saintjules
Member
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Activision Blizzard Executive Brian Bulatao attempting to do union busting
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CGiRanger
Banned
Unions would not solve the problems at Blizzard. The woke workforce is main issue behind the quality of their games. The harassment issues would not have been solved by Unions for sure.
So yeah, it's clear it's no longer about the harassment and more about politics. Look at that Jessica Gonzales' twitter and you'll see she's the wokest of the woke. And Schrier the crier is just being himself as usual
So yeah, it's clear it's no longer about the harassment and more about politics. Look at that Jessica Gonzales' twitter and you'll see she's the wokest of the woke. And Schrier the crier is just being himself as usual
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Punished Miku
Gaslighter Pro: 16.7 Fireflops
Scumlord.
Vaelka
Member
Like with everything, unions have pros and cons.
Something that people who glorify them don't seem to understand or perhaps pretend to be ignorant about however is that unions also protect shitty workers who don't deserve to be protected and often become corrupted.
Considering the people who are the most vocal about them too, if I worked as a game dev I'd probably not be in favor of them.
I wouldn't want those people to be in charge and have power...
There's too much politicization going on surrounding it that in reality has nothing to do with unions inherently. There's so much baggage being attached.
The biggest union in the US is the police union, whatever people might think about cops ( I am not against them, I wanted to become a cop when I was a kid and only have positive experiences with them ).
It's still a fact that getting rid of bad cops is extremely hard because of it, and their union does protect them.
Sometimes workers actually are just shit and should be gotten rid of, unions makes it a complete nightmare to try and get rid of bad actors.
DeepEnigma
Gold Member
He's an activist. Nothing more now.
He stays clear of topics when "his people" are exposed, but has no issues piling on "the other side" with little to no information from the get-go.
Pure emotional activism in nature. For the cause, comrade.
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saintjules
Member
Clear
CliffyB's Cock Holster
Who the fuck are Vodeo games? Seriously! Try putting that into Google
Like, the only reference I could find was off of Polygon because they released a thing called "beast breaker" last September.
I'm sorry, but the timing of this is all weirdly convenient don't you think?
But anyway... please unionize guys. If that catches on and US development becomes all that way its great for us in the rest of the world. Because we'll be the cheaper and thus the preferred option going forwards.
IntentionalPun
Ask me about my wife's perfect butthole
God I'm starting to hate Jason.
Employees forming their own union is not the same as employees being contacted by a massive labor union. I seriously doubt the "Vodeo Workers Union".. does much of anything.. I wonder if they even have union dues? lol There are 13 people at the entire company, and that is going to include people who CANT be in a labor union in the US (owners/supervisors.) Just a group of try-hards.
You really should be cautious of signing forms from a massive labor union who contacts you.
Having said that, Activision execs shouldn't be emailing employees about it either.. although they are well w/in their rights to do so.
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Starting to?
Clear
CliffyB's Cock Holster
What bugs me the most is the way this is being presented as like the start of a glorious revolution or some such nonsense!
Be realistic, where do you think things will go next? I mean for each individual who signs up to some big union with no specific knowledge of the industry in question?
Do you think that's going to help them secure better working conditions? Help them career-wise in an otherwise un-unionized international industry that is entirely based on performance? What sort of leverage do you really have working in videogames? Sure, you can withdraw your labour and cost your employer money... but how's that exactly supposed to help you when you're not working at a plant with expensive, fixed infrastructure and therefore can simply be replaced by another employee literally anywhere in the world connected to the internet?
Its madness! People like Schreier are so ideologically (and controversy) focussed that they don't give a second's thought to the consequences of unionization. Yes, these workers are just asserting their rights, but it just means their employers are going to assert theirs as they stand within their respective jurisdictions.
Be realistic, where do you think things will go next? I mean for each individual who signs up to some big union with no specific knowledge of the industry in question?
Do you think that's going to help them secure better working conditions? Help them career-wise in an otherwise un-unionized international industry that is entirely based on performance? What sort of leverage do you really have working in videogames? Sure, you can withdraw your labour and cost your employer money... but how's that exactly supposed to help you when you're not working at a plant with expensive, fixed infrastructure and therefore can simply be replaced by another employee literally anywhere in the world connected to the internet?
