He's about as much of a clone as Falco was in Brawl which is to say, not at all. Both characters are clearly inspired by Fox's moveset but in execution they're so wildly different that it's hardly worth mentioning.
Super Smash Bros Wii U and 3DS: Info Collection - Dojo, Mega Man and Trailer! 2014!
- Thread starter IntelliHeath
- Start date
He's about as much of a clone as Falco was in Brawl which is to say, not at all. Both characters are clearly inspired by Fox's moveset but in execution they're so wildly different that it's hardly worth mentioning.
LonelyGreyWolf
Banned
People who claim that Wolf is a clone are absolutely clueless.
Kind of a moot point, then, since more recent interviews (post-game reveal) have Sakurai pegging the gameplay between Melee and Brawl, which is probably a better indicator of what to expect.
Poltergust
Member
ShockingAlberto
Member
I don't like Wolf and never play him, but if he's the cork keeping Krystal out of the game then I hope he never leaves.
NeonZ
Member
I think it's really amusing that people think Krystal wouldn't be considered a clone, if they consider Wolf one. She'd likely end up with all unique normals, but that didn't help Wolf. Her specials likely still would be:
B - Energy blast... from her staff
Up B - Upwards thrust... with staff
Forward B - Forward Rush attack... with the staff
Down B - Barrier/Reflector... with the staff
She could easily end up with a Fox type moveset even while wielding the Staff.
ScraftyDevil
Banned
Obviously, it will be
Glorious.
Perhaps, but the unknown is what leaves room for hype!
I did notice he was discussing Melee as if it for some reason, it kept certain people from playing. I have never seen anyone have an issue of Melee being too "hardcore" to play. I mean, it's Smash...
He refers to people who played his game, Melee, as gaming "maniacs", and people who play Brawl as "casual" gamers. With that said, he also talks as if his demographic he targeted for Brawl didn't do what he was saying Melee did, driving away certain people, fans of Smash.
Just felt I should point that out.
I suspect that people consider Wolf to be a clone because he comes so late that no one bothers with him. I certainly can't remember his moves.
Krystal's probably one of those flavour-of-the-month characters that fans are only really excited about at one point in time. Like how people went "Ghirahim in Smash!" before Skyward Sword even came out. Smash doesn't have a lot of those. Although she's probably got a smaller set of fans that stays excited.
Krystal's probably one of those flavour-of-the-month characters that fans are only really excited about at one point in time. Like how people went "Ghirahim in Smash!" before Skyward Sword even came out. Smash doesn't have a lot of those. Although she's probably got a smaller set of fans that stays excited.
AnkiRendan
Member
I'm highly disagreeing with everyone wanting Pokemon Trainer to be a different trainer or having different Pokemon. Red has been in every single generation. He's extremely iconic, as are the first three starters. I feel that if any first gen rep needs the boot, it's Jigglypuff. But even that is difficult since she is now half Fairy type, with new possibilities...
I don't know. Maybe it will be an all first gen roster this time...
I don't know. Maybe it will be an all first gen roster this time...
Ignis Fatuus
Banned
I'm more offended that people think that blue Rareshit furrybait is a better character than Wolf O'Donnell.
You can't possibly be this stubborn.
Like give me a goddamn break dude. You can't see why Purge could be a projectile move... like a Side B. It doesn't have to "seal" anything, it could just be a damage dealing attack. Monado Eater would just be a B-move / Smash... It doesn't have to add DoT (though DoT would be cool) and I was thinking that Monado Shield / Armor could reflect projectiles or act as a counter move.
There's also speed, which could literally temporarily increase Shulk's movement speed when used (there would have to be a cool down timer and some penalties) and like I mentioned earlier, the regular sword art skills could act as smash moves.
But you're right, Shulk obviously isn't getting in. I was a fool to argue against Masashiro Sakurai. But seriously though, I don't think Shulk has a very high chance of getting in either, but don't feed me this croc and bull that his moveset isn't "smash worthy" just because you aren't creative enough to actually find an application for his massive moveset.(which dwarfs like 90% of the cast mind you)
Jawmuncher
Member
I think we're done here
and of course I forgot Toon Link
I gotta say. There's way to many Pokemon on there.
