OmegaSupreme
advanced basic bitch
Since this is the closest thing we have to a Peterson thread. Got mine preordered.
Beyond Order: 12 More Rules For Life https://www.amazon.com/dp/0593084640/?tag=neogaf0e-20
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Beyond Order: 12 More Rules For Life by Jordan Peterson announced
- Thread starter OmegaSupreme
- Start date
Since this is the closest thing we have to a Peterson thread. Got mine preordered.
Beyond Order: 12 More Rules For Life https://www.amazon.com/dp/0593084640/?tag=neogaf0e-20
ZZZZ
Member
I was about to post this, needs it's own thread in my opinion, got mine preordered as well, can't wait.
OmegaSupreme
advanced basic bitch
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The rules themselves were previously announced as:
Described in the video as (possibly in different order):
"Rule 1 describes the relationship between stable, predictable social structures and individual psychological health, and makes the case that such structures need to be updated by creative people if they are to retain their vitality.
Rule 2 analyses the centuries-old alchemical image relying on several stories, ancient and modern, to illuminate the nature and development of the integrated human personality.
Rule 3 warns of the dangers of avoiding the information vital to the continued rejuvenation of the psyche, signaled by the emergence of negative emotions such as pain, anxiety, and fear.
Rule 4 argues that the meaning that sustains people through difficult times is to be found not so much in happiness, which is fleeting, but in the voluntary adoption of mature responsibility for the self and others.
Rule 5 uses a single example drawn from my experience as a clinical psychologist to illustrate the personal and social necessity of attending to the dictates of conscience.
Rule 6 describes the danger of attributing the cause of complex individual and social problems to single variables, such as sex, class, or power.
Rule 7 outlines the crucial relationship between discipline, striving in a single direction, and the forging of the individual character capable of resilience in the face of adversity.
Rule 8 focuses on the vital importance of aesthetic experience as a guide to what is true, good, and sustaining in the human world of experience.
Rule 9 makes the case that past experiences whose current recall remains laden with pain and fear can be stripped of their horror by voluntary verbal exploration and reconsideration.
Rule 10 notes the importance of explicit negotiation to maintenance of the good-will, mutual regard, and heartfelt cooperation without which no true romance can be sustained.
Rule 11 opens by describing the world of human experience in a manner that explains what motivates three common but direly dangerous patterns of psychological response, delineates the catastrophic consequences of falling prey to any or all of them, and lays out an alternative route.
Rule 12, finally, makes the case that thankfulness in the face of the inevitable tragedies of life should be regarded as a primary manifestation of the admirable moral courage required to continue our difficult march uphill."
- Do not carelessly denigrate social institutions or creative achievement.
- Imagine who you could be and then aim single mindedly at that.
- Work as hard as you can. Work as hard as you possibly can on at least one thing and see what happens.
- Do not hide unwanted things in the fog.
- Abandon ideology.
- Notice that opportunity lurks where responsibility has been abdicated.
- Do not do things that you hate.
- Try to make one room in your house as beautiful as possible.
- If old memories still make you cry, write them down carefully and completely.
- Plan and work diligently to maintain the romance in your relationship.
- Be grateful, in spite of your suffering
- Do not allow yourself to become resentful, deceitful or arrogant.
Described in the video as (possibly in different order):
"Rule 1 describes the relationship between stable, predictable social structures and individual psychological health, and makes the case that such structures need to be updated by creative people if they are to retain their vitality.
Rule 2 analyses the centuries-old alchemical image relying on several stories, ancient and modern, to illuminate the nature and development of the integrated human personality.
Rule 3 warns of the dangers of avoiding the information vital to the continued rejuvenation of the psyche, signaled by the emergence of negative emotions such as pain, anxiety, and fear.
Rule 4 argues that the meaning that sustains people through difficult times is to be found not so much in happiness, which is fleeting, but in the voluntary adoption of mature responsibility for the self and others.
Rule 5 uses a single example drawn from my experience as a clinical psychologist to illustrate the personal and social necessity of attending to the dictates of conscience.
Rule 6 describes the danger of attributing the cause of complex individual and social problems to single variables, such as sex, class, or power.
Rule 7 outlines the crucial relationship between discipline, striving in a single direction, and the forging of the individual character capable of resilience in the face of adversity.
Rule 8 focuses on the vital importance of aesthetic experience as a guide to what is true, good, and sustaining in the human world of experience.