Its madness! People like Schreier are so ideologically (and controversy) focussed that they don't give a second's thought to the consequences of unionization. Yes, these workers are just asserting their rights, but it just means their employers are going to assert theirs as they stand within their respective jurisdictions.
Hawking Radiation
Wants to watch an Event Horizon porno
Ah, its Jason being a cock again.
Can someone please gag that cock? He's making a mess.
Can someone please gag that cock? He's making a mess.
Dick Jones
Banned
In Bulatao's defence, it could have been Bobby who sent it. That's the only defence that's acceptable here.
Vodeo Games please change your dumbass name. If Google is autocorrecting you to video games then the name sucks.
Vodeo Games please change your dumbass name. If Google is autocorrecting you to video games then the name sucks.
Kerotan
Member
Nah unions are trash.
Kiddo Cabbusses
Member
I'd probably like to see the video game devver union finally come up just so we have an example instead of a thread debating theoreticals.
I use services from businesses that are unionized locally, and I have not had a major quality issue from any I remember. If neither customers or employees are complaining, than logically the union would be considered a positive IMO.
I use services from businesses that are unionized locally, and I have not had a major quality issue from any I remember. If neither customers or employees are complaining, than logically the union would be considered a positive IMO.
drganon
Member
As others have said, who the fuck are "vodeo" games? Also Jason "rat boy" Schreier can go fuck himself.
Fuz
Banned
BlackM1st
Banned
Coolwhhip
Neophyte
That Blizzard employee of course has her gender in her Twitter bio and her tweets are mainly about mental illness. Blizzard stay winning.
Whenever I see an incredibly dumb or hateful tweet I click on their bio and there is a 98% chance there is a she/her or his/him there. Fucking idiots.
Whenever I see an incredibly dumb or hateful tweet I click on their bio and there is a 98% chance there is a she/her or his/him there. Fucking idiots.
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STARSBarry
Gold Member
Is this like an American thing? It has to be, I have worked in my role which has a strong Union for almost a decade now and while a member and paying my fee's, have been in the fortunate position to never have to use there services.
However colleagues have and I can only say they have done what needed to be done. Most frequently to stop what was some other middle manager who's a bit to big for their boots going on some insane power mad rampage and get back into something that is covered in there perview of responsibility
There like a safety net, that makes sure that legislatively rules are followed. If they are not it's normally not the staff that's skipped out on process, it's the red faced mad lad screeching behind a closed door about someone being .5 below on targets.
There are bad unions, but there's also bad people... this weird fantasy that unions "just don't work" always bemused me about the Yank contractors who just don't understand why everything is so smooth, like our public healthcare. I would look into the history of the people spouting such nonsense and who they work for, rather than the context of the speech itself.
Unless yout some junior vice president or above the unions are going to bat for you, not pitching against.
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You do know that the only unionized workers will be the current one, nothing is telling Activision that they're REQUIRED to hire unionized workers, also whatever the criteria to become unionized is, X hours a week, they'll ensure all workers not "grandfathered" into this will never get this, leaving new workers fucked on hours or pay, whatever that clause is.
I'm just laughing my ass off at all the tools giving money to the Activision GOFUNDME strike to get a union fund.
The main people that benefit from unions are those who are creating and running it, the workers these days basically get fucked for the most part. Oh but you can GRIEVE when you have a union... yea and 95% of the unions in North America are TOOTHLESS so the grievances go through tons of steps and then NOTHING happens, typically the company will grease the union manager they're dealing with and guess what? The grievance of sexual assault or crunch or whatever ends up being the EMPLOYEES issue.
I'm just laughing my ass off at all the tools giving money to the Activision GOFUNDME strike to get a union fund.
The main people that benefit from unions are those who are creating and running it, the workers these days basically get fucked for the most part. Oh but you can GRIEVE when you have a union... yea and 95% of the unions in North America are TOOTHLESS so the grievances go through tons of steps and then NOTHING happens, typically the company will grease the union manager they're dealing with and guess what? The grievance of sexual assault or crunch or whatever ends up being the EMPLOYEES issue.
