30? 60? Who cares?
- Thread starter DCX
- Start date
SolidSnakex
Member
It matters when it can affect the gameplay, especially in the case of racers.
DaCocoBrova
Finally bought a new PSP, but then pushed the demon onto someone else. Jesus.
Thorough-ass developers care.
For me it's principle more than anything. It's not that much of a feat. Just code games with that goal in mind. There isn't a bell, whistle or flavor of eye candy in existance that's worth halving the frame rate for, yet it's done all the damn time.
This wouldn't even be an issue if devs gave us the option to run the game at 30fps or 60fps.
Was Sega Rally 2 the only game ever to give us that option?
For me it's principle more than anything. It's not that much of a feat. Just code games with that goal in mind. There isn't a bell, whistle or flavor of eye candy in existance that's worth halving the frame rate for, yet it's done all the damn time.
This wouldn't even be an issue if devs gave us the option to run the game at 30fps or 60fps.
Was Sega Rally 2 the only game ever to give us that option?
KyotoMecca
Member
I care.
60fps is a special feeling.
Didn't realise it had that option... which version do you mean?
60fps is a special feeling.
Didn't realise it had that option... which version do you mean?
Necroscope
Member
Not again... frame rate is critical when u play a good racer and a good figthing game like VF4 Evo.
DaCocoBrova
Finally bought a new PSP, but then pushed the demon onto someone else. Jesus.
The US version.
SolidSnakex
Member
SR2 has a framerate code that lets you boost the framerate to 60fps (it'll drop some background detail to do that). It's worth it though. Some developers should consider doing that without the code. You should do anything possible with racers to make sure it's going to be 60fps.
DaCocoBrova
Finally bought a new PSP, but then pushed the demon onto someone else. Jesus.
Code... There are two actually. This one takes the game up to 60fps, but it dips slighlty here and there...
Another code (hold Y at track select screen IIRC) kills trackside detail to boost the frame rate.
Another code (hold Y at track select screen IIRC) kills trackside detail to boost the frame rate.
DCX
DCX
Yeah i remember that code. Still though, i understand about about racing games...i believe you need the best frame rate possible, but a game like Resident Evil 4?!?! Why would it matter if in a game like that i would much rather have better quality voice and music samples better effects that frame rate. Fighting games should be 60 as should racers, but there are some racers that looks great even at 30, didn't Lemans on DC look and play fantastic at 30?SolidSnakex said:
DCX
SolidSnakex
Member
" believe you need the put frame rate possible, but a game like Resident Evil 4?"
There are certain games that really don't need to be 60fps, RE4 is one of them.
"Fighting games should be 60 as should racers, but there are some racers that looks great even at 30, didn't Lemans on DC look and play fantastic at 30?"
It's easy to make a 30fps look great, but is it worth it? Hardcore race fans expect a 60fps framerate now because they know it's important to the actual gameplay. I think the developers who really care about that are the ones that make sure their racers run at 60fps.
There are certain games that really don't need to be 60fps, RE4 is one of them.
"Fighting games should be 60 as should racers, but there are some racers that looks great even at 30, didn't Lemans on DC look and play fantastic at 30?"
It's easy to make a 30fps look great, but is it worth it? Hardcore race fans expect a 60fps framerate now because they know it's important to the actual gameplay. I think the developers who really care about that are the ones that make sure their racers run at 60fps.
CrimsonSkies
Member
If people say they can see it why argue about it?
I don't see how it's possible on a standard television set. However, some claim they can tell the difference. On a computer monitor it's pretty apparent due to the screen being able to display high FPS.
To each their own I say. If someone won't buy a game because it's not 60 FPS. That's their right.
I don't see how it's possible on a standard television set. However, some claim they can tell the difference. On a computer monitor it's pretty apparent due to the screen being able to display high FPS.
To each their own I say. If someone won't buy a game because it's not 60 FPS. That's their right.
