Support NeoGAF

[orthodoxy1095]

I already have to carry a phone and a tablet/computer every day, and I don't really want to carry more devices around anymore.

On top of that, with mobile making leaps and bounds, I feel pretty satiated by mobile gaming.

 

[Mivey]

With PC ports of typical handheld games and gamepad controlls in general being quite prevalent, a small factor PC resembling a handheld could be what you are looking for. The advantage here is also that it would not need to have an audience big enough to sustain an eco system, the larger PC space already does that. It would only need to sell at a high enough price to be profitable to the manufacturer.

But I guess for the Vita fanbase, it would be preferable to complete give up and start getting used to the mobile market than to start using PCs, in whatever form factor.

 

[Aostia]

I think OP described the exact opposite of what a portable should do

 

[jblank83]

TBH, I've been happier with the 3DS than any other system (that isn't PC) in the last 10 years, so I hope there's still a large enough market for handhelds.

As far as numbers, 3DS seems to have done about 20 million in NA, so there's that.

 

[bigkrev]

The Vita memory card pricing kept me away from the longest time. It wasn't even the price of the console or games.

That's not even comparable. You would need to be able to take a $349 PS4 innards, miniaturize them into something that could fit in a pocket, add a screen and somehow end up well under $300, probably under $200. It's just not possible.

 

[pkmaximum]

Check out the gpd win 10 that was recently announced. That will be a good hand held solution for gaming since it runs traditional windows.

 

[Who]

Check out the gpd win 10 that was recently announced. That will be a good hand held solution for gaming since it runs traditional windows.

Fuuuuck I'm all over this... Bet it would run Overwatch no issues too... Damn. There it is.

Your title was intriguing your actual text not so much.why would you want to play AAA on your handheld?

Only Nintendo can save handheld gaming or at least make it shrink slower than predicted.

Well I just gave my opinion on specifics but the purpose of the thread is for people to give their own thoughts too if they disagreed. What do you think Nintendo would have to do/not do to make a highly successful handheld device that appeals to traditional console gamers?

 

[jahasaja]

Your title was intriguing your actual text not so much.why would you want to play AAA on your handheld?

Only Nintendo can save handheld gaming or at least make it shrink slower than predicted.

Edit below:

My point is that the machine you are describing sounds like a Vita or something similar which I would guess could only sell a few million units. For a handheld to succeed it need games built from the ground up for the handheld.Why I mentioned Nintendo is because they have several titles handcrafted for the handheld (pokemon,animal crossing, FE) that will make their console sell.

 

[Osukaa]

I have to say that I really agree with your ideas 100% especially the advertising part. The US is pretty much shallow as to how many people idolize the so called celebrities here. I mean I can almost guarantee if you have one of the Kardasian's (ughhh) or music celebrities in commercials supporting the system it would be a huge sales boon. I think there is still a market. It might not be the popular opinion but it's still feasibly possible. ...... I want a Vita Successor
-_-

 

[Leafhopper]

Sure the games are selling well... But at the same time it's only attracting and surprising those who already own the device.

It's not really getting anyone else interested in getting the handheld.

That is true.

 

[Pizza]

Wasn't that made for the 3DS?

Yeah, I've come to realize I'd rather sacrifice handheld gimmicks and portability in favor of playing on a home console tbh

Not that anything is inherently wrong with handhelds, but I prefer to surf the 'net on my phone over carrying my 3DS XL around, and when I'm gaming I'd rather be sitting with a controller in hand on my tv over playing on a 3DS

 

[Iksenpets]

This strategy seems indistinguishable from the Vita. The only difference is an unattainable promise to make AAA console games available day and date. People don't want inferior console experiences on their handheld; they don't want to spend money on a second, worse version of a game so they can play it both on the road and on a console at home.

The handhelds that have done the best have been the ones that tried to create unique experiences. The problem is a lot of those experiences are now reproducible on a smartphone with little or no loss in quality. Any turn-based or point-and-click style game is good enough on a phone for most people. And that leaves precious little territory where a dedicated handheld can excel where it can't either be outperformed by a console or undercut by the phones people already own. I don't see the path forward to correct those problems. I don't think handhelds die, but I don't think they ever bounce back, either.

