Support NeoGAF

[CJY]

Didn't Lisa Su At Computex say they'd be showing more off their Ray Tracing solution/strategy at E3???


Maybe they meant E3 2020... SMH

 

[MightySquirrel]

Those are two completely different markets. Both priced correct. If you disagree send your resume in to AMD and show them what’s up.

AMD needs to claim market share from Intel AND Nvidia and looking at those prices they're only trying to go all out in CPU market, but not gpu.

 

[Ivellios]

Those are two completely different markets. Both priced correct. If you disagree send your resume in to AMD and show them what’s up.

Nice arguments, so anyone who disagrees with you should just send their resumes to amd because we are clearly wrong.

While i agree that all of Ryzen 2 are priced perfectly, the same cannot be said by their GPU. Everyone was expecting them to go cheaper than the competition. Plus these cards dont even have ray tracing

 

[JohnnyFootball]

Do I really need to explain economics 101 to you bozos? These cards are priced perfectly. Why would they go lower when they have to go lower next round after Nvidia lowers their price this round?

Should I draw a chart using blocks to explain competition?

Ryzen 2 is priced perfectly too.

Ryzen is finely priced, but I do feel that they could have done better with their GPUs. AMD has been getting their ass kicked so badly by nvidia, AMD really needed to make a statement and offer lower pricing that would really make consumers pause and have to give serious consideration to Navi. At $399 it would have been very compelling. $449 is not terrible, but they gave nvidia an easy opening.

 

[Redstarwater]

These cards are going to fly off the shelves when they go on sale this Holliday season. There is a lot of people playing on 570s and 580s, these are the cards they will buy when it’s time to go from 1080/60 to 1080/144 or 1440/60.

A 1200 dollar card is not a priority to the majority of the majority of the people who live in a country who can’t afford a 400 dollar emergency or whatever that statistic is.

The profit is in mass produced mid-high tier cards that almost all of you will buy.

 

[Redstarwater]

Ryzen is finely priced, but I do feel that they could have done better with their GPUs. AMD has been getting their ass kicked so badly by nvidia, AMD really needed to make a statement and offer lower pricing that would really make consumers pause and have to give serious consideration to Navi. At $399 it would have been very compelling. $449 is not terrible, but they gave nvidia an easy opening.

Exactly it gave Nvidia an opening and they will strike, and next year AMD will strike back ... and then.... guess what happens next....

 

[Insane Metal]

Both the PS5 and the XBII are supposed to have hardware for RT yet nothing was shown here... weird.

Edit: why are you laughing at me CyberPanda

 

[JohnnyFootball]

AMD needs to claim market share from Intel AND Nvidia and looking at those prices they're only trying to go all out in CPU market, but not gpu.

This is a myth. AMD has shareholders like every other corporation. AMD needs to make profit first and foremost. If marketshare was all that mattered then they should slash the CPU prices in half and call it a day. I guarantee you if Lisa Su went into the shareholders meeting and said, "We're losing money on each CPU and no profits, but we got good marketshare" she would be out of a job. AMD isn't a charity, it's profit driven first and foremost. Marketshare is nice, but smart corporations don't go for it at the expense of profits.

 

[Xyphie]

The big problem is that N7 HPC is just trash for density.

Navi 10 is 10.3B transistors in 255mm^2. Oh look. The same 40Mt/mm^2 Vega 20 had. Only a 60% increase over 16nm while having twice the wafer cost using AMD's own numbers.

nVidia made a very smart move staying on 12nm.

 

[MightySquirrel]

These cards are going to fly off the shelves when they go on sale this Holliday season. There is a lot of people playing on 570s and 580s, these are the cards they will buy when it’s time to go from 1080/60 to 1080/144 or 1440/60.

A 1200 dollar card is not a priority to the majority of the majority of the people who live in a country who can’t afford a 400 dollar emergency or whatever that statistic is.

The profit is in mass produced mid-high tier cards that almost all of you will buy.

