Good post.
Give me one advantage "always online" brings
- Thread starter Dibbz
- Start date
hope u were joking
I would argue that the *online* version of Demon's Souls adds sufficient extra features that it's a *markedly* different experience from the *offline* version. Sure, you can choose to play it offline, but you're not getting the same game as a result.
Hypothetical example: Imagine a version of World of Warcraft that could be played offline, but made absolutely no balancing concessions to make that enjoyable; it's exactly the same as the online version, just you're the only guy in the world. Would it be worth allowing people to play that? They're getting a markedly inferior game.
Of course, this is in no way presenting 'always online' as therefore *always* correct, just that - as I've said elsewhere - I firmly believe that it's quite possible to make a game that requires online to be enjoyable.
Edit: Oh, in terms of hardware? Increased revenue for developers, one would have to assume; through ads, through increased security, easier to sell microtransactions. How does that affect the consumer? I would expect it to have an effect on game budgets. If you *like* huge-budget games, this gives more security to encourage developers to keep making them. For that bracket of consumers, there would be an advantage there.
Hypothetical example: Imagine a version of World of Warcraft that could be played offline, but made absolutely no balancing concessions to make that enjoyable; it's exactly the same as the online version, just you're the only guy in the world. Would it be worth allowing people to play that? They're getting a markedly inferior game.
Of course, this is in no way presenting 'always online' as therefore *always* correct, just that - as I've said elsewhere - I firmly believe that it's quite possible to make a game that requires online to be enjoyable.
Edit: Oh, in terms of hardware? Increased revenue for developers, one would have to assume; through ads, through increased security, easier to sell microtransactions. How does that affect the consumer? I would expect it to have an effect on game budgets. If you *like* huge-budget games, this gives more security to encourage developers to keep making them. For that bracket of consumers, there would be an advantage there.
Those revenue streams already exist. People that are online now will be online with always online. People that are offline now will be offline then.
This can all be done with the current online/offline system.
I understand. I just wanted to highlight it for everyone else.
Uhhhh...
Remote access to system for services and multi-media content.
Protection against hacked consoles where players are cheesing/cheating in games.
Live streaming of multiplayer games featuring your friends.
That's all I got.
The idea of an always connected machine doesn't completely scare me, it's the added factor of the required Kinect camera being paired with an online system... way too big brother for me.
M$ can go jump, Sony too possibly. In the chase for social connectivity, privacy doesn't seem to be a concern at all for these companies.
Remote access to system for services and multi-media content.
Protection against hacked consoles where players are cheesing/cheating in games.
Live streaming of multiplayer games featuring your friends.
That's all I got.
The idea of an always connected machine doesn't completely scare me, it's the added factor of the required Kinect camera being paired with an online system... way too big brother for me.
M$ can go jump, Sony too possibly. In the chase for social connectivity, privacy doesn't seem to be a concern at all for these companies.
Oppo
Member
bigdaddygamebot
Member
In theory...if it does away with software piracy on consoles and publishers no longer have to be concerned about it. Then in essence they are making more money...or losing less money. (although I doubt it. Most people that pirate have little intention of buying the game to begin with)
So...maybe games will no longer be $50 or $60?
yeah...I won't hold my breath.
SenjutsuSage
Banned
Standards for always being connected must automatically be raised to a higher level compared to when it was just optional, thus leading to a better connected experience. Because now everybody will be experiencing it and connecting to it, not just some. Knowing this, content providers will have to step up their game.
So what you want is a version of Demon Souls that can only be played online? That means everyone who plays it offline would no longer be able to play it and people that play it online, well nothing would change because they can already do that.
cpp_is_king
Member
Some, not all. People that are offline now because they don't have internet will definitely be offline then. People that are offline now because they aren't required to be online now - some of them will stay offline by not buying the console, and some of them won't. I would wager that most won't. Unless it's possible to play PS4 without ever connecting to the internet, in which case maybe you're right. But even then, many of the currently offline people will just go online because they don't really care.
So your saying if I go online now I cannot do the above? I have to be forced to be always 24/7 online to do those?
I think you need to try a little harder.
Maybe in the future, toasts will have to be online and you will not be able to sell them to someone else.
Oppo
Member
The only distinct disadvantage I can think of is basically patching.
If you keep your console totally offline, every so often you'll get hit with a disc-based update that ships with a game, and you would presumably have to sit through that process before playing.
That's the only thing I can think of.
If you keep your console totally offline, every so often you'll get hit with a disc-based update that ships with a game, and you would presumably have to sit through that process before playing.
That's the only thing I can think of.
IonicSnake
Banned
We get awesome ShuniLegend gifs?
Grinchy
Banned
I'm going to be pissed if I can no longer sell my toast.
someguyinahat
Member
The advantage is you know right away what not to buy.
The problem is that the thread title is "always online" and how it can be interpreted (and is by plenty) as everything that can be achieved when the device is connected to the internet.
What the OP is asking is 'Give me one advantage of required "always online" brings' or alternatively "online-only".
Everything that can be done with the current system where the base game (unless it's multiplayer only) can be played offline with enhanced features available when you have an internet connection can't be used in this thread.
What the OP is asking is 'Give me one advantage of required "always online" brings' or alternatively "online-only".
Everything that can be done with the current system where the base game (unless it's multiplayer only) can be played offline with enhanced features available when you have an internet connection can't be used in this thread.
Wonder if I can just throw a blanket over Kinect...
Oppo
Member
depends on how good the mics are
ShockingAlberto
Member
Would be pretty funny if the game stopped and took you to Kinect calibration.