 

[MUnited83]

People say handhelds are dead but, then main series Pokémon and Fire Emblem numbers come out and folks are surprised.

I don't know. I think sometimes people overestimate the sales on x platform.

Isn't X&Y the worst performing mainline Pokemon title yet? I mean, it still sells ridiculously well, but it is going on a downwards trend. It is a mega-franchise, a huge brand so it still holds up pretty well, but as you can see from the hardware sales and overal software numbers, the market is a lot more small than it was back in NDS's time.

 

[MrChom]

Only Nintendo can save handheld gaming or at least make it shrink slower than predicted.

Why does it need saving? Nintendo's mobile market is still equal to that of the PS4 and XBox One combined.

Frankly at this point if anyone mentioned to me they wanted some great games I'd point them at the phenomenal 3ds and DS back catalogue that knocks their TV based cousins into a cocked had.

 

[Narroo]

So, you want a "Traditional Handheld gaming device" with 4 shoulder buttons and clickable sticks? And all AAA games on it?

That's not traditional at all. Handhelds are meant to be portable, not impossibly miniaturized consoles with a giant batter duct taped to it. Heck, why do you think the 3DS, and DS, had two screens? It's because the clamshell design makes it much more pocketable than the gameboys were and adding a second screen capitalizes on the clamshell. Sure, it doesn't need the camera, or the 3DS (even though I like the 3D), but what you're asking for isn't traditional; traditional is 2 face buttons.

 

[DietRob]

Phones are the new handheld market. The tech is getting better everyday. There will come a time in the not so distant future that phones will be able to play games of the same caliber of anything you can get on Vita or 3DS. Some of the current phone games are almost there.

 

[Orayn]

$300 if you get in early.

https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/gpd-win-intel-z8550-win-10-os-game-console#/

 

[10k]

It's been fully tapped. Kids these days just want to game on their phones and tablets and consider handhelds and console for old people.

If Nintendo put out a vita like handheld with SD card memory instead of proprietary memory, and a decent price ($199-250) they would probably still sell 3DS like numbers.

Dedicated gaming handhelds are on their way out. The NX handheld will likely be the last one (and the NX console likely Nintendo's last as well )

 

[Blak_Status]

Phones are the new handheld market. The tech is getting better everyday. There will come a time in the not so distant future that phones will be able to play games of the same caliber of anything you can get on Vita or 3DS. Some of the current phone games are almost there.

I agree but I'll never understand why. I hate gaming on my phone (I have a Note 4). I get way more satisfaction out of playing my 3DS.

 

[10k]

I agree but I'll never understand why. I hate gaming on my phone (I have a Note 4). I get way more satisfaction out of playing my 3DS.

It's because you weren't raised on it.

The 6-16 year old crowd grew up gaming on their parents laptops, tablets and phones, and rarely got exposed to console and handheld gaming. They are fine because they never know better. They went from Facebook games to mobile games and tablet games. They have clans in school for clash of clans and always have their phones on them. It's quicker and more accessible to them. If they want a meatier experience they play on their consoles at home.

 

[friz898]

I also agree. Final Fantasy Record Keeper broke me of this though. I was one of the very-very salty Vita owners on mobile gaming. My post history about 2 years ago proves it.

That being said, FFRK has slowly pushed me into mobile gaming as a whole. I recently bought a Nvidia Shield K1 Tablet, now that it's super cheap for 199. It's getting as much use as my (since-sold) 3DS was during FE: Awakening and FF Theatrhythm days. Or as much use as my Vita did the first year or so, before it officially became an indie machine.

I agree but I'll never understand why. I hate gaming on my phone (I have a Note 4). I get way more satisfaction out of playing my 3DS.

 

[Yoday]

My point against that is that people don't know what they want. Idk to me, the idea of being able to play all the same games but off of the TV, on the toilet, in bed, on the couch while the wife is watching TV etc. is still something that can appeal to the traditional western gamer if done right.

These days most people would rather just browse the web/social media/YouTube on their phones or tablets than get invested in a game. I think there is still a market for handhelds aimed at a younger audience, but that is about it. For teens and older handheld time is now browsing time with the occasional check in on a mobile game that only takes a minute or two.

