SmokedMeat
Gamer™
I can't possibly imagine Sony seeing all of this backlash and saying yeah, we're still going forward with the same plan. Even if it was originally considered they'd be crazy to follow Microsoft's lead!
Xbox One: Details on Connectivity, Licensing (24 hour check-in) and Privacy Features
- Thread starter mcfrank
- Start date
DenogginizerOS
BenjaminBirdie's Thomas Jefferson
It sounds like a game's license can only be transferred once. Essentially, used game sales are final.
dreamer3kx
Member
Wouldn't mind if games were $30 but these things are kind of expensive and not being able to sell if I want is just wrong, all this is wrong, wont be purchasing this console, if Sony does the same wont be purchasing also, spent so much money gaming and this is what you get.
anexanhume
Member
Yup.
I think the prior. Giving here means gifting (and I guess soiling, as that's the only time it is acceptable as a gift).
RepairmanJack
Member
Pretty sure it's one and done. Only one single transfer. They specificaly use the word GIVE for a reason. There is no lend.
Can't be an indian giver!
I think the "loaning to a friend" and the "selling used game at participating retailer" systems are mostly separate. So I think a game can be sold many times (assuming the publisher lets you), but you can't give it to your friends freely.
I wonder if selling it used resets that "only give it away once" limit.
Hahahaha then this isn't really lending/sharing at all. I completely misread it. Oh fuck off MDOLLAR
rocksteady1983
Member
I would honestly like to see when Microsoft comes out to do their e3 presentation if the whole room booed them like crazy. Just to send a little message. That would at least be interesting to see and surely let them know how the "gaming community" views their policies for next gen. Would it matter....of course not.
RepairmanJack
Member
Just like people are reading the "publishers choose" part wrong. They chose their wording very carefully.
yes they said loaning and renting won't be available at launch but they'll look into implementing it
i think the biggest problem with this is that every xbone exclusive game will be unplayable forever when the next one comes out and MS turns off the authentication server. they've shown they don't care about backwards compatibility and this announcement shows they don't care about game preservation either.
Ok I am sure this has been asked/discussed but I don't want to wade through 100 pages.
As far as sharing games with family members is concerned. What determines who is your family? Can you just get together with 10 friends, say you are family and then all games anyone buys can be freely shared between you?
Can two family members play the same game on different systems at the same time?
Giving games to friends so this is not lending. You are actually giving/transferring the license to them. Obviously you no longer own the game. Can that friend now give the game again or any game transferred this way is now stuck with that person forever? They said can only be transferred once, but does that mean YOU can only transfer it once or that the LICENSE can only be transferred once between any party?
As far as sharing games with family members is concerned. What determines who is your family? Can you just get together with 10 friends, say you are family and then all games anyone buys can be freely shared between you?
Can two family members play the same game on different systems at the same time?
Giving games to friends so this is not lending. You are actually giving/transferring the license to them. Obviously you no longer own the game. Can that friend now give the game again or any game transferred this way is now stuck with that person forever? They said can only be transferred once, but does that mean YOU can only transfer it once or that the LICENSE can only be transferred once between any party?
Woo-Fu
Banned
I'm expecting cellphone pics of dead silent journalists up front with cheering Microsoft drones in the back rows.
Relaxed Muscle
Member
They surely tried to word it carefully to don't make it sound as bad.
Yeah, I have egg on my face. I read "giving games to friends" as lending/loaning and that it just wouldn't be available at launch but you could have 1 loan buddy when they do implement it.
They really mean "gifting" games to friends. Obviously their answer is so unsatisfactory for "selling" games to friends.
you can't blame yourself for misunderstanding any of this, it's all way more complicated than it needs to be
even if the message here were positive it'd still probably be bad press for them just because it's so obfuscated
Sola Scriptura
Member
Microsoft, as a consumer, I have rights. Since you have intentionally ignored them and adopted policies for your new system that are clearly and decidedly anti-consumer, let me clue you in on one right you can't ignore:
I have the right not to spend a dime on your gaming content ever again.
I have the right not to spend a dime on your gaming content ever again.
JonathanPower
Member
LOL, it is because MS really believes in the power of friendship, and they think that a real friend should never ask for a gift back.
I don't think it was necessarily pressure from publishers either, but I think that the online check-in DRM was a part of a few of the next-gen moneyhats being thrown around for console exclusivity.
EA dropping online passes was pretty huge and now they have at least one exclusive game that could be a big system seller for Microsoft. Online DRM could have easily sweetened the deal for EA to be able to control access to their games and make additional profits by restricting used game sales and sharing.
I think the best news to come out of all of this is seeing Microsoft continue to draw back it's stance on used games and game sharing. These are by no means great, but you can really see where they have back-tracked due to pressure from the gaming community.
badcrumble
Member
Yeah, upon further thought, I have to agree that there's pretty much no way for Sony to implement this at a console level (though obviously any third party can implement 100kb single-player unlock keys with a key-code, just like they can on the current gen, but at the cost of not being playable to people without an internet connection) due to the lack of an internet connection requirement.
Yeah, the wording is very carefully and very deliberately kept vague enough that you have to parse very precisely for the actual meaning and it's easy to misinterpret it in a positive way if you miss a word here or there.
