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Autumn Anime 2015 |OT| Like leaves on a tree… we’re falling one by one.

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I'm just not going to talk about Imaishi any more since it's clear that the very subject causes me to lose my mind and start ranting.

Apologies for driving things so far off-base.

1. His and her circumstances isn't the groundbreaking amazingness you think it was. It was a rush-edited animation mess whose plot didn't end. I know this is because Japan was in a huge recession, but still, come on.
I have watched it, and i did enjoy it, but seriously....

I just want to address this, however. Yes, it was very rushed, but rather than just putting out a bad looking product, they took advantage of the situation and made the most of their budget. There were some amazingly groundbreaking decisions in the show. Yes, they were driven by time and budgetary constraints, but sometimes the greatest inspirations come from such outside constraints. I think it's silly to just brush off some of the very unique decisions made as "they were rushed and out of money".

The point is more that with their backs against the wall, they put together some very inspired bits of television.
 

dimb

Bjergsen is the greatest midlane in the world
Also what at FLCL. The entire show is over the top and sex jokes.
This is overly reductive. What it comes down to is theme. Sexuality as a new and confusing dynamic is pushed to certain extremes to emphasize how crazy all of this stuff is to Naota. It's not just about throwaway jokes, sex is integral to the confusing cascade and rippling overlap of relationships around Naota. It distorts the world into something crazy. In many ways the same can be said of the over the top set pieces. These impossibly daunting scenarios challenge Naota to mature and ask him to weigh what is important in his life.

There is intelligent design at play in some earlier GAINAX works that is absent from what Imashi works on. When you stack up the script writers of Enokido vs. Nakashima it's clear which one has a background with instilling substance to their works.

At the same time it's not like Gurren Lagann was some low point for GAINAX. I dunno why the point of realization would come for someone there. They worked on some trash shows before it and some bottom of the barrel stuff after it.
 

Jarmel

Banned
Evangelion had fanservice, sure, but it was also in service of a wider critique the show was making. And no, I don't remember a single obnoxious character in Evangelion. Every member of the main cast were well-developed and had strong arcs. They may have been annoying at times as people, but none of them felt like obnoxious characters acting out shtick. They were believable as human beings who underwent growth.

Yes, FLCL was over the top, and it had sex jokes. But they were generally pretty well thought out jokes, rather the sort of puerile toilet humor Imaishi's works have. Beyond that, FLCL was, at its heart, a coming of age story. It has a lot of nonsense, but it's all there to be used as symbolism for the larger story and showing Naota's transition through adolescence. It's not just filled with stuff that's just in there to look cool and throw everything at the wall like something like Gurren Lagann or Panty and Stocking does.

If Imaishi was following along from Tsurumaki, he was doing a bad job of it. FLCL is filled with quality memorable characters, not just in the main cast, but even from the periphery characters. Imaishi has never created a character who possesses even a single dimension.

And FLCL is a well directed show with tons of immensely memorable moments that I can instantly recall even having not watched the OVA in more than six years. It's a work that transcends the typical level of anime by understanding that form itself is function, and utilizing a number of form breaking techniques to tell a story in a unique and memorable way. TTGL, on the other hand, is a fairly blandly conveyed story that doesn't actually do anything particularly unique as far as anime is concerned. When you compare it to stuff like FLCL or His and Her Circumstances which were truly groundbreaking material when they came out (and honestly, they still are today. There are episodes of His and Her Circumstances that have never been equaled by any TV anime), it's obvious that the former comes up very short.

Is this the time where I post Shinobu from Nisemonogatari and talk about how Monogatari is a dissection of fanservice in anime? You can criticize something and glorify it at the same time, ala Gundam's core problem. Let's not forget Shinji is widely regarded as an aggravating protagonist at the best of times, which is obviously intentional but there it is. Evangelion is very much about being over the top, you can look at the dancing episode for reference, but it's also about the psychological impacts this can cause and it's a dissection of super robot anime to that point.

