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[royalan]

You are such a tease!


I really think IdeaMan wants us to really consider the Subscreen in his hints, and I mean REALLY consider it when placed next to his "2x 360". With that in mind my optimistic self is taking IdeaMan's information to mean something like this.

His sources have seen prototype software/engines that are displaying a full scene on the main screen and a full scene re-rendered (different angle or not, but lower res of course) on the Subscreen. When one looks at those displays they think "That looks twice as good as the 360". With other assumptions in place like 720p main screen and high fidelity with shaders employed etc, that leaves me rather happy.

While I am prepared for less, I am happy to live in my own little reality until proven otherwise.

That's what I took his words to mean, as well.

And I'm happy with that. The fact that even people who aren't hands-on with the hardware will be able to just look at the games and see something that they register as being twice as impressive as a 360 game speaks to the Wii U having some impressive hardware, even if not as cutting edge as what we're likely to see from the other consoles. But that's fine with me, and honestly I don't think anybody really expected more than that.

And I gotta say I really respect IdeaMan for taking the time to actually share with us some of what he knows. Thanks Bruh! Gotta say of all the "in-the-know" posters in this thread, you're definitely kicking ass with how much you "safely" engage with us.

You gonna sit there and let some newbie take your shine, Lherre? I wouldn't take that if I were you...

 

[Nibel]

Would be awesome if anybody made a full blown AAA game only for the tablet controller. I think the graphics would look extremly good considering the smaller resolution and screensize. A handheld with 2-5 x the power of the 360.. And as i play handheld games at home....

Have you seen the first Wii U video from E3 2011 which shows some of the features? There is a scene where two persons play a game of Go.

I bet there will be many Wii U ware games which work on the tablet controller only. Nintendo created its own kind of iPad and I'm pretty sure that they will use this big touchscreen to create some cool games.

And since you are able to play most full-price games on your tablet, I think this grants your wish in some way.

 

[bgassassin]

You gonna sit there and let some newbie take your shine, Llerre?

I don't think lherre's brother has much to say.

 

[blu]

Would be awesome if anybody made a full blown AAA game only for the tablet controller. I think the graphics would look extremly good considering the smaller resolution and screensize. A handheld with 2-5 x the power of the 360.. And as i play handheld games at home....

Imagine the following scenario: a high profile, 'showcase' game which runs @30 fps on the TV, and perma-solid 60 fps when played on the upad.

Handheld bliss.

 

[TwilightPrincess]

Have you seen the first Wii U video from E3 2011 which shows some of the features? There is a scene where two persons play a game of Go.

I bet there will be many Wii U ware games which work on the tablet controller only. Nintendo created its own kind of iPad and I'm pretty sure that they will use this big touchscreen to create some cool games.

And since you are able to play most full-price games on your tablet, I think this grants your wish in some way.

Yes of course. There will be games which concentrate on the controller. I was dreaming about bigger Games that where produced from the scratch only for the controller, putting all the horsepower on the small tablet

@blu: I would like that too.

 

[AzaK]

And that's 2x before most of the nice effects get added in, such as shadowing and AA, which can make a huge influence on that perception/estimate.

True, although I was never sure if he meant either

- They think it's 2x the 360 (res, framerate etc) but still have to add effects. In this case it'd make it less. BTW I doubt this
- Or it already looks 2x as good but we haven't even added all the sexy stuff yet.

I took the later in my assumptions.

Another thing for reference, is that the Subscreen is about 44% of the area of a 1280x720 screen. If my assumptions are correct (And we know what they are the mother of) with regard to what he's saying, and a developer made the Subscreen a simple 2 poly, single flat shaded texture then that would give the main screen a considerable about of extra "grunt" to do more with.

Again, the whole 2x - 5x bullshit comes to mind. Render two screens at once = 2x as sexy looking. Render to the main screen with as much grunt as possible given to one screen and we get 5x.

Imagine the following scenario: a high profile, 'showcase' game which runs @30 fps on the TV, and perma-solid 60 fps when played on the upad.

Handheld bliss.

Oh god yes, yes! Ever since I heard about the Subscreen I have been dreaming of this. If it can work in another room I would be a happy, happy man.



Basically in the end we'll get a range based on:

1) Developer skill and effort
2) Desire to have 1 or 2 screens
3) The level to which those screens have sexiness or just purely functional graphics.

 

[royalan]

I don't think lherre's brother has much to say.

Damnit! >_<

 

[Shin Johnpv]

Man I go away for the weekend and this thread goes insane. Fucking hell.

 

[jay]

Twice Xbox 360 graphics means you'll have a 360 quality image on your TV and a 360 quality image in your lap.

 

[Fourth Storm]

Have you seen the first Wii U video from E3 2011 which shows some of the features? There is a scene where two persons play a game of Go.

