Excellent post.
Being white is a privilege, says this PSA.
- Thread starter ChiTownBuffalo
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Excellent post.
Annnnnnnd thread.
way more
Member
Up your ass!
WanderingWind
Mecklemore Is My Favorite Wrapper
Almost zen like in its simplicity.
Vicetrailia
Banned
This is true, far more often than not. The opportunity is largely there. But the part about "having their attention" as seen in a positive opportunity is downright untrue, because that's not where it starts.
There are cases where nothing can be done about it, simply because you are non-white. But out of the jobs worked I've only encountered such a terrible place once.
Totally.
CountAntonius
Member
Thanks for putting this into words better than I could.
Have and have not is a simple fact of life, and putting your hands over your ears and ignoring it helps no one.
As a very privileged person I welcome the opportunity to be reminded of the advantages I have been given in life; it improves my perspective and helps me appreciate what I have.
Fuck anyone's trodden sensibilities if they can't handle it, honestly. Don't feel guilty and assume responsibility, just acknowledge and move on.
elongation
Neo Member
Interesting how many dislikes this is getting. Do people not realise that white people have it easier in general (in western nations)? This isn't racist, it's simply saying all races should be equally treated..
I feel sorry for people who feel their achievements are less valuable when they find out that black people have it harder than white people. They should see a therapist. That's a major self-esteem issue.
True enough, but don't you think inter-generational social mobility would be helped a fair bit by reminding poor whites and minorities that they have more in common with each other than they do individuals of their same race in higher social strata? How do this ad or this discussion facilitate that?
Red_Ragnarok
Banned
If white people are privileged, in the way that the other poster was suggesting, it should be expected that all minorities (including North East Asians) are more likely to be harassed by police because they are not white.
There is another thing I noticed. On Wikipedia, under the Personal Income in the United States I found that Asian males have the highest income in America. It seems strange to me that Asians could be so successful given that society is built for whites and whites are so privileged. The only explanation I can think of is that white people are dumber and lazier than Asians. Maybe thats what the people who say that there is white privilege think. That sounds kinda racist to me though.
Uhm, only if they're really defensive...
Are you telling me that someone can't simultaneously feel good about their accomplishments and know that they are privileged?
Most people in this forum are from 1st world countries. If I say that we are privileged in comparison to people in 3rd world countries, all I'm doing is bringing hate?
Half and half
Member
I agree with you completely that there are places that cannot be fixed and it is pretty darn unfortunate.
Can't say I really understand this statement. If you try and take what is a very complicated issue and reduce it down to something extremely simple for the sake of making it easy to hand-wave, you won't benefit anyone; neither those that enjoyed success or suffered greatly.
I hope most people don't think like this, because this is a stupid post (and also a strawman, I believe.)
Why should it be expected that everyone minority is treated the exact same way by society/police?
Also, it sounds like you're appealing to Asians as some kind of 'model minority'. You should read about that. That very image is damaging to Asians (as well as other minorities.)
WanderingWind
Mecklemore Is My Favorite Wrapper
Care to explain how that wasn't simply stated? I mean, it was only 2 sentences long.
The joke being that his name is Buddha. Zen? Buddha.
...I'm here all night, folks.
First of all, it's not black vs. white.
Second of all, I wish it was being presented as "persona of color have to deal with X and Y," rather than "white people don't have to deal with X and Y." That's just poor marketing, and to steal the feigned, inflated, delusional sense of superiority of others in this thread; I think it's sad that you don't see that. D'awww. Maybe you should talk to your mommy. Etcetera.
Blech.
Thank you for not boring us with an explanation.
I am mad, but honestly? think I would feel the same way to be honest. I suspect it is similar to the irritation and need to justify and defend the same advantages and behavior I enjoy as a man over a woman. I suppose the difference is that I will always openly acknowledge they exist. I can only hope that some posters in this thread at their core at least try to acknowledge or understand.
It is what it is.
LaserBuddha
Member
If you tell a poor/struggling person they were born privileged, what point are you trying to make?
If you tell a successful person they were born privileged, what point are you trying to make?
People have been doing that for years. Doesn't seem to work very well....
The best way is to do both. People are bound to understand at least one of those two.
That even if they have it bad, there are other people who, in similar situations, would be treated a lot worse by society based on skin color?
Even if your life sucks, you should still be aware of your status in society compared to others.
You seem to imply that someone is trying to say "hey, your life doesn't actually suck".
While I agree in premise, there is something to be said about context.
If a given race or whatever has had real advantages over outside groups, pointing that out in an effort to engender thought and discussion for the implications to others isn't necessarily a bad thing and doesn't automatically devalue their accomplishments.
It's about creating awareness, empathy, and understanding about the adversity and hurdles others have faced that are simply outside of one's personal field of view.
You're crazy if you don't think things have gotten dramatically better over time and that this "privilege" approach doesn't immediately cause a knee-jerk reaction of "hey, wait a minute..."
Again, look at the votes on the PSA video in the OP. Now tell me with a straight emoticon that you believe the votes would be the same had it been presented as "I'm a person of color, and I have to deal with X."
Regulus Tera
Romanes Eunt Domus
Thanks for sharing this. Not much I can add beyond it being insightful in more angles than just the racial ones.
I don't think anyone here is arguing that white people have it better. If you compare a poor white man with a poor black man, obviously the poor black man has it worse.