1200 dollars and 5700? What are you on. 5700 doesn't compete against 2080ti . DId you missed the benchmarks part?

You failed to give a reason why someone whose not an amd fanboy would choose AMD 5700 XT over 2070? You know that nvidia has around 80% market share right? Ryzen looks extremely attractive - Navi not so much.

 

[MightySquirrel]

This is a myth. AMD has shareholders like every other corporation. AMD needs to make profit first and foremost. If marketshare was all that mattered then they should slash the CPU prices in half and call it a day. I guarantee you if Lisa Su went into the shareholders meeting and said, "We're losing money on each CPU and no profits, but we got good marketshare" she would be out of a job. AMD isn't a charity, it's profit driven first and foremost. Marketshare is nice, but smart corporations don't go for it at the expense of profits.

You're new to this. Obv nobody wants to sell at a loss, but sometimes you have to make very small profit per chip to gain big profit by selling more of them in the future. With bigger market share say 50% [thats what AMD is going after in cpu space, clearly not gpu] meaning they would be selling same amount of units as intel so even at lower price they would be generating more revenue meaning more profit year on year.

 

[MadAnon]

Both the PS5 and the XBII are supposed to have hardware for RT yet nothing was shown here... weird.

Edit: why are you laughing at me CyberPanda

Technically it could be raytraced 3D audio simulation they were talking about. Wasn't it rumored already that they will use dedicated processor for 3D audio simulation? Afterall, MS didn't specify what kind of hardware accelerated ray tracing they were talking about.

 

[gspat]

Intriguing conference!

Better uprez sampling vs dlss

Lowered latency for gaming

new lighting effects

Baiting for wenchmarks...

 

[Xyphie]

'

Looks like you're going to want either 3200CL14 or 3600CL16 with Ryzen 3000 for best gaming performance, not exactly cheap memory kits. Roughly 2x cost of the 3200CL16 most people buy.

 

[stetiger]

Didn't Lisa Su At Computex say they'd be showing more off their Ray Tracing solution/strategy at E3???


Maybe they meant E3 2020... SMH

They did. They had another talk where they said ray tracing on shader level, ray tracing on hardware, and ray tracing on cloud. Shader is expected this year, hardware for specific features next year, and cloud unknown but who cares.

 

[SonGoku]

I was out during AMDs conference, any big RDNA news i missed?

Both the PS5 and the XBII are supposed to have hardware for RT yet nothing was shown here... weird.

Both PS5/XB2 will use a bigger GPU (56CU minimum) and rumors say AMD will introduce RT with Navi20.

AMD likely doesn't want to devaluate its new GPU lineup by mentioning tech it doesn't support.

 

[zeroFiveNine]

Expecting a decent 16 core setup to be $1000+, more with the memory they are recommending.

MSI CEO: Even Low-End AMD X570 Motherboards Will Be Expensive

We heard from MSI CEO Charles Chiang and others at Computex that AMD's third-gen Ryzen CPUs are going to bring higher-priced motherboards along with them.

www.tomshardware.com

Chiang also says that AMD is changing its marketing strategy to focus on being a premium brand, as opposed to being the value alternative.

 

[CyberPanda]

I was out during AMDs conference, any big RDNA news i missed?

Both PS5/XB2 will use a bigger GPU (56CU minimum) and rumors say AMD will introduce RT with Navi20.

AMD likely doesn't want to devaluate its new GPU lineup by mentioning tech it doesn't support.

You didn’t miss shit. Lol

 

[Insane Metal]

Expecting a decent 16 core setup to be $1000+, more with the memory they are recommending.

MSI CEO: Even Low-End AMD X570 Motherboards Will Be Expensive

We heard from MSI CEO Charles Chiang and others at Computex that AMD's third-gen Ryzen CPUs are going to bring higher-priced motherboards along with them.

www.tomshardware.com

Chiang also says that AMD is changing its marketing strategy to focus on being a premium brand, as opposed to being the value alternative.

Uh oh. I think it's too early for that Lisa.