Rule 9 makes the case that past experiences whose current recall remains laden with pain and fear can be stripped of their horror by voluntary verbal exploration and reconsideration.
Rule 10 notes the importance of explicit negotiation to maintenance of the good-will, mutual regard, and heartfelt cooperation without which no true romance can be sustained.
Rule 11 opens by describing the world of human experience in a manner that explains what motivates three common but direly dangerous patterns of psychological response, delineates the catastrophic consequences of falling prey to any or all of them, and lays out an alternative route.
Rule 12, finally, makes the case that thankfulness in the face of the inevitable tragedies of life should be regarded as a primary manifestation of the admirable moral courage required to continue our difficult march uphill."
TrainedRage
Banned
I could use another good ass kicking!
I wonder what his advice is for letting go of resentment.
I wonder what his advice is for letting go of resentment.
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Rentahamster
Rodent Whores
Not a bad set of guidelines to try to live by
MiyazakiHatesKojima
Banned
I heard there's a secret 13th rule at the end of the book.
Here's a snippet of it:
13) Always buy a console that has the letter "P" at the beginning of its name.
Here's a snippet of it:
13) Always buy a console that has the letter "P" at the beginning of its name.
Kadayi
Banned
Fixed that for you
MiyazakiHatesKojima
Banned
I've played 6 hours of Valorant and hated every second of it.
Unknown Quantity
Member
Umbasa?
#3 I'm at atm. Working on setting up a business. Its what I'm going to be doing for the rest of my life. That's it for talk.
The other suggestions are interesting, involve a lot of common sense (not that common). Might check out when my workload lessens & other distractions are pacified.
CrankyJay™
Member
Some of these are straight fire. Been working on gratitude and concentrating everything that is good in my life instead of focusing on what is bad.
OmegaSupreme
advanced basic bitch
Thanks for this write-up. Looks like another winner that somehow some people will take offense with.
12 Rules sold over 3 million copies, and is literally about cleaning your room and taking good care of yourself so that you can shoulder responsibility, but some at Penguin Random House Canada want to cancel Beyond Order for the usual reasons:
“
“He is an icon of hate speech and transphobia and the fact that he’s an icon of white supremacy, regardless of the content of his book, I’m not proud to work for a company that publishes him,” a junior employee who is a member of the LGBTQ community and who attended the town hall told VICE World News.
Another employee said “people were crying in the meeting about how Jordan Peterson has affected their lives.” They said one co-worker discussed how Peterson had radicalized their father and another, who is talked about how publishing the book will negatively affect their non-binary friend.
“The company since June has been doing all these anti-racist and allyship things and them publishing Peterson’s book completely goes against this. It just makes all of their previous efforts seem completely performative,” the employee added.
A third employee told VICE World News the company’s diversity and inclusion committee received at least 70 anonymous messages about Peterson’s book, and only a couple are in favour of the decision to publish it.
In an email statement, Penguin Random House Canada said it is open to its employees’ feedback.
“
“
“He is an icon of hate speech and transphobia and the fact that he’s an icon of white supremacy, regardless of the content of his book, I’m not proud to work for a company that publishes him,” a junior employee who is a member of the LGBTQ community and who attended the town hall told VICE World News.
Another employee said “people were crying in the meeting about how Jordan Peterson has affected their lives.” They said one co-worker discussed how Peterson had radicalized their father and another, who is talked about how publishing the book will negatively affect their non-binary friend.
“The company since June has been doing all these anti-racist and allyship things and them publishing Peterson’s book completely goes against this. It just makes all of their previous efforts seem completely performative,” the employee added.
A third employee told VICE World News the company’s diversity and inclusion committee received at least 70 anonymous messages about Peterson’s book, and only a couple are in favour of the decision to publish it.
In an email statement, Penguin Random House Canada said it is open to its employees’ feedback.
“
D
Deleted member 1159
Unconfirmed Member
All these accusations and they don't even bring up the fact he's objectively Kermit the Frog cosplaying as a Canuck?
OmegaSupreme
advanced basic bitch
They can whine all they want. I doubt penguin will cave in.
Lionel Richie
Member
#1: Lobsters and shit LMAO.
I'm kidding, love this dude. Happy to see he's still with us, how is his health doing these days?
I'm kidding, love this dude. Happy to see he's still with us, how is his health doing these days?
Pumpkin Seeds
Member
The tear jerkers haven't really listened to or read Peterson.