As for FLCL and puerile humor:
http://sakuga.yshi.org/data/3f1204f346ecd14c3c73c88512501712.webm
FLCL is all about juvenile humor. It's obviously much more than that but that element definitely exists. Many of the elements you're attributing to Imaishi can just as easily be attributed to Tsurumaki. Now if you want to talk about execution that's fine but it's not like Imaishi took Gainax in some radically different direction.

I didn't even get into Mahoromatic as I haven't watched it. However this doesn't exactly look grounded either:

http://sakuga.yshi.org/data/1ffb20aa32420725e77c03fc902bab48.mp4

This is overly reductive. What it comes down to is theme. Sexuality as a new and confusing dynamic is pushed to certain extremes to emphasize how crazy all of this stuff is to Naota. It's not just about throwaway jokes, sex is integral to the confusing cascade and rippling overlap of relationships around Naota. It distorts the world into something crazy. In many ways the same can be said of the over the top set pieces. These impossibly daunting scenarios challenge Naota to mature and ask him to weigh what is important in his life.

There is intelligent design at play in some earlier GAINAX works that is absent from what Imashi works on. When you stack up the script writers of Enokido vs. Nakashima it's clear which one has a background with instilling substance to their works.

At the same time it's not like Gurren Lagann was some low point for GAINAX. I dunno why the point of realization would come for someone there. They worked on some trash shows before it and some bottom of the barrel stuff after it.

Obviously there was more to it but the series had Haruko running around in a bunny costume for a good chunk of an episode. Again you can use something as a theme for your work such as sexuality for a teenager while still playing it up. I think FLCL is a better show, partially due to the writing, but dismissing these elements and saying they don't exist just seems almost surreal.

My point is more about the general direction of the company rather than the quality of TTGL in of itself.
 
I can understand not enjoying Imaishi's style. Looking at his other works, yeah those seem to be pretty messy.

What I don't understand is hating Gurren Lagann most of all because that one seems like the least offensive in that regard.

You can take one look at Panty and Stocking and say: "Oh yeah, that's gonna be crazy and over-the-top."

But Gurren Lagann eased you into that stuff. It had action sure, but it had just the right amount that you'd expect from a robot that uses giant drills to fight. It put all that craziness into the finale to make it the most exciting final episode it could possibly be.

But the best part of TTGL is its heart. It's positive, it's upbeat, its message is basically "You're awesome and don't you forget it!", it aimed to embrace the old, fun, action of the old super robot shows of the 80s and 90s and it succeeded.

Does that mean I want all mecha shows to be like Gurren Lagann? No! I love Eureka Seven and G Gundam. I enjoyed the original Mobile Suit Gundam. Shows that are less crazy and more refined definitely have their place in the mecha genre.

But Gurren Lagann is a reminder of what made the mecha genre popular. That crazy, over-the-top action with hotblooded characters was always there from the start, and Gurren Lagann embraced the heart of those old shows.

It's just an upbeat show and to this day it still remains my favourite.
 

Mailbox

Member
Wasn't the moral of TTGL that practically: everyone will try to tell you what your limits are, that everyone will try to keep you where you are and keep you down, even yourself. And that despite those thing, you shouldn't listen to them and keep getting better and keep going forward.

Its actually a perfectly executed metaphor at that
 
Wasn't the moral of TTGL that practically: everyone will try to tell you what your limits are, that everyone will try to keep you where you are and keep you down, even yourself. And that despite those thing, you shouldn't listen to them and keep getting better and keep going forward.

Its actually a perfectly executed metaphor at that

Yeah that's what I meant. I love the show so much for that as well.
 

John Blade

Member
Man..so much hate on GAINAX here. Kinda interesting to read people reason and it's kinda funny as I finish His and Her Circumstance last week. Yea, you feel the rush as you're watching it and the ending just end without any proper end. I guess I stop watching any GAINAX show after I finish FLCL till I go back watching His and Her Circumstance.
 