But that still doesn't help the poor white man, and you run the risk of making him feel worse.
Of course, you have to weigh that risk versus the utility of informing people about white privilege, which is a calculation I cannot do.
LaserBuddha
Member
Telling someone in horrible circumstances that someone else probably has it worse, and that they are "lucky" in some way... how doesn't that fit the definition of devaluing their suffering?
Telling someone who has achieved a lot that it wasn't just their determination and talent, that they always had an unfair advantage... how doesn't that fit the definition of devaluing their success?
CountAntonius
Member
I'll just quote this cause it has been ignored and makes a very valid point.
It's a framing device. Most people don't care about things that don't concern them. If a white person sees some statistic about how hard it is to get a loan, more likely than not their eyes will gloss over. When that statistic is expressed in terms that are relatable, it's easier for white people to understand. You can tell how effective it is by the reaction: either understanding or outrage vs indifference. All that matters is whether white people are understaning of the hardships POC face or whether they become outraged that someone revealed to them that they live in a racist society.
I never said anything to the effect that I didn't believe things have gotten better over time.
What I am saying is that some people still don't understand the adversities of POC. Thus, it should be worth it to change your approach, since apparently, the previous approach wasn't working against those people.
I don't understand how you can logically say that it is devaluing their suffering. It's saying that if they were someone else, they would be suffering even more. It says nothing about the current extend of their suffering.
As I said before: You are most likely from a 1st world country. You know that you are privileged compared to people in 3rd world country. Does that make you feel like your success (or lack thereof?) devalued?
lol this won't help things
Absolutely.
If there are underprivileged people (and my browser isn't underlining that word in red), why do people deny that there are overprivileged people? (Notice how Firefox underlines that word because it doesn't exist in our dictionary).
Underprivileged people can only exist if there are Overprivileged people.
So, your logic is that people won't care if they hear a person of color is being discriminated, but when they're shown that they have it so great, they suddenly will?
And outrage and indifference show the INeffectiveness of this tactic, not the opposite.
soul creator
Member
"stop whining, bootstraps! raargh!" would probably be one response. So as mentioned, there's probably not any single way to approach this, and both ways should be seen as valid (since they're both true by pretty much every measurable sociological statistic in this context)
Anyone can be good at something if they have the skill, talent, patience, work ethic and opportunity to do so.
The problem is, there are many places where who you are and what you look like determines whether you get that opportunity in the first place.
That is the problem, and you are dismissing that a bit too hastily.
Red_Ragnarok
Banned
Because you are singling out whites as being privileged, and saying that society was built for whites. That would mean that Asians are also less privileged than whites since they are a minority. Therefore, they too would have problems with police harassment/becoming successful, etc.
"one of these things is not like the other" is a more direct and honest way of saying something. When you see a row of pristine Fords and there is a Ferrari among them, do you notice the anomaly or think about why alll of the other Fords are not Ferraris? Sugarcoating changes nothing.
Taking a cold hard truth; that is, that white people are born with advantages, especially in America, and packaging it the way you intend accomplishes nothing. It only distracts from the purity of the message. And that should be avoided in principle even IF there is a difference in effectiveness because who should give a shit if you can't handle the truth?
Right. When most white people hear about how hard it is to be black, they don't listen. When they hear about how easy it is to be white, they go hog wild.
Indifference is what happens when most white people listen to black people talk about the issues they face. Outrage means it's finally getting to them.
1) Saying that whites are privileged doesn't logically lead to the idea that every minority suffers in the same way.
2) Related to 1), Asians making a lot of money doesn't mean anything.
EDIT: Well, it means a lot of things, because money is important! But nothing related to the topic >.>
Perhaps some Asian members can speak of how society treats them. I don't know. I pay more attention to black issues (and hispanic issues, since they seem mostly the same.)
What is there to say? Straight white males have never been historically discriminated against in the U.S. I do agree that a false binary black and white framing can be harmful to dialogue.
JustProgress
Member
Lol, you do you just try to cram as many words into a sentence as possible?
On topic, sorry world.
As an asian applying to med school.... Stop complaining.
can't read a long sentence? find something better to post about.
If you weren't white, would you even be in a position to apply to med school?
I come from a family of doctors. I'm not white but I am South Asian, which has a large presence in the healthcare field. I knew growing up that I had a good chance to become a doctor, so that's what I focused on during school.
If I was born African American, chances are I would have no connections to the healthcare field and maybe never attend college.
I'm not saying your experiences have to be similar to mine, but it was a genuine question that I think you should answer.
JustProgress
Member
As an asian applying to med school.... Stop complaining.
can't read a long sentence? find something better to post about.
Yeah, I'll post about how some people are more privileged than I. That's a noble cause.
LaserBuddha
Member
No, this strange dichotomy isn't true. You can have underprivileged people in contrast to normally-privileged people. Which is what we seem to have, unless you think the proper situation is that everyone in the country should have it a bit worse than whites have it currently.
The "over-privileged" people I suppose would be the super-rich, or famous. On that note, money has a lot more to do with opportunity than race does, as well as fame, and (for the most part) attractiveness. Poor/middle class people of all races have a lot more in common with each other than poor/middle class white people have in common with rich white people. But anyway, all of those things are bigger privilege factors than race and yet this divisive and non-productive motto is what we're going with for some reason.
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