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[Fourth Storm]

Why do people say this? He's just Iwata's puppet.

Reggie: "Mr. Iwata, I've done some market research and it seems American gamers want a system with competitive graphics, a unified online infrastructure, and Western third party support. What do yah say?"

Iwata: (laughs)
Miyamoto: "I've always wanted a screen on my controller."

 

[soulassssns]

Dat worse company in America.

 

[OrangeJulius]

The posts in this page, after yours. You're not even trying :/

Again, I haven't read any post that didn't quote me directly. I'm only engaging those that engage me for the most part, otherwise I feel like I'm talking to a brick wall. I'm not going back, so if you want to repost them for me to read then I gladly will.

Edit: Ok, wait, I see your post now, give me a minute.

 

[Margalis]

He actually said only Mario and Zelda make money on Nintendo systems...hmmm...

A lot of developers put out bad games or games with no market, they don't sell, then instead of analyzing why they didn't sell they just shrug and blame Mario. Then, because they're convinced that only Mario sells, when they do make games they just mail them in.

Maybe this was one of the guys who thought Facebreaker was going to create a new EA Sports Casual and had his dreams crushed.

Ubisoft to some degree has Nintendo systems figured out - make high quality games and games people want to play. ZombiU probably sold more than every EA game combined.

 

[Projectjustice]

Why does it matter what I prefer? Did you read the post? We are not the core market. I'm not going back and forth on anything, i've stated my preference. What I like isn't what sells and makes money.

Everyone else seems to handle replying to your ridiculous post just fine. I dont need to add salt the wound.

 

[frankie_baby]

People either say he's a puppet or he's not a puppet.
If he wasn't a puppet, why can't he bring games over?
Why can't he offer us the same level of courtesy gamers in Japan get?

It's either he's a failed president, or a puppet, pick one.

I don't think he's a puppet at all, I'd say most of the non localisations are down to him, he claimed responsibility for disaster not making it to the states

 

[Deguello]

Again, I haven't read any post that didn't quote me directly. I'm only engaging those that engage me for the most part, otherwise I feel like I'm talking to a brick wall. I'm not going back, so if you want to repost them for me to read then I gladly will.

"I promise I won't ignore them this time?"

 

[Rehynn]

Again, I haven't read any post that didn't quote me directly. I'm only engaging those that engage me for the most part, otherwise I feel like I'm talking to a brick wall. I'm not going back, so if you want to repost them for me to read then I gladly will.

All of us quoted you directly. It's on the previous page. But I also collected the replies in my previous post.

 

[Brera]

Reggie is shit because even NOE do a great job!

NOE...think about that! Less resources, 3rd leg of Nintendo etc and still they localise great games with good translations!

 

[RM8]

Again, I haven't read any post that didn't quote me directly. I'm only engaging those that engage me for the most part, otherwise I feel like I'm talking to a brick wall. I'm not going back, so if you want to repost them for me to read then I gladly will.

They were posted for you on last page. Plus I directly quoted you when responding to your statement anyway.

 

[Dave Meltzer]

He actually said only Mario and Zelda make money on Nintendo systems...hmmm...

A lot of developers put out bad games or games with no market, they don't sell, then instead of analyzing why they didn't sell they just shrug and blame Mario. Then, because they're convinced that only Mario sells, when they do make games they just mail them in.

Maybe this was one of the guys who thought Facebreaker was going to create a new EA Sports Casual and had his dreams crushed.

Ubisoft to some degree has Nintendo systems figured out - make high quality games and games people want to play. ZombiU probably sold more than every EA game combined.

Zombie U got a pack in and promotion from nintendo. The only reason it was successful is because Nintendo positioned it to be accepted by their dedicated audience.

 

[jello44]

That is a long ass gif.

And worth every minute.

 

[TreasureHunterG]

But to advertise them for the platform a developer would already have had to commit to the resources required. They need to make a business investment, what Nintendo need to do is to provide a less financially risky proposition for developers. The industry isn't charitable.

Wii U isn't in a situation to play it safe, it's all or nothing now. If Nintendo still have a little hope to make the machine successful, they need to take the risks.

 

[Camp Lo]

Why is it bullshit? Discuss. Don't just post hit and run three word sentences to start shit and then bail out.

There's no hit and run here. You have a sleuth of people willing to go toe to toe on "is graphics > gameplay". To me, the Wii makes your argument completely moot. There's so much in this thread to have that discussion here, to me anyways.