I bet there will be many Wii U ware games which work on the tablet controller only. Nintendo created its own kind of iPad and I'm pretty sure that they will use this big touchscreen to create some cool games.

And since you are able to play most full-price games on your tablet, I think this grants your wish in some way.

Indeed. I got into a debate God knows how many pages back as to whether all games will have the "tablet only" mode included. I was under the impression that this would be OS level, but I'm honestly not so sure. However, going forward, I can see this feature as a way for 3rd parties to scale their games to Wii U in a business savvy way. It gives their games more time to be played over other versions, since giving up the tv needn't ever be an excuse again. Over the years, this has been a huge issue in my gaming career. My brother and I had it out numerous times back in the day!

 

[tkscz]

Twice Xbox 360 graphics means you'll have a 360 quality image on your TV and a 360 quality image in your lap.

Why are some people taking it this way?

 

[IceDoesntHelp]

Why are some people taking it this way?

Because that's what it obviously means, duh.

 

[blu]

Oh god yes, yes! Ever since I heard about the Subscreen I have been dreaming of this. If it can work in another room I would be a happy, happy man.

And how about some 8x MSAA during handheld sessions?

 

[Fourth Storm]

That's an interesting point, actually: While it's pretty easy to identify members of the team at IBM that worked on the CPU, it's nearly impossible to find a single team member from AMD outside of two dudes working on secondary stuff like the IO processor. But I also have no idea what Nintendo Technology Development was up to in recent years, and those guys were very deeply involved in the creation of Flipper as far as I know, to the point of actually codeveloping the TEV architecture. I kinda wonder just how custom the GPU is at this point, and who developed/ customized what.

EDIT: I believe parts of the chip design process were outsourced to other companies, too. Cadence for example does contract microprocessor design and was involved as far as I know. So maybe Nintendo also contracted, say, DMP to work on parts of the GPU.

Thanks for sharing this. It's interesting to wonder who is actually designing this thing.

 

[Log4Girlz]

Did Ideaman indicate if the RAM was closer to 1 GB or 1.5 GB?

 

[ThankeeSai]

Totally understand. Makes the whole thing more interesting, and guessing about the new reveal is great fun anyway!

There's going to be a new reveal?

Trying not to get myself too hyped as iirc, the final reveal for the Wii was something to do with the SD card slot

*Edit*

Or did you just mean the reveal as in "*This* is what it is capable of"?

 

[AzaK]

And how about some 8x MSAA during handheld sessions?

I may very well need some new undies.

Twice Xbox 360 graphics means you'll have a 360 quality image on your TV and a 360 quality image in your lap.

Because that's what it obviously means, duh.

I was not sure if this is what IdeaMan meant too, but to me that seems unlikely, if not primarily because the Subscreen is much lower resolution than 1280x720 which would mean the thing is less than 2 360's (Grr multipliers be gone!) i.e not going to happen.

 

[anon_mastermind]

I read and didn't see this posted but there's a product page for the Wii U on BestBuy.ca

http://www.bestbuy.ca/en-CA/nintendo-wii-u.aspx

Picture of the console, product features with screenshots, shows what the controller can do.

And system details:

Approximately 1.8 inches tall, 6.8 inches wide and 10.5 inches long.
New Controller: Approximately 5.3 inches high, 0.9 inches deep (not including buttons and other projections) and 9.0 inches long.
The new controller incorporates a 6.2-inch, 16:9 touch screen and traditional button controls, including two analog Circle Pads. This combination removes the traditional barriers between games, players and the TV by creating a second window into the video game world.
The rechargeable controller includes a Power button, Home button, +Control Pad, A/B/X/Y buttons, L/R buttons and ZL/ZR buttons. It includes a built-in accelerometer and gyroscope, rumble feature, camera, a microphone, stereo speakers, a sensor strip and a stylus. Other Controls: Up to four Wii Remote&#8482; (or Wii Remote Plus) controllers can be connected at once.
The new console supports all Wii&#8482; controllers and input devices, including the Nunchuk&#8482; controller, Classic Controller&#8482;, Classic Controller Pro&#8482; and Wii Balance Board&#8482;.

Media: A single self-loading media bay will play 12-centimeter proprietary high-density optical discs for the new console, as well as 12-centimeter Wii optical discs.
Video Output: Supports 1080p, 1080i, 720p, 480p and 480i. Compatible cables include HDMI, component, S-video and composite.

Audio Output: Uses AV Multi Out connector. Six-channel PCM linear output through HDMI.

Storage: The console will have internal flash memory, as well as the option to expand its memory using either an SD memory card or an external USB hard disk drive.

CPU: IBM Power®-based multi-core microprocessor.

GPU: IBM Power®-based multi-core microprocessor.

