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[VanillaCakeIsBurning]

I wouldn't downplay tiers that much when it comes to character relevance in competitive play. Still tier lists matter very little outside of high level play and I would think it'd be too early to come to conclusions, but the game's been out in Japanese arcades for a while, huh.

All I know is it's gonna be fun literally stomping people with Terumi.

People create tier lists to state who they think are the best in terms of damage, combo's, mixups, etc when played to to a high level of potential. As for character relevance I think that's why high level players will gravitate towards characters that allow them to make more mistakes and while leaving less room for error for their opponents.

The Hakumen 100% combo is a good example of this. When money and/or prestige is on the line I can understand why someone would want to change characters to increase their likelihood of winning.

Personally, choosing a character I like and winning based on that is more important to me than picking based on someone's tier list. I imagine that's the case for most if not all people here as well.

Like you said, tier lists is something we really don't need to worry about. Since this is a skill based game, it's possible for any character to win against any other character.

I'm really looking forward to corner trapping people with Noel. We need to get some games going once people start getting it.

 

[Teknopathetic]

Tempting, but don't really want to buy Japanese store credit just to crush Dementia and Prototype.

 

[cj_iwakura]

So is anyone going to be playing story, or just waiting for the US release?

Also, OP could mention the remixed OST and return of glorious CT-style art(I hated CS' portraits so much.)

Mm, Six Heroesy.

 

[RoeBear]

So is anyone going to be playing story, or just waiting for the US release?

Also, OP could mention the remixed OST and return of glorious CT-style art(I hated CS' portraits so much.)

Mm, Six Heroesy.

I'm gonna play story just so I can have Kagura unlocked.

 

[Fugu]

Tempting, but don't really want to buy Japanese store credit just to crush Dementia and Prototype.

Buy Japanese store credit so you can be crushed by me.

 

[SUPARSTARX]

I'm gonna import this.

 

[Auskeek]

So is anyone going to be playing story, or just waiting for the US release?

Also, OP could mention the remixed OST and return of glorious CT-style art(I hated CS' portraits so much.)

Mm, Six Heroesy.

I love Blazblue music in general, but this. Wow, what an awesome theme.

 

[Teknopathetic]

"Buy Japanese store credit so you can be crushed by me."


I fear no gaffer, as previous undefeated burei bruu gaf champion.

 

[RoeBear]

I think it'd be cool if we had some team matches when this comes out. Even though I won't be able to play this till after my brothers wedding.

 

[VanillaCakeIsBurning]

I'm already writing down combo's/resets from good Noel players online.

It feels like back when CT first released. I'm really going to dive deep into it again.

I think it'd be cool if we had some team matches when this comes out. Even though I won't be able to play this till after my brothers wedding.

This is a good idea. Did your internet situation work out for streaming?

 

[RoeBear]

This is a good idea. Did your internet situation work out for streaming?

I'm getting my new net installed on the 28th but 30dl and 5mbps upload should be enough to do that right?

This Hazama makes me want to play him since he doesn't do many mash C combos
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NiIeDzbzUVw

 

[Rhapsody]

A teams thing sounds pretty fun. Only problem is just if we have enough importers.

 

[VanillaCakeIsBurning]

I'm getting my new net installed on the 28th but 30dl and 5mbps upload should be enough to do that right?

I'm not sure. Google is telling me 3 - 4.5 Mb/s is good for 720p.

 

[RoeBear]

Well when I get it I can test if it's good enough and if not I'll just record em as people play and upload them. Right now my net is incredibly bad upload. Streaming offline games like Mega man drops frames like crazy.

I think we should at least add to the OP who all is importing so we have a better idea of who all is getting the game. Even if half only want to do team battles or whatever it would be nice to have a general idea of the numbers.

importing.

 

[VanillaCakeIsBurning]

Well when I get it I can test if it's good enough and if not I'll just record em as people play and upload them. Right now my net is incredibly bad upload. Streaming offline games like Mega man drops frames like crazy.

I think we should at least add to the OP who all is importing so we have a better idea of who all is getting the game. Even if half only want to do team battles or whatever it would be nice to have a general idea of the numbers.