I'm not gonna pretend Gainax is some lord and savior of anime and every show they did was the best show ever, but their batting average is pretty goddam high and when they swing for the fences they knock it out of the park farther than almost any anime company has.

Wait wait, someone tell me that Panty and Stocking being made while they were drunk story.
 

Jarmel

Banned
In just being primarily terrible.

There's so many bad writers and directors working this season that it's hard to pick just one. We have so many shitty battle harems that one of those is almost certainly going to be atrocious. Aside from the usual suspects, possibly Garo. Which fucking sucks. Okada is at least going to be entertaining, none of the stuff I've seen from her have ever been boring.

I'm not gonna pretend Gainax is some lord and savior of anime and every show they did was the best show ever, but their batting average is pretty goddam high and when they swing for the fences they knock it out of the park farther than almost any anime company has.

Need to use past tense.
 
Wow, I posted that much...

...maybe I should actually take a look at my life. See where it's going. Set some goals....

...or I could finally get back to Haibane Renmei...
 
There's so many bad writers and directors working this season that it's hard to pick just one. We have so many shitty battle harems that one of those is almost certainly going to be atrocious. Aside from the usual suspects, possibly Garo. Which fucking sucks. Okada is at least going to be entertaining, none of the stuff I've seen from her have ever been boring.



Need to use past tense.

Could you name those bad writers and directors. I want to keep myself from not watching a lot of bad anime this season.

Though I do know Okada is a bad but so good in the entertainment department.
 
Need to use past tense.

Like fuck I do. I know you're trying to be elite su-

*looks at their filmography*

...I guess past tense is applicable here. I mean...I liked Panty and Stocking and...hrmmmmmm...uh...

You know, never mind. Carry on. Lemme edit that.
 

Jarmel

Banned
Gundam IBO-
Tatsyuki Nagai
Mari Okada
Concrete Revolutio-
Mizushima
Aikawa
Garo-
Atsushi Wakabayashi
Shou Aikawa
Comet Lucifer-
Yasuhito Kikuchi
Yuuichi Nomura

I give up, there's too many. I would be listing the staff for over 10 shows. It's easier to just list the potentially good ones and go from there. Check back in three weeks.
 

Crocodile

Member
The shows I'm must looking forward to are One Punch Man and the New Lupin. I'm also hoping Bones' new Superhero show delivers. It seems Ushio & Tora is actually getting good now so I should probably get back to that. Noragami I will only watch if I get a guarantee Yukine isn't going to torpedo the show again. Comet Lucifer and Garo are shows I'll keep an eye on and I'll eye my ears open to anything with particularly strong impressions.

should watch Godannar instead.

This a good show and I say this unironically. If more "fanservice" anime were like this the world would be a much better place. I'm going to go out on a limb and assume Valkyrie Mermaid won't be within striking distance of the quality of Godannar.

Even as someone who has liked only one thing Imaishi has directed, this claim leaves me speechless.

The irony is delicious isn't it <3

I can understand not enjoying Imaishi's style. Looking at his other works, yeah those seem to be pretty messy.

What I don't understand is hating Gurren Lagann most of all because that one seems like the least offensive in that regard.

You can take one look at Panty and Stocking and say: "Oh yeah, that's gonna be crazy and over-the-top."

But Gurren Lagann eased you into that stuff. It had action sure, but it had just the right amount that you'd expect from a robot that uses giant drills to fight. It put all that craziness into the finale to make it the most exciting final episode it could possibly be.

But the best part of TTGL is its heart. It's positive, it's upbeat, its message is basically "You're awesome and don't you forget it!", it aimed to embrace the old, fun, action of the old super robot shows of the 80s and 90s and it succeeded.

Does that mean I want all mecha shows to be like Gurren Lagann? No! I love Eureka Seven and G Gundam. I enjoyed the original Mobile Suit Gundam. Shows that are less crazy and more refined definitely have their place in the mecha genre.

But Gurren Lagann is a reminder of what made the mecha genre popular. That crazy, over-the-top action with hotblooded characters was always there from the start, and Gurren Lagann embraced the heart of those old shows.