DCX said:
I dunno, I have to wonder how YOU can't tell. It is so obvious to me that I can tell whether a game is 60 fps from a few short seconds. The difference between 30 and 60 is like night and day to me...
The fact that YOU can't see it doesn't mean the difference isn't there...
SolidSnakex
Member
It is poison to some if a racer doesn't run at 60fps, just look at some of the threads about those racers. Some people are very serious about that stuff and if developers don't address those problems they'll lose sales from those people, even if it's a small amount of people. I can understand that complaint although it won't hold me back from playing the game (I won't buy them).
Lord Error
Insane For Sony
Progressive scan TV sets update the whole screen at 60Hz refresh rate, so in that regard they work the same way as the computer monitor.
'Regular' TVs update every 2nd line on the screen at 60Hz refresh rate. So, the picture is partially updated every 1/60s. Even then it's still easy as hell to see the difference between 30 and 60FPS, especially if the game moves fast.
60FPS, IMO is not mandatory for any game that doesn't move fast or require high speed precision inputs, but it's always welcome as it gives the visuals that something extra, that is otherwise missing.
DaCocoBrova
Finally bought a new PSP, but then pushed the demon onto someone else. Jesus.
Don't you all remember when you first saw Daytona arcade, VF2 and all that other Model 2 goodness for the first time? I didn't know what was so different about those games, but I knew it was something.
Now I know, and to settle for less generation after generation I think is silly.
Now I know, and to settle for less generation after generation I think is silly.
radios shipping overview
Member
...says the pot.Celicar said:Only the uber nerds who post on gaming forums care about fps.
DaCocoBrova
Finally bought a new PSP, but then pushed the demon onto someone else. Jesus.
A 60fps game = a polished game
Who doesn't want polished software?
Who doesn't want polished software?
ToyMachine228
Member
As long as it's solid, I don't really care if it's 30 or 60.
DCX
DCX
I'll agree that a game running at 60 is smoother than not, but again if you offer me more in other departments than it's ok, i mean look at Doom III it limits it's frame rate to 60, now PC gamers are probably going ape shit becuase they are used to 120fps...Resident Evil 4 looks great and doesn't warrant 60, MGS 3 looks and i'm sure will play great and i would care if it was 30. Now i wonder, if GT4 was running 30 what people would say then?dark10x said:
DCX
SolidSnakex
Member
"Now i wonder, if GT4 was running 30 what people would say then? "
I'd say "Where did Kaz go?". Because he's already said that one of the main points of development with a GT game is making sure it runs at 60fps. As long as he's at Polyphony, I don't think we ever have to worry about a GT game running under 60fps (aside from GT1/2 where they had no choice). He cares way too much about racing games to do anything less than that.
I'd say "Where did Kaz go?". Because he's already said that one of the main points of development with a GT game is making sure it runs at 60fps. As long as he's at Polyphony, I don't think we ever have to worry about a GT game running under 60fps (aside from GT1/2 where they had no choice). He cares way too much about racing games to do anything less than that.
DaCocoBrova
Finally bought a new PSP, but then pushed the demon onto someone else. Jesus.
The only time a dev should settle for 30fps is when their game is doing things on a technical level that warrant the sacrifice. RE4 applies I think as it looks better than 95% of what we're playing now.
Sad thing is, many, if not most 30fps aren't even solid.
Conceptually, a lot of this is too much for you to grasp apparently, but the notion is simple.
There's not a person in this thread that would admit to 30fps looking better than 60fps. So becuase 60fps makes games more fluid whether your eyes can tell or not, it IMO and that of many, many others, makes a game more polished. It also speaks volumes about optimiztion and efficent coding.
Sad thing is, many, if not most 30fps aren't even solid.
Conceptually, a lot of this is too much for you to grasp apparently, but the notion is simple.
There's not a person in this thread that would admit to 30fps looking better than 60fps. So becuase 60fps makes games more fluid whether your eyes can tell or not, it IMO and that of many, many others, makes a game more polished. It also speaks volumes about optimiztion and efficent coding.