 

[ASIS]

Reggie is shit because even NOE do a great job!

NOE...think about that! Less resources, 3rd leg of Nintendo etc and still they localise great games with good translations!

I never, ever, imagined I would ever agree with Brera on anything Nintendo. But this is honestly true. NOA dropped the ball pretty hard circa 2010 till now.


I can't even.... Me, agreeing with you, Just....the hell?

 

[OrangeJulius]

And this is why underpowered (even for their time) systems like Game Boy, DS and Wii were such failures.

I guess you didn't read my other post where I said if you are going the gameplay route over graphics you better release a shit ton of great games for the system at a steady clip.

Gameboy....check.

DS......check.

Wii......sorta check I guess. Not a ton of great games, but enough to keep the system from being a failure.

So yes, I never said gameplay focused sytems are doomed, Go back and read, I said they need great software support, which the systems you mentioned got, some in spades.

 

[Colonel Mustard]

Zombie U got a pack in and promotion from nintendo. The only reason it was successful is because Nintendo positioned it to be accepted by their dedicated audience.

Also, you know, because it was compelling original software.

 

[RM8]

I guess you didn't read my other post where I said if you are going the gameplay route over graphics you better release a shit ton of great games for the system at a steady clip.

Gameboy....check.

DS......check.

Wii......sorta check I guess. Not a ton of great games, but enough to keep the system from being a failure.

So yes, I never said gameplay focused sytems are doomed, Go back and read, I said they need great software support, which the systems you mentioned got, some in spades.

Then why would you say gameplay is kind of a "niche" thing that doesn't sell games afterwards? It makes no sense at all.

It's always been about graphics, always.

This "it's all about the gameplay" business is laughable.

 

[OrangeJulius]

There's no hit and run here. You have a sleuth of people willing to go toe to toe on "is graphics > gameplay". To me, the Wii makes your argument completely moot. There's so much in this thread to have that discussion here, to me anyways.

If you don't want that discussion here than make another thread and I'll happily discuss it just you and me. I'm a junior so obviously I can't make a thread.

The Wii doesn't make my argument moot. The Wii has a pathetic lack of software compared to the systems it competed with, the 360 and PS3. It sold because millions of moms and grandpas and other casuals bought it so they can play wii sports. The system moved a lot of units, but that doesn't mean it had a ton of great games.

 

[Dave Meltzer]

Also, you know, because it was compelling original software.

It didn't score especially well. Reaction to it in general was mixed. It sold well because of how it's positioned.

 

[JordoftheDead]

I don't think the guy should be fired for the comments everyone can have an opinion. However I think the fact that a highranking senior dev has such strong vitriol for the big n shows just how much the western industry hates nintendo. You would think these people wouldn't actually care who the hardware makers are, only how good there games can be.

Again, why the hyperbolic language? No one hates Nintendo. Developers may be frustrated that they have released another console out of cycle with the other big players meaning more resources required for cross platform due to the inherent difficulties and over people crying foul over support. People do realise that staff time costs actual money yeah?

 

[RM8]

It sold because millions of moms and grandpas and other casuals bought it so they can play wii sports.

Hey, it's almost like this is the point!

 

[SMT]

I don't think he's a puppet at all, I'd say most of the non localisations are down to him, he claimed responsibility for disaster not making it to the states

That sounds like something Iwata would do, minus the bow.
Damn, why would he deny us games if he's trying to sell a system?

 

[Margalis]

Zombie U got a pack in and promotion from nintendo. The only reason it was successful is because Nintendo positioned it to be accepted by their dedicated audience.

This is absolutely false.

ZombiU got much more buzz on Neogaf, much more buzz on Miiverse. On Miiverse ZombiU comments were only behind Nintendoland and NSMBU and were mostly positive. EA games Miiverse was filled with a lot of "don't buy this game" and "should I buy this?" "Not really." As well as low post volume in general.

ZombiU got a pack in and promotion because it was worthy of a pack in and promotion, because it was a cool game people wanted to play.

You think a sports game with no roster updates should have been a pack-in?

You can flail around all you want for increasingly ridiculous alternate explanations about Ubisoft/Nintendo conspiracies, or you can accept that incredibly obvious notion that people don't buy EA games because there was no reason to buy them.

If you open up a lemonade stand that sells dog piss do you also blame Nintendo when not many people buy your "lemonade"?

 

[Principate]

I guess you didn't read my other post where I said if you are going the gameplay route over graphics you better release a shit ton of great games for the system at a steady clip.

