MS: Xbox One 40x More Powerful Than 360 with the Cloud, Only 10x Without the Cloud

Not even factoring in the practical implementation issues with using elastic computing in games, who is going to pay for this computational power?

Last I checked, the elastic computing model was that implementers of these computing resources had to pay for it. In this case, I'm assuming publishers would be on the hook for it.

We're in an era when we have publishers shutting off servers 2 years after a game is released to save money. And we're supposed to believe they're going to be opening up their wallets to pay for cloud computing resources in addition to the normal development budgets?

Unless MS is feeling generous and is tossing in Azure resources as part of their XBL hosting agreements, I'm calling major bullshit on this feature gaining any kind of traction with penny pinching publishers.

Exactly, it totally defies common sense. This is a company that's trying to kill used games, charges for P2P multiplayer and Netflix access, and sells ad space all over their OS. And we're supposed to believe that they're going to give away tons of free cloud computing power?
 

godhandiscen

There are millions of whiny 5-year olds on Earth, and I AM THEIR KING.
Godhandiscen is the guy who gave the info that got Reiko banned. Just so people know. You know, the info that turned out to be BS about the Xbox One having much better hardware than it actually ended up having lol.

Out of curiosity, how many servers does GaiKai have?

not-this-shit-again.jpg



I didn't lie to Reiko. I PM'd Bish the information I gave to Reiko, he can confirm.
 

LiquidMetal14

hide your water-based mammals
There's a difference between then and now, Sony is not planning on tripping out the gate and falling right on their face this time around.

And let's not act like MS' past releases been resounding successes (WinPhone/Surface) either.

There is a stark contrast between the Sony of now and 4 years ago. They are seemingly fixing all the issues which plagued them with PS3 and on top of that, they are sending a clear message about PS4. It's about the games.
 

AgentP

Thinks mods influence posters politics. Promoted to QAnon Editor.
But when you interact, local system takes over. When you leave the area or are not directly interacting with these objects, they are then shifted to the cloud.

It's not rocket science.

So when real calculations are needed, the local system takes over. You are describing none-sense, the reason you can not get into details is because you don't know any.
 

jacobs34

Member
All of these MSoft threads are just a precursor to how insane E3 is going to be this year, the real question is whether GAF will be able to handle the traffic load.
 

Eusis

Member
If Penguins brought us anything is that Respawn and Bungie are both going to have always-online games.

Also re-confirms Respawn is giving XBone exclusivity as per Crazy Buttocks on a Train.
We knew Bungie was going for that, even on PS3/360, but that's because they want to make some MMO-ish thing, and that's what you usually accept for always online, not just any damn game. And I doubt it's really doing computation to look OMG amazing.

Holy fuck, I can't believe anyone can buy into that so readily even with everyone shooting it down, though I guess being an MS employee actually COULD explain it. But then I think they'd try to stay quieter so he's probably just an imbecilic fanboy.
 
It will be demoed at E3, a controlled environment and the press and some gamers will eat it up. Microsoft is already covered with its online policy you know the one it tells you on the box how playing online will differ.
 

Azull

Member
I have learned from this thread that Gaikai will never work. Good to know.

Than apparently you haven't learned anything or being purposely ignorant. Gaikai streams the whole game/video/etc., "The cloud" supposedly does a certain amount and leaves the rest to the system. Two very different things.

Hey guys what's goin--

...


Fuck.

Remember when Sony was talking about the potential of CELL, and how distributed computing would take us farther than we'd ever imagined?

I could've sworn I'd heard the same arguments and armchair engineering speeches before. :)

Seriously, though. I'm not sure if a) these ms reps really have any clue what they are talking about, or b) they are gambling with some very forward thinking concepts and tech that may or may not prove worthwhile, in the end.

After reading some of Dopeyfishes arguments towards the cloud I swear I was having flash backs to Crazy Ken. Xbox One is actually PS31.5.
 

Steroyd

Member
All of these MSoft threads are just a precursor to how insane E3 is going to be this year, the real question is whether GAF will be able to handle the traffic load.

Gaf nearly got crushed when Microsoft had their conference.

At E3 it's going to be all 3 companies, and who knows what stupid stuff they'll do.
 

godhandiscen

There are millions of whiny 5-year olds on Earth, and I AM THEIR KING.
Hey guys what's goin--

...


Fuck.

Remember when Sony was talking about the potential of CELL, and how distributed computing would take us farther than we'd ever imagined?