It's just an upbeat show and to this day it still remains my favourite.

picard_clapping.gif


I don't have much to contribute that hasn't already been said so I'll just applaud the above.

Wasn't the moral of TTGL that practically: everyone will try to tell you what your limits are, that everyone will try to keep you where you are and keep you down, even yourself. And that despite those thing, you shouldn't listen to them and keep getting better and keep going forward.

Its actually a perfectly executed metaphor at that

Yep. Thematically, unlike KLK, TTGL was ON POINT. Like I can understand not liking it (it's not perfect) but it is an excellent work with a goal it sets out to do and accomplishes it.
 

Mailbox

Member
watch one of these shows be absolutely shit in the beginning, and end yup being actually good by the end. (or visa versa)
 

Jarmel

Banned
Follow his list and if any shows other than that become good, you'll probably hear about it anyway.

Since people are posting their lists of stuff they're checking out, I guess I'll post mine again. Also because it'll be more helpful to people who don't know what's coming out than the OP.
Most interesting shows:

Haikyuu S2 - The second season of the well-produced and engaging volleyball series. It's a conventional sports story, but the strong focus on a team dynamic, which lets each character have a unique place in the ensemble and brings clashing personalities together into effective teamwork, makes it stand out.

Lupin III: Italian Series - It's notable whenever this storied franchise gets a new entry that has more effort put into it than the usual yearly TV specials, and the return to the light-hearted adventure atmosphere that Lupin is traditionally known for should make this more successful than the experimentation gone awry that was the Fujiko Mine TV series. The production looks pleasing, with colorful, vibrant art, and we know an Osamu Kobayashi solo episode is part of the series, which is always an event. Hopefully this can capture the spirit of what made Lupin at its height (Caligostro) so appealing.

Noragami Aragato (S2) - The first season was a big surprise to me, treating this shounen action story with an uncommon amount of thoughtfulness in its visual and aural direction and moments of atmosphere that approached the heights of shows such as Flowers of Evil and Hyouka. I'm especially looking forward to the new season because it will be adapting the Bishamon arc, which is considered by manga readers to be a strong highlight and will be focusing on an interesting character who went underutilized in the first season. Plus more Taku Iwasaki goodness.

Osomatsu-san - This is the show I'm most looking forward to from the fall season. It's a new spin on an old comedy manga from the 1960s, with a strong staff including Youichi Fujita, who proved his comedic directing skills on Gintama, Naoyuki Asano, one of the strongest active character designers with a distinctive voice, and Seiji Tamura, who contributes strikingly beautiful backgrounds to the productions he provides art direction for (including the K-ON series, the Fujiko Mine TV series, and Rolling Girls earlier this year). The visual style looks unique and arresting, and there's a lot of potential boiling here.

Other possibilities:

Concrete Revolutio - The visuals are really colorful and polished, if a bit garish, and the melting pot of superheroes premise has potential. The Seiji Mizushima/Shou Aikawa combination is iffy though - their work on the original Full Metal Alchemist series was excellent but their more recent outings have been less successful.

Fushigi na Somera-chan - I haven't watched Ai Mai Mi, but it is fairly well-regarded so this new series from the same manga author and anime creator is worthy of note. Itsuki Imazaki has brought a level of visual flair which rises above the crowd in all the short anime he's worked on recently.

Garo: Guren no Tsuki - The first Garo anime season was inconsistent, but had some striking highlights. The Heian period setting and female protagonist are noteworthy aspects of this new season.

Kagewani - I haven't seen Yami Shibai, but that horror short series has good impressions so this new "monster suspense" series from the same creator is worth consideration.

Mobile Suit Gundam: Iron-Blooded Orphans - Gundam is a franchise littered with mediocrity and Mari Okada's brand of melodrama is problematic at the best of times, but Nagai is a skilled director so... you never know? At least it won't be senile Tomino?