Sounds good to me. I'm importing so feel free to add me OP (Ken)!

 

[Ken]

bullet is fish. In other words, that means she sucks. Too gimmicky. She's in terrible tier along with Izayoi and amane.

Also, 6 MORE DAYS GET HYPE!

why do i always choose fish

;_;

 

[Bury]

She's not bad. It's just other characters are lots better. Her normals are ok, but for a character that uses resources, it feels like she doesn't get as much damage as she should. She probably has more potential to discover though.

But the thing is, Izayoi was released in December in arcades so there was plenty enough time for as much people to get their hands on her and figure her out. Yea her movements are kinda jerky when she's in her Rip-off orgia mode and has ok normals, but her defensive options are normally shit and not that much better even with meter. The general consensus at the time was that she did had alot of potential to be found but after some time, we realized that the potential was not there. The cold hard truth is that she's fish.

Also, http://www.arcadeshock.com/items/sa...=0&Count_Class_1_6298997=9504678#ITEM_6298997

Did... Did I just spent $40 on ONE azrael pushbutton? that shipping to Canada is murder. Plus no returns on special items like these. FML

On a final note, 5 MORE DAYS! GET HYPE

 

[Lokbob]

His run animation gives me the chills.

Love it.

 

[Fugu]

Tiers are irrelevant at all but the highest levels of play. Learning curve is a far bigger factor for those of us who aren't pros. See: American Tagers.

I swear I've been saying this since the CT thread.

 

[cj_iwakura]

Does play-asia charge when shipped, or when placed? Hoping I wasn't charged for Drakengard 3 when I cancelled and got this instead.

 

[Onemic]

Does play-asia charge when shipped, or when placed? Hoping I wasn't charged for Drakengard 3 when I cancelled and got this instead.

When shipped I think. I'm still waiting for them to charge me the full amount for BBCP, I think I only paid the pre-order price so far which is like 10 bucks.

 

[VanillaCakeIsBurning]

Does play-asia charge when shipped, or when placed? Hoping I wasn't charged for Drakengard 3 when I cancelled and got this instead.

They charge you when they begin shipping the order.

 

[suko_32]

I'm still bitter at what happened to Rachel in BBCS.

 

[cj_iwakura]

They charge you when they begin shipping the order.

Good to know.

I'm still bitter at what happened to Rachel in BBCS.

Pretty sure they fixed her in CSII...

 

[VanillaCakeIsBurning]

That first round clutch.

And THIS is amazing.

 

[NEO0MJ]

Tiers are irrelevant at all but the highest levels of play. Learning curve is a far bigger factor for those of us who aren't pros. See: American Tagers.

I swear I've been saying this since the CT thread.

It depends IMO. Sometimes there are coincidences where top tier character work in any player level, such as Sagat in SF4.

 

[Fugu]

It depends IMO. Sometimes there are coincidences where top tier character work in any player level, such as Sagat in SF4.

Right. Because of the learning curve.

 

[FluxWaveZ]

Right. Because of the learning curve.

Is that really the primary reason? Some characters like Elizabeth or Kanji in P4A are at the bottom of the tier list, however they are very powerful when it comes to casual play because of their gimmicks that wouldn't work on more advanced players but that casual players tend to fall for.

 

[Rhapsody]

Is that really the primary reason? Some characters like Elizabeth or Kanji in P4A are at the bottom of the tier list, however they are very powerful when it comes to casual play because of their gimmicks that wouldn't work on more advanced players but that casual players tend to fall for.

I think you're mistaking what Fugu was saying. He wasn't saying that characters ranked high were easy to learn.
He was reiterating that lower leveled players might be winning with top tier characters because the one they chose might've been easy to learn, not just because that character is strong.

 

[FluxWaveZ]

I think you're mistaking what Fugu was saying. He wasn't saying that characters ranked high were easy to learn.
He was reiterating that lower leveled players might be winning with top tier characters because the one they chose might've been easy to learn, not just because that character is strong.