Other: Four USB 2.0 connector slots are included.

The new console is backward compatible with Wii games and Wii accessories.

Note: Details are subject to change.

Not sure if any of this is new info.

 

[themadcowtipper]

CPU: IBM Power®-based multi-core microprocessor.

GPU: IBM Power®-based multi-core microprocessor.

WTFDog.gif
AncientALien.gif

 

[Berg]

CPU: IBM Power®-based multi-core microprocessor.

GPU: IBM Power®-based multi-core microprocessor.

Note: Details are subject to change.

forgot that part

 

[anon_mastermind]

oops, I edited it in.

 

[StevieP]

WTFDog.gif
AncientALien.gif

Cell 2.0 confirmed for Wii U

 

[wsippel]

Thanks for sharing this. It's interesting to wonder who is actually designing this thing.

That's what I tried to find out for months, but I really can't figure it out. At least not on the GPU side of things. But we've heard very little from AMD so far. It's extremely unlikely, but maybe the GPU is an AMD/ DMP joint project. As in: The mysterious PICA Extreme GPU for consoles that appeared on DMPs roadmap a while ago might actually be a heavily modified Radeon chip or something (with DMP providing the geometry setup stage and TMUs or whatever). AMD and DMP aren't really competing in the same space anyway, and maybe AMD already inked a deal behind closed doors to take over DMP, just like they took over ArtX back in the day. And I believe the company that did the very weird DS GPU (Alchemy?) was also bought out right before the DS launched.

 

[Aguila]

Not sure if any of this is new info.

All of that info comes from Nintendo's own website.

 

[themadcowtipper]

All of that info comes from Nintendo's own website.

There is one slight difference, see if you can spot it

CPU:IBM Power®-based multi-core microprocessor.GPU:AMD Radeon™-based High Definition GPU.

 

[Nibel]

Cell 2.0 confirmed for Wii U

So Wii U 2x PS3?!??!?!

 

[anon_mastermind]

All of that info comes from Nintendo's own website.

I see.

Well, at the very least, it was up to Nintendo to give Best Buy the go-ahead to create a product page right? They are starting to get more visibility for the WiiU. Does this mean a name or design change is less likely?

 

[Shogmaster]

So Wii U 2x PS3?!??!?!

Which means 1.5X 360.

 

[Rösti]

I see.

Well, at the very least, it was up to Nintendo to give Best Buy the go-ahead to create a product page right? They are starting to get more visibility for the WiiU. Does this mean a name or design change is less likely?

It is common practice for resellers to setup pre-order deals for consoles just announced, and for console we don't even know exist. There are pre-orders for Xbox 720 now already, and that hasn't even been shown yet. It's nothing special and doesn't indicate any changes when it comes to Nintendo's plans regarding distribution of Wii U information.

 

[bgassassin]

I see.

Well, at the very least, it was up to Nintendo to give Best Buy the go-ahead to create a product page right? They are starting to get more visibility for the WiiU. Does this mean a name or design change is less likely?

Wal-Mart had a placeholder page up months ago so I wouldn't take any meaning from stuff like that.

 

[nordique]

Yes, very interesting. I was browsing bestbuy.ca not too long ago, and I didn't notice the Wii U page ever being there before

http://www.bestbuy.ca/fr-CA/nintendo-wii-u.aspx


I guess this means a name change may be unlikely as some were hoping (to me it makes more sense to use the Wii brand)


Might this be indicative of a strong GDC presence? Still, it's not the strongest indicator.



Mind you, Future Shop has no Wii U page

http://www.futureshop.ca/fr-CA/cate...spx?path=4e80f1990235eea88f24e4f56bb345a1fr01


And Future Shop is owned by Best Buy.

 

[antonz]

its kinda random like Best Buy USA doesnt have a page for the Wii U but does have a sign up for news option though you can preorder lego city stories and smash brothers Wii U lol

 

[Nibel]

If the Wii U pad would be capable of THIS.. my god, this would be such a crazy console.
Feeling the dirt in Pikmin 3.. and the Wii U would sell gangbusters with a Love Plus game that uses this feature.

 

[Lupin the Third]

I think the controller has haptic feedback functionality, but it hasn't been revealed yet.

-The early rumors reported it.

-It would make the controller more obviously expensive than just with the existing featureset and less viable to be sold separately.

-It's the kind of out-there addition that the competition couldn't implement last-minute (unlike the controller screen, which is already quite possible for MS and Sony to ape by this point).

-Nintendo has pulled this last-minute trick on us before (Wii Remote Speaker, the digital click on GameCube triggers).

-Haptic feedback would provide a new level of immersion and interaction and would allow the player to "feel" the touchscreen's surface and interact with it on some level without taking their eyes off the screen (which is always the chief complaint of some when "moving the HUD to the controller" is suggested).

e: LOL Nibel, great minds think alike, huh?