I mean... hot damn. MS was the first to go along with it? And now they want to put boxes WITH CAMERAS AND MICS in our living rooms? Forget used games people... this is bigger than that, isn't it?
Did anyone make a thread on this yet?
This is probably 100,000x more important than the used games shitstorm.
Right, they maybe trying to figure out how close to the line they can get without crossing it. But that's still a shitty practice I can't support. That they're going to be exactly as anti-consumer as sales allow them to be.
BigWeather
Member
Like many things they stated, it can be read multiple ways:
Kind reading:
You can give your game to a friend, but you lose it. That friend can then give it to someone else, but then they lose it. So, basically, the "give it once" means you can't give your game to two friends. The right to "give it once" is attached to you.
Harsh reading:
You can give your game to a friend, but you lose it. That friend then is stuck with it. The right to "give it once" is attached to the game.
Will be interesting to see which way this one goes.
Edit: Ah, that's right, the kind reading above would allow lending and that has already been ruled out on launch. Probably harsh reading then. =/
Perhaps but I think you are choosing a rosie picture...It seems to me that transfers to a friend or to a "participating retailer" are essentially the same. Every game is accorded ONE transfer only. I would also assume that the game you gave to a friend would not be eligible for reselling...It's a pessimistic view, I grant you, but I don't have much faith anymore.
Louis Cypher
Banned
People are morons who always believe in freedom and pie and that the government is a force for good!
Fine Ham Abounds
Member
I'm assuming publishers can decide what to allow us to do with their product on either platform. We're not buying games anymore, we're buying licenses to play games.
The fact that they are stating here that every game will be available digital or physical and saved to your account means they aren't considering a distinction between physical products and digital licenses.
As a huge fan of PS+, I've become comfortable with the idea of games as a service, but it's because I accept certain realities of digital distribution, and PS+ is a good value for a good service. Locking my physical purchases to a service is not something I'm comfortable with, as I am primarily a renter. Gamefly is the only reason I have played anything for the last two years.
The bottom line for me as of right now with the info we have is that new physical releases would have to be under $30 for me to even consider purchasing one of these consoles.
Completely agree it's shitty. It'll be a horrible decision and heavily anti-consumer, but they have adjusted to where a lot of the used game stuff and loaning is at publisher discretion instead of something required by all. At least that is what it sounds like to me.
Oh noes the American Government knows I fap on shemale porn.
That's something I hadn't thought of, but it definitely makes sense.
Can Crusher
Banned
At this point, is there anything positive about this product?
Much weaker hardware, focus on TV, shit DRM implementation, same prices.... Kinect 2 mandatory...
When do the good news start coming?
Much weaker hardware, focus on TV, shit DRM implementation, same prices.... Kinect 2 mandatory...
When do the good news start coming?
maquiladora
Member
I can foresee a legal shitstorm in the EU over this.
And these are just the details we know about. I wonder what they don't want to tell us just yet and what will only be discovered in the fine print at launch?
It's draining a lot of the fun out of pre-E3 for me. Worried about Sony's intentions too.
BlazingDarkness
Member
Well they also said there is no game lending. So it's give it once, as far as they've said - and it can only be 'given' on one occasion, so your friend can't then give it on to somebody else.
And MS don't exactly have the best history with the EU courts.
There's a thread on OT about it.
MikeE21286
Member
Wait til the moneyhats and exclusives come.
This is MS brute-forcing this by buying up all the games and developing tight 3rd party partnerships
We've heard from CBoaT and others that this was originally worse and then scaled back. So I believe that.
Forza 5 is 1080p/60fps ...
Tylahedras
Banned
Yeah, I would expect them to have a few solid publisher exclusives as a result of this.
BruiserBear
Banned
I'm not sure about that. Anyone who knows a thing or two about broadband around the world, knows that in many places there are data caps, and having to download 20 gig games wasn't going to work for a lot of people.
So discs were always part of the plan.
fatgamecat
Member
15 years later, "LTTP: Xbox One"
OP: Hey guys, I totally want to dig into the Xbox One library, where should I get started?
Reply: Umm sorry dude.. MS shut down the Xbox One access servers a couple years ago. Xbox Ones are as good as paperweights. MS wants you to buy the Xbox Two instead.
OP: Hey guys, I totally want to dig into the Xbox One library, where should I get started?
Reply: Umm sorry dude.. MS shut down the Xbox One access servers a couple years ago. Xbox Ones are as good as paperweights. MS wants you to buy the Xbox Two instead.
digoutyoursoul
Member
Honestly it's a waste of time posting on his blog. The situation only the likes of them people will ever take notice is if the sales decrease dramatically
There are positives, but they are all attached with negatives. I like no disc swapping, but it means shitty DRM. I like the idea of Kinect 2.0, but people don't like the privacy issues. I like having a sandboxed OS that allows for true multitasking, but that reduces the usable RAM for games. etc, etc...
Hey, it will have some neat games and you can pay them to watch the TV that you already have.
A Steam-like approach probably would have been better IF they had actually used Steam as the basis of their console. Instead we get a lot of publisher-inspired (read: anti-consumer) half measures.
The only thing I liked was the idea of family use...too bad for you orphans though...go fuck yourselves.