Shadow map resolution, texture quality, anti-aliasing, transparency resolution (smoke, etc), object LOD, SSAO accuracy, etc. There are a lot of things they can scale back.
EDGE: "Power struggle: the real differences between PS4 and Xbox One performance"
- Thread starter Musiol
- Start date
Shadow map resolution, texture quality, anti-aliasing, transparency resolution (smoke, etc), object LOD, SSAO accuracy, etc. There are a lot of things they can scale back.
Mihael Mello Keehl
Banned
I thought that was max for a long good secondXbox is back baby!
Think of this thread as a honeypot.
digoutyoursoul
Member
What you mean is because Xbox One has the weaker hardware so certain people are trying to twist the argument saying gameplay over graphics, right?
I responded to a guy who said Infamous wipes the floor with Dead Rising in response to Edge's piece. I wasn't sure if he meant purely on a technical level or overall. If overall I disagree, Dead Rising in the past has been the more enjoyable experience then Infamous for me anyway and from what I have seen from the these new entries nothing has changed. That's all there is to it. No loyalty to companies, no agenda, no snidey little warrior tactics. Just an opinion on two games. It's getting fucking ridiculous this.
Here. Here.
The sensible thing would be healthy skepticism over all launch titles on both platforms. The only two new retail exclusives I feel relatively confident about are Killzone and Forza. For everything else, I think there's more reason to be pessimistic than optimistic about Knack, DR3, KI and Ryse, and console warriors hyping one console's games and bashing the other's is utterly asinine.
My first game will likely be Blacklight: Retribution or Warframe...known and proven commodities that may not push the hardware but certainly make good use of it.
deputyspade
Member
Dead Rising 2 was pretty underwhelming and Capcom is one bad game away from being bankrupt. I don't have much confidence in DR3 being much better than DR2 was.
shinra-bansho
Member
If I was responding directly to you I would have quoted you.
My comment was more general commentary on 1) how pointless arguments about "fun" are since such matters are entirely subjective, and 2) the resurgence of the false dichotomy between "gameplay" and "power."
Your current comment seems directed to the former? I have no real issue with anyone finding one thing more "fun" than another. I simply find statements of such generally redundant. They cannot be proven or dis-proven, they cannot be argued, they cannot be discussed, because they're always going to vary from person to person.
digoutyoursoul
Member
I see. Well I have said all I have had to say , I shall leave it at that.
Sword Of Doom
Member
And that's why so many people have issues with that Edge article
deputyspade
Member
Please elaborate on these issues you have with the edge article. It appears we keep getting confirmation that the article was accurate. The COD Ghosts being demoed on PS4 hardware further confirms that.
SwiftDeath
Member
Pretty sure sword is referring to the other edge article where it made some quips about launch games between the two
NoMoreTrolls
Banned
He's taking about the garbage article that made the faulty game comparisons. The one that reads like PR. Shinobi made a thread for it, it's probably floating around the front page right now.
Edit: beaten
mangochutney
Member
COD is finished, and pressed on both platforms so they're both as far along as they'll ever be.
deputyspade
Member
Oh Lawd, I was unaware of that article. It did indeed read as a Microsoft PR piece and quoted Phil Harrison a few too many times. That obviously wasn't written by the same guy that wrote the power difference article. I could have sworn I had read this article before on a different site. It looks a lot like the article on Forbes, written by Erik Kain, about 6 weeks ago. It has all the content of this article with the exception of multiple quotes from Microsoft PR guys.
Xenon
Member
Huh? Choosing any system is a matter if opinion. Both were opinion peices supported by some facts and personal preferences.
The PS4 is the more powerful system, fact.
PS4 is the best system to own this upcoming generation, opinion.
fastford58
Member
Your tag is hilarious.
deputyspade
Member
It did read like an opinion piece and didn't even have an author willing to take credit (or blame) for it. It looked like one of those opinion pieces I see submitted to N4G quite often.