 

[NeoRausch]

Ha, some cockteasing by ideamen till E3? I'm cool with that! Just drop some info every 3 weeks and this threa is gonna assplode!

 

[HylianTom]

I think the controller has haptic feedback functionality, but it hasn't been revealed yet.

-The early rumors reported it.

-It would make the controller more obviously expensive than just with the existing featureset and less viable to be sold separately.

-It's the kind of out-there addition that the competition couldn't implement last-minute (unlike the controller screen, which is already quite possible for MS and Sony to ape by this point).

-Nintendo has pulled this last-minute trick on us before (Wii Remote Speaker, the digital click on GameCube triggers).

-Haptic feedback would provide a new level of immersion and interaction and would allow the player to "feel" the touchscreen's surface and interact with it on some level without taking their eyes off the screen (which is always the chief complaint of some when "moving the HUD to the controller" is suggested).

e: LOL Nibel, great minds think alike, huh?

The more I read about it, the more excited I get. Such possibilities..

Imagine searching your map on the pad, with the vibrations getting more and more forceful as you get closer to your target. As soon as you get a good idea on the map, you can then use this info to find your target in the world on the TV..

 

[AceBandage]

If the Wii U pad would be capable of THIS.. my god, this would be such a crazy console.
Feeling the dirt in Pikmin 3.. and the Wii U would sell gangbusters with a Love Plus game that uses this feature.

Haptic feedback would be neat, but it could also be problematic with programing for games.

 

[jimi_dini]

If the Wii U pad would be capable of THIS.. my god, this would be such a crazy console.

Oh god, please...


Iwata *laughs*

 

[Nibel]

e: LOL Nibel, great minds think alike, huh?

Holy crap..!

Anybody ever thought of Nintendogs HD with that feature? Or a new Wario Ware HD which would spill out dozens of minigames based on it? This would be such a killer feature, and I think that Nintendo thought about it since this could be the perfect fusion between a touch screen and the Vitality sensor.

Edit: Okay, informed myself about that Vitality sensor again. It has nothing to do with haptic feedback. Sorry guys, I just wanted to pull a bgassassin for once!

 

[StevieP]

Ha, some cockteasing by ideamen till E3? I'm cool with that! Just drop some info every 3 weeks and this threa is gonna assplode!

Is he verified yet?

Haptic feedback would be neat, but it could also be problematic with programing for games.

Screen durability too, no? I'll admit it's been awhile since I looked at haptic tech.

 

[AceBandage]

Is he verified yet?



Screen durability too, no? I'll admit it's been awhile since I looked at haptic tech.

Probably, yeah.
Then there's trying to explain it to consumers so they don't think something is wrong with their controller...

 

[bgassassin]

If the Wii U pad would be capable of THIS.. my god, this would be such a crazy console.
Feeling the dirt in Pikmin 3.. and the Wii U would sell gangbusters with a Love Plus game that uses this feature.

XD

-The early rumors reported it.

I remember that as well.

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=27551077&postcount=7659

Sorry guys, I just wanted to pull a bgassassin for once!

Did you kill anyone dead?

 

[lherre]

Do you have any idea what the DK-DEV kit is? Seems slightly older than the latest CAT-DEV, but has a higher version number (V5 vs. V42).

Also, do you know if direct register access is available on current kits, or do developer have to use higher level APIs?

I forgot this question, DK are the initials of "Development Kit" so DK-DEV kit doesn't exist.

 

[Cheesecakebobby]

I think we'll have to wait for Wii U2 for haptic feedback. With a launch title where you have to feel Bono's face

 

[AceBandage]

I think we'll have to wait for Wii U2 for haptic feedback. With a launch title where you have to feel Bono's face

Ah yes, I can feel the pretentiousness already.

 

[methodman]

Haptic feedback would be insanely awesome.

 

[HylianTom]

Breaking news: new Nintendo Juicy™ console to feature unprecedented level of haptic feedback technology!

 

[jaz013]

I have one question for Ideaman, outside of the system capabilities. Is Nintendo still pulling off that weird 3-devices development cycle they used for the Wii? It was certainly a lot of fun making something run on the main DEV kit, only to discover that the game froze at random on the second development kit.

If they ditched that, maybe it would help to some developer to reconsider developing for a Nintendo system (someone at my old job told me this was a complain he keep hearing on some developer events).

 

[Nibel]

I think we'll have to wait for Wii U2 for haptic feedback. With a launch title where you have to feel Bono's face

OR they will remake Mario 64 for Wii U2 where you can touch and feel Mario's face! (Actually this could be a funny feature for Wii U Mario, minus the feel)

Did you kill anyone dead?

 

[bgassassin]