Edit: unless those are the ones trainer will use
ScraftyDevil
Banned
SuperAngelo64
Banned
RE: Villager's Final Smash: That's a brilliant idea, Poltergust. Bees, bees everywhere! I can totally see that happening. 
RE: Newcomers: I think Little Mac, Pac-Man and Mii all have potential to be EXCELLENT characters. And since they were leaked alongside Villager, Mega Man and Wii Fit Trainer, they're virtual certainties.
Just to ramble off some possibilities:
Little Mac can have Doc Louis cheering him on in the background, like Pokémon Trainer, or even incorporate Doc into his moves, I.E. Down B makes Mac sit down for a toweling and pep talk by Doc, restoring his health, or Forward B makes Doc dash forward on his bike with Little Mac jogging behind, steamrolling enemies. Doc then disappears, like Rush in Mega Man's Rush Coil move.
Of course you'd have your Star Punch move, and probably Giga Mac as a Final Smash. Little Mac could also pull a Ness and borrow moves from other Punch-Out characters. Maybe Sakurai could even explain it as Little Mac going the extra mile to be competitive on the all-new Smash Circuit -- the presumed name of the boxing arena level.
Pac-Man can tuck in his arms and legs and chomp through the air by tapping Forward B. Once he starts chomping through the air, arcade-style, you can tap in another direction and even up and down to pivot in that direction. In effect, you can pursue enemies as they leap away! Other moves could have him dribbling like a basketball, launching himself like a human cannonball, spitting pellets and belching up ghosts, and even chewing enemies he manages to gobble. For his Final Smash, he could power up and chase enemies like in the arcade game. His stage would be Pac-Maze, complete with the neon walls against a black backdrop. And his appearance would be as follows:
Mii will be a surprisingly exciting character, as well. Like the Wii Fit Trainer, Mii represents the causal expanded audience and is emblematic of Nintendo's most successful console in recent memory. You can swap in different heads, effectively allowing you to play as yourself, your siblings, your friends, Reggie, Obama, Hitler, Jesus, etc. The body would be uniform in all cases, one balanced build that incorporates abilities from Wii Sports/Resort, Wii Fit, Wii Music, Wii Play, Wii Party, Find Mii, Pilotwings Resort, Nintendo Land and so on. There's a ton they can do with the character!
Frankly, these are the characters I want to see next, now that we have good reason to believe they exist and were even considered for a possible E3 reveal before they were pulled. I'm 110% happy with Villager, Mega Man and Wii Fit Trainer. Can't wait to see more!
RE: Newcomers: I think Little Mac, Pac-Man and Mii all have potential to be EXCELLENT characters. And since they were leaked alongside Villager, Mega Man and Wii Fit Trainer, they're virtual certainties.
Just to ramble off some possibilities:
Little Mac can have Doc Louis cheering him on in the background, like Pokémon Trainer, or even incorporate Doc into his moves, I.E. Down B makes Mac sit down for a toweling and pep talk by Doc, restoring his health, or Forward B makes Doc dash forward on his bike with Little Mac jogging behind, steamrolling enemies. Doc then disappears, like Rush in Mega Man's Rush Coil move.
Of course you'd have your Star Punch move, and probably Giga Mac as a Final Smash. Little Mac could also pull a Ness and borrow moves from other Punch-Out characters. Maybe Sakurai could even explain it as Little Mac going the extra mile to be competitive on the all-new Smash Circuit -- the presumed name of the boxing arena level.
Pac-Man can tuck in his arms and legs and chomp through the air by tapping Forward B. Once he starts chomping through the air, arcade-style, you can tap in another direction and even up and down to pivot in that direction. In effect, you can pursue enemies as they leap away! Other moves could have him dribbling like a basketball, launching himself like a human cannonball, spitting pellets and belching up ghosts, and even chewing enemies he manages to gobble. For his Final Smash, he could power up and chase enemies like in the arcade game. His stage would be Pac-Maze, complete with the neon walls against a black backdrop. And his appearance would be as follows:
It'll be nice having Pac-Man on board. He's one of the most iconic figures in gaming, a crucial part of gaming history. He was the darling of Miyamoto's Pac-Man Vs. project that exemplified GCN-GBA connectivity before it became central to the WiiU concept. That game, in turn, inspired Luigi's Ghost Mansion and other Nintendo Land attractions. And then of course Pac-Man has starred alongside Mario twice, by way of the Mario Kart Arcade GP titles in Japan. He also has new games and multi-media productions on the horizon. It makes sense and I look forward to seeing him in action now that he's all but confirmed (thanks to the leaker).
