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[ReBurn]

It just keeps happening

Layoffs suck but that's a great meme

 

[Judge Magister]

Same as Crystal Dynamics. Go woke, go broke.

 

[Randall365]

Next time give us Churchill AND the British for FREE, you rotten cunts. Always nice when the market corrects.

Spoiler

I can claim no credit whatsoever as I paid for the main game and British 'DLC', for shame

 

[WhiteWaterM00se]

I feel bad for everyone affected.

Does anyone believe Take Two has a plan to fix Civ VII? If they are going to screw over their fanbase with everyone (including myself) who bought the game.

Release an HD version of Civ Rev (Xbox 360/ps3) with game updates and QoL improvements. Also release an Xcom collection.

 

[Sinozen]

Sad they didn't deliver with Civ 7. I was really hoping it'd be a proper sequel. Its been forever! Someone has got to make a proper Civ game if Firaxis can't

 

[Braag]

It just keeps happening

This is literally Firewalk Studios and BioWare Edmonton

 

[vpance]

This is actually their 2nd big layoff since 2023.

Also this Glassdoor review was revealing. Posted it in a previous thread

I worked for three years as a UI designer. Throughout the entire process, I was treated as the game design department's toy to abuse and hurt. Production was too asleep at the wheel to help save me, and the c-suite only cares about their next vacation. There's a mountain of examples of times I was treated poorly by game design, and the c-suite tacitly endorsed that mistreatment by sheltering their friends from the consequences of their own actions.

This scheme, where game design tortures artists while the c-suite makes excuses to shield them, resulted in three years of my life's work being destroyed, without evidence, and the entire project's launch being ruined. The people who asked "why would you shoot us in the foot like this?" are all fired now. The people who architected this scheme are still cashing their checks to this day.

I can not stress enough, that if you have respect for yourself, respect for the medium, or respect for art-- this is not the studio for you. I can tell you from experience that you will be lied about, your work destroyed to satisfy the egos of designers who stopped caring about games a decade ago, and you'll still be dealing with the professional fallout over a year later. You owe it to yourself, you owe it to your career, and you owe it to your peers to stop building UIs for a company that refuses to see the value in your time, effort, or skill.

 

[StereoVsn]

Weird balance decisions and missing features.

My friend who has thousands of hours in this series didn't even get this new one.

Same. My favorite was IV, but V and VI had their advantages. VII is just a dog and I didn't bother with it.

I have been playing Civ and similar games since original Civ 1 and Master of Orion and Master of Magic for context. A lot of fans either just didn't get the game in the first place or stopped playing pretty quick.

 

[Grildon Tundy]

It's because they don't need as large a team to develop XCOM 3, which is in the pipeline...right?

 

[StereoVsn]

I quite liked (civ-like) Old World, which is 75% off on Steam atm.

Old World is pretty darn good. I recommend it and the DLCs, especially for the price.

Humankind - not so much. Same with that recent Paradox game Millenia. Didn't bother to get the latter.

 

[StereoVsn]

It's because they don't need as large a team to develop XCOM 3, which is in the pipeline...right?

Do you really want Xcom game from people who brought us Civ VII? You just know it's going to be:

 

[skit_data]

Damn, I was hoping for a new XCOM game and this doesn't really increase the chances of that becoming a reality...

 

[Grildon Tundy]

Do you really want Xcom game from people who brought us Civ VII? You just know it's going to be:

Tbh, kinda. There's a chance it could turn out well. If not, I ain't gotta buy it. The beauty of being a consumer.

 

[StereoVsn]

Tbh, kinda. There's a chance it could turn out well. If not, I ain't gotta buy it. The beauty of being a consumer.

I would rather just keep it in my mind imaging what it could be. Otherwise we wound get an equivalent of Mass Effect Andromeda and that just is not right.

Thankfully there are bunch of Xcom "like" games on the horizon.

 

[WhiteWaterM00se]

I have a serious comment. This is not a woke debate, or anything.

With the average age of a console gamer somewhere around 40 years old depending on platform. With this, do we assume maybe gaming companies live in an echo chamber and have made their games too difficult for a modern audience and it is difficult to attract younger generations?

Furthermore, i have never understood why Sony, Xbox, and Nintendo don't release a controller with less buttons and not more. Surely, these companies are smart enough to figure out a way to play their games with less buttons? Especially with AI assistance. Do we really need a special move for spin or dive in Madden? Can't we use one button and have AI use the appropriate move for the situation?