One Punch Man - The manga has such incredible art thanks to Murata that it'll be practically impossible for the anime to live up to it, but Shingo Natsume and a team of high-class animators working on the adaptation make it about as promising as it could be. Hopefully the show will be able to capture some of what makes the manga so beloved.

Sakurako-san no Ashimoto ni wa Shitai ga Umatteiru - This adaptation of the light novel "A Corpse is Buried Under Sakurako's Feet" catches my eye mostly due to its premise - a high school student teams up with a beautiful woman in her twenties to investigate various incidents surrounding bones. It could prove to be a more grounded and substantial story than is typical for light novels.

Shin Atashin'chi - Not much is known about this new incarnation of the well-known family comedy, but if experienced comedy director Akitaro Daichi returns to the series it could be successful.

Subete ga F ni Naru - This adaptation of a serial murder mystery novel by the author of Sky Crawlers, featuring character designs by respected manga artist Inio Asano (Solanin, Punpun) has some potential.

Young Black Jack - A spinoff of Osamu Tezuka's classic series about the titular unlicensed genius doctor. There's no way this will live up to the classic OVA treatment of Black Jack by Dezaki but it could prove entertaining in its own right.


The only thing I'd add is that I'm also interested in Brave Beats, because it's the successor to Tribe Cool Crew, which is cool.
 

Sterok

Member
Aikatsu on top. Anime really is saved. I want to take credit for bringing it to prominence. Concrete Revolutio might be interesting. Still not much that looks interesting though.
 

Lain

Member
I'd like to reaffirm that BGBW is my preferred animegaf poster. Great OP.
I'm also excited for this season because the Italian legal streaming side picked a lot of interesting stuff this time.
 
OP has shown me just how amazing this season will be.

Aikatsu on top is good. I JUST HAVE 144 MORE EPISODE TO GO TILL I'M CAUGHT UP.
 

ibyea

Banned
Good thing there aren't a lot of shows I am interested in this fall. Because school work and grad school prep is killing me.
 

Cornbread78

Member
Walkure Romanze ep.9-END
I finally did it GAF. I finally finished one of the worst shows I've ever watched. I mean there was a plot, but the comedy disappeared, the ecchi was horrible, there was no romance, and the girls were all useless tropes. Uggh, at least it's all over now, lol.
 
You know, not referencing the OP at all, this season does have the potential to be amazing...

two_weeks_later.png


Fuck this season. Fuck these shows.
 
I had a little panic attack. I'm as sick as sick man can be with a nasty virus, I'm swimming in school work, I go on GAF to check the thread out and it is closed. I didn't see the link, so I went and searched it, no results. Right when I thought I lost you all, I went back to the Summer thread to see the link right in the middle of everyone's posts on the last page. Phew.

Here I thought this miserable season was only gonna be even more miserable. Here's to good health for everyone, good studies for those who are in school like myself, good work days for the older peeps and good
shit
anime for everyone this Fall!

 

Feltrol

Banned
Here I thought this miserable season was only gonna be even more miserable. Here's to good health for everyone, good studies for those who are in school like myself, good work days for the older peeps and good
shit
anime for everyone this Fall!

Welcome back. =)
 

Mailbox

Member
You, not referencing the OP at all, this season does have the potential to be amazing...

two_weeks_later.png


Fuck this season. Fuck these shows.

so the exact opposite from summer season?

Where everyone didn't know what to think at all and came out going "yeah, that was pretty alright"
 
bgbw that op is pretty great, well done

by the way i finished idolm@ster and watched the movie, pleasantly surprised to find that haruka and chihaya were really the two most important characters of the show, although for some reason i felt like they were kept... sort of short of actually growing as persons, which was definitely a weird feeling because for the most part they were very intelligently handled
 
Symphogear 5
Got back from a test so I wanted something stupid and I sure got something stupid though the mindless action didn't happen until the end. The naked women that was first speaking in horrible english and then moved onto torturing to Chris as some sort of twisted relationship seemed pretty stupid and I'm pretty sure Ryouko is someone special though as to what role exactly I'm not sure
 
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