Mii will be a surprisingly exciting character, as well. Like the Wii Fit Trainer, Mii represents the causal expanded audience and is emblematic of Nintendo's most successful console in recent memory. You can swap in different heads, effectively allowing you to play as yourself, your siblings, your friends, Reggie, Obama, Hitler, Jesus, etc. The body would be uniform in all cases, one balanced build that incorporates abilities from Wii Sports/Resort, Wii Fit, Wii Music, Wii Play, Wii Party, Find Mii, Pilotwings Resort, Nintendo Land and so on. There's a ton they can do with the character!
Frankly, these are the characters I want to see next, now that we have good reason to believe they exist and were even considered for a possible E3 reveal before they were pulled. I'm 110% happy with Villager, Mega Man and Wii Fit Trainer. Can't wait to see more!
Spring-Loaded
Member
I think it's original. They'll probably go this route once they have a post-apocalyptic Mario game.
They should definitely keep Red. Red and his Gen I Pokémon are classics. However, I think they should change his name to Pokémon Trainer Red, and introduce a new trainer alongside him, like Pokémon Trainer X, with a team of three Gen VI Pokémon. Then you can have the two trainers fight in an actual Pokémon battle!
Flavor of the month? The last game she was in came out in 2006. Krystal is here to to stay, dude.
yep, I just replaced the R/B starters with the X/Y ones
If any Pokemon character is leaving, it's going to be Lucario, and I also personally want the Pokemon Trainer out, even though I liked playing as Squirtle and Ivysaur but I didn't like the gimmick of the Pokemon Trainer, we already have a trainer for this game and is the Wii Fit Trainer~
Ignis Fatuus
Banned
People will keep asking for Krystal no matter how many Smash games come out, just like they keep asking what Rare is doing no matter how many times Microsoft yells KINECT SPORTS in response.
I feel like stamina's probably on the chopping block. If they want to keep his playstyle oriented around switching they should incentivize using all three, rather than punishing you until you did.
Shulk will probably be in, I think. It seems to be have a strong following even in Japan, at least according to Famitsu's 2012 poll. Operation Rainfall even had some Japanese reporting on it if I recall.
Although I personally think Shulk's a boring swordfighter with too many passive effects. Aeron would be way more interesting. More weapons and that variety of chain-based moves. Ah well.
Is there a lot of demand for Kursed, by the way?
Although I personally think Shulk's a boring swordfighter with too many passive effects. Aeron would be way more interesting. More weapons and that variety of chain-based moves. Ah well.
Is there a lot of demand for Kursed, by the way?
ScraftyDevil
Banned
I'd be a happy man if they removed PT's stamina and forced switch on KO mechanics. Squirtle was my absolute best character in Brawl and I could dominate with him, but I sucked eggs with Ivysaur and The Zard. I know that both mechanics make sense in regards to his series and are kinda neat I guess, but they seriously debilitate the character's usability because you need to get good with all three or die trying.
I'd be fine if they just made the switch instantaneous so that you can easily change back to your main after KO instead.
If they fix the Pokemon Switching mechanic (you can sometimes punish someone for switching if the Wii didn't load the character fast enough) and make all 3 characters about on par with each other, then the stamina feature should be fine. It exists to force players to demand switching, since if it didn't exist PKMN Trainer would have 3 characters to choose from in a single match.
Yeah, I'm really pulling for another Pokemon Trainer. I want to see two trainers duking it out at Pokemon Stadium!
Honestly, if I could ask for one Star Fox character, it'd be Slippy. He's been at Fox's side the whole series (unlike Peppy, who retired, and Falco, who went missing 'til the end of Adventures). He's adorable, and was used to hilarious effect in Snake's Falco codec in Brawl. He could be a short, stocky fighter, incorporating various gizmos and gadgets into his attacks. It'd be fun!
AnkiRendan
Member
I did like that it somewhat forced you to be skilled with all 3, but yes, that was ass. It hurt him in the long run.
