And also planted phone, burned remains, etc the same night Avery had a bonfire. I guess he had inside info on that too.
Making A Murderer Lawyer Alleges Ex-Boyfriend Of Halbach Was Murderer- Motion Filed
- Thread starter alr1ght
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And also planted phone, burned remains, etc the same night Avery had a bonfire. I guess he had inside info on that too.
The thing that always stood out to me is that Avery was kind of a.....simpleton, for lack of better word. To pull off the crime in the way the prosecution suggested, and yet leave not one single shred of DNA in the alleged room she was allegedly tied up, raped and murdered in? Eh....
Read the document. The facts of the case indicate that the bone fragments and phone were not located on the property for days, despite the burn barrel being searched. And they amounted to about half a 2-liter soda bottle worth of material. Easily something someone can sneak on their person. And before these materials were found, Hillegas had made his way onto the property without checking in, verified by the logs kept by law enforcement.
Really (and as brought up in the document) the first question anyone who buys the prosecution's story needs to ask themself is... If the case was so airtight, why did Kratz have to pursue two completely different and incompatible theories of the crime in Avery and Dassey's trials? The only explanation is that in one trial or the other, the prosecution presented a knowingly false version of events, which is a major breach of due process and instantly brings every other aspect of Kratz's case under suspicion.
thechristoph
Sir!
There's an episode of a show called Murder Made Me Famous that tries to shoot some holes in Making a Murderer. And it had some seriously chilling reenactments. I recommend looking it up.
thecouncil
Banned
I don't remember this clearly anymore but wasn't some evidence or Halbach's body burned in Avery's backyard?
This guy might be a pro pulling all this off without leaving any physical evidence.
There's no proof that the body was burned there, but bone fragments and parts of her phone were found in his burn pit after several days of searching. When they were not found there on previous searches. However, there is also evidence of a fire and bone fragments in the nearby quarry and cadaver dogs found a trail off the property as well and signs of a nearby temporary burial site. Does it make more sense for Avery to burn her off site and then drag the evidence onto his property, or for someone else to do so? Or if she was burned on-site, why would the other evidence be there? Basically none of it adds up to solid proof Avery burned the body.
What sort of physical evidence do you mean? Who's to say he didn't leave any? The point is that investigators never even looked. (Also see above regarding evidence the body was likely moved)
RustyNails
Member
I think Avery's lawyers claimed that her remains were moved to Avery's property and that the amount of heat required to disintegrate human body could not have happened in someone's backyard using a barrel and gasoline.
RepairmanJack
Member
The defense's whole thing was that the police and prosecutor never even looked for any other suspects or where other evidence could have directed the case. I think the point is there's no knowing what evidence was ignored because they didn't actually try.
Hell they had witness testimony that contradicted their version of events that was illegally withheld from the defense!
John Rabbit
Banned
Bone fragments in a burn pit.
MaximusPayne
Member
Isn't the ex-boyfriend the one that hacked into her phone account and changed some things. Yeah, not guilty at all.
RepairmanJack
Member
Deleted voicemails I think.
Yeah he straight up admitted that to investigators from jump and yet was never a suspect? How exactly does that work? The only person with a clear motive admits to destroying potential evidence and you just don't look into him... At all? And instead invite him to take part in the investigation?
Even if there was no malice on the part of MCSO, it's very clearly incompetence that undermines the entire case.
MaximusPayne
Member
Avery got shafted the first time and I'm not saying he's not guilty but the investigation was botched from the very beginning.
Insane Metal
Member
Yet another twist in this fucked up story. Damn, man. I hope this gets solved and they make an actual movie out of this.
Sapiens
Member
yes
Yup, evil widow's peak hairline right there.
What makes it more strange is that he was supposedly sophisticated enough to remove all the DNA from his home (and garage?), but not to remove the car/blood and bones from his property.
Inspector Jones
Member
Can't wait for season 2.
Literally, everyone I've watched Making a Murderer with was outraged by the series of events. It's disheartening to think about how often these injustices go on with no attention drawn to them at all.
Literally, everyone I've watched Making a Murderer with was outraged by the series of events. It's disheartening to think about how often these injustices go on with no attention drawn to them at all.
PhantomThief
Banned
Good, Steven deserves to be free.