I've been seeing the usual insecure hottakes on twitter in response to this announcement. One thing i hear is "Peterson is wrong about transpeople." Something to that effect. To me, this is a clear sign the person hasn't engaged Peterson's work. Not because I think Peterson is right about trans people, but because I know he really hasn't talked much at all about trans people. He's talked about the trans activists and their mistakes in what they push, but activist groups aren't the same as an entire people. Mostly Peterson talked about the dangers of compelled speech and the ideology behind the push for compelled speech. Someone like Abigail Schrier talks a lot about trans people and trans activists. Peterson does not. He talks more about bible parables and their modern use than he does about trans people. His only real interactions on the trans topic is the activists fighting for bill C-16 and the idiots who protest him thinking they've been dehumanized.
I've been seeing the usual insecure hottakes on twitter in response to this announcement. One thing i hear is "Peterson is wrong about transpeople." Something to that effect. To me, this is a clear sign the person hasn't engaged Peterson's work. Not because I think Peterson is right about trans people, but because I know he really hasn't talked much at all about trans people. He's talked about the trans activists and their mistakes in what they push, but activist groups aren't the same as an entire people. Mostly Peterson talked about the dangers of compelled speech and the ideology behind the push for compelled speech. Someone like Abigail Schrier talks a lot about trans people and trans activists. Peterson does not. He talks more about bible parables and their modern use than he does about trans people. His only real interactions on the trans topic is the activists fighting for bill C-16 and the idiots who protest him thinking they've been dehumanized.
D
Deleted member 1159
Unconfirmed Member
Seems like Jordan's changed a bit over the years.
Piku_Ringo
Banned
Is EVS drawing again
FreedomOfSpeech
Banned
Last years have been rough.
QSD
Member
I don't know how to feel about Peterson. On the one hand I really appreciate his appearance and the revived interest in philosophy and jungian psychology that came along with it. I also think most of his rules are sound advice. However I can't really square his political leanings with the reality I perceive around me. One of Peterson's ideas is that the philosophy of "the west" is characterized by "logos", or true speech, being the thing that separates order from chaos. One of his rules is also basically "don't lie". But when I look around me, one of the most prominent features of modern, western, societies is the ubiquitousness of manipulative advertising and media that spin narratives to maximize viewership. It's a struggle to wade through all the misinformation and distraction, and it has been for some time. I mean, remember all those 8oies toy commercial cartoons? Don't get me wrong, I loved my transformers when I was little, but I can't escape the feeling that all this rampant consumerism hasn't really been all that great for us and our societies. But I remember seeing some talk with Peterson saying he has a "fair bit of respect" for people that work in advertising. So I feel like he's having his cake and eating it at the same time.
Any Petersonites here? Fight me.
Any Petersonites here? Fight me.
diffusionx
Gold Member
Rule 13: Don't drink apple cider
FreedomOfSpeech
Banned
Peterson's #1 fan here.
What Peterson does is what people in the West should have done: educate newer generations about where their freedom and peace comes from, since it is rather exceptional in human history to have peace and freedoms.
He explains what 'the West' is: the result of realizing that the proper way to 'be' in the world is to be an individual, as opposed to being part of a group first. This is what Jesus is, a 'mythical', 'perfect' person, that even an illiterate peasant can emulate if he listens to a priest. For example, behaving like Jesus (what would Jesus do) is supposed to result in a society that allows forgiveness, as opposed to being branded for life for a transgression. It's the difference between being your mistake and having made a mistake (see his discussion with Roger Scruton for a better explanation).
What you see around you would be explained as the result of rejecting Christianity. If God is dead, then anything goes, as we can see. The West is morally confused. Currently the autistic, easily digested, and decidedly NOT individual woke ideology takes center stage. To the wokesters dividing people into infinitely many groups and just placing labels on those groups is the right way. But they refuse to take the final step and realize that the endgame should be a group of one, the individual. Identity politics
.I used to be 'that' anti-religion guy, after watching his Biblical Lecture series, I've changed my tune.
I think what you write about advertising is just a very small part of it all. It would be something like a Darwinistic response to the capitalist environment, finding a niche. The manipulistic aspect of course is not 'true speech'.
Way I see it, religion used to be forced upon people, and by doing so, people were forced to think about what it means to make moral choices in difficult situations. Now (at least since when I was growing up), this is just neglected. Also the internet has made it very difficult for such matters to reach the psyche, it's apparently much easier to just ogle at Kardashian ass.