TheExecutive
Member
I have no idea why but I platinumed the original infamous and beat the second twice. If I went solely by amount of playthroughs the infamous series is my favorite of this gen.
I don't think it's that good of a game- I sound crazy but yeah...
fastford58
Member
I would say your second point may become fact before too long.
Yep.
Sword Of Doom
Member
I wasn't referring to the OP. My apologies. Earlier we were discussing another article from edge.
Sword Of Doom
Member
NoMoreTrolls
Banned
So... did you not comprehend what you read? The two articles are vastly different in the way that the opinions are couched.
Please tell me that you can see the glaring disparity between the two.
With recent rumors about COD being 720p on Xbone, added to an already big list of sub-HD games on Xbone, I had a simple explanation for this (you can take it with large grain of salt) but I will lay it down anyway:
I firmly believe that X1 GPU is more than capable of 1080p rendering, the problem lies in DDR3+eSRAM memory configuration for X1. 32mb of fast eSRAM is not enough to hold high-quality textures , it's just too small for such a huge increase in textures quality expected for next generation consoles. Sony was forward thinking by considering a TRUE unified pool of RAM for PS4 (accessible for both CPU/GPU at the same time). Xbox one will suffer throughout the generation, it's simply a machine that's not designed for 1080p gaming and the bottleneck is the memory system, not the GPU itself.
Cboat latest posts about 1080p being the exception in X1 just solidified my thought.
I firmly believe that X1 GPU is more than capable of 1080p rendering, the problem lies in DDR3+eSRAM memory configuration for X1. 32mb of fast eSRAM is not enough to hold high-quality textures , it's just too small for such a huge increase in textures quality expected for next generation consoles. Sony was forward thinking by considering a TRUE unified pool of RAM for PS4 (accessible for both CPU/GPU at the same time). Xbox one will suffer throughout the generation, it's simply a machine that's not designed for 1080p gaming and the bottleneck is the memory system, not the GPU itself.
Cboat latest posts about 1080p being the exception in X1 just solidified my thought.
Sword Of Doom
Member
You talking about COD?
The big exclusive games (Forza/Ryse) run in 1080/900 respectivly. I think what we have is the "hard to develop" aspect ESRAM rearing its ugly head. The studios that have been working on exclusive X1 content have had longer to do it and can dedicate more resources to it. Third party games like CoD, AC4, BF4 etc have to develop multiple versions and aren't going to fool around trying to optimize the X1 version. it also appears like the X1 was rushed out the gate and should have been coming out in 2014.
I think as developers start to work with the system more you'll start to see better results. It may not be, but I hope that's the case.
I think as developers start to work with the system more you'll start to see better results. It may not be, but I hope that's the case.
SwiftDeath
Member
So yeah I guess we will be seeing significant differences between launch games and all that
Only question is how dev tools will improve on both systems over the generation and what happens to the gap that is clearly very significant at present
Only question is how dev tools will improve on both systems over the generation and what happens to the gap that is clearly very significant at present
Sinthor
Gold Member
I don't see how that could be the issue for devs when it's almost exactly how the 360 was setup?? This smells like BS to me. I'm sure things will get better as time goes on and devs learn to be more efficient with code, but then the same will happen on the PS4 side, and that raw horsepower advantage won't be overcome by clever coding.
The problem with eSRAM is not that it's "hard to develop" it's that it's no match for a better GPU with constant 176GBs access to a full 8GB of GDDR5.
A little 32MB scratch pad with questionable bandwidth is only going to go so far. Developers had all last gen to learn how to work around eDRAM on the 360 and even the PS2 before that. It's not like it's an exotic configuration like the Cell with its oddball SPEs and such that developers eventually figured out for the most part. eSRAM is just a hack to compensate for slow system RAM.
eddfromtheriver
Banned
CBOAT said that they might improve the tools... but the gap will always be there, it's not another "CELL" type situation at all.
Also Sony has more ACEs for gpgpu....
And HUMA....
By the time they figure out ESRAM...
I think the gap will widen personally
Syphon Filter
Member
isnt that a good thing for MS.
