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[Transhuman]

Am I the only one who thinks the term "friendzoned" has an undeserved sense of entitlement to it? That's why I don't like it.

To clarify, I mean it seems like when a guy uses the term to describe his relationship with a girl, they exude a sense of entitlement because of how they went about pursuing the girl. I dunno. It comes off as "she denied my advances even though they were supposed to work and now I'm in the friendzone."

Exactly.

It makes it seem like the girl has done something wrong. "She friendzoned me" or "I got friendzoned", as opposed to- "I asked if she wanted to be more than friends and it didn't work out".

It puts the failure of the situation on the person doing the rejecting instead of the rejectee.

 

[-Pyromaniac-]

I think people read into the term too much. Friendzone is just when you have feelings toward someone and they don't share them and just want to be your friend. There's no malicious intent in the term. Not sure why some people see that there is.

 

[BigEvilTurtle]

Exactly.

It makes it seem like the girl has done something wrong. "She friendzoned me" or "I got friendzoned", as opposed to- "I asked if she wanted to be more than friends and it didn't work out".

It puts the failure of the situation on the person doing the rejecting instead of the rejectee.

This is pretty much how I feel about it. It's the connotation of the term.

 

[TUROK]

The friend zone doesn't exist. You creepily confessed feelings of love to someone you barely know and were pretending to just be friends with.

You're lucky she's taking the time to let you down softly.

Overly PC GAF is my favorite GAF.

So many biased assumptions just to make your point.

 

[Dr_Boris_Goltz]

The second you feel you would want to take things further you have to make your intentions UNBELIEVABLY CLEAR.

I'm saying the very moment you realize, "Hey I could see her as a girlfriend," you have to immediately tell her. It's ridiculous thinking that somehow you will just naturally become a couple.

And if that doesn't work out then you can decide if you want to remain friends.

 

[Mononoke]

I had this happen to me once. I met this girl in college and we shared all the same interests. She would always call me all the time, and wanted to hang out a lot. We even would go on dinner dates (don't worry, we split the cost). She was giving off (what I thought) was all these obvious signals. Like she would touch me a lot in public (rest her head on my shoulder, or touch my arm when we sat next to each other in class etc.). Then she started buying concert tickets for us, and we would take turns driving out to the city to go to shows. So after about 4 months of this, I finally asked her out.

Yeahhh, turns out she just wanted a really good friend. Shit was mad awkward after I asked her out. I kind of did the immature thing and avoided her for a couple of months (not because I was mad, just because I was more so embarrassed that I misread the signals so badly). I had plenty of girlfriends before her too, and this to me was like THE MOST OBVIOUS that a girl was into me (the other girls I dated were a lot more work before we finally dated).

But after a while, we moved past the awkwardness. And we are still like best friends today. And to be clear, it was never a case where she was using me, or wanted things from me. Whenever we did stuff, we always either paid for ourselves, or split the cost. She just wanted someone to hang out with. So I learned from that, to never just assume someone is into you, regardless how obvious you think the signals are. And also, sometimes it's just impossible to tell. Either you have to access whether you want to take the risk (or chance ruining the friendship), or be able to take the risk, but not get wounded and just move on and still be friends.

 

[Karkador]

It puts the failure of the situation on the person doing the rejecting instead of the rejectee.

and despite what people are claiming, that "friendzone" is a gender-neutral term, I have seen way more guys take that attitude than women

I think people read into the term too much. Friendzone is just when you have feelings toward someone and they don't share them and just want to be your friend. There's no malicious intent in the term. Not sure why some people see that there is.

I agree that "friendzone" is probably an innocuous term, but If you haven't seen the attitudes and statements that tend to accompany the word, you probably haven't been paying attention.

 

[royalan]

Exactly.

It makes it seem like the girl has done something wrong. "She friendzoned me" or "I got friendzoned", as opposed to- "I asked if she wanted to be more than friends and it didn't work out".

It puts the failure of the situation on the person doing the rejecting instead of the rejectee.

Then argue negative connotation, not gendered connotation.