Nietzsche predicted lotsa corpses from the rejection of God. We saw many in the previous century. But I fear that now being supercharged by automated propaganda on the internet, we're gonna see a hell of a lot more.
Stiflers Mom
Banned
The Apple Pippin?
OmegaSupreme
advanced basic bitch
I'm not nearly the fan of his daughter that I am of him but he does most of the talking here and it's the closest we've gotten to some long form Jordan content in a long time.
QSD
Member
Peterson's #1 fan here.
What Peterson does is what people in the West should have done: educate newer generations about where their freedom and peace comes from, since it is rather exceptional in human history to have peace and freedoms.
He explains what 'the West' is: the result of realizing that the proper way to 'be' in the world is to be an individual, as opposed to being part of a group first. This is what Jesus is, a 'mythical', 'perfect' person, that even an illiterate peasant can emulate if he listens to a priest. For example, behaving like Jesus (what would Jesus do) is supposed to result in a society that allows forgiveness, as opposed to being branded for life for a transgression. It's the difference between being your mistake and having made a mistake (see his discussion with Roger Scruton for a better explanation).
What you see around you would be explained as the result of rejecting Christianity. If God is dead, then anything goes, as we can see. The West is morally confused. Currently the autistic, easily digested, and decidedly NOT individual woke ideology takes center stage. To the wokesters dividing people into infinitely many groups and just placing labels on those groups is the right way. But they refuse to take the final step and realize that the endgame should be a group of one, the individual. Identity politics
you'll get no argument from me here, this part I totally agree with
I can understand that. I don't really see myself ever becoming *actually* religious but Peterson has helped me understand the evolution and purpose of religious belief so I have more respect for it now.
Here is where we disagree most. This "advertising is just a very small part of it" statement feels to me like a fish telling another fish that there's occasionally some moisture in the air, but never mind. In other words, we're so deep in it that we've become accustomed to ubiquitous manipulation and deceit. Have you ever seen that movie "They Live"? There's a scene where the protagonist puts on special sunglasses that lets him see all the persuasive subliminal messaging that's implicit in advertising:
One of the reasons this scene is still so striking and the movie is a cult classic, is IMHO because it hits so close to home on this point. And this movie was made in the 80ies, way before the advent of internet and social media. It's a lot worse and more insidious now. I feel like Peterson kind of drops the ball when it comes to criticizing the toxic aspects of our own "consumerist" culture. It's one of the reasons his debate with Zizek went the way it did. In a way I feel it's low hanging fruit to criticize 19th century communism (which has obviously failed) when our own system has such glaring flaws and hypocrisies that desperately need addressing.
It certainly is, which is part of the problem. It's very easy to divert attention away from serious issues with the appropriate amount of tits 'n ass, so to say. But moreover, there doesn't seem to be any force currently active in our western cultures that admonishes people to refrain from distracting and manipulating other people for our own benefit, which leads to the catastrophic breakdown in trust we see today.
I feel we should be trying to find ways to avoid this outcome instead of resigning to it. I don't think religion's gonna come back in a serious way. The development of science and technology has gone too far ahead for the Christian religious narrative to be literally believable to most people, especially the young. We're gonna have to find another way of promoting virtues like integrity, industriousness and frugality if we're ever gonna find our way out of this swamp.
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manfestival
Member
I need this whole book right now
Kadayi
Banned
QSD
I agree that western society is kind of post religion, and in that regard, it had served its purpose and you can't really put the genie back in the bottle, even though a lot of Christian tenets are still inherently baked into the culture in terms of social mores and legislation, however, there is a kind of moral vacuum arising as a result of the cult of self and it feels like there's a need to perhaps rethink education in terms it being solely about core functionality, history and skills and instead exploring it as a platform for instilling secular ideals of universal morality whilst at the same time jettisoning the divisive nature of SJW politics in the process. I think a vision is required of collective goals people can buy into. Given we live on an extinction event waiting to happen, I'd say that one should be towards exploring the stars, and other should be towards sustainability and maintaining our planet whilst we endeavour to get there. Arguing over Priveliege, the middle-east or Twitter BS isn't going to get us anywhere. These are the preserve of those who can only see themselves as part of a collective versus part of a species. If tomorrow Aliens came down and wiped the minds of everyone, none of these issues would exist because they are all in our heads, fables passed on from generation to generation. Whereas the need to preserve what we have and get off this planet would very much still exists.
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Bolivar687
Banned
Traditional religious devotions have the power to change people in ways for which there are no secular equivalents, even beyond our own biological hard wiring.