Lord Error
Insane For Sony
It's 60, just like MGS2
MGS is one kind of game where 60FPS is not really necessary, but it adds so much oomph to the game's overal visual feel when everything moves so smooth.Look no further than PGR2 threads back then when it was announced it would run at 30FPS. The game got trashed like there's no tomorrow. I can't even imagine what would happen to GT4 considering to what kind of standard that game is usually held.
CrimsonSkies
Member
"Even then it's still easy as hell to see the difference between 30 and 60FPS"
I don't agree. If you can then I believe you. Just don't assume everyone can see what you are seeing when it comes to FPS.
I don't agree. If you can then I believe you. Just don't assume everyone can see what you are seeing when it comes to FPS.
DaCocoBrova
Finally bought a new PSP, but then pushed the demon onto someone else. Jesus.
This is a two-fold issue though. Some games are rendered at 60fps, but animate at 30fps. Looks pretty sh!tty too. So much so that I'd rather a solid 30fps if given the option.
All this back and forth is why I tend to game more on the PC these days. On top of crushing consoles from a visual standpoint (dark10x... another time), you actually have some level of control when it comes to how well the game performs.
All this back and forth is why I tend to game more on the PC these days. On top of crushing consoles from a visual standpoint (dark10x... another time), you actually have some level of control when it comes to how well the game performs.
DaCocoBrova said:
I won't disagree with you anymore, PCs are the king right now...but that's expected. Happens every gen. It takes a while for PCs to catch up, though...
One year ago, I would have disagreed...and prior to that, I would have said you were flat out wrong.
I actually don't like the ability to tweak these days, though. The problem is that I go TOO crazy and end up focusing on a goal I may or may NOT be able to achieve. The game loses purity as a result. I simply spend TOO much time tweaking...
FortNinety
Member
I'm beginning to think that some people genuinely cannot see the difference between 30 and 60 fps. Sorta like how some are color blind.
shpankey
not an idiot
I definately care on racing games. Not for visual reasons (although I can see it, it doesn't bother me visually) but I care for the feeling I get with the control/gameplay. Unless you are a hardcore racer, I doubt you'll understand, but ask any bigtime racing gamer and they will immediately tell you there is a huge difference in the feel of the control of the vehicle. The control is much much MUCH more precise and smooth... the car responds to my input immediately and accurately. At 30fps the only way I can tell you that some of you will understand is, compared to 60fps, 30fps almost feel like there is a little delay (like playing a game over the internet with a 300 ping).
There's a big difference. If you don't notice it, consider yourself lucky.
There's a big difference. If you don't notice it, consider yourself lucky.
V
Vennt
Unconfirmed Member
Depending on the game/genre it can be a dealbreaker for me, therefore I care, moreso on Racing Games than others, but generally I find 30fps a major negative.
(Above assumes 60 vs 30 locked - Don't get me started on wildly fluctuating FPS rates)
(Above assumes 60 vs 30 locked - Don't get me started on wildly fluctuating FPS rates)
Grizzlyjin
Supersonic, idiotic, disconnecting, not respecting, who would really ever wanna go and top that
Virtua Fighter fans care. Some of Akira's moves have to be timed down to the frame in VF4...and there you have the reason why I only play as Lion.
evilromero
Member
It made Metroid Prime even better. Without the smooth framerate the game would've not had the whole impact. If Mario Sunshine had 60fps I can't imagine just how fucking jawdropping it would've been.
SolidSnakex
Member
Grizzlyjin said:
Well the reason for playing as Lion is because he's the best character in the game.
But I see your point.
MaddenNFL64
Member
I will settle for 30 only if the technical achivements warrant it, with the exception of racing & fighting games, which should be 60 no matter what.
SolidSnakex
Member
"A racing game at 30 actually looks FASTER because it's showing fewer frames every second"
Kinda strange that the fastest racers on the market are 60fps, huh?
Kinda strange that the fastest racers on the market are 60fps, huh?