That's not what I meant, however I did misinterpret what Fugu was saying.

What I was questioning was whether the main reason a casual player could win with a low tier character consistently against players of their level was because of a character's easiness to learn or whether it's something inherent to the character itself (e.g. gimmicks or damage output).

 

[Fugu]

Is that really the primary reason? Some characters like Elizabeth or Kanji in P4A are at the bottom of the tier list, however they are very powerful when it comes to casual play because of their gimmicks that wouldn't work on more advanced players but that casual players tend to fall for.

Of course.

People lost to CS1 Tager at the highest levels of American play despite some seriously bad matchups because he only needs to get it right twice a match to win. It's relatively easy to develop the Tager skills to block well enough to get to the point where you are likely to get those two correct guesses in a match. Conversely, it's relatively difficult for players to build up their skills with other characters to the point that they can pressure effectively without leaving the kind of gaps that Tager can expose.

Tager is at the bottom of the CS1 tier list because he depends on mistakes; all but the best players in the world make the kind of mistakes that Tager can exploit.

That's not what I meant, however I did misinterpret what Fugu was saying.

What I was questioning was whether the main reason a casual player could win with a low tier character consistently against players of their level was because of a character's easiness to learn or whether it's something inherent to the character itself (e.g. gimmicks or damage output).

I would argue that gimmicks and damage output are a significant part of a character's learning curve.

CSEX Ragna's damage output is so high that combo efficiency and careful attention to carry don't really matter; inefficient combos will still provide more than adequate amounts of meter and damage. That CSEX Ragna also happens to sit comfortably on top of the tier list is just convenient.

 

[FluxWaveZ]

Tager is at the bottom of the CS1 tier list because he depends on mistakes; all but the best players in the world make the kind of mistakes that Tager can exploit.

I see. So despite being at the bottom of the tier list, players (apparently American more than Japanese) found success playing as Tager because of the skill curve you mentioned where a good Tager could take out a good higher tier character because the player playing as the higher tier character was not skilled enough to not leave the openings that Tager could exploit.

Pretty much what my perspective on the subject was, but more precise.

 

[Fugu]

I see. So despite being at the bottom of the tier list, players (apparently American more than Japanese) found success playing as Tager because of the skill curve you mentioned where a good Tager could take out a good higher tier character because the player playing as the higher tier character was not skilled enough to not leave the openings that Tager could exploit.

Pretty much what my perspective on the subject was, but more precise.

Yeah. I single out Americans (by "Americans", I actually mean "everywhere but Japan") because if you take a glance at tournament standings, there is a very wide difference in the level of representation that Tager gets here versus Japan. There are Tager players in Japan and they're better than the Tager players that we have here, but they get thwomped; American Tagers are very successful because the standard of play here is lower and the vast majority of players -- even tournament caliber players -- can't handle him.

 

[Papercuts]

Yeah, that's all dead on. He always had crazy damage output leading to upsets but consistency could be tough. He has a load of gimmicks on top of this which means it's a character you need to be careful about even if he's bottom tier, but some of those matchups...even a semi good Nu back then would be hair pulling to fight, especially when system mechanics like burst worked heavily in her favor.

I haven't kept up with this one at all yet so I don't know how he is now, but I was always frustrated that instead of improving on stuff he really has needed he kept getting mostly new gimmicks to work with. Gimmicks get found out and lose any worth, especially at tourney level, so it has been no surprise that every game he has been at the bottom. Still find him the most fun to play though.

 

[VanillaCakeIsBurning]

By gimmicks I'm assuming you're talking about Tager buster > Gadget Finger X until victory?

 

[Rhapsody]

I haven't kept up with this one at all yet so I don't know how he is now, but I was always frustrated that instead of improving on stuff he really has needed he kept getting mostly new gimmicks to work with. Gimmicks get found out and lose any worth, especially at tourney level, so it has been no surprise that every game he has been at the bottom. Still find him the most fun to play though.

Tager has... air combos now. lol It's too bad that he has an interesting mechanic that just falls flat.