The "science and technology has gone too far" argument is completely illogical. The historical Resurrection changes everything because we know it's otherwise impossible. People didn't believe in it under the condition it is an ordinary natural occurrence.
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QSD
Member
I agree that western society is kind of post religion, and in that regard, it had served its purpose and you can't really put the genie back in the bottle, even though a lot of Christian tenets are still inherently baked into the culture in terms of social mores and legislation, however, there is a kind of moral vacuum arising as a result of the cult of self and it feels like there's a need to perhaps rethink education in terms it being solely about core functionality, history and skills and instead exploring it as a platform for instilling secular ideals of universal morality whilst at the same time jettisoning the divisive nature of SJW politics in the process. I think a vision is required of collective goals people can buy into. Given we live on an extinction event waiting to happen, I'd say that one should be towards exploring the stars, and other should be towards sustainability and maintaining our planet whilst we endeavour to get there. Arguing over Priveliege, the middle-east or Twitter BS isn't going to get us anywhere. These are the preserve of those who can only see themselves as part of a collective versus part of a species. If tomorrow Aliens came down and wiped the minds of everyone, none of these issues would exist because they are all in our heads, fables passed on from generation to generation. Whereas the need to preserve what we have and get off this planet would very much still exists.
Agree completely. I was struck by your comment about the "cult of self"... have you ever seen the documentary "the century of the self" by Adam Curtis? It's a documentary about, well, |'ll just paste the first episode here and he explains in the first minute exactly what it's about. It's not a part of 20th century history that is discussed much, but is extremely important/influential in shaping our world today. Highly recommended viewing to anyone with a passing interest in this subject.
The first sentence I believe. The second... yeah the problem is you're not going to able to convince people that the resurrection is historical. I've heard people argue for it back in my new atheist days but they couldn't convince me. I think the best bridge between religious and atheist people is to come to some understanding about "the sacred". I mean, I can't see myself start to believe in a biblical god. But I can believe that there are certain traditions or institutions that we can agree to honor and not discard.
Kadayi
Banned
Yeah, big fan of Curtis's Documentaries. I have seen it before but it's been a while. The stuff about Bernays basically taking his Uncles ideas and then essentially singlehandedly revolutionising the advertising industry to cater towards aspiration is pretty startling especially because, its something that we are so immersed in that it's hard to imagine a time when it wasn't commonplace. It was quite revelatory in that respect As the saying goes (somewhat) 'The last species to discover water are fish'. The insidious nature of it all I feel is really highlighted by the fact that smoking at the time was largely the preserve of men, but in order to grow the market for cigarettes, Bernays essentially co-opted the liberation movement to make women smoking seem like it was a statement of independence.
QSD
Member
Yeah, big fan of Curtis's Documentaries. I have seen it before but it's been a while. The stuff about Bernays basically taking his Uncles ideas and then essentially singlehandedly revolutionising the advertising industry to cater towards aspiration is pretty startling especially because, its something that we are so immersed in that it's hard to imagine a time when it wasn't commonplace. It was quite revelatory in that respect As the saying goes (somewhat) 'The last species to discover water are fish'. The insidious nature of it all I feel is really highlighted by the fact that smoking at the time was largely the preserve of men, but in order to grow the market for cigarettes, Bernays essentially co-opted the liberation movement to make women smoking seem like it was a statement of independence.
Hah, preaching to the choir. Good to see some awareness of this documentary. I was just using the fish analogy to explain my view to
FreedomOfSpeech
so it looks like we're on the same page here completely. So yeah, that's my biggest beef with Peterson, he never really wrestles with this, how to call it? The ugly face of capitalism? The manipulative and exploitative aspect of it. Whenever he attacks the left he's all about "resentful ingrates" that just hate rich people, and that's certainly partially true, but IMHO also people drift to the left because they find these kind of manipulative marketing & communication strategies morally repulsive and detrimental to society.
Kadayi
Banned
Hah, preaching to the choir. Good to see some awareness of this documentary. I was just using the fish analogy to explain my view to
So yeah, that's my biggest beef with Peterson, he never really wrestles with this, how to call it? The ugly face of capitalism? The manipulative and exploitative aspect of it. Whenever he attacks the left he's all about "resentful ingrates" that just hate rich people, and that's certainly partially true, but IMHO also people drift to the left because they find these kind of manipulative marketing & communication strategies morally repulsive and detrimental to society.