Maybe this would help attract more gamers.

Also, we need more mobile/arcade style games. Kudos to what Atari is doing. I was floored seeing the Centipede remake and their other "remakes". Very smart move by them.

 

[Katajx]

Shit user interface, age system that for forced you to switch civilisations, holding popular civilisations like the British and ottomans behind dlc.

Just all around liquid bum sauce of a game

Thanks for the info. Never played the others.

 

[Hari Seldon]

I liked the age system a lot in Civ 7, it just wasn't finished. It is fun to have mechanics change as the game progresses. They just needed to make it less jarring and discontinuous. The UI was complete trash, and the game seemed to suffer from the sin of setting itself up to be a DLC platform. The game was clearly rushed out. With EU5 coming out in a few months this game doesn't have a bright future.

 

[Brakum]

Not a Civ player, but why is 7 so unpopular or worse?

Not gonna explain this myself but i just wanna add that the game is massively overpriced. Even being bad, it would have easily crushed civ 6's launch numbers. Civ 6 is old, steam has like twice as many users. It is actually insanely hard for a new game to not beat the previous entry when the previous entry is 9 years old. This happens all the time. But at 70$ and 30$ for dlcs and the first dlc launching within a month of release aka 100$ to have all the content one month after launch? Yeah people are gonna wait for reviews and reviews were.. well. And im not even sure if 100$ got you all the content, pretty sure two leaders were locked behind the founders edition, if that's the case it's 130$ to have all the content jist one month after release.

 

[Shadowstar39]

They used to celebrate humanity.

I can't believe that civ 7 ad , i never seen that, I wish I would have. I bought civ7 as I buy every civ. I never in a million years would of thought them woke. I guess they are now as they don't like nations and countries and just want everyone to big mass. I am also geussing Sid Meier is bascially retired by now, which is probably part of the problem.

I have bought every civ game since civ2 (i owned civ1 but it was a copy from a friends floppy) .... civ 7 is the only one I wish i didn't buy. It was horrible!

 

[Wildebeest]

Furthermore, i have never understood why Sony, Xbox, and Nintendo don't release a controller with less buttons and not more. Surely, these companies are smart enough to figure out a way to play their games with less buttons? Especially with AI assistance. Do we really need a special move for spin or dive in Madden? Can't we use one button and have AI use the appropriate move for the situation?

Maybe this would help attract more gamers.

The first problem is that kids are growing up with touchscreens. Maybe resetting to a NES or Gameboy type controller would give them a way in but would that be richer to them than touchsceen and would it be an ideal input for roblox which is all they seem to care about?

The second problem is that US development is becoming very expensive while catering to a market that just isn't growing as quickly and also sees their games and culture as having more negatives instead of increasing their appeal. It is mostly the USA which is shedding jobs currently while east asia is doing just fine.

 

[Hookshot]

I remember hearing it didn't include Britain. Even if I wasn't British I'd think that was completely fucking stupid. There isn't a country on Earth not affected by them. The modern world exists because of them.

You wouldn't make a football game without Brazil or a military shooter without America.

 

[Shadowstar39]

I liked the age system a lot in Civ 7, it just wasn't finished. It is fun to have mechanics change as the game progresses. They just needed to make it less jarring and discontinuous. The UI was complete trash, and the game seemed to suffer from the sin of setting itself up to be a DLC platform. The game was clearly rushed out. With EU5 coming out in a few months this game doesn't have a bright future.

They could of done ages differently.

A game that did it right was Millenia.

The Millennia ages system is a central mechanic in the video game Millennia where players progress through a series of different Ages, each providing unique technologies, units, and gameplay rules. There are four types of Ages: Standard (historical), Variant (alternate history), Crisis (disaster-driven), and Victory (end-game conditions). Players advance by researching new Ages, which are then locked in for all players, creating a dynamic and collaborative progression through a shared timeline.

The thing is that in that game you choose 1 civilization, it changed based on what you researched and how you played. You could have a golden age or a crisis age or an iron age, age of heroes, age of myth, or an age of war, famine, pestilence, etc....
The game changed based on this for everyone, whoever got the age first. It was really forward thinking, but without taking away what makes a good civiliaztion type game.