Gameboy....check.

DS......check.

Wii......sorta check I guess. Not a ton of great games, but enough to keep the system from being a failure.

So yes, I never said gameplay focused sytems are doomed, Go back and read, I said they need great software support, which the systems you mentioned got, some in spades.

TBF the wii could have survived on wii sports alone that and wii fit.

The wii was a health fad, it didn't actually need that much support

 

[Rehynn]

I guess you didn't read my other post where I said if you are going the gameplay route over graphics you better release a shit ton of great games for the system at a steady clip.

Gameboy....check.

DS......check.

Wii......sorta check I guess. Not a ton of great games, but enough to keep the system from being a failure.

So yes, I never said gameplay focused sytems are doomed, Go back and read, I said they need great software support, which the systems you mentioned got, some in spades.

But that doesn't explain why the games I mentioned (NSMB vs Galaxy, CoD vs any other FPS with better graphics, Angry Birds, The Sims...) sell way more that titles we usually associate with cutting-edge graphics. NSMB Wii greatly outsold the Uncharted games, just like it did the Galaxy games, which were on the same platform, so you can't even bring up the "yeah, but the Wii's user base was bigger" argument.

 

[OrangeJulius]

Then why would you say gameplay is kind of a "niche" thing that doesn't sell games afterwards? It makes no sense at all.

Because it is a "niche" thing. Why do you think dumb shiny shootie games like call of duty outsell everything else by huge margins?

Good lord, I can't keep up conversations with like six different people. Some of you guys will need to slow down, I don't even know who I'm talking too at this point.

 

[Deguello]

If you don't want that discussion here than make another thread and I'll happily discuss it just you and me. I'm a junior so obviously I can't make a thread.

The Wii doesn't make my argument moot. The Wii has a pathetic lack of software compared to the systems it competed with, the 360 and PS3. It sold because millions of moms and grandpas and other casuals bought it so they can play wii sports. The system moved a lot of units, but that doesn't mean it had a ton of great games.

I think it sort of does make your argument moot. Despite your subjective qualitative issues, the Wii did still move more units and had the highest selling software titles, despite being underpowered. You can thrash around and blame Casuals and Mario and little girls all you want as you move the goalposts, it still makes your argument moot.

 

[zroid]

:lol oh man

 

[Principate]

Because it is a "niche" thing. Why do you think dumb shiny shootie games like call of duty outsell everything else by huge margins?

Mario Kart wii outsold any single cod. obviously cod comes out annually but shooters aren't the only thing that sells.

 

[Dave Meltzer]

This is absolutely false.

ZombiU got much more buzz on Neogaf, much more buzz on Miiverse. On Miiverse ZombiU comments were only behind Nintendoland and NSMBU and were mostly positive. EA games Miiverse was filled with a lot of "don't buy this game" and "should I buy this?" "Not really." As well as low post volume in general.

ZombiU got a pack in and promotion because it was worthy of a pack in and promotion, because it was a cool game people wanted to play.

You think a sports game with no roster updates should have been a pack-in?

You can flail around all you want for increasingly ridiculous alternate explanations about Ubisoft/Nintendo conspiracies, or you can accept that incredibly obvious notion that people don't buy EA games because there was no reason to buy them.

If you open up a lemonade stand that sells dog piss do you also blame Nintendo when not many people buy your "lemonade"?

I don't care about Miiverse. The kind of person who uses Miiverse to express their opinions is the kind of person I considered to be affected by Nintendo's backing of this title.

I'm not saying it's bad, I've not even played it. It's sub 80 on Metacritic. It's not like it's some critical hit. The reason it did well was because it was well marketed at launch, not because it's "high quality". It got a pack in, which probably helped a lot. I'm sure it was demo'd on late night shows and such. It got the second most advertising of any game at launch.

 

[Projectjustice]

Im still trying to figure out OrangeJulius argument. One sentence its all about gameplay and the next its all about graphics and gameplay is stupid. Which is it?

 

[MagiusNecros]

Well you know what they say: If you don't have anything nice to say, don't say anything at all.

 

[OrangeJulius]

Mario Kart wii outsold any single cod.

And is that going to sell a lot of WiiU's?

 

[Calamari41]

Because it is a "niche" thing. Why do you think dumb shiny shootie games like call of duty outsell everything else by huge margins?

I'm having a lot of fun watching your little episode in this thread. By the way, Call of Duty is an example of a game that doesn't push graphics selling incredibly well because people love the gameplay.

