User 100115
Banned
Conflicting witness statements to call it into question, for one. What indisputable evidence do you have that his friends testimony is a lie?
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George Zimmerman (killer of unarmed Florida teen Trayvon Martin) found not guilty
- Thread starter Dude Abides
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Conflicting witness statements to call it into question, for one. What indisputable evidence do you have that his friends testimony is a lie?
what did they ask?
I don't, I'm just calling it into question based on odd behavior and the fact that she previously lied under oath. The same as your doing with Zimmerman.
But because I'm one of the few siding with Zimmerman so far I'm the only one getting called out for it.
Byakuya769
Member
First time hearing a trial? She's not going to be like a witness in the movies and the courtroom isn't going to erupt in tears and applause.
I think the prosecution objected to something and then the judge called them up. The defense just said they wanted to make a speaking objection all of a sudden. It was very odd.
faceless007
Member
Zimmerman hasn't testified yet. Doubtful he will.
Hmm, that raises the question of how the defense is going to depict the fight. Without Zimmerman testifying to his account (stopping and then Martin coming up to him and saying "Well you have a problem now" like he was a Steven Seagal movie villain), the only admitted account of what actually happened is Rachel's.
User 100115
Banned
For one, she doesn't have several other people stating that different events occurred.
What indisputable evidence do you have that Martin initiated the conflict as the killer says.
Odd behaviour? Could you expand on that? And in regards to her lying under oath, I might be missing something but when was this? I've been listening for like 20minutes, and they mentioned that she lied about her age - but that wasn't under oath was it? It mentions she also lied about why she didn't go to the wake.
Testimony? He hasn't testified has he? But he has been caught in a lie or two - for example his money thing with his wife, and if I remember correctly (I might be remembering it wrong) - his story of how the altercation happened changed a few times before he decided on the final series of events. Could be wrong though, it's been a while.
Xenon
Member
Why would you side with Zimmerman before the trial is finished?
She was under oath when she lied about why she did not go to the wake. She said it was because she felt very guilty for not going and got very upset saying she did not want to see the body.
Those two lies are the main thing everyone is talking about because they were under oath.
Dude Abides
Banned
At least one of them wasn't actually under oath. The defense counsel stated that a few minutes ago.
Got ya. I guess I just don't see them as relevant lies - it has nothing to really do with the case, and they both make complete sense.
What witnesses other than her are saying Zimmerman initiated the confrontation?
I said "so far".
User 100115
Banned
As far as I recall, there are several witness that are calling his statements into question, and as other people have said, his story has changed several times.
Knowing what we know so far, why would you side with Zimmerman?
Gotcha, now we are on to their texts lol
OrangeYouGlad
Banned
I was just going to ask why this guy is dragging out the texts. Is he trying to establish a different relationship between the witness and Martin?
faceless007
Member
...What the hell? What does her friend/girlfriend status have to do with anything?
The Abominable Snowman
Member
Theyre trying to throw as much doubt on her ability to remember as possible
vas_a_morir
Banned
It's his opinion. Let it slide.
faceless007
Member
Dammit, prosecution, control your witness from volunteering information.
Equus Bellator Apex
Junior Member
They're trying to paint the relationship as one sided.
soundscream
Member
She is on point with her dates.
not psycho
Member
This is correct, but it is very easy to establish self defense.
The defendant never has to prove self defense, they just have to provide some evidence for it. Any evidence at all, it doesn't have to be fully convincing.
Once you provide something, you establish self defense, and the prosecution now has to prove beyond a reasonable doubt that it wasn't self defense.
OrangeYouGlad
Banned
I wonder if the prosecution groomed her into remembering those dates.
Leaving your vehicle after being told not to by a 911 operator isn't an initiation of confrontation? If he wasn't going to confront Martin, why did he get out of the vehicle?
Because no one (other than Martin's friend who has already lied under oath) has said that Zimmerman started the fight between the two, and Martin had no damage to his body other than the gunshot wound and the abrasion by his knuckle, while Zimmerman had multiple wounds on the face and back of the scalp.
So it seems to me that so far it comes down to whether you believe Martin jumped Zimmerman as Zimmerman states or if you believe Martin's friend that Zimmerman walked up behind Martin and started the altercation.
I don't know why the prosecution isn't objecting to this meandering questioning.
Officerrob
Banned
She's killing it on dates and times
BronsonLee
Member
This screams trap card... She knows the dates and times pat
Very rarely does it seem like the defense is trying to get any substantial answers from her.
vas_a_morir
Banned
They've tried, and it's been overruled. My only guess is... there is nothing legally objectionable going on.
Ask the Dude. He'd know.
KibblesBits
Member
This cross examination seems like it's been going on forever.
He was already out of his vehicle when the dispatcher asked if he was following, so...
faceless007
Member
What's this Krump interview she's referring to?
Dude Abides
Banned
You get a lot of leeway on cross. And it's not as if her testimony is a model of clarity.
Xenon
Member
Ahhh, I thought you meant, so far you were the only one on this forum to support Zimmerman. Even still it's a bit early to be picking sides. Once you do that it can change your perspective and how you view things.
It has, and they are really wearing her down. I am afraid she is going to break at some point. I don't know that I could stand this crap.
I see.
Yeah that was a good one again caught changing her story then tries to cover it up "well I didn't take that interview seriously" Nice move
Her statement has never been that Zimmerman started a physical altercation though, has it? The implication is that he started the fight by following and confronting Martin - after that she has been consistent in saying that she doesn't know what happened.
And I know she lied under oath once, but... it feels like it's such a silly lie. I'm not a lawyer, so I can't really know about the relevance - but it's like lying about your natural hair colour on the stand because you're embarrassed, and then using that lie for character assassination.
The testimony of every person of interest so far has contradicted at least one major component of Zimmerman's account of how the fight went down (which itself has changed significantly over time). Every testimony has suggested that Zimmerman not only was an aggressor in the lead up to the fight, but during the actual fight, as well.
Furthermore, everyone, including the defense, agrees that Zimmerman killed Trayvon Martin after abandoning the safety of his own home and his vehicle to engage Trayvon Martin, who he perceived to be a dangerous criminal that was fleeing from George Zimmerman.
The preponderance of the evidence and testimony seems to paint Trayvon as the victim rather than Zimmerman, even ignoring the outcome of the fight.
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