Unfortunately there was some issues early on with the game and people didn't like the graphics. I seen in reviews "not next gen, ugly, looks like civ5...blah blah blah"

Sorry but i would rather a game like this , that plays well and is decent enough looking then a overly polished turd known as civ7.

I don't think this looks bad at all. Too bad the devs disbanded.

All they needed to do is keep the "build a civiliaztion to stand the test of time. But that scrapped that for the woke humankind ages and civ switching shit.

 

[RubberedDucky]

Dick move. Rush the development and release before it's finished to make up for the GTA6 delay. And now Strauss Zelnick lays out a bunch of scapegoats. What a sad existence that of the video games industry's executive.

I have insider knowledge. Won't tell you how so I don't doxx myself. But this title was delayed several times, not rushed. Firaxis is to blame for that. They tried to get tricky with gameplay and it backfired, and 2K leadership doesn't have the spine nor tact to tell Sid what to build. And the marketing campaign was a classic over expenditure with no soul.

 

[March Climber]

Theres a lot going on with your post, so I'm going to split it up into segments:

With the average age of a console gamer somewhere around 40 years old depending on platform, do we assume maybe gaming companies live in an echo chamber and have made their games too difficult for a modern audience and it is difficult to attract younger generations?

It depends on what you mean. If you mean successfully transitioning phone and tablet gamers to console controls, then no, they haven't made things too difficult. I think unfortunately we have reached a peak point with controllers and nothing is going to change from this point onwards.

Furthermore, i have never understood why Sony, Xbox, and Nintendo don't release a controller with less buttons and not more. Surely, these companies are smart enough to figure out a way to play their games with less buttons? Especially with AI assistance. Do we really need a special move for spin or dive in Madden? Can't we use one button and have AI use the appropriate move for the situation?

I do think that there should be some sort of bridge between the gap of both, but the compromise for that right now seems to be making consoles themselves portable and tablet-like, rather than reinventing the controller, of which their layout has not changed in a big way since the dualshock.

Maybe this would help attract more gamers.

Also, we need more mobile/arcade style games. Kudos to what Atari is doing. I was floored seeing the Centipede remake and their other "remakes". Very smart move by them.

If your post is more in regards to Civ-style games, City builder and RTS-games, then I agree, these genres should have been 'mobile-ized' years ago. I have said the same before about Turn-based JRPGs and Turn-based strategy. All of these would benefit and find new life on touch-based devices. Don't get me wrong, a few have tried, but the minute they sensed any hint of failure or the minute they went too far with putting MTX in it (which kills it anyway), they reel back into relying on the PC and console crowd.

However, there is a big glaring issue. Mobile gaming stores have already 'shit the bed' for older gamers. There's only one form of curation for both Android and Apple devices, and those are through their gaming subscription services (which admittedly is quite good at curation for good games). If you don't subscribe however, you have to browse through a mess of options, and the ones that are being advertised at the top mostly have some sort of MTX or gambling mechanics behind them.

Due to that, I think that older gamers still look at mobile/tablet gaming like the complete chaotic mess that it still presents itself to be, and they are instantly turned-off by it. Thus they are being stubborn on their side, and the Civ-style/builder/RTS devs are being stubborn on their side too by not announcing mobile ports of their games. What you have is essentially a standoff where these genres themselves are going to slowly die out to a small niche-level because both sides are too stubborn about embracing the youth and bringing them into the fold.

Barely anyone wants to take a massive swing and innovate in them either, as they just follow in the footsteps of the widely known and revered I.P., hoping to grab a few of those older, instilled fanbases rather than capturing a fresh new audience.

 

[tr1p1ex]

thanks. adding to my master list.

 

[rkofan87]

2K confirms layoffs at Civilization developer Firaxis

2K says the decision will "restructure and optimize" its teams within Firaxis. Sources say dozens could be impacted.

www.gamedeveloper.com

i am not even a civ guy and i think this is trash fuck you 2k.

 

[Kacho]

I have insider knowledge. Won't tell you how so I don't doxx myself. But this title was delayed several times, not rushed. Firaxis is to blame for that. They tried to get tricky with gameplay and it backfired, and 2K leadership doesn't have the spine nor tact to tell Sid what to build. And the marketing campaign was a classic over expenditure with no soul.

So what's next? Do they bunker down and fix Civ7 or move on to the next project.