 

[DirtyManos]

First post was never more accurate. Wow, this thread just cannot be stopped!

On topic, twitter has really become the worst thing for this industry on all sides.

 

[mightynine]

Come on man, don't be ignorant. What do you think video games have marketed themselves with since the 80's. It's always been about graphics, always.

This "it's all about the gameplay" business is laughable.

People aged 10-34 want shiny pretty graphics. This bourgeois gameplay stuff is only for snobs on the internet. People like you and me. But guess what, we aren't the focus groups.

The Lynx, Game Gear, Neo-Geo Pocket, and Dreamcast would like to disagree.

 

[Margalis]

It didn't score especially well.

Like half the Miiverse posts about it are "Why did this game score so low? It's great!"

This is another fundamental misunderstanding: that people are going to buy Madden Wii U with a Metacritic of 80 vs Zombi U with a Metacritic of 76 or whatever - despite the fact that Zombi U is a much more compelling purchase.

Church of Metacritic doesn't determine sals. Metacrtic rewards games that are "objectively good" (lol), sales favor games that people actually want to play.

 

[Principate]

And is that going to sell a lot of WiiU's?

Simply that your point was incorrect. Not only shooters sell.

 

[Colonel Mustard]

It didn't score especially well. Reaction to it in general was mixed. It sold well because of how it's positioned.

Nah, it faired relatively well (critically) for a launch game. The majority of reviews were positive. It also catered to a largely underserved audience.

 

[JordoftheDead]

Wii U isn't in a situation to play it safe, it's all or nothing now. If Nintendo still have a little hope to make the machine successful, they need to take the risks.

I know, but my point is that those franchises are already successful on other platforms. It will cost developers to port those titles, and selling to the existing WiiU marketshare likely isn't worth the investment. So short of Nintendo providing actual resources to third parties it is a moot point.

 

[RM8]

Because it is a "niche" thing. Why do you think dumb shiny shootie games like call of duty outsell everything else by huge margins?

Good lord, I can't keep up conversations with like six different people. Some of you guys will need to slow down, I don't even know who I'm talking too at this point.

~30 million copies of Mario Kart Wii, NSMB or NSMBWii (individually) is niche, I guess. Nintendogs, Brain Age, Tetris, Just Dance, Angry Birds - all niche products.

 

[Rehynn]

And is that going to sell a lot of WiiU's?

That's.... not even what we've been talking about.

 

[EmCeeGramr]

Because it is a "niche" thing. Why do you think dumb shiny shootie games like call of duty outsell everything else by huge margins?

Good lord, I can't keep up conversations with like six different people. Some of you guys will need to slow down, I don't even know who I'm talking too at this point.

Call of Duty sells well because it has a reliable gameplay formula that appeals to a wide audience. If graphics were all that mattered, then Uncharted, Crysis, Battlefield, and others would have wiped the floor with COD's sales.

 

[OrangeJulius]

Im still trying to figure out OrangeJulius argument. One sentences its all about gameplay and the next its all about graphics and gameplay is stupid. Which is it?

The problem is you think it's an argument. I'm taking issue with all these people that are equating past success with future success.

What Nintendo has done in the past 5-8 years or so is clearly not working right now. Whether it's lack of software, poor marketing, crappy console name that sounds like a accessory to most casuals.

You all keep quoting sales numbers and the usual defense force tactics when that isn't the root of what I'm saying. If you can't discern what I'm saying when I just spelled it out for you in the first two sentences of this post then that is your problem.

 

[dragonfart28]

I'm not saying it's bad, I've not even played it.

The reason it did well was because it was well marketed at launch, not because it's "high quality".

 

[Margalis]

I don't care about Miiverse.

If you are a company and everyone on Miiverse is telling people not to buy your game or if your game has very few posts you probably should care.

"I don't care what customers and potential customers think of my products."

K. Sounds like brilliant business strategy.

 

[Keyouta]

Nobody posted this here yet? SunhiLegend created another crazy gif.

lol, this one is really good.

But I suppose no more pinning problems on Reggie now that Iwata's the Global President

 

[RM8]

The problem is you think it's an argument. I'm taking issue with all these people that are equating past success with future success.

You said graphics > gameplay since the beginning of times. You said it.

 

[OrangeJulius]

That's.... not even what we've been talking about.

But that is what I've been talking about....you have all just warped it into a graphics vs gameplay, salesfigures, wank fest.