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Batman Returns is a Christmas movie

cryptoadam

Banned


I never really thought about it but I have to agree with James on this.

Returns actually when you think about it comes off as a Tim Burton twisted Christmas movie that just happens to star Batman characters. I might even say that its more of a Christmas movie than Edward Scissor hands which only has the ending as Christmas, while Batman takes place during Christmas.
 

Kev Kev

Member
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diffusionx

Gold Member
It's been a long time since I've seen it, how integral is Christmas to the actual plot of the movie? Could it take place in another time of year and everything would proceed the same way? A Christmas movie needs more than just a bit of scenery here and there. It's why Die Hard is not a Christmas movie.
 
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NeoGiffer

Member


I never really thought about it but I have to agree with James on this.

Returns actually when you think about it comes off as a Tim Burton twisted Christmas movie that just happens to star Batman characters. I might even say that its more of a Christmas movie than Edward Scissor hands which only has the ending as Christmas, while Batman takes place during Christmas.



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cryptoadam

Banned
It's been a long time since I've seen it, how integral is Christmas to the actual plot of the movie? Could it take place in another time of year and everything would proceed the same way? A Christmas movie needs more than just a bit of scenery here and there. It's why Die Hard is not a Christmas movie.

Well as James points out 2 of the big scenes involve the Christmas tree lighting. So the plot needs that plot point to keep the movie moving along.

Christmas is ever present in the movie, as it takes place during Christmas, missle toe is important, and Alfred/Bruce wish each other Merry Christmas a few times. I mean Home Alone could of taken place of labor day too.

Now keep in mind this was directed by Burton, and how much of a non Batman movie it really is. And if Burton was going to make a Christmas movie, this is probably would it would look like. A bit of a dark gothic tale.

If you took out the Christmas element it wouldn't really be the same movie, and a lot of the themes dealing with Penguin/Batman/Catwomen and their place in the world does fit into a Christmas theme about family and loneliness.
Max Schreck is a perfect scrooge like character as well as James points out.

So overall I think that Christmas is more intergral to the movie than Batman is. Replace the Batman characters with generic characters and the movie loses less than if you took Christmas out of it. at least IMO.

Like I said in my OP, if Burton was going to make a Xmas movie this is what I would picture. He isn't going to remake its a wonderful life and be all schmaltzy. 90's Burton would of done exactly this type of dark gothic tale. He just was able to use the Batman license to tell his Christmas story.
 

FunkMiller

Banned
But id rather watch batman returns.....and its the second best old skool batman film.

It’s easier to watch than TDKR because it’s not 93 hours long and has a plot that more or less makes sense, but the characterisations are so awful, I just can’t bear it. It’s more coherent with the first film though.

Burton just never really understood Batman... whereas Nolan was a hubristic mother fucker who decided to alter Batman to suit is own narrative desires.

Very much hoping Reeves will get it right. Everything so far indicates he will.
 

INC

Member
It’s easier to watch than TDKR because it’s not 93 hours long and has a plot that more or less makes sense, but the characterisations are so awful, I just can’t bear it. It’s more coherent with the first film though.

Burton just never really understood Batman... whereas Nolan was a hubristic mother fucker who decided to alter Batman to suit is own narrative desires.

Very much hoping Reeves will get it right. Everything so far indicates he will.

I'm the opposite, the story is horrific, batman's barely in it, cat woman isn't sext at all, banes voice.......batman's lisp,.

Its just a poor end, to an otherwise great trilogy.

But everyone is different I guess.
 

NeoIkaruGAF

Gold Member
Rewatched it recently. It’s great. It’s more of a Christmas movie than Die Hard, for sure. You can argue that it’s less of a Batman movie and more of a Tim Burton movie ’cause let’s face it, almost every Burton movie is all about how Tim Burton sees thing X in his Burtonesque mind. The Penguin could be a Burton original character and you wouldn’t notice the difference.

Great movie, anyway. Best of the pre-Nolan Batmans by a mile.
 

cryptoadam

Banned
Rewatched it recently. It’s great. It’s more of a Christmas movie than Die Hard, for sure. You can argue that it’s less of a Batman movie and more of a Tim Burton movie ’cause let’s face it, almost every Burton movie is all about how Tim Burton sees thing X in his Burtonesque mind. The Penguin could be a Burton original character and you wouldn’t notice the difference.