But if their NAVI GPUs are an indication... they're not cheap at all.

 

[JohnnyFootball]

You're new to this. Obv nobody wants to sell at a loss, but sometimes you have to make very small profit per chip to gain big profit by selling more of them in the future. With bigger market share say 50% [thats what AMD is going after in cpu space, clearly not gpu] meaning they would be selling same amount of units as intel so even at lower price they would be generating more revenue meaning more profit year on year.

Except revenue doesn’t mean anything if it isn’t generating profit!

Not only that AMD already has gained significant market share and they’re now at the earning profit stage

Neither you nor I have any idea what AMD needs to sell the 3000 series CPUs to turn a profit.

 

[Ivellios]

I was out during AMDs conference, any big RDNA news i missed?

Both PS5/XB2 will use a bigger GPU (56CU minimum) and rumors say AMD will introduce RT with Navi20.

AMD likely doesn't want to devaluate its new GPU lineup by mentioning tech it doesn't support.

5770xt $449 RTX 2070 equivalent
5770 $370 for RTX 2060 equivalent
5770(something) $399 for better performance than 5770 from what i understood.

They have some features:

Fidelity X which increase image quality

Some sort of upscaling that dont make the image blurry if i did not misunderstood

Reduced Latency game mode, which reduces MS and lag in multiplayer games.

 

[wordslaughter]

'

Looks like you're going to want either 3200CL14 or 3600CL16 with Ryzen 3000 for best gaming performance, not exactly cheap memory kits. Roughly 2x cost of the 3200CL16 most people buy.

Thanks for posting this.

Can you explain the difference between 1:1 mode and 2:1 mode?

 

[Xyphie]

Thanks for posting this.

Can you explain the difference between 1:1 mode and 2:1 mode?

Infinity Fabric is the connection between the I/O die and the CPU die. If you use below 3733 memory it's clocked 1:1 with your RAM, so 1600MHz with 3200 memory, 1333MHz with 2666 memory etc. When you go above it's clocked down to half the clock of the RAM, so 1000 MHz with 4000 memory and so on, lowering the clock speed of the IF means you get higher latency. So if you want low latency (important for games) rather than high bandwidth you should not use above 3733 memory.

 

[llien]

Didn't Lisa Su At Computex say they'd be showing more off their Ray Tracing solution/strategy at E3???

They did show it.

 

[llien]

5700 (non XT) vs 2060

 

[Panajev2001a]

They did show it.

Considering next generation consoles will not be here until next year and Navi ships this summer, it is likely that as for the previous generation of consoles MS and Sony will be taking features for the GPU core after Navi too hence both companies talking about HW acceleration for RT.

 

[Ovek]

 

[Aintitcool]

Don't trust stock AMD coolers though.

 

[woigemok]

The feck! is there any engineering reason why it was designed like that?

 

[llien]

Hm, so 8 + 6 pin, not 8+8?

 

[CyberPanda]

Maybe AMD hardware will work better now.

 

[llien]

The event:

 

[Ovek]

The feck! is there any engineering reason why it was designed like that?

Nope, AMD just wanted it to look like it's been pre damaged.

 

[Armorian]

Don't trust stock AMD coolers though.

Yep, AMD blowers are the worst of the kind, I had 7970... I'm deaf now.

 

[nightmare-slain]

that 3950X sounds like a beast. i'm torn between the 3900X + 3950X for my next processor.

$750 for a 16/32 cpu is crazy but it's gonna take me out my budget. $750 in GBP (with 20% tax) comes to about £710 but i assume they'll bump it up to £750. i have a £1,000 budget. not only do i need a new cpu but a new motherboard and possible a new PSU. my budget was

£500-550 - Cpu
£250-300 - Motherboard
£170 - PSU (EVGA 1000W G3. i currently have a EVGA 750W G2)

best case scenario i have £80 left. worst case i go over by ~£20. gonna need to decide once i see official pricing at launch. $500 is £473 (20% tax added) so hopefully the 3900X doesn't go over £500. i just really need to know how much a good X570 board is gonna cost. the Gigabyte X470 Gaming 7 is £220 and the Asus X470 Crosshair VII Hero is £254 so i expect i'll probably paying ~£300 for X570.