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IntentionalPun
Ask me about my wife's perfect butthole
I honestly never paid attention to the dude; after he ended up at Bloomberg I feel like he was harder to ignore.
StreetsofBeige
Member
We'll have to see what the union terms are. It's not a one way street. So whatever the union workers want to get, management will want something back. The agreed upon deal can involve whatever, but typically there's big things about pay, tiers, job task and hours worked.
Jigsaah
Gold Member
I don't think any of this has to do with the quality of their games directly. However the problem you admitted that unions would solve is probably the sole reason they are trying this.
You have to blame the company when these kind of rights are not enforced. Maybe they see unions as the only way out, double edged sword as it may be.
StreetsofBeige
Member
Thats a video game employee issue you see all the time. Wild west attitude where they wing off uploading to social media internal memos, confidential info, leaks and Adios! emails where they make one last stand before leaving.
Rarely get that in other industries.
That's why I wouldnt trust any gaming employee adhering to any rules agreed to by management and the union rep.
Now if this was a bank and a bunch of pissed off employees working in branches wanted to unionized for better pay or safety (robbers), I'd trust the bank employees 100x more than any gaming employee listening to rules.
Imru’ al-Qays
Member
Bizarre to see all the cucks in this thread whining about unions. Unions are the only option most American workers have to improve their quality of life in a meaningful way.
I will never work a non-union job for the rest of my life if I have any say in the matter.
I will never work a non-union job for the rest of my life if I have any say in the matter.
Clear
CliffyB's Cock Holster
Oh please, we're talking about game-dev not mining coal in Appalachia!
If you don't like long hours and deadlines, get a straight job. Noone gives a shit about how kindly you were treated if the product is late or overpriced, or bugged to fuck.
Generations of devs have survived crunch just fine, and they will continue to do so particularly in countries where people aren't such snowflakes.
StreetsofBeige
Member
Thats the thing I never understood. If game companies are so trashy with 14 hour crunches killing your home life, then get a different job. It's not like some secret only found out after you accept employment. When the gaming populace even knows about it, it's no secret. But they forged ahead.
Getting back to coal mining, if I hated being underground in dark cold tunnels and smelling dusty fumes, and didnt want to work at a job that has high rates of injury, well golly, the logical thing to do is NOT be a coal miner.
But then some guy will get accepted to a job there and complain about dark tunnels.
WTF?
CGiRanger
Banned
Thought I saw a tweet from she/her that "they" are going to leave the game industry and have lined up a job in a telecom company. So seems they conned someone in a different industry into getting through the door.
Imru’ al-Qays
Member
Americans have the worst working conditions in the developed world, that's just a straightforward fact. And it's because only 6% of our workforce is unionized.
Clear
CliffyB's Cock Holster
The coal mining analogy is a good one because its a job with serious long-term health implications on top of it being a fundamentally dangerous occupation. More to the point its a regional thing, the coal has to be mined at that source and so workers are likely to be drawn locally. Hence communities become dependent upon that one industry to provide a living for them and their families. The mine shuts and the town dies, same deal with all sorts of heartland heavy industries.
In that context unionization and the ability to collectively bargain for labour rights is very important.
However, with game dev absolutely none of this applies. Its an entirely different scenario.
The worst thing that's going to happen is you are going to have to deal with long hours and not great job security. Things you really ought to be aware of going in, because its always been that way. Which naturally is why most of the stuff you hear being agitated about is stuff to do with gender politics and alleged harassment and cronyism.
Its a sham.
PhaseJump
Banned
Coal miners traditionally were exploited, in times when safety wasn't a concern at all for them. Capital would flow into a region, set up mines, a town would spring up around it, the same company management would own the supply chain behind the local shops and housing and families would work in the mines for a living wage. Without unions, they wouldn't have benefits that let them raise families to succeed and get away from all of it. They would still have private police forces showing up to evict people from company owned houses when the employee's got too injured to pay rent.
To say "The logical thing to do is NOT be a coal miner" when you consider where and when coal mines were viable and started becoming unionized, is almost as egregious as saying to someone "The logical thing to do is NOT be poor."
GymWolf
Member
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