foreunner with fuck now what and you can certainly build a nice MP game type around 3 differentiated factions. And thus you don't deal with AA. It's mostly picking your side at the beginning.
Had there been no playable Arbiter, who knows if we could use Covies in MP?
AdventureRacing
Member
I blame you guys for the story in halo 3 
.
.ElzarTheBam
Member
Disagree strongly, The arbiter levels featured far stronger narrative and better missions that were grander in scope than the chief's.
For those who read the books :
I think the Didact, if he's in the game!, needs to have his own story and thus needs to be playable rather than be a a companion all the time and figure in cutscenes.
There is stuff only him knows, places he's best fitted to go and certain asses I wish I kicked while in his giant body
If the Didact is playable, it leaves the door opened to keep building a mystrious campaign for the Chief sall throughout the trilogy, whereas the Didact has clearer goals and better knowledge of the Galaxy which helps drive the narrative while offering a different but haloish gameplay.
I wish Forerunners were playable in MP too, but I think I can live if it's only through armor permutations in Halo 4. (I'm afraid some sort of Forerunner armor in halo 4 might just be accessible to the utmost completionnists).
I think it's also possible the Didact does not figure prominently in the Game, while Halo 4 terminals (videos!!) could serve as a Bear's books redux.
There is stuff only him knows, places he's best fitted to go and certain asses I wish I kicked while in his giant body
If the Didact is playable, it leaves the door opened to keep building a mystrious campaign for the Chief sall throughout the trilogy, whereas the Didact has clearer goals and better knowledge of the Galaxy which helps drive the narrative while offering a different but haloish gameplay.
I wish Forerunners were playable in MP too, but I think I can live if it's only through armor permutations in Halo 4. (I'm afraid some sort of Forerunner armor in halo 4 might just be accessible to the utmost completionnists).
I think it's also possible the Didact does not figure prominently in the Game, while Halo 4 terminals (videos!!) could serve as a Bear's books redux.
The Librarian
Banned
On average, I wouldn't say better missions.
oddworld18
Member
not to interrupt the lovely ongoing discussions in here, but have there been any rumblings of a halo 4 beta? i can't imagine they would skip out on it, but at the same time, we should have heard about something by now...
Rumors are that it may come with a McMultiplayer Happy Meal.
K
kittens
Unconfirmed Member
I'm pretty sure I'm the only person who thought the Arbiter missions in Halo 2 were interesting, well done, and just as compelling as the Master Chief bits. Gameplay wise, they were a lot better.
Disclaimer: I haven't played Halo 2 since 2007, and my judgement might be clouded.
Disclaimer: I haven't played Halo 2 since 2007, and my judgement might be clouded.
Slightly Live
Dirty tag dodger
"Leaked" Halo 4 picture from mlg, looks shopped badly.
Heh.
Biggest-Geek-Ever
Member
I don't see "Tom Morello" anywhere on that picture. Do not believe.
And this is why we can't have nice things and get stuck with shit video game stories like Halo 3.
I didn't mind it. Halo 3's conclusion was competent.
While I wasn't a fan of the Arbiter approach, it wasn't a terrible perspective. It was almost necessary and did a great job expanding the universe.
I just prefer the more cohesive style when you're one character moving from objective to objective.
potential vehicle news tomorrow at the toy fair
Steelyuhas
Member
His fault
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Oh, you mean the much more interesting character than chief? The Arbiter was one of the main reasons that Halo 2 was so awesome.
KidA Seven
Member
Never understood the hate for Arbiter in Halo 2. He actually made the story interesting.
Etrian Oddity
Member
A boring person can be competent. That doesn't mean they're desirable. :\
And I'll echo the interior level design praise. Cairo Station and Gravemind had ridiculously great ambiance and soundtrack suites.
His fault
The Arbiter perspective was the best thing that happened in Halo2. It massively fleshed out the overall universe.
Dudebros missed playing Masterchief though, or something; they want Halo to have the same story depth as CoD or something.
I loved what the Arbiter did to Halo 2, and I loved the Halo 2 story overall. It felt like I was reading a novel. (Almost literally, because the gameplay was botched).