SquiddyCracker
Banned
I could have made it a lot more biased if I wanted it to.
Went ahead and edited out nation-specific issues and some issues that aren't widely recognized.
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Men rights and issues
- Thread starter SquiddyCracker
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I could have made it a lot more biased if I wanted it to.
Went ahead and edited out nation-specific issues and some issues that aren't widely recognized.
It's not though.
If the woman has one drop of alcohol she is legally entitled to claim that she was raped, without recourse.
It's the only fair way to do it. If she had a drink, keep it zipped up boys.
Devolution
Member
So would it not be better to instead focus on ways that might encourage the false claim to begin with? Or on other issues that can be resolved? Like family court laws that still harbor benevolent sexism or getting more perks for fathers and mothers when it comes to work leave?
I've heard some real horror stories of dudes getting fucked over in divorce. That is something that should definitely be looked at.
But I feel like that would just be a part of reforming the way divorce is handled in general. Like, do we really need a men's rights movement to do that?
Is the collective voice of men in the world really not being heard?
But I feel like that would just be a part of reforming the way divorce is handled in general. Like, do we really need a men's rights movement to do that?
Is the collective voice of men in the world really not being heard?
It's always useful to try to consider how your own privilege and biases might affect your opinions, but "until I realized who agreed with me" is a textbook ad hominem fallacy.
He definitely has issues.Real men don't have issues.
No issues here.
Biased threads are the best threads.
D
Deleted member 47027
Unconfirmed Member
Everyone should want equality, I agree with you.
DUFFMCWALIN
Member
Sure. Idk I'm leaving now. I feel a ban coming on. And I'm at work. Maybe I'll jump in again later when I do some more research and thinking.
SpeedingUptoStop
will totally Facebook friend you! *giggle* *LOL*
Yea, this place isn't reddit and I don't want it to become reddit, thanks.
Fenderputty
Banned
Divorce laws in Cali are a little wonky, but I've never understood the whole movment. Being born a white male in the states is like winning the lottery on a global scale.
Steve Youngblood
Member
There are two issues at play. One is that going out of our way to address this as a problem worthy of high concern carries with it the implication that we need to be very skeptical of rape claims for fear that this is another person lying to ruin a man's reputation. It necessarily follows that women should feel pressured not to step forward unless they've got solid evidence to present, lest they be regarded as yet another person lying for whatever reason.
The other is that it's often presented as a unique situation that has slipped through the cracks. There are laws on the book about libel, slander, defamation of character, etc., and if sworn testimony is offered, perjury exists as a a punishable offense. False rape charges aren't some unique class of accusation that you can make against someone without fear of repercussions, as some seem to think.
Aside from that, there's nothing inherently wrong with suggesting that a false accusation of rape is a bad thing. However, many feel that it's not a particularly strong threat relative to actual rape that merits special inquiry into how to fix it and consequently increased scrutiny of reporting rape.
D
Deleted member 47027
Unconfirmed Member
I can tell you I'm more self-conscious than I ever used to be in the past 10 years about the perception of being around children. And I hate kids - I can't stand the little assholes, and I wish I'd never see them - but that being said, I feel like I can't look at one and smile if it does something entertaining or says something funny. I just know I'm under a stupid, stupid amount of scrutiny now.
Kano on the Phone
Member
This doesn't actually happen, don't be silly.
The latter is an argument that can be made but fucking certainly not an issue that needs a movement behind it considering our justice system is male by a giant majority.
Liu Kang Baking A Pie
Member
As others have been saying, it's playing life on Easy mode.
In an effort to save this thread (because there are some interesting debates to be had), I would like to bring up the following discussion topic.
I've read that in the US, divorce alimony law has an unfair bias towards the woman. There are tons of 'alimony nightmare' stories out there on the internet, several alimony reform groups, ...
Do people here agree with that assertion?
I've read that in the US, divorce alimony law has an unfair bias towards the woman. There are tons of 'alimony nightmare' stories out there on the internet, several alimony reform groups, ...
Do people here agree with that assertion?
Real men don't have issues.
No issues here.
No issues here.
No issues here.
I don't get it. Fictional people don't have real problems?
Yes, it's a men's rights issue. Several news reports are coming out now about men being treated unfairly in airplanes just because they're sitting next to unoccupied kids. The assumption is "you might be a pedophile, so move."
Liu Kang Baking A Pie
Member
Are you sure you got my point?
People try to paint feminism as an enemy of men when we're really all in it together. Men just get defensive because we're generally idiots and can't listen.
I feel like it is an issue. I think its really sad that men can't work with children in any sort of teaching/mentoring position without being treated with a certain level of suspicion, for example. But what can be done about that?
TUROK
Member
There is no collective voice of men that tries to rectify the imbalance between the sexes. These MRA groups are trying to be that collective voice, but since most of them just focus on men's issues, they're just as bad as the Feminist groups who claim to be for the equality of both sexes, but just focus on the issues that plague women.
About 2 weeks ago at my kids school they had the police come and watch the gates and stuff. The reason? Some suspicious guy was standing under the tree looking at the kids. Turns out he was a dad there to pick up his kid when the wife couldn't get off at work. Nice.