I could've sworn I'd heard the same arguments and armchair engineering speeches before. :)

Seriously, though. I'm not sure if a) these ms reps really have any clue what they are talking about, or b) they are gambling with some very forward thinking concepts and tech that may or may not prove worthwhile, in the end.

Sony's computing network was conceptual. Azure exists already. All that Microsoft has made is an API to leverage cloud computing in the Xbox SDK. The Microsoft PR is fucking shit up by not giving examples. Perhaps some actual game demos would have helped.
 

DrWong

Member
Than apparently you haven't learned anything or being purposely ignorant. Gaikai streams the whole game/video/etc., "The cloud" supposedly does a certain amount and leaves the rest to the system. Two very different things.

This thread... delivers.

E3 is going to be mental.
 

VariantX

Member
I have learned from this thread that Gaikai will never work. Good to know.

Gaikai does all the processing on their end and sends the image back to the user with a bit of lag. Ms is talking about splitting up processing tasks between the cloud and the console itself.
 

jacobs34

Member
Gaf nearly got crushed when Microsoft had their conference.

At E3 it's going to be all 3 companies, and who knows what stupid stuff they'll do.

Not to mention the Apple Keynote, which makes me wonder if they will suspend the Off Topic forum, which would make a lot of people mad.
 

Desaan

Member
I feel sorry for the people falling for this PR buzzword bullshit and if you're stupid enough to buy into it I shall enjoy watching you getting fucked in the ass by a cloud.
 

Eliciel

Member
all of this reminds me of elpresadors killzone 2 demo impression video on youtube 4 years ago. This hole debate 40x better. Go get a Tr4y 4 life
 

Chosen3

Member
Seriously guys, this shit is just shocking. If ever there was a revelation of how incompetent this industry is at the moment, this is it.

Here is a fucking company who actively has announced things that WILL negatively impact every single consumer on the market... and then, in an attempt to muddy the waters, released literally like five or six different versions of the story to try to pretend it wasn't a problem. Oh hey, WE CAN CONFIRM that no used games is false! Wait, I mean *you* won't pay a fee! See, no fee! Don't look behind the curtain, because we're about to tell you that your friends WILL have to pay! Now hold on, what we mean is you just can't lend games without your friend payin' a fee, you can still resell games! Wait a second, we're just discussing POTENTIAL SCENARIOS. Oh wait, think of it like it's a new game... NO FUCKERS, IT'S NOT A GODDAMN NEW GAME. YOU FUCKING DIRTY NO-GOOD ASSHOLES. Goddamn, Microsoft is the worst company ever. Where were the journalists with a list of all the stories being told about this subject, showing them to the latest bullshit artist representing the Xbox One and demanding some honest straight forward answers?

Ok, so what's next? Oh yeah, hey everyone...if you use CLOUD, the Xbox One will get a billion times stronger! A trillion! A zillion! "But wait," anyone with a shred of fucking intelligence responds, "what happens if the internet goes down? What happens if you don't have as faster of a connection? How would such shit get around the endless cloud service bottlenecks? How will it do any fucking thing you assholes say? Can a fucking game journalist do their job?" Find out at eleven o'clock!

No, you won't be able to rent games! Fuck that shit, what a privilege all you potential thieves out there have had for this long! How dare you have such a right, like trying these gargantuan bloated MODERN AAA pieces of garbage out so you don't waste $60 fucking bucks playing the latest 4 hour hallway corridor generation X-Z nonsense title produced almost entirely by eight thousand board rooms across the planet. But hey, it has multiplayer guys! The same fucking multiplayer you've played in Call of Duty twenty eight thousand times, but it's there! VALUE ADDED!

No, you won't be able to fucking use your games beyond 24 hours if you don't have an internet connection, because we believe your lardy, undeveloped asses are so goddamn lazy that you're willing to actively give up ownership privileges just so you can fucking swap games around a little easier! Of course, that's all bullshit, because this is all an elaborate scheme to fuck piracy up some more, even though every fucked up DRM scheme that has been tried this past generation has reamed honest, hard-working and hard-payin' consumers so far up the ass that they have gaping holes larger than what's at the center of the fucking Milky Way Galaxy.