Great movie, anyway. Best of the pre-Nolan Batmans by a mile.

Yup thats where I am at.

If Burton was going to make a Xmas movie, its how you would imagine it.

Look at Edward Scissorhands which is also sometimes a "christmas" movie too. Same sort of asthetic, and the Penguin is more of an evil/grotesque Edward in a way. Both are abandoned freaks trying to fit into the "normal" world. Instead though Penguin just has an evil plan, while Edward is more of a naive guy.
 

OmegaSupreme

advanced basic bitch
Yeah it is a Christmas movie also one of the best Batman movies easily. It’s also totally insane. That cast is unbeatable.
I get whiplash from reading your posts sometimes. You say something completely reasonable like this then you will call the prequel trilogy "timeless with great dialogue" Do you have a spilt personality? lol
 

Happosai

Hold onto your panties


I never really thought about it but I have to agree with James on this.

Returns actually when you think about it comes off as a Tim Burton twisted Christmas movie that just happens to star Batman characters. I might even say that its more of a Christmas movie than Edward Scissor hands which only has the ending as Christmas, while Batman takes place during Christmas.

I remember the three big action movies of the 70's/80's I always watch that were set during Christmas although not much is said of Christmas during the films.

1976 - Rocky
1982 - First Blood
1987 - Lethal Weapon
 

Nymphae

Banned
It's more of one than Die Hard is that's for sure. Way more snow and actual Christmas imagery, the holidays play more of an important role in the story, and it opens and closes on Christmas day IIRC.

I still don't put it in my Christmas rotation, but yeah, less of a problem with this being considered a holiday movie than bugman contrarian favourite Die Hard.
 

GeorgPrime

Banned


I never really thought about it but I have to agree with James on this.

Returns actually when you think about it comes off as a Tim Burton twisted Christmas movie that just happens to star Batman characters. I might even say that its more of a Christmas movie than Edward Scissor hands which only has the ending as Christmas, while Batman takes place during Christmas.


Because it has one scene at christmas with a christmas tree for 5 seconds?
 

INC

Member
Are you talking about Die Hard?

die hard has Christmas spirit tho. Its at its core, just a man trying to reconnect with his estranged wife, by travelling across the country, to be with his family at Christmas.........
 

Kimahri

Banned
I'm the opposite, the story is horrific, batman's barely in it, cat woman isn't sext at all, banes voice.......batman's lisp,.

Its just a poor end, to an otherwise great trilogy.

But everyone is different I guess.

Not to mention the god awful Harvey Dent
 

Nymphae

Banned
Die Hard is a real christmas movie. Go away. We watch it every christmas xD

No snow means not a Christmas movie, he covers this in the video you didn't watch. The "Die Hard as Chrsitmas movie" retardation was a joke that bugmen took too far and now will not let go of because they prefer explosions to traditional Christmas fare.
 

cryptoadam

Banned
Because it has one scene at christmas with a christmas tree for 5 seconds?

If you watched the video there is more to it.

Entire movie takes place during the Xmas season
Max Schreck is a classic scrooge like character
Movie opens and closes on Xmas
Merry Xmas mentioned a few times, especially as the final lines of the movie
Missle toe plays an important role
Movie is in a twisted way about family.
Penguin and his family, Bruce and Selena, Max and his son.
Yes the 2 scenes that involve the Christmas tree, but those scenes are integral to moving the plot of the movie along.

Change Batman with Generic Man and then look at it as a Tim Burton twisted dark take on a Christmas movie and it will click that way. This isn't Burton shoe horning Christmas into a Batman movie, its the other way around. Its a Tim Burton Xmas movie about a freak who was abandoned by his parents on Xmas eve, and 30 years later comes back to find his place in the world and revenge. ITs also a Christmas love story.
 

Nymphae

Banned
die hard has Christmas spirit tho. Its at its core, just a man trying to reconnect with his estranged wife, by travelling across the country, to be with his family at Christmas.........

No snow, not a Christmas movie. Name one other Christmas movie with no snow.
 
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