The former's less stupid.

and despite what people are claiming, that "friendzone" is a gender-neutral term, I have seen way more guys take that attitude than women

I understand that, and that is a problem, but none of that is actually implied by the term "friendzoned."

ANYONE and EVERYONE can be friendzoned, and it happens often to EVERYONE. Men may use the term more often, but that's just a symptom of the fact that we still live in a society where men are socially expected to be the pursuers/instigators in a relationship. But that alone doesn't make friendzoned a "gendered" term. A girl/gay man will just as easily use the phrase when they're attracted to someone who only regards them in a platonic sense, and it doesn't mean anything less or different in those cases.

.

 

[Transhuman]

Then argue negative connotation, not gendered connotation.

The former's less stupid.

Would you argue that calling a girl a slut isn't sexist, because guys can be called sluts too? Sheesh.

 

[-Pyromaniac-]

I agree that "friendzone" is probably an innocuous term, but If you haven't seen the attitudes and statements that tend to accompany the word, you probably haven't been paying attention.

I don't know I just never looked at it that way. At least in my personal life any time someone has ever used the term friendzone like you got friendzoned by her! They were never damning the girl for doing it they were damning the situation. As in you put yourself out there and got rejected, that suxxx.

But I am sure there's some that blame the rejecter.

 

[Bad_Boy]

I'm pretty sure i'll get friend zoned tonight. Going out with this chick who is completely out of my league. I've dated good looking girls before, but this one.... gez.

 

[BigEvilTurtle]

I don't know I just never looked at it that way. At least in my personal life any time someone has ever used the term friendzone like you got friendzoned by her! They were never damning the girl for doing it they were damning the situation. As in you put yourself out there and got rejected, that suxxx.

But I am sure there's some that blame the rejecter.

Oftentimes when people use the term, there is a bit of implied malice toward the rejecter. But it's not always like this of course. This is where the negative connotation of the word comes from for me.

 

[TUROK]

ITT I learned that "friend zone" is a sexist and misogynist term rather than simply describing a situation in which someone considers you just a friend with no romantic aspirations (current or future), even though you may feel otherwise.

It's so amazing how people have no idea how ridiculous they sound when they push their pre-conceived notions on a fucking colloquial term that has no concrete agreed-upon definition.

And then they look upon any person who uses the word as an entitled little shit, even though that person may not even be using the word in the way the person judging them is.

The lack of self-awareness is baffling.

 

[Darkmakaimura]

Would you argue that calling a girl a slut isn't sexist, because guys can be called sluts too? Sheesh.

Slut is a gender specific slur.

Friendzone is not gender specific nor is it a slur.

 

[BigEvilTurtle]

It's so amazing how people have no idea how ridiculous they sound when they push their pre-conceived notions on a fucking colloquial term that has no concrete agreed-upon definition.

And then they look upon any person who uses the word as an entitled little shit, even though that person may not even be using the word in the way the person judging them is.

The lack of self-awareness is baffling.

It's not entirely weird for words to have different meanings and connotations to different people, you know, but I definitely see where you're coming from.

 

[jimi_dini]

What?

He played too much Deus Ex: Human Revolution.

 

[Liu Kang Baking A Pie]

It's so amazing how people have no idea how ridiculous they sound when they push their pre-conceived notions on a fucking colloquial term that has no concrete agreed-upon definition.

And then they look upon any person who uses the word as an entitled little shit, even though that person may not even be using the word in the way the person judging them is.

The lack of self-awareness is baffling.

I remember it was popularized by the Ladder Theory, which is pretty much the height of evolutionary psychology wankery and male self-victimization. Then MRAs got really into it. The term doesn't have the best history.

 

[royalan]

Would you argue that calling a girl a slut isn't sexist, because guys can be called sluts too? Sheesh.

Actually, I do think the meaning of the term "slut" as used today is shifting a bit, but that's another can of worms for another thread.

To answer your question, I don't think this analogy applies here. The term "slut" was originally derived with much clearer and more strict gender connotations than the term "friendzone"...which has ALWAYS been used in a gender-neutral way. As I said earlier, you just happen to see more men using it because more men tend to be the instigators of relationships.