 

[rkofan87]

XCOM is so dead

i knew xcom was dead when the Marvel card strategy game Bomb.

 

[rkofan87]

I didnt play it, but if I remember correctly wasnt the gameplay done in a such a way that a gamer goes through eras/stages? And after that ends, the gamer has to start over in the new era.

So instead one one giant gameplay from 0 BC to 3000 AD kind of thing, it was chopped up into pieces.

wow so they so they changed what made civ civ talk about not caring about your audience i feel bad for Sid Myers.

 

[xrnzaaas]

They're becoming another Bioware or Rocksteady - a shell of their former greatness. Which is very sad, I may not be interested in modern Civ games, but I care about the XCOM series.

 

[Larxia]

Were they the one behind Midnight Sun? I think messing up multiple game in a row is probably not a good idea.

They definitely didn't mess up Midnight Suns though, it was incredible.
It did flop, but it really was an amazing game.

 

[The Cockatrice]

XCOM died for this trash.

 

[Rentahamster]

Tbh, kinda. There's a chance it could turn out well. If not, I ain't gotta buy it. The beauty of being a consumer.

The people who made xcom 1 and 2 left a while ago. I gave up hope already.

 

[StereoVsn]

I liked the age system a lot in Civ 7, it just wasn't finished. It is fun to have mechanics change as the game progresses. They just needed to make it less jarring and discontinuous. The UI was complete trash, and the game seemed to suffer from the sin of setting itself up to be a DLC platform. The game was clearly rushed out. With EU5 coming out in a few months this game doesn't have a bright future.

Eh, EU5 is going to be a completely different animal with a cliff like learning curve, lol. They aren't really a competitor, although to be fair a lot of folks like both 4X and Grand Strategy.

Plus, let's face it, it's going to take 1-3 years for EU5 to get good, looking at past history of Paradox' games.

 

[DonkeyPunchJr]

I have a serious comment. This is not a woke debate, or anything.

With the average age of a console gamer somewhere around 40 years old depending on platform. With this, do we assume maybe gaming companies live in an echo chamber and have made their games too difficult for a modern audience and it is difficult to attract younger generations?

Furthermore, i have never understood why Sony, Xbox, and Nintendo don't release a controller with less buttons and not more. Surely, these companies are smart enough to figure out a way to play their games with less buttons? Especially with AI assistance. Do we really need a special move for spin or dive in Madden? Can't we use one button and have AI use the appropriate move for the situation?

Maybe this would help attract more gamers.

Also, we need more mobile/arcade style games. Kudos to what Atari is doing. I was floored seeing the Centipede remake and their other "remakes". Very smart move by them.

Look at something like Clair Obscur. Finally some no-name French devs came along and made the "JRPG for grown ups" like we all wished Squaresoft would do for the last 25 years. Hard as hell. And it sold like hotcakes.

Devs that understand what the hell their audience wants, and give it to them, thrive. It's as simple as that.

Look at Path of Exile 2 and Space Marine 2 for a couple other recent examples.

 

[WhiteWaterM00se]

Look at something like Clair Obscur. Finally some no-name French devs came along and made the "JRPG for grown ups" like we all wished Squaresoft would do for the last 25 years. Hard as hell. And it sold like hotcakes.

Devs that understand what the hell their audience wants, and give it to them, thrive. It's as simple as that.

Look at Path of Exile 2 and Space Marine 2 for a couple other recent examples.

I haven't played Clair Obscure. But from what i have watched it seems like Clair Obscure is what Final Fantasy XVI should have been. Probably why they met with Square Enix.

But my question stands. Do young people play Clair Obscure? They don't play Final Fantasy. Average age of a Dragon Quest or FF player is in their 40's.

 

[Katajx]

Not gonna explain this myself but i just wanna add that the game is massively overpriced. Even being bad, it would have easily crushed civ 6's launch numbers. Civ 6 is old, steam has like twice as many users. It is actually insanely hard for a new game to not beat the previous entry when the previous entry is 9 years old. This happens all the time. But at 70$ and 30$ for dlcs and the first dlc launching within a month of release aka 100$ to have all the content one month after launch? Yeah people are gonna wait for reviews and reviews were.. well. And im not even sure if 100$ got you all the content, pretty sure two leaders were locked behind the founders edition, if that's the case it's 130$ to have all the content jist one month after release.