TheNatural
My Member!
Ironhead Haynes' Nine Commandments:
1. It's okay to call hooters "knockers" and sometimes "snack trays."
2. It is wrong to be French.
3. It's okay to put all bad people in a giant meat grinder.
4. Lawyers: see rule three.
5. It is okay to drive a gas guzzler if it helps you get babes.
6. Everyone should car pool but me.
7. Bring back the word "stewardesses"
8. Synchronized Swimming is not a sport.
9. Mudwrestling is a sport.
These are the issues that either affected me or people very close to me.
Several others I feel like there's an immediate need to address them.
I think the problem is that it's always framed as a fight of men vs. women. People should realize that there are problems on both sides, and they all need to be addressed. The fact that I hate how almost all of these issues are being handled doesn't mean that I think that feminists don't have a point sometimes too. It shouldn't be "Now it's our turn".
Devolution
Member
Well many of the laws were written at a time in which women were the general caretaker and sacrificed their careers to stay at home. So all of that time they could have spent working and advancing and making money for themselves was put on hold. So in a divorce they would essentially take the kids and care for them, like they had done previously, while the man would be the "check." Different houses, essentially the same roles. It's only recently that many women work and balance care taking instead of just staying home. In a lot of cases though women still bear the brunt of being the one to sacrifice their career to take care of the children, also known as the "housewife." So the laws haven't had much reason to change nor have they been successfully lobbied by fathers/men who want to see them change. As much as some men find them unfair, plenty of men would rather work and have someone else take care of their kids. So this problem remains.
Kano on the Phone
Member
Oh shit, well that thing happened once, better start a movement.
my sentiments as well. A whole movement for a people are mostly priveledged relative to the other gender doesn't seem right. I say tackle each issue, a whole movement seems to to undermine those who are truly disenfranchised or oppressed.
In Pakistan, a woman needs to have 4 male witnesses before she can prove a rape.
In America, a woman needs nothing but her word to prove a man has domestically assaulted her (source: http://www.avoiceformen.com/feminism/feminist-governance-feminism/vawa-and-the-war-on-men/)
Both are unjust.
Shao Kahn Going Shopping
Banned
Of course. But you'll have plenty of other people saying "nope! We have problems too!" while they sit back and enjoy their privilege.
ColonelColon
Member
It may be anti-feminism, but opposing some aspects of feminism doesn't make you a misogynist.
Karsticles
Member
Oh, it's definitely true. I've dealt with too many divorcees to not know it.
Indeed.
and plenty would not
Kano on the Phone
Member
Yes, this is exactly it. The winning team doesn't need any more help. No sane person starts a petition to give the winning team in the Super Bowl a higher draft pick because they lost a few games during the season.
SquiddyCracker
Banned
I think the argument goes that that a housewife who went into the relationship assuming that the breadwinner would take care of her financials might end up with no means to support herself (or himself, though I don't know how alimony laws work when the woman is the breadwinner) in a divorce.
I don't know how these things work but my thoughts:
Alimony shouldn't be indefinite, only long enough for the woman to either support herself or gain the ability to support herself (say should she need to get back into education).
No alimony if the partner has an income that is at least minimum wage. Or perhaps a reduced/finite length alimony in order for the partner to get used to their own income.
Devolution
Member
Then those that do not need to lobby for change. Simple as that.
People who moan about alimony should hook up with people who work or write up pre-nuptials. It goes both ways. It adversely affects men more right now since they are typically the breadwinners.
Ein Soph Aur
Member
Oh and shit like this:
Is that real?
cutmeamango
Banned
Young McClane doesn't.
Wow, if you think they are fictional you have some real problems.
Shao Kahn Going Shopping
Banned
Oh come on, that's meant to be humorous, there's nothing insulting about it. Except if you actually buy it, I guess.
I think you should be able to sign some form at the courthouse with your SO or whatever random girl you sleep with, where you both agree to an abortion if she get's pregnant, and absolving the male of parental responsibility if she changes her mind. A verbal contract should also work in this instance, but would probably be incredibly hard to prove.
Just some sort of legal framework for responsibly getting out of having a child that neither of you originally wanted.
Just some sort of legal framework for responsibly getting out of having a child that neither of you originally wanted.
TUROK
Member
This line of reasoning is so fucked up. Are men and women now competing against each other in a battle of civil rights?
Devolution
Member
Well you know what a great way to help this along is? Making abortions more available (there are some states without clinics and ridiculous laws) and not so demonized. Oh hark a feminist issue that also helps men who don't want children.
Vermillion
Banned
All I can think of are:
- Assumed to be paedophiles
- Less bearing(?) in custody hearings
This too. How many people would go to the courthouse for the random girl, though?
- Assumed to be paedophiles
- Less bearing(?) in custody hearings
This too. How many people would go to the courthouse for the random girl, though?
I agree except verbal would never work.
I think there needs to be something with the birth certificate. something like "You have been designated as the father for this child you have 30 days to contest and absolve your parental rights." blah blah blah.
Liu Kang Baking A Pie
Member
Yes. Why do you think politicians, who are mostly white Christian males, give so much of a shit about abortion, birth control, and pre-marital sex?
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