so i guess i'm just asking myself if i should wait another couple months and put by another £300 to get the 3950X or just go for the 3900X in July.

i'll be gaming on it of course but my CPU becomes an absolute sluggish nightmare when i try edit 4K 60fps videos. in addition to video editing i'll probably create a couple virtual machines to mess about with in Linux. my current 4/8 cpu doesn't really let me do shit. i want 8 cores dedicated to my PC for gaming. if i get the 3900X then i can run a 4 core Linux machine alongside Windows. if i get the 3950X i can run 2x4 core Linux machines. but that's really not important. i guess 12 would be plenty for VMs so i really just need the extra cores for video editing.

 

[Aintitcool]

that 3950X sounds like a beast. i'm torn between the 3900X + 3950X for my next processor.

$750 for a 16/32 cpu is crazy but it's gonna take me out my budget. $750 in GBP (with 20% tax) comes to about £710 but i assume they'll bump it up to £750. i have a £1,000 budget. not only do i need a new cpu but a new motherboard and possible a new PSU. my budget was

£500-550 - Cpu
£250-300 - Motherboard
£170 - PSU (EVGA 1000W G3. i currently have a EVGA 750W G2)

best case scenario i have £80 left. worst case i go over by ~£20. gonna need to decide once i see official pricing at launch. $500 is £473 (20% tax added) so hopefully the 3900X doesn't go over £500. i just really need to know how much a good X570 board is gonna cost. the Gigabyte X470 Gaming 7 is £220 and the Asus X470 Crosshair VII Hero is £254 so i expect i'll probably paying ~£300 for X570.

so i guess i'm just asking myself if i should wait another couple months and put by another £300 to get the 3950X or just go for the 3900X in July.

i'll be gaming on it of course but my CPU becomes an absolute sluggish nightmare when i try edit 4K 60fps videos. in addition to video editing i'll probably create a couple virtual machines to mess about with in Linux. my current 4/8 cpu doesn't really let me do shit. i want 8 cores dedicated to my PC for gaming. if i get the 3900X then i can run a 4 core Linux machine alongside Windows. if i get the 3950X i can run 2x4 core Linux machines. but that's really not important. i guess 12 would be plenty for VMs so i really just need the extra cores for video editing.

SPEND MORE ON RAM AND MOTHER BOARD AND GO WITH CHEAPER CPU: With next gen games maxing 7 cored and 14 threads most likely 16 cores 32 threads is overkill unless your a cgi/video editor. What you want it a PCI.4 system. That will give more gaming performance at 4k and is more future proof. The highest end 8core is all gaming will need for the perceivable future. You can go 12 cores too but they will rarely will used and lower your per core performance. And single core tasking performance.

 

[Ovek]

that 3950X sounds like a beast. i'm torn between the 3900X + 3950X for my next processor.

$750 for a 16/32 cpu is crazy but it's gonna take me out my budget. $750 in GBP (with 20% tax) comes to about £710 but i assume they'll bump it up to £750. i have a £1,000 budget. not only do i need a new cpu but a new motherboard and possible a new PSU. my budget was

£500-550 - Cpu
£250-300 - Motherboard
£170 - PSU (EVGA 1000W G3. i currently have a EVGA 750W G2)

best case scenario i have £80 left. worst case i go over by ~£20. gonna need to decide once i see official pricing at launch. $500 is £473 (20% tax added) so hopefully the 3900X doesn't go over £500. i just really need to know how much a good X570 board is gonna cost. the Gigabyte X470 Gaming 7 is £220 and the Asus X470 Crosshair VII Hero is £254 so i expect i'll probably paying ~£300 for X570.

so i guess i'm just asking myself if i should wait another couple months and put by another £300 to get the 3950X or just go for the 3900X in July.

i'll be gaming on it of course but my CPU becomes an absolute sluggish nightmare when i try edit 4K 60fps videos. in addition to video editing i'll probably create a couple virtual machines to mess about with in Linux. my current 4/8 cpu doesn't really let me do shit. i want 8 cores dedicated to my PC for gaming. if i get the 3900X then i can run a 4 core Linux machine alongside Windows. if i get the 3950X i can run 2x4 core Linux machines. but that's really not important. i guess 12 would be plenty for VMs so i really just need the extra cores for video editing.