My son has 6, it's been ages and that genre has never been my thing. It's hard for me to look at though. It's kinda hard to get a feel for what's wrong from a gameplay standpoint when I don't have much investment myself.

I just see the low ratings and reviews. Game is bad, or seeing some of them that just says the game sucks is hard to relate without the experience.

 

[semiconscious]

.Edit: What's also annoying is that the game seems to be technically competent. It's the same issue as Veilguard where actual developers (who wrote code) suffer for the sins of morons in charge...

great point! having no experience in the field, myself, i can only imagine what kinda morale-killing effect these games end up having on these studios' talented staffs...

 

[Durin]

Sucks to see people losing their jobs, but they've also put out some duds. Heard nothing good about Civ 7, and while I liked some combat stuff with Midnight Suns...the storytelling was filled with cringe millennial writing.

 

[WhiteWaterM00se]

Theres a lot going on with your post, so I'm going to split it up into segments:

It depends on what you mean. If you mean successfully transitioning phone and tablet gamers to console controls, then no, they haven't made things too difficult. I think unfortunately we have reached a peak point with controllers and nothing is going to change from this point onwards.

I do think that there should be some sort of bridge between the gap of both, but the compromise for that right now seems to be making consoles themselves portable and tablet-like, rather than reinventing the controller, of which their layout has not changed in a big way since the dualshock.


If your post is more in regards to Civ-style games, City builder and RTS-games, then I agree, these genres should have been 'mobile-ized' years ago. I have said the same before about Turn-based JRPGs and Turn-based strategy. All of these would benefit and find new life on touch-based devices. Don't get me wrong, a few have tried, but the minute they sensed any hint of failure or the minute they went too far with putting MTX in it (which kills it anyway), they reel back into relying on the PC and console crowd.

However, there is a big glaring issue. Mobile gaming stores have already 'shit the bed' for older gamers. There's only one form of curation for both Android and Apple devices, and those are through their gaming subscription services (which admittedly is quite good at curation for good games). If you don't subscribe however, you have to browse through a mess of options, and the ones that are being advertised at the top mostly have some sort of MTX or gambling mechanics behind them.

Due to that, I think that older gamers still look at mobile/tablet gaming like the complete chaotic mess that it still presents itself to be, and they are instantly turned-off by it. Thus they are being stubborn on their side, and the Civ-style/builder/RTS devs are being stubborn on their side too by not announcing mobile ports of their games. What you have is essentially a standoff where these genres themselves are going to slowly die out to a small niche-level because both sides are too stubborn about embracing the youth and bringing them into the fold.

Barely anyone wants to take a massive swing and innovate in them either, as they just follow in the footsteps of the widely known and revered I.P., hoping to grab a few of those older, instilled fanbases rather than capturing a fresh new audience.

So, you have a lot here, and i appreciate your full answer. Truly.

First, I disagree with you on the controller. You can't "reset" players who grew up on mobile. In my opinion, the next best solution is lowering the barrier to entry by reducing the number of buttons.

I also believe that games which transition well should be available on console, PC/Mac, and mobile simultaneously. Madden is a good example. Sports games, in general, tend to illustrate this point because input methods vary naturally and lend themselves to different platforms and play styles.

Second, I agree with you about mobile game stores being a poor experience for older gamers. The solution isn't to ignore mobile, but to create natural tie-in experiences. Some games could be identical across platforms, while others could offer complementary gameplay. For example, Pokémon Go should automatically integrate with the traditional Pokémon games. Even if not all Pokémon could transfer, at least some of them should.

Other franchises could work equally well across mobile and console/PC. A Nintendogs reboot or a Civilization/XCOM-style game, for instance, could translate almost one-to-one.

Meanwhile, as we watch industry layoffs pile up and companies complain about poor sales, I can't help but think: "This should have been expected." I don't understand why it wasn't.

Take Sony's last earnings call as an example: in the most recent quarter, more than 50% of their games revenue came from live-service titles like Fortnite, Roblox, Minecraft, EA FC, and Madden Ultimate Team. With that reality in mind, it seems obvious that publishers should be finding better ways to link mobile versions with their console, PC, and tablet counterparts.

Full disclosure: I bought a Switch 2 for my son and nephew, along with four launch games — Breath of the Wild, Mario Kart World, Street Fighter VI, and Civilization. I had high hopes for Civ, but the result has been disappointing. It leaves me wondering: did the core talent behind Civ VI leave the studio, or did younger developers simply fail to understand the gameplay loop and mess it up?