This is different from "slut," which was derived at a time when it was practically unthinkable, socially, to consider a man a slut.

 

[Karkador]

Would you argue that calling a girl a slut isn't sexist, because guys can be called sluts too? Sheesh.

This. It's pretty much ignoring the context and history of the word.

Royalan, I get what you're saying that the term isn't inherently sexist or harmful, but using the conditional "if only we didn't live in a society where men are looked at as having persue the relationships" is a pretty big "if" and ignoring tons of context.

Anecdotally, I've friendzoned women and they did not, at least to my knowledge, do anything weird or act like it could have been more.

 

[Messypandas]

The terms fine, as long as you accept that if you bottle your feelings, stifle your advances and always play the quiet type hiding in the outskirts then you'll always be in the "friend-zone". Projecting some type of embittered blame onto the pursuee is bullshit.

 

[Karkador]

The terms fine, as long as you accept that if you bottle your feelings, stifle your advances and always play the quiet type hiding in the outskirts then you'll always be in the "friend-zone". Projecting some type of embittered blame onto the pursuee is bullshit.

Or on some other guy who has nothing to do with you, as I see a lot in friendzone stories, including this one

 

[RyanDG]

There's only one thing that will work now...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4clhZZ6sdjk

 

[Beardz]

"Sir, don't break the touch barrier please"

 

[flippedb]

Are you GAF Man, OP?

 

[The Technomancer]

There's only one thing that will work now...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4clhZZ6sdjk

DON'T YOU KNOW YOU'RE GONNA SHOCK THE MONKEY

SHOCK THE MONKEY

 

[royalan]

This. It's pretty much ignoring the context and history of the word.

Royalan, I get what you're saying that the term isn't inherently sexist or harmful, but using the conditional "if only we didn't live in a society where men are looked at as having persue the relationships" is a pretty big "if" and ignoring tons of context.

Anecdotally, I've friendzoned women and they did not, at least to my knowledge, do anything weird or act like it could have been more.

The context of "friendzoned" is nothing at all like the context of the word "slut". The term "friend-zone" itself comes from a much more gender-neutral background, and there are famous examples throughout the years that the term has existed of men rejecting woman on the grounds that they only view them as friends. I mean, just look at shit like Dawson's Creek and My Best Friend's Wedding, significant bits of pop culture that focus on that very idea of men friendzoning women.

It's not the same as slut, which came about at a time when it was literally UNHEARD OF to hold a man's sexuality against him in that way.

A simply question to ask yourselves: if a female, or homosexual used the term "friendzone" would it mean ANYTHING different than if a male used it? Would it invoke a different response or subconscious reaction? Not at all.

 

[SHIT]

girls are just mad because we know about the friendzone now.

pretty much this

people are wiseing up and refusing to simply waste their time and money and just move on

its better for everyone involved

 

[Sianos]

Attractions between people are not the same as attractions of particles. There's no "touch barrier", no "friend zone" and no complex mathematical formula to get a date.

Just try and relax, feel chill and at peace with the world but confident in who you are. Don't stress too much, don't think too much, just live and enjoy yourself.

 

[Zuhzuhzombie!!]

Am I the only one who thinks the term "friendzoned" has an undeserved sense of entitlement to it? That's why I don't like it.

Entitlement and a lack of socialization.

 

[Colocho]

Touch barrier is my new favorite term of the week.

 

[Zuhzuhzombie!!]

"Didn't make a move soon enough"

That's not how relationships work.

 

[SHIT]

Touch barrier is my new favorite term of the week.

is it bad of me to hope this escalates into a full out love confession by OP (if he is recording the whole thing on his phone) and then all of a sudden it gets real awkward the other guy simply calls the cops and it turns into a WSHH thread

you owe it to yourself to see this though to the end OP.

 

[RyanDG]

Touch barrier is my new favorite term of the week.

I have to admit, when I read that part of the OP's post, I couldn't help but imagining some guy in a corner watching another guy brush the hair out of a girl's face, and secretly tallying up the touch on a special "touch card tracker".

