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Dota 2 Beta Thread 2: Real Talk Discouraged [Magnus, Teams, 6.75b, 150+ Shop Items]

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But a shitty mid can lose the game quickly. So if you dont have the basics down, dont try mid >.<

The thing is, even the best solo mid players lose their lanes sometimes. There are just match-ups in mid that suck for your hero. For example, if you're playing Lion, good luck against a TA. If the TA player is smart he'll just block all your spells with Refraction and harass you with the spill damage from Psi Blades. Once he's level 6, you can die really quickly when he puts a trap under your feet and just goes for you.
 
I don't know why, but after having the beta for a while, I finally caught the Dota bug bad. I've been playing a bunch of single draft, and it's pretty fun, even if it feels like half my games have someone DC'ing within the first ten minutes. It encourages me to try out a lot of different heroes.

I like playing support types. As someone who tends to blame themselves a lot, being support makes me feel less culpable. If I'm a carry, I have a bad habit of walking too deep into fights and dying too fast. But I like champs who are evasive and elusive. Weaver was fun to play, and I find Puck's complexity really intriguing.

If there are some low-level people who play around now, I'd be interested in joining up with people every now and then.

EDIT: How do I get rid of chests? Especially International ones.

You can delete chests but without a chance to find an item. Could I have your international chests if you're getting rid of them, I have keys that I've been itching to use.
 
I believe I have an international chest or two if interested. I have no idea how to trade in this game and never plan to buy keys so if you can enlighten me how to get them to you they are yours. I may only have one though.
 
Buy keys. Worst case is trade for an item (sometimes they give multi-ple). If you want to trade for keys you need like 4 or more for 1 key. Or give me (especially if drow)


So people, how are you suppose to play middle?

The two heroes I know how to mid with are Viper and Tinker. Viper as a counter to whatever carry they're likely to send mid because of his incredible early game damage output that allows him to seriously harass and even gank. Tinker because he needs the farm and he needs easy access to both runes for bottle refilling and survivability.
 
If losing mid, ask the sidelaners to help gank before mid snowballs and if they don't, blame team for sucking and move to next game and claim mid SF, ez.

Hard to pull in a pub game. Any time I've seen someone ask for a gank mid they're just like "wtf you're mid you should be ganking." Apparently mid lane never needs ganks.
 
Solo mid is probably one of the hardest roles in the game to play well, for a few reasons. You need the last hitting skills of a carry, but you can't rely on a support to help you out against ganks. You also need good map awareness so you don't get ganked. You also have to be good at controlling the lane creeps. (maintaining creep equilibrium, pushing the lane when necessary, anti-pushing etc.) As a carry, you just need to keep the lane in one place, as a mid player, you need to push the lane shortly before a rune spawns so you don't lose XP and gold when going for the rune or anti-push the lane when you mess up your block.

It's often also not easy to know when to go for a gank. On some hereos it's very easy to gank and quite obvious when you should gank (e.g. Nightstalker, Beastmaster, Pudge). On others you're better off farming or only ganking with a rune (Tinker, Morphling, Drow Ranger). Something I think not a lot of people keep in mind is that kills don't give that much money, usually. Unless it's first blood or you get a tower as a byproduct of your kill (or you get more than one kill), you get around 200-300 gold, plus some for your assisting team mates. If you're farming well, you're gonna be at around 300 GPM in the laning phase (or more). That means that unless you get a kill in less than a minute, you will get more farm by just sitting in lane. That excludes, of course, the fact that killing someone will set him back in farm, will help your teammates win the lane and make the enemies more afraid to be aggressive. Still, you should keep in mind that even a successful gank on one person is not that cost effective for you alone. That is especially important for heroes who desperately need gold and can't gank that well, like Tinker (when doing a March build. With 4 levels on Laser/Rocket you can gank pretty well) or Morphling.
 
Got the rare Jugg mask of one zillion eyes or whatever from the international crates. I don't want it. Where can I go to see what I can trade it for?
 
Here's a game where I do terrible mid (barely any cs) but still end up succeeding because of rune control and ganking other lanes:

34887479

Some heroes can get away with just having boots/bottle by level 6. Just don't give your lane opponent first blood, and you should do fine. Also your starting item lineup can make a huge difference. Stout Shield is insanely good on melee vs. range, you usually won't need quelling blade to out last hit them. You would want quelling blade on melee if you're laning against another melee, or if you're fighting a prophet.
 
tbh mid is my favorite lane because i usually don't get gangbanged by 2-3 heroes (like in laning), i don't have to support no one, and i dont have to rely on a support that just sits at the tower sappin my exp. mid is just good ol 1v1 (unless ur milkman, then u get a nice 5v1 at the start ez).

for me the most important aspect is rune control; some heroes just make it impossible or ez for you to do this, but for the most part when it comes cloes to 2,4,6,8 minutes, you should always push the lane hard so you can nab that sexy haste to destroy the sidelanes. also mistake a lot of people make (and i used to in hon), is not using an ounce of mana. You should never be at full mana while mid, you need to constantly harass the other guy to make him scared to last hit, and eventually get the kill when he runs up with 50% hp.
 
but gaf lanes are never shitty. perfect game imo:

1) super sanjay dark seer solo bot
2) neki potm solo top
3) thorinbei jungle brood
4) pillow roaming support bh
5) milkman invoker mid

ez game is ez
 
Solo mid is probably one of the hardest roles in the game to play well, for a few reasons. You need the last hitting skills of a carry, but you can't rely on a support to help you out against ganks. You also need good map awareness so you don't get ganked. You also have to be good at controlling the lane creeps. (maintaining creep equilibrium, pushing the lane when necessary, anti-pushing etc.) As a carry, you just need to keep the lane in one place, as a mid player, you need to push the lane shortly before a rune spawns so you don't lose XP and gold when going for the rune or anti-push the lane when you mess up your block.