And this isn't just a Civ problem. It's a recurring issue across the industry: Madden, Mario Kart World, Monster Hunter Wilds, Death Stranding 2, Starfield, and others all show signs of studios not listening to consumers or delivering what players actually want. That's the bigger challenge the industry needs to solve going forward.

 

[Shifty1897]

Switching civs mid game was hands down the stupidest idea I've ever heard and completely turned me off the game. I went from day one to never. They should've known.

 

[BossLackey]

It just keeps happening

I'm legitimately, utterly perplexed that this just keeps happening.

 

[DonkeyPunchJr]

I haven't played Clair Obscure. But from what i have watched it seems like Clair Obscure is what Final Fantasy XVI should have been. Probably why they met with Square Enix.

But my question stands. Do young people play Clair Obscure? They don't play Final Fantasy. Average age of a Dragon Quest or FF player is in their 40's.

That's exactly my point. Square Enix has spent the last 20-25 years making games targeted at teens and 20-somethings, doing stuff they imagine the younger audiences would like, and yet they've utterly failed at broadening their appeal. It's a fool's errand.

Then you have the Clair Obscur devs who basically said "fuck it, we're making our dream game we always wanted to play" and they were handsomely rewarded for it.

If the audience for grounded 4X strategy games is mostly older dudes, so what? There's plenty of them and they have money. A game that knows what it wants to be and executes it well will find its audience, and just maybe bring in newcomers as well.

A game that treats its actual audience as a mistake and tries to appeal to some imaginary "Modern Audience" instead is just going to end up some mediocre slop that nobody wants. There are countless examples in games/movies/etc

 

[March Climber]

First, I disagree with you on the controller. You can't "reset" players who grew up on mobile.

This wasn't what I was trying to say. I was stating that these new portable consoles are bridging the gap between phones/tablets, and traditional design. There is no reset going on, just a gradual learning curve being produced. To me, that's a good thing and the Switch, Steam Deck, and the tons of other portables here or soon to come are great devices for this.

In my opinion, the next best solution is lowering the barrier to entry by reducing the number of buttons.

And in going with my earlier point about controllers never changing, this can't happen unless we provide an equivalent exchange for the loss of those buttons. The more buttons we remove, the more there is a loss in control, especially precise control. That's a drastic change for controllers. Some form of control has to take the place of that loss, or else games will drastically increase in automation and thus become less 'fun'.

I also believe that games which transition well should be available on console, PC/Mac, and mobile simultaneously.

I agree with this 100%, and the good news is that with the rise of Gacha games constantly releasing on all platforms along with the console generations being in flux right now, there has been a slow erosion of that barrier.

Madden is a good example. Sports games, in general, tend to illustrate this point because input methods vary naturally and lend themselves to different platforms and play styles.

Agreed.

Second, I agree with you about mobile game stores being a poor experience for older gamers. The solution isn't to ignore mobile, but to create natural tie-in experiences. Some games could be identical across platforms, while others could offer complementary gameplay. For example, Pokémon Go should automatically integrate with the traditional Pokémon games. Even if not all Pokémon could transfer, at least some of them should.

The problem here lies with the companies themselves. Companion apps don't work as well as they should and feel like a minor annoyance to those who just want to play the main game. Also, most of these other companies aren't allowed to have their own downloadable game storefronts on phones without jumping through a ton of legal hoops. I would really love to just open the steam app on either an iPhone or Android and just download the game on that platform (if it allows for mobile controls), because I notice a ton of indies are listed for both but there's no bridge there.

Instead I have to purchase it on Android/Apple store to play the same game with touch controls.

Other franchises could work equally well across mobile and console/PC. A Nintendogs reboot or a Civilization/XCOM-style game, for instance, could translate almost one-to-one.

Agreed 100%

Meanwhile, as we watch industry layoffs pile up and companies complain about poor sales, I can't help but think: "This should have been expected." I don't understand why it wasn't.

Because this issue is way more complicated than 'they chose the wrong platform, or wrong side in the culture war, or wrong platform, etc.' People try to make the video games industry a single-issue problem but there's a ton of cogs in the machine, from the executive side, to the publisher side, to the developer side, to the media side, to the online side, to the end-user side.