I get what you're saying. Unchecked capitalism definitely has its issues, but I suspect that Peterson is likely looking at what poses the greater threat to western society at the moment from a functional perspective and in that regard, I'd say identity politics and the whole pandora's box of feelings over facts and 2+2=5 mentality of many of its adherents is a real issue because they are basically modern-day religious zealots who wholeheartedly believe in the myths they've concocted, whether that be the Patriarchy, White Privilege or Gender fluidity. Capitalism can always be reined in (and historically has over time) but the suffocating stultifying nature of stay in your lane identity politics and thoughtcrime is a cultural cul-de-sac that if it gains the upper hand (which it's in danger of doing), is going to essentially enslave us wholesale because the war with Eurasia will never end.
^ seem familiar
QSD
Member
I don't know if I fully agree here. Although I'm pretty much on board with the woke stuff being bad, I would argue that it's partially a symptom of the same (much more fundamental) problem, that the culture of the west has over the last century, more than anything, become a culture of deception and manipulation. The reason that the woke stuff gets the leverage that it does, is that corporations cynically adopt it as their latest marketing strategy, to give their potential customers a false feeling of belonging or virtuousness. If there were some kind of cultural norm against blatantly deceiving or manipulating one another in this way, we wouldn't be in this toxic shitstorm to begin with.
I was really disappointed in the Peterson/Harris debates because they didn't seem to get much further (IMHO the best thing to come out of those debates was ironically Bret Weinstein's notion of 'metaphorical truth') and moreover because they both actually agree on this point (i.e. 'don't lie' is one of Peterson's 12 rules, and Harris has written a short book about the problems with lying) but they really never address that it's almost become a fundamental feature of our society.
Rentahamster
Rodent Whores
But Petersons' focus on religion is his way of promoting positive moral values without the literal/fundamentalist interpretations of Christianity. Peterson never advocates for the literal interpretation of the Bible or the literal existence of a God that created the universe. He advocates for the metaphorical value of the tradition and culture.
As far as I can tell, Peterson has never focused on the actual resurrection of Christ as a fact. He defines the existence of God and morals as the culmination of the positive accumulated culture and history of Western Civilization, the positive "metaphorical substrate" as he likes to call it. I think a lot of his Christian fans miss that point. When Peterson says, "I believe in God", it's quite different from a Christian literalist who also says, "I believe in God". Those two statements are not equivalent because they're talking about different things, e.g. metaphor vs literal.
I could be wrong on this, however. The speeches and material I'm basing this analysis off of is a few years old by now.
FreedomOfSpeech
Banned
Peterson says: I act as if God were real.
There's also a quote about faith that I'm having a hard time finding, something like faith is the belief that if you act 'in faith', things will get better. As in, faith in the system. I botched it, though.
There's also a quote about faith that I'm having a hard time finding, something like faith is the belief that if you act 'in faith', things will get better. As in, faith in the system. I botched it, though.
Rentahamster
Rodent Whores
He said something along the lines of you improving your life by having faith in assuming the best things about life so that you can work towards that as a goal, which is akin to having faith in God, except he's not using the literal God but God as a metaphor for all the positive cultural values He represents. Sort of like positive thinking, to grossly oversimplify it. Peterson is using the secular definition of "faith", as in, "confidence", rather than the Christian version of faith, which is more like "conviction of things unseen". In other words "faith" (i.e. "confidence) in "God" (i.e. the positive cultural metaphor that God represents) as applied to one's life, leads to generally good outcomes. This is what acting as if God is real looks like, as opposed to believing a literal God is real.
OmegaSupreme
advanced basic bitch
Douglas Murray spiting some good fire here. I particularly like when he goes after people who say "educate yourself"
Bolivar687
Banned
I admit that it is ultimately an article of faith but I don't think Christians should be ashamed of that, because it is worthy of belief. The resurrection has permanently and irreversibly changed human history and Western civilization, with entire continents of nations and peoples gathered unto Christ as the Psalms and the Prophets of the Old Testament had written, but also with the public institutions and concepts we would not have but for the ministry of Christ.
I don't think we can have religion without faith, but I do think you have to at least afford some reasonable weight to the fact that the eye witnesses to the resurrection were willing to undergo torture and execution on behalf of their testimony, even if it can't necessarily bring you over the goal line. There is also the miracle of the sun at Fatima in 1917 and eucharistic miracles, of all these consecrated hosts becoming heart tissue of a person who died in agony, and always of the same blood type.
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