 

[jdstorm]

Its the mobile/tablet market. cases like the Logitech PowerShell ( don't own just the first result Google showed) are affordable solutions that turn your phone into a comfortable gaming device for less then the cost of a dedicated gaming portable. Plus mobile/tablet versions of games are often cheaper and there are many excellent games from past systems with ports ( GTA 3, KOTOR, Bastion, Transistor, FF 1-9 ect)

 

[Duxxy3]

I'd be perfectly happy with a DS 2 lite with a higher PPI. Don't give a crap about analog sticks, stereo sound, SD cards, downloadable content or any internet connection at all.

I just want a simple, dumb, cheap, portable. I don't have any interest in console games on the go.

 

[Aaron D.]

These days most people would rather just browse the web/social media/YouTube on their phones or tablets than get invested in a game. I think there is still a market for handhelds aimed at a younger audience, but that is about it. For teens and older handheld time is now browsing time with the occasional check in on a mobile game that only takes a minute or two.

This is an important point.

When I metro to and from work, my mobile does like 6 different things seamlessly. I can check email, browse the web, shoot off a text or two, and dive into my favorite game in rotation. All while listening to my favorite gaming podcast the whole time.

Dedicated handhelds will never have that functional diversity, and people simply demand that versatility on the go. They're not interested in pulling out multiple, single-use dedicated hardware when they can do it all on a single device. It's the same reason why mp3 players, digital cameras, etc. are dead.

 

[DietRob]

I agree but I'll never understand why. I hate gaming on my phone (I have a Note 4). I get way more satisfaction out of playing my 3DS.

I'm with you there. I sold off my Vita recently because I just didn't play it much anymore but playing a game with traditional controls is so much better than fumbling around with a touchscreen.

 

[jak153]

I don't think a handheld like that would succeed in the west. Like many others have said your ideas are very similar to what the Vita tried to do and it failed to gain popularity in the West. I wish that everything didn't point to that because I do enjoy playing AAA games on the go or in my bed but I guess people that enjoy that type of thing are the minority even though the PSP was a good success which from when I was younger the appeal was playing AAA titles on the go.

 

[Crankshaft]

I don't play handhelds because I want/like handhelds. I play them because the games I want are on handhelds.

Would I rather have played Etrian odyssey on the Wii or the DS? The wii

Did I really want to buy a 3ds just so I could play Shin Megami Tensei 4? Not really

Put those games on a console. So I don't have to lay on my couch getting hand cramps with these tiny devices. Or sell a super game boy type device.

 

[hymanator]

I always liked the idea of a "gaming phone" with physical buttons, I used to "side talk" on an N-gage even.

After the plug was pulled on N-gage, I remember being really hyped about the Xperia Play, but didn't get one because it was exclusive to specific phone carriers (I was locked into a contract).

It makes me wish Sony and Nintendo would experiment with making a "phone version" of the Vita and 3DS. Making their devices compatible with every phone carrier would be a huge help also.

 

[The Abominable Snowman]

I definitely think there is a missing link...

First, SnapDragon SoCs are so far past any handheld ever released in the past, and smartphones are so ubiquitous, handheld makers are completely ignoring existing platforms with obvious gaps (A Steam-like or Origin-like system with real backing, exclusive developments, access on other platforms)

The biggest thing is of course physical. When Samsung and Oculus can sell >5 million VR headsets for $99, why can't we get a slim, pocketable controller that grips on the sides like the Steelseries? Maybe add some premium features like sensors, bluetooth, speakers w/ headphones, battery bank (Since it'll likely cover those ports), maybe even e-ink buttons with colored LEDs, NFC and external peripherals.

Make it work with all Android phones with a certain minimum chipset, and introduce some kind of best-fit settings for phone resolutions and SoC combinations.

At least I can see a market for it. It would take a Sony or Nintendo to do this, though.

 

[Buster Machine]

This is an important point.

When I metro to and from work, my mobile does like 6 different things seamlessly. I can check email, browse the web, shoot off a text or two, and dive into my favorite game in rotation. All while listening to my favorite gaming podcast the whole time.