This is why I never bother getting into these discussions when mass firings come up because the single-issue problem that GAF is laser focused on was "is wokeness the sole reason why this game has failed? If assumed yes, go down this dialogue tree. If assumed no, go down another dialogue tree, which might still lead to the first tree somehow in an inexplicable way."

Microsoft's recent mass firing had very little to do with any of the things people bring up here. Their CEO was starstruck by A.I.'s profit potential and went 'all-in' on that bet for technology, which meant everything else had to shrink or go away.

When a Japanese publisher does a mass firing, instead of people looking to instantly connect it to a culture war issue, they will actually do critical research or look for more info elsewhere to see what actually happened. Again, I expect that reaction though because that's how people view Japan, Japanese culture, and Japanese gaming. They always start on a higher pedestal regardless of what happens. It is what it is.

Take Sony's last earnings call as an example: in the most recent quarter, more than 50% of their games revenue came from live-service titles like Fortnite, Roblox, Minecraft, EA FC, and Madden Ultimate Team. With that reality in mind, it seems obvious that publishers should be finding better ways to link mobile versions with their console, PC, and tablet counterparts.

Agreed, but it has to be done right. Co-op games might be the way through.

And this isn't just a Civ problem. It's a recurring issue across the industry: Madden, Mario Kart World, Monster Hunter Wilds, Death Stranding 2, Starfield, and others all show signs of studios not listening to consumers or delivering what players actually want. That's the bigger challenge the industry needs to solve going forward.

Once again this is more than a single-issue problem and lumping all of those games together without context just to claim they're all 'not delivering on what consumers want' doesn't sit right in this situation.

 

[dottme]

They definitely didn't mess up Midnight Suns though, it was incredible.
It did flop, but it really was an amazing game.

I'm playing it. Why the game is relatively good, there's a lot of issues with it. From a technical point of view, on PS5 Pro at least, the game isn't smooth. The design is not great at all. the part in the abbey as far as I am for now isn't really interesting to play.

 

[StereoVsn]

I'm playing it. Why the game is relatively good, there's a lot of issues with it. From a technical point of view, on PS5 Pro at least, the game isn't smooth. The design is not great at all. the part in the abbey as far as I am for now isn't really interesting to play.

I couldn't stand the "social links" in Midnight Suns. I felt that it just did not work right in the setting, writing itself was ham-fisted and it detracted from the game.

Also, going with a card system pushed a lot of strategy genre fans off. Frankly bad decision on the design and writing teams throughout.

 

[WhiteWaterM00se]

This wasn't what I was trying to say. I was stating that these new portable consoles are bridging the gap between phones/tablets, and traditional design. There is no reset going on, just a gradual learning curve being produced. To me, that's a good thing and the Switch, Steam Deck, and the tons of other portables here or soon to come are great devices for this.

And in going with my earlier point about controllers never changing, this can't happen unless we provide an equivalent exchange for the loss of those buttons. The more buttons we remove, the more there is a loss in control, especially precise control. That's a drastic change for controllers. Some form of control has to take the place of that loss, or else games will drastically increase in automation and thus become less 'fun'.

I agree with this 100%, and the good news is that with the rise of Gacha games constantly releasing on all platforms along with the console generations being in flux right now, there has been a slow erosion of that barrier.

Agreed.

The problem here lies with the companies themselves. Companion apps don't work as well as they should and feel like a minor annoyance to those who just want to play the main game. Also, most of these other companies aren't allowed to have their own downloadable game storefronts on phones without jumping through a ton of legal hoops. I would really love to just open the steam app on either an iPhone or Android and just download the game on that platform (if it allows for mobile controls), because I notice a ton of indies are listed for both but there's no bridge there.

Instead I have to purchase it on Android/Apple store to play the same game with touch controls.

Agreed 100%

Because this issue is way more complicated than 'they chose the wrong platform, or wrong side in the culture war, or wrong platform, etc.' People try to make the video games industry a single-issue problem but there's a ton of cogs in the machine, from the executive side, to the publisher side, to the developer side, to the media side, to the online side, to the end-user side.

This is why I never bother getting into these discussions when mass firings come up because the single-issue problem that GAF is laser focused on was "is wokeness the sole reason why this game has failed? If assumed yes, go down this dialogue tree. If assumed no, go down another dialogue tree, which might still lead to the first tree somehow in an inexplicable way."