I seriously love this idea! I'm just afraid of there being too many Pokemon reps. :/
EmCeeGramr
Member
wolf has a gun that's also a knife so he's okay in my book
Solid Samus
Banned
Don't you think that that kind of defeats the point of even having Miis in the game? Having Nikki in the game as opposed to choosing your own Mii (which could include, uh, duh, Nikki or yourself or thousands of other characters or things)? That'd be kind of lame actually.
ScraftyDevil
Banned
You can't have too many Pokémon reps. There should be 8 Pokémon reps at least so that Jigglypuff, Red and Pikachu keep their slots while every other Gen get one rep each.
There's Also the issue of his Pokemon taking bonus knockback due to their types. Ivysaur had it the worst since a lot of characters have fire attacks.
Back when Black and White came out, I dreamt up a Pokémon Trainer Black, using Hilda's model, who'd command three Pokémon: Tepig, Dewott and Serperior.
Tepig: A small Pichu-sized fighter who scampers on all fours
Dewott: The well-rounded bipedal with shell-blades
Serperior: Smash's first limbless fighter, manipulating objects with his prehensile tail
All together, they'd be a rather unique team. Of course, since X and Y will be out before Smash, this pipe dream has become even pipe-ier (lol).
nintendoman58
Member
Despite all the hate, I think Zoroark should be the replacement for Lucario here. His illusion ability would work so well. Press B to randomly change into another fighter on screen. Get hit and you instantly revert back.
Lucario had a gameplay style that made him unique with his aura in brawl (the more damage he had, the more damage he did), and I think a gameplay with Zoroark's ability would fit in with the new Smash perfectly.
Lucario had a gameplay style that made him unique with his aura in brawl (the more damage he had, the more damage he did), and I think a gameplay with Zoroark's ability would fit in with the new Smash perfectly.
That's the simplest yet coolest implementation I've seen proposed for the Illusion ability. A good Zoroark player could emulate his opponent at length if he can avoid being hit.
NeonZ
Member
Rather than making his gimmick a disadvantage, I think they should make it an advantage. Give limited health regen upon using a Pokemon for the first time in that stock (which would be lost if you returned to the previous Pokemon), and you could see people wanting opportunities to change Pokemon and actually have an incentive for having to deal with 3 different play styles.
Illusion is only aesthetic, so I don't see what gameplay function it would serve. You couldn't transform into, say, Kirby, while still using Zoroark's attacks. The animations wouldn't fit. I could see it being incorporated into his taunts and victory animations, but that's it.
Then, uh, they could balance them like they should be doing anyway
Really, it's a broken mechanic. Again, just camp a bit and your opponent will be tired in no time, being forced to switch. It's just awful.
Nintendoman is proposing a reworking of the Illusion mechanic so that you not only copy the opponent's appearance, but can copy their abilities, as well. I.E. Zoroark becomes Mario, and now moves like Mario and can shoot fireballs like Mario, etc. But as soon as Zoroark is hit, the illusion breaks, and he goes back to being Zoroark.
ScraftyDevil
Banned
The irony to that was that Ivysaur was both the lightest of the three, so if you waited too long you could be KO'd on the switch.
Just let me play as solo Squirtle, Sakurai ;_;
I understand that, but Zoroark's only a shapeshifter in Pokémon canon, so I don't know if Game Freak would allow for the replication of abilities (or if Sakurai would even want to).
Perhaps Zoroark would still "keep his moves" while transformed. So using Kirby for example, if he attacked with his back aerial, Zoroark could potentially have more range and hit unsuspecting opponents (just an example). To keep it balanced, Illusion would have to have startup / revert the instant you got hit.
Oh, really? Ivysaur was my favorite of the three and I never quite felt vulnerable as him. Really, all three characters were excellent. I love Squirtle's spinning shell move and Charizard's air attack where he flaps his wings forward while blasting fire.
Ivysaur turned out terrible, even if I think he's really fun. You can literally throw him out of the stage and grab the ledge and he's done. His recovery issues put Ivysaur individually below Link or Bowser easily. Characters that can throw projectiles downwards like Peach or Sonic are particularly great at getting VERY early kills on poor Ivysaur.