 

[SHIT]

I have to admit, when I read that part of the OP's post, I couldn't help but imagining some guy in a corner watching another guy brush the hair out of a girl's face, and secretly tallying up the touch on a special "touch card tracker".

someone should make an app for this for android, iOS and win phone.
to keep tabs on how many times her touch barrier is violated.
what happens if the other guy is fucking her?

does each thrust counts as 2 or 1 violations ?
what about handjobs, does that count as her breaking your touch barrier ?

 

[mikeGFG]

That's not how relationships work.

lmao

 

[Hawkian]

Damn OP, you were close too. A girl's Touch Barrier has about 1300 organic hitpoints. Every touch to her hand takes away about 10 hitpoints, but touching her knee takes out a chunkier good 50 hitpoints. A lot of knee touches over the course of a month would've meant you breaking that Touch Barrier and reaching the final phase of the encounter.

Now, because Life is a Free-2-Play experience, the playing field isn't always fair. You can work out at the gym at least four days a week to gain an Attraction Booster to double your Touch effectiveness (that means every knee caress takes 100hp off that Touch Barrier instead of 50!).

Once her Touch Barrier is down, then you've earned the right to capture her for your own romantic purposes. Just toss a Date Ball at her and she'll have to say yes.

you're my favorite of all the lumps.

 

[Zuhzuhzombie!!]

You sound like you think you know what you're talking about, but in reality are completely clueless.

Yes, because in reality, relationships are completely black and white and irreversible. In reality, women are a certain way and you must make a move at a specific time for maximum efficiency.

Jesus Christ.

Put the manga down, son.



edit


^^^^^^^
Said it better than I can.

 

[terrene]

3. I encourage you to get beyond this shallow (and very recent!) "friendzone" concept. It's a silly myth that's been spread by self-involved, pathetic dudes who think they are owed sex by women. I doubt you're that kind of guy, so why talk like one? To these dudes, the natural or default relationship progression is supposed to be I like a girl -> we become friends -> I fall for her -> I tell her I like her -> we have a romantic relationship. These morons think that when the last part doesn't happen, they've got something to whine and complain about ("Ugh! Friendzoned!"). I'm normally much more inclined to feel sympathy for women who are constantly "sexzoned" by guys who misrepresent themselves as looking for an honest, simple friendship, when in fact they're trying to fuck. So, anyway, I hope you'll just drop the "friendzone" shit. it's an unhelpful way to look at things.

What a load of bunk. *I* have a fucking friendzone, and I'm a guy. It means I see them as friends, but have no romantic or sexual interest. Whatever bullshit Tumblr says that term implies is probably what ought to be dropped. A term that is literally interchangeable for "platonic" is the least of feminism's worries.

 

[Liu Kang Baking A Pie]

What a load of bunk. *I* have a fucking friendzone, and I'm a guy. It means I see them as friends, but have no romantic or sexual interest. Whatever bullshit Tumblr says that term implies is probably what ought to be dropped. A term that is literally interchangeable for "platonic" is the least of feminism's worries.

I think when some guys can start to feel as if they were entitled to a person but that person sucks for putting them in a made-up zone, yeah, it should be a pretty big worry.

This is where I have to add the disclaimer that obviously not everyone thinks that way, and I'm sure you're a real nice guy, but some guys out there suck and it's best not to be making them feel as if the way they take their terrible insecurities out on potential mates is valid.

 

[royalan]

I think when some guys can start to feel as if they were entitled to a person but that person sucks for putting them in a made-up zone, yeah, it should be a pretty big worry.

You're on the right track, but YOU'RE the one who keeps inserting gender where it doesn't need to be here. This can happen to ANYONE. That's the point of the post you were responding to.

 

[terrene]

I think when some guys can start to feel as if they were entitled to a person but that person sucks for putting them in a made-up zone, yeah, it should be a pretty big worry.

This is where I have to add the disclaimer that obviously not everyone thinks that way, and I'm sure you're a real nice guy, but some guys out there suck and it's best not to be making them feel as if the way they take their terrible insecurities out on potential mates is valid.