Microsoft's recent mass firing had very little to do with any of the things people bring up here. Their CEO was starstruck by A.I.'s profit potential and went 'all-in' on that bet for technology, which meant everything else had to shrink or go away.

When a Japanese publisher does a mass firing, instead of people looking to instantly connect it to a culture war issue, they will actually do critical research or look for more info elsewhere to see what actually happened. Again, I expect that reaction though because that's how people view Japan, Japanese culture, and Japanese gaming. They always start on a higher pedestal regardless of what happens. It is what it is.

Agreed, but it has to be done right. Co-op games might be the way through.

Once again this is more than a single-issue problem and lumping all of those games together without context just to claim they're all 'not delivering on what consumers want' doesn't sit right in this situation.

I get what you're saying about controllers needing to preserve precision, and I agree that just ripping buttons away without an equivalent system would be a disaster. Where I think there's real opportunity, though, is using AI to step in as that "equivalent exchange."

Take Madden as an example. If I accidentally hit spin instead of dive, AI could step in and recognize the context—knowing I'm at the goal line, it could override the spin and trigger the dive instead. That's not automation that takes away fun—it's automation that reduces frustration. Done right, it could let players focus more on strategy and flow, while still rewarding skill and timing.

Sports games, shooters, RPGs—all of them could use a similar system. AI can already read player intent in ways that weren't possible ten years ago, so instead of keeping layers of button combinations, we could have fewer inputs with smarter responses. The player still makes the decision, but the AI interprets it in a way that's forgiving and natural.

This wouldn't replace traditional control for hardcore players—there'd always be an option to keep the full button set. But for newer or mobile-first gamers, lowering the barrier this way could ease them in without diluting the experience. That's the bridge I think we need: keeping depth for veterans while using AI to make controls less intimidating for everyone else.

I appreciate the conversation. There is a lot more we could discuss, but i need to go to bed. I believe GAF will be onto new topics tomorrow. NBA 2k26 will be interesting tomorrow.

 

[StreetsofBeige]

I get what you're saying about controllers needing to preserve precision, and I agree that just ripping buttons away without an equivalent system would be a disaster. Where I think there's real opportunity, though, is using AI to step in as that "equivalent exchange."

Take Madden as an example. If I accidentally hit spin instead of dive, AI could step in and recognize the context—knowing I'm at the goal line, it could override the spin and trigger the dive instead. That's not automation that takes away fun—it's automation that reduces frustration. Done right, it could let players focus more on strategy and flow, while still rewarding skill and timing.

Sports games, shooters, RPGs—all of them could use a similar system. AI can already read player intent in ways that weren't possible ten years ago, so instead of keeping layers of button combinations, we could have fewer inputs with smarter responses. The player still makes the decision, but the AI interprets it in a way that's forgiving and natural.

This wouldn't replace traditional control for hardcore players—there'd always be an option to keep the full button set. But for newer or mobile-first gamers, lowering the barrier this way could ease them in without diluting the experience. That's the bridge I think we need: keeping depth for veterans while using AI to make controls less intimidating for everyone else.

I appreciate the conversation. There is a lot more we could discuss, but i need to go to bed. I believe GAF will be onto new topics tomorrow. NBA 2k26 will be interesting tomorrow.

But what if a gamer at the goal line wanted to do a spin?

 

[WhiteWaterM00se]

But what if a gamer at the goal line wanted to do a spin?

The ai would be smart enough to determine the appropriate move. I am just saying. I would think you could go from an 8 button layout with and additional two clickable sticks. To possibly a 6 button layout at most. Maybe 4 buttons. It would seem easier to new gamers to the space to bring them in.

I have always viewed the barrier to entry as too high. This is not the sole remedy, but possibly a step in the process to correcting the issues that are plaguing the industry.

 

[bighugeguns]

The ai would be smart enough to determine the appropriate move. I am just saying. I would think you could go from an 8 button layout with and additional two clickable sticks. To possibly a 6 button layout at most. Maybe 4 buttons. It would seem easier to new gamers to the space to bring them in.

I have always viewed the barrier to entry as too high. This is not the sole remedy, but possibly a step in the process to correcting the issues that are plaguing the industry.

Aren't you just describing rollback netcode but instead used for accessibility?

Non-network related implementation of that sounds like Blizzard's one button dynamic rotation in retail World of Warcraft.