Night Angel
Member
No. The console is not balanced (it only has 14 CUs for graphics anyway), and we all know that most of that GPGPU is for audio that will be done with SHAPE on the One. What we're seeing here is just a case of lazy developers who can't use the One's 200+ GB/s RAM. Not that resolution matters, anyway. Just wait for the exclusives; those will really shine.
/s
Can we please set up a crow buffet in here? It seems like a fitting way to send this thread into the netherworld in style.
Whiteshirt
Member
No because the Cell was actually a beast that was hard to use. Once you actually use it, the results are actually pretty good and even some games ended up being technically better on the PS3 despite everything else being against it.
The Xbox One can only really get less worse.
eddfromtheriver
Banned
I don't see how the gap staying there for the remainder of the yet to start next generation is a good thing?
And this:
Night Angel
Member
To be fair, at least SOME of the gap will close. That's a good thing. No one with reasonable expectations is shooting for total equality; better than now is still better for those who can't afford/don't want both consoles and are getting an XB1.
Whilst the Xbox One's tools are maturing in order to make up for the performance deficit from the GPU, the bandwidth of the DDR3 and the limited ram amount of the Esram, the PS4 tools will also mature to take further advantage of hUMA, the added Compute advantages, ACE's and so on.
I don't see the gap closing. Only the goal posts moving.
James Sawyer Ford
Banned
It really seems like the differences between the two platforms are much larger than some had suggested previously.
900p with better effects vs. toned down 720p sounds about what I expected when the power information was revealed (that is, a significant difference).
But we're also getting games running 1080p on PS4 and 720p on Xbox One.
I'm wondering if that's going to be the case with AC4 as well.
I never expected that sort of gap. Microsoft's PR over the past few months about balance and not being able to tell a difference between the PS4 has really come home to roost as being completely disingenuous.
900p with better effects vs. toned down 720p sounds about what I expected when the power information was revealed (that is, a significant difference).
But we're also getting games running 1080p on PS4 and 720p on Xbox One.
I'm wondering if that's going to be the case with AC4 as well.
I never expected that sort of gap. Microsoft's PR over the past few months about balance and not being able to tell a difference between the PS4 has really come home to roost as being completely disingenuous.
Night Angel
Member
And that's a distinct possibility (I even think it's likely). I was playing devil's advocate to present a reasonable counterpoint (something we don't often see due to emotional investment in the warz).
Yes, if compute is all that it's cracked up to be (which I believe it is, since we haven't seen any evidence to the contrary), the gap will widen once more. Hopefully, though, the XB1 won't be stuck with 720 on most of its games.
TheOctodad
Member
The next big bomba for me would be Destiny. I think that's going to be a make or break title for MS to achieve parity with.
Night Angel
Member
Seems like almost everyone made the same assumption (including me). It also looks like we don't give devs the credit they deserve (parity). Man, what a ride this launch is/has been. I hope the games are as fun.
DeejayKnight
Member
This was my thought on this as well. So much talk discussing how the One will mature with tools but not much mention of the fact that the PS4's tools will mature in the same time range.
If we're at PS4/1080p & One/900p at launch, it's only going to get more hardcore as time goes on. Hell, when they figure out how to get the 1080p on PS4 with the extra effects? So much victory.
Its a cross-gen game and apart from some of the lighting it doesn't even look better than Killzone or BF4.
I have the same feeling as AJanitor. It might be that huge online games like BF4 and Destiny might do worse than their single player counterparts because of the Xbox's RAM set up (purely a guess). That might be the reason why Xbox BF4 single player in 720p stands up better to PS4 SP in 1080p than the multiplayer mode (i.e. bigger gap in MP).
TheOctodad
Member
I just mean that a situation where X1 is 720p and the PS4 is 1080p would be a big deal for Destiny. It's the next huge crossplatform game. It'll be a big hit and people will be looking to see what the best experience for it is. With no PC version at launch, the PS4 could easily be marketed as the ultimate Destiny experience.