It's often also not easy to know when to go for a gank. On some hereos it's very easy to gank and quite obvious when you should gank (e.g. Nightstalker, Beastmaster, Pudge). On others you're better off farming or only ganking with a rune (Tinker, Morphling, Drow Ranger). Something I think not a lot of people keep in mind is that kills don't give that much money, usually. Unless it's first blood or you get a tower as a byproduct of your kill (or you get more than one kill), you get around 200-300 gold, plus some for your assisting team mates. If you're farming well, you're gonna be at around 300 GPM in the laning phase (or more). That means that unless you get a kill in less than a minute, you will get more farm by just sitting in lane. That excludes, of course, the fact that killing someone will set him back in farm, will help your teammates win the lane and make the enemies more afraid to be aggressive. Still, you should keep in mind that even a successful gank on one person is not that cost effective for you alone. That is especially important for heroes who desperately need gold and can't gank that well, like Tinker (when doing a March build. With 4 levels on Laser/Rocket you can gank pretty well) or Morphling.

Agreed, been noticing this myself lately. I'm mostly a mid player, and lately I'm like.. I got this kill, but I could have had more gold staying at mid..

Been playing some bot games on insane to see how that goes, and I went like 25 kills 3/4 deaths or something, my gold wasn't even that high and my items weren't that big because of that. (I was Pudge, so I just went for kills all the time to get more points on flesh heap). That's when I really noticed kills don't really give you that much, it's basically 1 creep wave unless it's first blood or the hero you kill has a streak going on.
 
Ganking as mid lets you do a few things:
1) Give your carries room to farm
2) Suppress their carries
3) Snowball, if your ganking is frequent and consistent. Not all heroes snowball in the same way but some just go out of control with some early kills. TA, NS, Storm immediately come to mind. SF as well, even if he's not much of a ganker.

Remember that you're not just getting money from kills, you're also forcing them to lose money (in most cases).
 
If losing mid, ask the sidelaners to help gank before mid snowballs and if they don't, blame team for sucking and move to next game and claim mid SF, ez.
I have a strange feeling that this doesn't work out that well for you.
Agreed, been noticing this myself lately. I'm mostly a mid player, and lately I'm like.. I got this kill, but I could have had more gold staying at mid..
You're supposed to find a balance between ganking and farming, finding the appropriate opportunities to go to a lane and attempt a gank ( Proper Runes for example ), if the lanes are doing well enough then just farm.

But remember winning 2/3 lanes handily is far better then possibly winning / breaking even in 3, which is what successful ganks will do for you.

Someone please Steam message Moodyshuffle and tell him to reply to my PM
 
Feeding mid by dying 4 times before 15 mins, not calling out miss so mid can get a few ganks.... Its all basic stuff you learn in any lane. Nothing to do with learning mid.

My problem is people who call it before picking, with other viable mid chars on the team, and then suck. In a pub, early losses can snowball easy, people give up, start playing stupider if they think its a loss already... Etc.
 
Solo mid is probably one of the hardest roles in the game to play well, for a few reasons. You need the last hitting skills of a carry, but you can't rely on a support to help you out against ganks. You also need good map awareness so you don't get ganked. You also have to be good at controlling the lane creeps. (maintaining creep equilibrium, pushing the lane when necessary, anti-pushing etc.) As a carry, you just need to keep the lane in one place, as a mid player, you need to push the lane shortly before a rune spawns so you don't lose XP and gold when going for the rune or anti-push the lane when you mess up your block.

It's often also not easy to know when to go for a gank. On some hereos it's very easy to gank and quite obvious when you should gank (e.g. Nightstalker, Beastmaster, Pudge). On others you're better off farming or only ganking with a rune (Tinker, Morphling, Drow Ranger). Something I think not a lot of people keep in mind is that kills don't give that much money, usually. Unless it's first blood or you get a tower as a byproduct of your kill (or you get more than one kill), you get around 200-300 gold, plus some for your assisting team mates. If you're farming well, you're gonna be at around 300 GPM in the laning phase (or more). That means that unless you get a kill in less than a minute, you will get more farm by just sitting in lane. That excludes, of course, the fact that killing someone will set him back in farm, will help your teammates win the lane and make the enemies more afraid to be aggressive. Still, you should keep in mind that even a successful gank on one person is not that cost effective for you alone. That is especially important for heroes who desperately need gold and can't gank that well, like Tinker (when doing a March build. With 4 levels on Laser/Rocket you can gank pretty well) or Morphling.

Basically ganking for the sake of kills isn't useful. It's what the gank allows the rest of the team to do that's more important (farming room/take a tower/initiate a team fight etc..).
 
~30 meg patch just hit. Probably has some the Darer/MTW flags and some other goodies.

Does anyone else hope Valve releases a new promotional video for TI2?
 

Some of the records stuff for me is wrong....IE my highest kills according to the site is 14 with OD but I've had 20+ kills games with Viper...

Also, I wish they'd incorporate overall damage like how dota2dmg does it for matches. It's always good to see how much damage you're doing in a given match (sometimes a hero maybe doing the majority of punishing but just not getting the last hits to register a kill).
 
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