Now there are obviously exceptions. Some game journalists are raging. But this shit is ridiculous. EVERY major website right now should be eviscerating Microsoft. IGN should be fucking vomiting at these decisions every five second around the clock until the system launches. They should be disemboweling these pathetic PR representatives of these hateful corporations, spitting their sludge all over the faces of everyone who ever purchased games from them, denying them even a second to mislead legions of consumers into thinking the system is anything except what it is: the world's biggest fucking cock being whipped out and slapped across your goddamn face!

Oh, what about this shit? Why is your focus during your GAME CONSOLE reveal fuckin' TV? Why have you chosen your philosophy? WHY should gamers take this shit lying down? WHAT BENEFIT DOES IT HAVE TO YOUR CUSTOMERS!? For the love of Christ, someone ask some hard goddamn questions! You are all informed to the tit, please use your knowledge to slash these assholes throats so that all the bullshit will spill out and we'll stop having to swim through torrents of anti-consumer diarrhea!

This post should be stickied or something on the front page.
 

Eusis

Member
Than apparently you haven't learned anything or being purposely ignorant. Gaikai streams the whole game/video/etc., "The cloud" supposedly does a certain amount and leaves the rest to the system. Two very different things.
I'm not too confident something like Onlive can really take off (I'm pretty sure Onlive itself IS doomed due to a stubborn, impractical setup, though I guess someone could gut it as-is and rebuild into something relatively sane), but the reasons for that are different for why this cloud co-computing wouldn't. Well, maybe not too different, it's ultimately about latency, but for streaming video it's just a matter of input lag and being able to cover server/bandwidth costs, whereas here it's literally impossible outside of specific situations. I'm guessing you might get something very intriguing doing it with Elder Scrolls and a fully dynamic world so while you're in a dungeon bandits raid a town or something, and so you see the aftermath when you go back, but nothing relevant for more linear games or actually making graphics better.
 
You think if this was the plan all along, MS would of put it on the slide along side "5 Billion Transistors"

No this is pure snake oil, that MS has pulled out of their collective ass to distract people while they try to get out of the mess they've got themselves into.
 
Remember when Sony was talking about the potential of CELL, and how distributed computing would take us farther than we'd ever imagined?

They are kinda right in this regard though... Not on the scale they have however.

Also lol no way they can offload millions of instructions per second without any large latency issues.
 

teh_pwn

"Saturated fat causes heart disease as much as Brawndo is what plants crave."
Cloud has networking issues and cost issues. When you do use CPU and GPU compute, it isn't a PC gamer class GPU and CPU. It's Xeons and enterprise GPUs. Super fucking expensive stuff. Even if it did work, you would need to pay a lot to use it.

No thanks.
 

i-Lo

Member
Guys serious question:

Could the cloud work in a way where the system pings the cloud to download AI routines (almost like on demand DLC) to be fed directly for processing and then rendering on screen in a matter of few tens of milli-seconds?

I can only imagine certain scripts contained with small bursts of packages being delivered from cloud and even then being highly sensitive ping rate and download speed.

I honestly can not see any meaningful tasks that can aid rendering on the system today given the variable in current ISP condition and given the ever improving LoD system and integration of tessellation in a more mainstream way, is there really a point?
 

Monas

Member
Maybe the CLOUD will be utilised to render realistic clouds?

To MS sympathizers: Nothing you can say will make a distributed computing job, like FOLDING@HOME, a working and reliable game asset. MS will try, MS will fail and we will have 300,000 servers storing scoreboards and saves, like they are supposed to.

And having realistic grass or raindrops rendered on the server and downloaded to the XBONE client, is both dumb and useless. It will also make the experience differ from gamer to gamer according to their Internet connection.

Lets classify this cloud talk as marketing BS. But by all means please continue, because I hadn't had so much fun in GAF since the APOCALYPS3.
 

DrWong

Member
Gaikai does all the processing on their end and sends the image back to the user with a bit of lag. Ms is talking about splitting up processing tasks between the cloud and the console itself.

So Microsoft can only split partially the processing tasks to the "cloud" when Onlive or Gaikai split ALL the processing tasks to the "cloud"?

Which is the more powerful cloud here?
 

ironcreed

Banned
I feel sorry for the people falling for this PR buzzword bullshit and if you're stupid enough to buy into it I shall enjoy watching you getting fucked in the ass by a cloud.

Oh, just wait until E3. I'm sure there will be plenty of smoke and mirrors on stage to make this always online environment look appealing. They are dancing around and avoiding the questions until then, where they hope the bright lights and games will make all of this go away.
 
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