I'll take it one step further and say this is true even if he actually killed Halbach. His guilt was not proven beyond a reasonable doubt in court, nor do I believe that the jury acted on that standard when deliberating. And that doesn't even take into account the due process violations outlined in Zellner's document. People might not be aware of this, but the pattern jury instruction used in Wisconsin actually specifically tells jurors that their duty is not to find reasonable doubt. This is straight up unconstitutional and needs to be changed.
More info here: http://www.cicchinilawoffice.com/Wis_JI_140.html
plagiarize
Banned
This is still my take on this:
Avery deserved a fair investigation, after what happened to him the first time. The local police recognized that they couldn't fairly perform this investigation and admitted this, unprompted, on record. They then shit all over that.
The people who found the evidence shouldn't have been anywhere near his property.
Just like if the police don't get an appropriate search warrant, you can't be found guilty based on evidence illegally attained, guilty or not, Avery was not afford due process, and guilty or not, should not have gone to prison.
The police were reckless, and desperate to stick this on a guy who they had already done massive harm to. So he should have walked free.
Who knows what would have happened if an untainted investigation was done. Maybe the same conclusion... but it will forever be tainted.
I mean, we're all meant to get due process. But Avery deserved it more than most.
Avery deserved a fair investigation, after what happened to him the first time. The local police recognized that they couldn't fairly perform this investigation and admitted this, unprompted, on record. They then shit all over that.
The people who found the evidence shouldn't have been anywhere near his property.
Just like if the police don't get an appropriate search warrant, you can't be found guilty based on evidence illegally attained, guilty or not, Avery was not afford due process, and guilty or not, should not have gone to prison.
The police were reckless, and desperate to stick this on a guy who they had already done massive harm to. So he should have walked free.
Who knows what would have happened if an untainted investigation was done. Maybe the same conclusion... but it will forever be tainted.
I mean, we're all meant to get due process. But Avery deserved it more than most.
Yeah I've said this before. To believe the prosecution, Avery was simultaneously a genius criminal that was able to destroy all DNA evidence in both his pig sty of a bedroom and garage-but also the dumbest criminal by hiding the SUV in plain sight right next to the road.
HalfBakedProphet
Member
I believe it is episode 6 when they discuss the phone messages, how the police didn't investigate anyone but Avery and the ex took the stand.
Going to need to rewatch it.
Going to need to rewatch it.
1000 pages? Good lord. She dont mess around.
I've watched enough of the ID channel to know that you should always at least question the person in a relationship with the victim. That was suspicious as hell.
I wasn't aware of that. I'm not surprised that it was all BS made up by the biggest vilain in the show.
I'll check it out. Thanks.
It was so shady.
And even if you did guess the voicemail password what good reason would there be for deleting the voicemails?
Always-honest
Banned
I knew it!
And he couldn't recall what time he saw her last, morning, noon or night, that's just nonsense.
Skellig Gra
Member
I remember him being suspicious but I'm not sure that evidence is convincing that he did it. However, it certainly casts more reasonable doubt on Avery doing it.
Yeah it doesn't have to be (and definitely isn't IMO) enough to convict, but that's not Zellner's job. Thankfully we've got a better standard than Ace Attorney, heh.
I don't think Kratz colluded with Hillegas, he's just a slimeball who wanted to make sure the biggest case of his career would play out the way he wanted it to. Colborn is the only one in Law Enforcement that sounds like he may have directly colluded with Hillegas, and there's a decent chance that even if that's the case, he probably didn't know Hillegas was the killer.
I really hope they get taken for even more when it's all said and done.
And criminal charges if any apply, particularly for Kratz. I really doubt anything along those lines happens though.
I'm not sure that Hillegas specifically planned the time of the murder to coincide with framing Avery, that seems more like a lucky break for him. I still don't think the former conclusion is inconceivable, though. If he was stalking Teresa he'd have a decent idea about her schedule.
Skellig Gra
Member
Damn how did the original defense miss that?Here's the deleted answering machine info
The prosecution must have never turned it over during the discovery phase. They probably never knew it existed.
This. Plus prosecutional misconduct. The trial was a sham and had enough shody tampering by the state to render it compromised.
LifEndz
Member
I hate to be glib by saying I'm looking forward to season 2 because this is the lives of two people who lost years of their life in prison, but goddamn season 2 is going to be amazing if it ends with both him and his nephew walking out. Hearing that kid cry that the detectives got in his head and coerced false testimony out of him was heartbreaking.
Also, fuck that piece of shit prosecutor.
Also, fuck that piece of shit prosecutor.