Just get a 3900X then. Even a 12 core CPU is overkill for gaming let alone 16 cores. I'm amazed AMD are trying to pitch the 3950X at gamers as its really just a workstation CPU.

Don't cheap out on the speed of your RAM, Ryzen likes fast ram.

Don't buy 1000W a power supply you don't need and put the money you save in to a better X750 motherboard as they are not going to be cheap.

 

[LordOfChaos]

Frickin AMD stock,man, why do I ever sell it?

 

[llien]

So, how is this supposed to work:

" Lower input-lag without increasing frame-rates! "

Don't buy 1000W a power supply you don't need and put the money you save in to a better X750 motherboard as they are not going to be cheap.

PSU's only work at promised efficiency at 60-80%-ish load. Way below it, they are worse. That's another reason not to overbook on PSU power.

$750 for a 16/32 cpu is crazy but it's gonna take me out my budge

That's $1000 cheaper than competitor.

 

[Coulomb_Barrier]

Frickin AMD stock,man, why do I ever sell it?

I bought £1500 worth about 6 months ago as I knew 7nm would really drive revenue (and kick Intel's ass) and it's now worth £2200, +700. I even think it's gonna hit close to $40 a share (I bought at $19).

 

[Ascend]

Nice arguments, so anyone who disagrees with you should just send their resumes to amd because we are clearly wrong.

While i agree that all of Ryzen 2 are priced perfectly, the same cannot be said by their GPU. Everyone was expecting them to go cheaper than the competition. Plus these cards dont even have ray tracing

Ray tracing is useless on anything other than a 2080Ti. Not having ray tracing is not an argument to not go with these cards. Really. It isn't.
As for the price... The 5700 XT competes with the RTX 2070 for ~$50 less... So, what's the issue?

 

[JohnnyFootball]

Ray tracing is useless on anything other than a 2080Ti. Not having ray tracing is not an argument to not go with these cards. Really. It isn't.
As for the price... The 5700 XT competes with the RTX 2070 for ~$50 less... So, what's the issue?

As someone who owns a 2080 Ti, it's barely better than useless. Metro Exodus is really the only playable game that utilizes ray tracing and even then it's debatable whether it was worth the performance cost. Rastuerization does an amazing job.

 

[LordOfChaos]

I do enjoy how much Lisa likes her own memes

 

[LordOfChaos]

Intel will support variable rate shading in their IGPs before AMD in their dedicated GPUs, wat

AMD Announces Radeon RX 5700 XT & RX 5700: The Next Gen of AMD Video Cards Starts on July 7th At $449/$379

www.anandtech.com

 

[chinoXL]

As someone who owns a 2080 Ti, it's barely better than useless. Metro Exodus is really the only playable game that utilizes ray tracing and even then it's debatable whether it was worth the performance cost. Rastuerization does an amazing job.

don't forget Quake 2.. granted we have to drop the resolution, but i can play it at either 1440p or 1080p with good framerates on my TI. agreed tho about Metro, its a nice subtle difference but nothing crazy. hopefully the process of it improves so we can get game using it without so much of a hit. hopefully AMD comes up with something unique

 

[mckmas8808]

I do enjoy how much Lisa likes her own memes

She's pretty cool.

 

[Celcius]

I for one really like the design of AMD's new reference cooler

 

[LordOfChaos]

I for one really like the design of AMD's new reference cooler

I like how it looks just fine, it's pretty elegant, but blowers tend not to have great noise to performance