Dedicated handhelds will never have that functional diversity, and people simply demand that versatility on the go. They're not interested in pulling out multiple, single-use dedicated hardware when they can do it all on a single device. It's the same reason why mp3 players, digital cameras, etc. are dead.

Exactly. People seem to think the choice is smartphone games vs. "serious" games, completely ignoring the fact that people occupy their time with all kinds of other things with these devices in addition to gaming. I also don't care about laying in bed and playing games. Even I did, I already own a laptop, tablet, and phone to fulfill that need.

Though honestly I never really liked handheld gaming in the first place. Only reason I bought them were because they had the games I wanted to play. Even as a kid, I'd rather play on a Super Gameboy or Gameboy player. I tolerated the DS and PSP because of how big their libraries were. Now that third party support on 3DS has shrunken to the point that I can count the number of games I don't regret buying on almost one hand and I don't need a dedicated device just to pass the time while i'm away from home, I'm done. I don't care about playing the games I already play on PC and consoles on a handheld; I want it the other way around. Give me a way to play the small amount of games I want on hardware I don't actively loathe or I'll just ignore them altogether going forward.

 

[SRTtoZ]

People want to play handheld games on handhelds, not worse console games on a worse console.

This right here. That was one of the worst parts of the Vita . Why would I want to play UC Golden Abyss when I could play a better looking, better controlling, better written version on my PS3? And studios put their B teams or give it to another developer because why would they want to work on a handheld game when they could work on a full fledged AAA game? Give me handheld games for my handheld.

 

[jdstorm]

I always liked the idea of a "gaming phone" with physical buttons, I used to "side talk" on an N-gage even.

After the plug was pulled on N-gage, I remember being really hyped about the Xperia Play, but didn't get one because it was exclusive to specific phone carriers (I was locked into a contract).

It makes me wish Sony and Nintendo would experiment with making a "phone version" of the Vita and 3DS. Making their devices compatible with every phone carrier would be a huge help also.

They already have this with 3rd party controller periferals for your phone/tablet that have physical buttons. What you want already exists on iPhone/android

 

[Aters]

I want handheld games, not COD portable.

 

[Xenoblade]

As Americans, we of course cant think for ourselves

interesting

 

[gblues]

I don't know that mobile has completely supplanted the market for handheld, so much as it has raised the bar of what people expect out of a handheld system.

The DS came out about a decade ago, and while it didn't have the PSP's sexy screen, it did have an innovative touch screen and it absolutely killed in the game department. But now that everyone and their brother has had at least one smartphone, going back to a low-res screen is really jarring. I'm trying to play Xenoblade 3D, and while it's an excellent game, I can't help but think how much more impressive it would be at a higher resolution--not to mention easier to see NPCs!

My personal dream-handheld would combine:

- the pixel density of an iPhone
- the ergonomics of the Wii U pad (or at least an N3DS with the 3rd-party grips attached)
- the RAM and CPU performance of a recent-ish SoC. Let's say a Snapdragon simply because Apple is highly unllikely to license their SoCs to third parties.
- a platform policy forbidding consumable IAPs of any kind. Want to sell level packs, cheats, or expansions? Go for it! Want to charge $700 for smurfberries? Go fuck yourselves.

I foresee a growing market for fed-up parents who want something that just plays games without constantly showing advertising or prompts to spend more money. It's something I already miss dearly. The 3DS and Wii U are the last systems capable of this (since both let you turn off the store notifications).

 

[Bear Force One]

We are living in a post handheld time.

 

[RedSwirl]

Things could have been different if we had a device with the ubiquity of the iPhone or Android devices where physical buttons came standard (but maybe didn't completely supplant the touch screen experience). Things could also have been different if the gaming market on mobile hadn't turned into a race to the bottom. I feel like if a lot of developers could get away with selling $30 games on iOS, it would be getting games of at least DS and PSP quality.

Where we stand now, on the one hand I think the era of dedicated handhelds as isolated platforms built on exclusive games is over. They need to be true extensions of console/PC software libraries. On the other hand, I don't see the physical possibilities for a handheld to natively run the same high-end games being made for consoles at the same time. The handheld tech, even if it's on the same architecture or OS, is still gonna be like five years behind.

