Freakinchair
Member
Finally 100% Arkham City. Maybe I'll be back to playing dota 2.
im batman
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Dota 2 Beta Thread 2: Real Talk Discouraged [Magnus, Teams, 6.75b, 150+ Shop Items]
- Thread starter Artanisix
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ur like a derp version of robin chair, always keepin wayne down but hes gotta deal with u cuz u were his nephew or some shit
na treant is really shitty man, like easily the most boring/worst designed hero in all of dota.
LoftyTheMetroid
Member
I think it will be like TB said, where developers will have to innovate with new mechanics and rethink the design from the ground up. Games like Blizzard All-Stars, as much of a "heathen" as it may be for deviating so much mechanically from Dota, will be considered "modest" among the types of games that would be unique enough to stand beside Dota 2 and succeed. We'll get more games like Super Monday Night Combat and Awesomenauts, and I think there's that potential space I mentioned for a new title to hit all the right buttons with competitive and casual players alike, and it will probably be built on the backs of all of these other products, iterating on their successes while throwing in its own innovations.
I say that, but I know many here will say, "Yeah, well, but those aren't DOTA/MOBA games, they don't even have top-down RTS controls/mechanics, let alone last hits, denying, etc.", and that's why I say the market is "locked down" since the definitions here tend to ensure Dota 2 is the only product capable of "owning" the market. But to me, I think this genre represents "Team-based competition involving character development, resource management, unit classes, and allied NPC combat", which gives plenty of room for the type of innovation that would allow the kinds of new games you mentioned to succeed.
(Wrote more than I expected to...)
To clarify, when I say "except under certain conditions and is not something that can be utilized in a widespread manner", I don't mean "Valve".
For example, Portal 2. I remember seeing cosmetic micro-transactions for emotes. I have no idea how well those sold, but I doubt it was enough to justify making the game F2P. (Of course, I have absolutely no sales figures to back this up, so maybe I'm completely wrong.)
I could write a whole blog post about this, but one of these "conditions" is some sort of multiplayer, or being able to "show off". This is I think why single-player games would not often make good cosmetic F2P games.
And even if every game in existence fulfilled these conditions, I'm not convinced the industry could sustain itself solely on this model. It works best in a case-by-case scenario, and depends on the game, budget, market, etc.
Treant is really only good in low tier games (which make up a large majority of overall games played, hence the winrate) where people don't know how to deal with invisibility, or are not aware how many items there are that just make treant's ult nearly useless. The higher level the game, the more aware people are how to counter treant's tricks. Buy them sentry wards, get that manta/bkb/diffusal and suddenly treant is never an issue.
I never followed the original Dota pro-scene--how good was DK? Were they winning tournaments? Just wondering, since a lot of people seem to think they will do really well in the International, but every match I have seen them play in Dota 2 has been them getting beat--pretty badly at times. Why is DK so hyped?
Treant is good in certain lineups (as are most heroes). His invisibility is his worst spell. It's his heal/slow and armor that allow your team massive diving power early and midgame. Sometimes my team uses him in scrims. Darer uses him here and there too. He's great for those timing pushes because a tree with mek gives your team so much midgame power.
Can you go further into this? I can see where he might be useful sometimes, yet I can't imagine ever picking a treant over something like an enchantress when it comes to towerdiving earlygame. Leech Seed lasts a couple measly seconds, and is dependent on the target living and your teammates staying close to the target to really heal much. His aura certainly isn't bad, but the things that irk me the most about treant are the STUPIDLY long fade time on his invis, his ult's horrendous scaling and the way playing him always feels so... Incredibly passive. What kind of lineups do you play him with? Night Stalker? :x
We usually run him in like so:
Windrunner long lane
Axe solo mid
Dark Seer jungle
Dazzle and Treant safe lane
Dazzle assists beating the enemy out of lane while stacking one of the camps for DS. DS does easy camp and stacks a hard camp. Treant maxes living armor first, allowing DS to easily jungle and giving Axe humongous lane presence during the first day.
Windrunner works towards a force staff and attempts to gain levels. Axe works towards vanguard, bottle, and his choice of boots. Dark Seer, with the help of Dazzle's jungle stacks, typically gets a 10-12 minute pipe. Treant has the safe lane and farms arcane boots + mek. Once these core items are up (generally around 15 minutes), we push straight into their rax.
We get massive diving and pushing power with Dazzle heal/grave/weave, Dark Seer pipe/vacuum/surge, and Treant aura/slow/root/mek. That's a ton of armor, heals, and teamfight power. 15 minutes into the game, enemy supports are still squishy and Axe's dot typically destroys them. Killing someone with culling blade gives us all a movement boost to dive even more. Throw up a wall on the tower, vacuum into call/root. Windrunner with her OP stun and long range damage.
It's a cheesy strat but has worked out really well for us.