Silly.Mikey
Banned
Like i said in the other thread:
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=52702356&postcount=1759
That would be amazing and isn't possible with the current systems that dont stay online when off (or idle). But i do agree that the 3 minute thing is pushing it. Theres no need for that and im not entirely convinced that it would stay that way for very long.
Mavromatis
Member
Building a huge botnet using the exploits of the console, because there will be a exploit and someone will use it to build something malicious. I'm not saying Skynet but I might be implying it.
Seriously, that will be the worst botnet. You can't disable it since consoles wouldn't be accessing central server anymore, and you can't offline patch it because, there is no offline. Unless they put some offline option for that possibility but then they'll exploit that to make the whole thing offline capable.
I would be really disappointed that such botnet doesn't appear after the release of an always online console.
Exactly so people pointing to Demon Souls or Burnout are totally misunderstanding what Always Online is and how it is different from the current offline/online system we currently have.
Is already done on PS3. PS+ automatically turns on your console at a set time you configure and will update and install any patches and will upload your save files to the cloud.
Also regarding the standby online mode. That could also be done with the current offline/online system.
What you describe in your linked post will be possible with the PS4 and the PS4 will also be playable offline.
There is no reason why Durango also can't have the benefits without the restriction.
Imagine they both do it, while the PS4 allows you to play offline and Durango forces you to be online.
All your games updated in the background with the newest patches and it even downloaded these 1 Hour trials that you now get for games you've watched trailers of.
You get home but your Internet is down.
PS4: You play the patched games and trials it has downloaded.
Durango: You play your PS4.
I need to emphasise that I'm not knowledgable enough about Demon Souls specifically to be certain it's entirely what I'm talking about, I'm just trying to emphasise that a game *could* exist where this *could* be the case:
No, I'm saying that there is already a version of Demon Souls that can only be played online: It's the online version of Demon Souls. I'm saying that the gameplay differences are great enough that the offline version is not the same game. There are two games in that package, two different games formed from the same base. One of them requires online, the other does not.
In the World of Warcraft example, playing offline - while functionally correct - takes out the very essence of the game.
Sometimes, you just need other players, and playing solo ain't the same - even if it's not explicitly a multiplayer game. The true Demon Souls, as they say, starts here.
(Another game where the offline experience is markedly different: Journey)
MrNyarlathotep
Banned
What you describe as some insane future of connectivity was available on the fucking wii
EDIT: of course, so was games working without an internet connection. OLD TECH DUCT TAPED TOGETHER
Silly.Mikey
Banned
Yes and the wii was idle not off was it not? So in a way, it was also "always online".
Is your argument that Demon's Souls would be better if it was only one game?
I've read your post twice but I still don't understand what your argument is. Demon's Souls already exists with the current offline/online system so it can't be used as an argument for why a required Internet connection for everything is needed.
To repeat: What is the advantage of having a required Internet connection as opposed to the optional Internet connection that current systems operate under.
MrNyarlathotep
Banned
The 360 is idle when 'off'. The PS3 is idle when 'off'.
Neither lose access to the primary functionality of the damn machine if for any reason any of the datahops between your house and the big brother authentication server fail to respond.
Listen, I get where you are coming from but you are essentially saying a game designed with multiplayer in mind is better played in multiplayer. That's a no brainer.
My point is though, whilst maybe it is not ideal to play certain games on your own eg. co-op games, sometimes you don't have a choice if there servers are down for maintenance or something. Right now you have the option to go offline if you run into a situation like that.
There are no advantages, only downsides.
What looks like is going to be forced on us though is, that option to be taken away from us. So if the servers run into trouble we are screwed. Essentially every game becomes a multiplayer game even if it's a singleplayer because you are forced to connect online.
Funnier if it took 3 minutes to do so!
How do you get the experience of a player invading your game offline?
And I'm saying that allowing developers the freedom to *always* design with the understanding that multiplayer is an option - even for players who are playing what they believe is a single-player experience - frees them up to be more creative.
I'm not trying to present this as necessarily a perfect situation in any regard - it comes with significant costs that should be taken into consideration - but it is an absolute advantage.
BigDaddyFatSack
Banned
Hackers magically disappear?
Silly.Mikey
Banned
I still have a lot of trouble believing that MS will completely stop you from playing if your internet goes down. Its incredibly dumb. It makes Windows 8 look like a work of genius. Id be really shocked if this happened.
MrNyarlathotep
Banned
What the hell do you think is upsetting people about these rumours? They state exactly that.
Do you think people on a gaming forum who regularly play games online have suddenly decided they don't like playing games online any more or something?
Being online is not the same as "always online"
Silly.Mikey
Banned
I think critical info is missing which is entirely possible with it still being unofficial and all.
MrNyarlathotep
Banned
That's the point of this topic; what possible feature could ever justify a mandatory always online requirement at a system level for all games irrespective of their need for online features.
You don't get that experience.
You're just arguing for multiplayer, which this topic is not about. It's about arguments for required internet connections.
When your arguments revolve around seamless online systems that already exist, you haven't made a good argument. What already exist doesn't require something new. What doesn't yet exist might require something new. You've not presented such an idea.
Can be done with the Sony Bluray redemption patent.
That's what "always online" is. No connection, no game.
That is not an advantage. There are thousands of games out there that are multiplayer only already and have been for decades.
Silly.Mikey
Banned
None than i can think of, other than piracy. Actually now that i think of it, im pretty sure i couldn't play NHL13 alone when the servers were offline. EA is already doing it.
I can already digitally download thousands of games right now. I do not need to be connected 24/7 to do that.