And that's also a reason why I hate grapplers like Tager and Kanji. A lot of them rely on gimmicks.
The yolo gimmicks definitely suits the majority of Western play though...

 

[Papercuts]

By gimmicks I'm assuming you're talking about Tager buster > Gadget Finger X until victory?

Lol, yeah. And casual wise he had endless stupid stuff when people don't understand how magnetism works, like 3C > a.5D > AC on landing because everyone would air tech. Or just straight up dropping a combo after 5b to 720 and see them mash an attack out into it. Hatemail has never flowed so much for me in any fighter compared to him. He's a tech trap monster and typically that is more of an experienced player thing to learn about, I guess.

 

[Fugu]

Yeah, that's all dead on. He always had crazy damage output leading to upsets but consistency could be tough. He has a load of gimmicks on top of this which means it's a character you need to be careful about even if he's bottom tier, but some of those matchups...even a semi good Nu back then would be hair pulling to fight, especially when system mechanics like burst worked heavily in her favor.

I haven't kept up with this one at all yet so I don't know how he is now, but I was always frustrated that instead of improving on stuff he really has needed he kept getting mostly new gimmicks to work with. Gimmicks get found out and lose any worth, especially at tourney level, so it has been no surprise that every game he has been at the bottom. Still find him the most fun to play though.

Tager is fine in CSEX. He has tools. His matchups against certain characters are still pretty bad but he does well against any character that depends on getting in up close. I don't really know anything about CP yet so I can't speak to his position in that.

CT, in general, doesn't count. CT had the 9-1 Carl-Tager matchup, too. The game simply was not balanced.

 

[Kincaido]

Looks like Play-Asia tried to charge me earlier but I can't put money on my debit card until Monday. Hope I still get it within the week.

 

[RoeBear]

Looks like Play-Asia tried to charge me earlier but I can't put money on my debit card until Monday. Hope I still get it within the week.

Yeah they already have my money pending, I'm glad I already put enough money in my account.

 

[Westlo]

Might import this... I imported CT even though the gap was not that long, but it had full english everything anyway..... might get that asian version if the english menus are true, pick up the english (more like US) release later for story + dlc characters.

It depends IMO. Sometimes there are coincidences where top tier character work in any player level, such as Sagat in SF4.

Yeah it definitely flows through all levels with certain matchups and characters, when CT came out I stomped every scrubby Tager I played with my even more scrubby Nu.

 

[Onemic]

Yeah they already have my money pending, I'm glad I already put enough money in my account.

I just decided to pay the whole thing today with Paypal, but it still says my order is not paid :/

 

[VanillaCakeIsBurning]

Looks like Play-Asia tried to charge me earlier but I can't put money on my debit card until Monday. Hope I still get it within the week.

Mine says Preparing Order but it hasn't been paid yet.

I'm hoping it ships early.

 

[Rhapsody]

I got the LE at cdjapan, so I'm not sure if they'll let me know the status before it gets shipped. If it somehow ends up getting here late, I'll have at least other alternatives to play it with local people.

Yeah it definitely flows through all levels with certain matchups and characters, when CT came out I stomped every scrubby Tager I played with my even more scrubby Nu.

Them full screen guard crushes with Nu.

 

[Ken]

I have mine pre-ordered from AmiAmi. Hopefully it won't take too long.

 

[Fugu]

Looks like Play-Asia tried to charge me earlier but I can't put money on my debit card until Monday. Hope I still get it within the week.

I've had issues with play-asia being unable to charge my card before and as long as you update your payment information in time they'll still send it out. They charge you like a week before they ship it so you have quite a bit of time.

 

[RoeBear]

I'm so excited for this game, more than the PS4 or any game any time soon. Thursday can't come any sooner.

 

[Rhapsody]

Same. Been going through normals and retained gatlings for the cast in Extend at the moment while watching vids.
Basically just trying to get as much as I can off of neutral game and frame traps.

I just wish I didn't have two midterms on the 24th and 25th...

 

[VanillaCakeIsBurning]

The next 4 days are going to be brutal.

 

[Orochinagis]

So it will be a PS3 exclusive? oh god lord why