Who said anything about being entitled? Friendzone = platonic. Whether you felt entitled to non-platonic is neither referred to or encapsulated in the term friendzone. Which, welcome to mine by the way.

Look man, I really care about feminism for personal reasons and I generally keep quiet about it and let women and activists take the lead, but I don't think the people who accuse dating rejectees of feeling entitled realize that the person who got rejected is probably just disappointed, which is perfectly understandable.

 

[Liu Kang Baking A Pie]

You're on the right track, but YOU'RE the one who keeps inserting gender where it doesn't need to be here. This can happen to ANYONE. That's the point of the post you were responding to.

I understand your point that anyone can say it and do it and feel it, but it's commonly known as a thing fedoraed men do to women who were unfortunately nice to them. I feel like ignoring that to make this out to be everyone's struggle or something is diminishing the problem.

 

[terrene]

I think the use of the term friendzone that's problematic is the PUA who sees a friendzone as a mutable object -- a literal place, that he just needs to penetrate through, like it's his little challenge that will test his manhood and worth. The garden variety guy who just got rejected and is like "aw, damn, I'm friendzoned!" doesn't meant it that way, and doesn't need Tumblr jumping on him, kicking him when he's down, assuming that he meant that in the absolute worst way that is possible to mean it. How does that help anything or anyone? Because guess what, the vast majority of guys are NOT PUAs and are in fact trying to be sensitive as they go about this whole dating thing.

P.S. Do yourself a favor and read less "Fedoras of OK Cupid" and "Nice Guys of OK Cupid." They are obviously making you believe those are random and representative samples if you really view the use of this word as a "problem" (your word).

 

[SeanR1221]

OP. You are not in love. You are infatuated. There's a huge difference.

 

[Zuhzuhzombie!!]

Jesus christ dude...where the fuck are you getting any of this from my post?

Making a move isn't a technique or black and white or well..anything you're currently projecting lol.

You know when you or somebody you know is talking to a girl, and you/they feel like kissing her, but you/the other person are too nervous, don't do anything, and the situation just gets awkward? That's not making a move. Making a move is just pushing past your anxieties and expressing your personal needs/desires. It's not a cheat code, or whatever the fuck you're talking about.

And the post that I responded to intimated that not making a move soon enough/at the right time puts in in some arbitrary "friendzone". I said that's not how relationships work, and you responded, and now here we are.

 

[tkscz]

OP, listen, you will get over it. I know you have been told you will like a thousand times in this thread, but you will. Here is the thing, don't go back, especially after finding someone else. Take it from someone who found something good after being friend zoned, and went back. Don't do it, once you finally let go, never grab it again.

 

[terrene]

By the way, to the OP, I think it's always a mistake to start with some kind of confession of feelings. Not that your feelings are anything to be ashamed of, they're great. But the best way to express them would've been to ask her to do stuff in a way that makes clear what your intentions are. Talk in situations that can be joined, not states of being that must be dealt with. How wrong would this feel to say?

"Look, I didn't mean to unload on you earlier with some kind of big heavy confession. I just really like you, and I was hoping you'd let me take you out sometime."

If someone said that to you, wouldn't that sound more FUN than having to respond to a -- perhaps somewhat random -- emotional outpouring? Because you really can put yourself in her shoes and approach her the way you would want to be approached if the roles were reversed and do great. The "secret" about women no PUA ever tells you is that they're exactly like you, just dealing with different circumstances.

 

[Liu Kang Baking A Pie]

Pokezoned.

 

[terrene]

Pokezoned.

Okay, that was pretty funny

 

[AlexSmash]

Attractions between people are not the same as attractions of particles. There's no "touch barrier", no "friend zone" and no complex mathematical formula to get a date.

Just try and relax, feel chill and at peace with the world but confident in who you are. Don't stress too much, don't think too much, just live and enjoy yourself.

liste to those wise words

but lets not all pretend here, that we never fell in love with a girl after knowing her for one month.
its just something that happens to some people and its ok. and after the 1st or 2nd time some will learn