We used to use Omni instead of Treant, but Tree works better for early game domination.
Windrunner long lane
Axe solo mid
Dark Seer jungle
Dazzle and Treant safe lane
Dazzle assists beating the enemy out of lane while stacking one of the camps for DS. DS does easy camp and stacks a hard camp. Treant maxes living armor first, allowing DS to easily jungle and giving Axe humongous lane presence during the first day.
Windrunner works towards a force staff and attempts to gain levels. Axe works towards vanguard, bottle, and his choice of boots. Dark Seer, with the help of Dazzle's jungle stacks, typically gets a 10-12 minute pipe. Treant has the safe lane and farms arcane boots + mek. Once these core items are up (generally around 15 minutes), we push straight into their rax.
We get massive diving and pushing power with Dazzle heal/grave/weave, Dark Seer pipe/vacuum/surge, and Treant aura/slow/root/mek. That's a ton of armor, heals, and teamfight power. 15 minutes into the game, enemy supports are still squishy and Axe's dot typically destroys them. Killing someone with culling blade gives us all a movement boost to dive even more. Throw up a wall on the tower, vacuum into call/root. Windrunner with her OP stun and long range damage.
It's a cheesy strat but has worked out really well for us.
We used to use Omni instead of Treant, but Tree works better for early game domination.
Lies. Why would anyone let you have DS?
Give them Lycan or Prophet in exchange.
Oooooh I finally got lucky for once in my life. Got an Unusual Enduring War Dog, with a white sunfire effect, never seen one before. The effect doesn't show well in screens but it's basically a white shining spotlight effect can shines down on the courier all the time.
BrLvgThrChmstry
Banned
Started playing jungling Axe. He is awesome. Love the whole blink in, aggro, tank aspect. Fun to play.
krameriffic
Member
I don't remember any team ever having success with the support Rubick, which mTw is again failing with.
They were the best team in the original dota for maybe the last 1.5 years, only recently going down (probably because of dota 2 practice) behind iG.
Was it a match reward or from a crate?
I actually got the summer crate from my friend who wasn't going to open them to begin with. So I got lucky twice xD.
Don't believe unsuals drop. Only from crates.
dorkimoe
Member
maybe, the crates turn into dust the 31st so make sure to open
Schweinehund
Member
59% win rate is too high to just blame on low skill games. Not saying he's some top tier hero but he isn't garbage, not by a long shot. BKB isn't a true hard counter to his ult, If a carry doesn't pop that bkb until after he uses his ult he could be eating a ton of spells...
I think he fits in most line ups and is easy to play is what contributes to his high win rate.
Procarbine
Forever Platinum
No skill in dota has an unlisted critical effect. Auto attacks can only crit after you get an item allowing you to do so, or have a passive skill that allows it.
Short answer: no, listed damage only.
Does not crit. Is a physical damage spell so will scale if the enemy has -armor.
Caught up on the Zenith versus WE series, and damn. Naga Siren really did act as kingmaker for whomever picked her up at times, and neither team on the opposing end really tried massing BKBs or picking up an Omniknight (this pick in particular could be very strong, as one could have magic immunity coverage on one key hero most of the time).
The dangerous thing about having magic immunity against Naga Siren though is that it allows Naga's team to completely focus on the magic-immune target without the enemy being able to respond. Don't forget that Naga's net goes through magic immunity, so your BKB'd hero is a sitting duck for Naga's gigantic physical damage output.
Thanks. I figured as much. I was kinda hoping it would be hilarious with a daedalus, after tobi mentioned dendi was rocking one on ES+totem for right click crit potential. I wasn't sure how counter helix worked.
What a shame haha.
While true, it's still a much better response than having the entire team slept and set up for something like a Ravage, Echoslam, or Epicenter. One hero not in the mess extends options, however slight, until the point where multiple heroes can farm up their own sources of magic immunity.
Schweinehund
Member
I've never fooled around with but I think medallion on axe would be interesting. Or pair axe up with dazzle/slardar. I don't think anything beats early soulring battle hunger spam in pubs though.
Yes its much better to have the fight start 4v5 and THEN get Ravaged.
If Naga was ever put in a position against an omni with repel being a nuisance she would just purge it anyways. I don't think omni is the right choice to counter her ultimate.
Doesn't his ultimate only block physical damage? So Naga's ult should go right through it.
Edit: Should have read everything. We're talking about him making someone magic immune and having him/her roam in Naga's ultimate. Carry on.
Taking all your summer crates!! Let me know if you want anything from my backpack.
http://steamcommunity.com/id/KristenBell/inventory/
http://steamcommunity.com/id/KristenBell/inventory/
Schweinehund
Member
I have two summer crates.
Interested in kunkka peg leg/pirate hat
I have some duplicates if you want to sweeten the pot.
http://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561197961739174/inventory/
Added you.
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