I agree with the OP's portable PS4 idea a few years down the line though. If Sony wants to maintain an environment of PlayStation devices all pulling from the same hardware-agnostic library, a portable form factor somewhere down the line would be great, even if it mostly only runs low-end (indie) and legacy software.

That's exactly what I'd like to see for a Windows handheld someday. The GPD Win 10 is a good start and I'd like to see someone build on it. I think the future for hardcore handheld gaming might be Windows/Linux devices that just run Steam. They might not run the latest games, but I'd be fine using one for just classic games, indie games, and emulators.

Even that however would probably be a niche device. For a handheld to get popular now with the mass audience it pretty much has to be another iPhone -- a ubiquitous all-purpose device that also plays games.

 

[ThoughtsOfSpeaking]

The fact is children would prefer tablets and phones and grown ass adults are not using these things in public. In the 4 years of owning a Vita, living in London for 2 of them, I have seen only 2 adults holding vitas and less than 10 holding DS/DSi/3DS.

If there is a market for these things, the people who are buying them are not using them as they were originally intended.

 

[ZOONAMI]

It's called "Remote Play" and it works really well.
People didn't care for it.

I've had 3 different vitas, have 40mb down 5up Internet and ps4 is hard wired, have changed router settings and turned off power saving setting on vitas. Direct connection is worse than using my network. Remote play is garbage in my personal experience. Display lag and input delay is unbearable, and that's not even mentioning the lack of r2 l2. The wii u gamepad streaming works well, remote play is garbage in comparison imo.

 

[Dremorak]

A "lightning in bottle" marketing campaign. I think a key reason why handhelds aren't as big in the west as they are in Japan is because of how they are perceived. As Americans, we of course cant think for ourselves, so we need celebrities and corporations to make handhelds look cool first. (I.e. Rappers, sports stars, playing it in commercials, market placement in movies and TV shows.)

...He's not wrong

 

[Anth0ny]

Maybe? If it does exist, it's not very big, though.

 

[Funyarinpa]

Screw those who want to butcher the handheld market by constant port begging and shitting on the form factor. You have the mobile market for shitty time wasters, keep actual handhelds out of that.

 

[Maximus.]

You essentially suggested a Vita with some minor changes. That did not work out so well for Sony. I think there is a market for handhelds, but it is definitely a smaller market. It really depends what kind of software support and marketing it receives, as well as price.

 

[OfTheOverflow]

Less untapped, just not lucrative. People are more interested in booting up whatever flavour of the week app they have at any given time.

 

[Jon Carter]

Your concept is unrealistic and would make the Vita look like a success.

The handheld market is competing with mobile gaming. It's not a market of people dying to play bad ports of games made for big HDTVs and soon even 4K and VR. Even with the Vita, the games that sold people on the system are, ironically, handheld-friendly indie games.

Nintendo is doing a lot of things right. Their games are the kind that mobile gamers want to play, except better. It's really the price of the games on mobile devices that are fucking things up for them. If they can come up with a solution for that, then they'll be in great shape.

Other than that, the market for portable gaming is full. There's no place for a Vita-type product. The idea of console/PC gaming on the go is only attractive to a small amount of people, most of whom are on Gaf or lurking Gaf.

 

[BigDug13]

Remote play seemed like a good idea on paper. But all it did was make me avoid it because I didn't want to experience all these PS4 games on a tiny screen with shit audio and shit controls when I could play those games on the TV in surround sound.

Basically I saw the remote play as too inferior of a method to experience my $60 PS4 games.

 

[KratosEnergyDrink]

There is a market for a kid friendly gaming device like the Game Boy, there always will be.

There is no market for a "serious" gaming handheld like the Vita as has been shown a thousand times.

There is a big market for a system that has kid friendly games and "mature" friendly Games. The 3DS proofed that.

Handhelds that only target one of these markets failed.

 

[peaceiscloser]

I actually prefer portable gaming, honestly. As a kid I could afford way more GBA games than GameCube games, and they were usually a lot more experimental and easier to jump into than console games.

Just miss them buttons.

 

[Sakujou]

i think people especially in the US wouldnt be interested in handhelds since most of them do not travel via metro/bus/train but with their own cars. another problem is that that handheld games need to be accessible hence pick up and play. most games which feature this, arent made for dual sticks.