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[Do The Mario]

Don’t people have to work?
Why spend one billion dollars trying to get people to vote when just changing the day of the election would grantee a greater turn out?

 

[levious]

I think most employer's are obligated to allow you time to go vote... I'm pretty sure actually.

And I cynically believe that having it on a saturday would reduce turnout.

 

[Willco]

Considering the polls are open for nearly 12 hours and there's no school for the younglings, it's not that hard to go.

Nobody works from 7 am to 8 pm. I mean, there might be one guy, but it's Election Day.

 

[Nerevar]

Don’t people have to work?
Why spend one billion dollars trying to get people to vote when just changing the day of the election would grantee a greater turn out?

Employers are required by law to allow time for their employees to vote. Thus, you actually get some time off from work.

The real issue is why isn't voter registration automated (considering they already have all your information for tax purposes ...) and why isn't voting compulsory?

 

[Willco]

Employers are required by law to allow time for their employees to vote. Thus, you actually get some time off from work.

The real issue is why isn't voter registration automated (considering they already have all your information for tax purposes ...) and why isn't voting compulsory?

Voting should be mandatory, like jury duty.

 

[Do The Mario]

We have compulsory participation in Australia, you don’t have to vote but you have to at least go to a polling station and get you’re name ticked off. Yes we vote on a Saturday a get a huge voter turnout?

What days do other countries have there elections on?

 

[Phoenix]

Employers are required by law to allow time for their employees to vote. Thus, you actually get some time off from work.

The real issue is why isn't voter registration automated (considering they already have all your information for tax purposes ...) and why isn't voting compulsory?

The answer for both of those is because people have the right to choose not to vote. The IRS doesn't share any information with other government agencies that would allow this to happen, and forcing people to choose a president is just wrong.

 

[lexi]

The US has imitated most Australian voting intiatives, Mandatory voting should be imitated too.

It's the only way to combat the vast Religious Right.

 

[Do The Mario]

The answer for both of those is because people have the right to choose not to vote. The IRS doesn't share any information with other government agencies that would allow this to happen, and forcing people to choose a president is just wrong.

People would not be forced to pick a president, they are only forced to participate not vote you can leave you’re slip blank or even refuse them.

 

[Phoenix]

People would not be forced to pick a president, they are only forced to participate not vote you can leave you’re slip blank or even refuse them.

So you force people to go to a polling station to say that they don't want to vote? I'm sorry, but that's kinda ass-backwards.

 

[aoi tsuki]

Voting should be mandatory, like jury duty.

i wouldn't want to be forced to vote if i had no interest in the process, like i did last election. Picking a candidate because you have to would be no better than picking one because all your friends did. Choosing a blank slip (or whatever the no vote option is called) just slows down the process for those who actually want to vote and get on with their lives.

 

[jecclr2003]

Because forcing people to participate isnt part of our democratic process.

Here it's all about the choice of participating in the functions of your country's government, not being forced.

 

[Do The Mario]

So you force people to go to a polling station to say that they don't want to vote? I'm sorry, but that's kinda ass-backwards.

No it’s not backwards it gets people thinking about politics.

I think it’s more backwards to
- Hold an election on a day when some people can’t attend
-Spend 1 billion dollars trying to get people to vote

I think we have more polling stations per person because every primary school becomes a polling station; there is normally at least one school per suburb maybe 2 or 3 so lines are very small and there is a polling station near everybody. It’s not too much to ask someone to spend NO more then 30 minutes once every four years (three in Australia).

 

[Willco]

i wouldn't want to be forced to vote if i had no interest in the process, like i did last election. Picking a candidate because you have to would be no better than picking one because all your friends did. Choosing a blank slip (or whatever the no vote option is called) just slows down the process for those who actually want to vote and get on with their lives.

You could say the same with jury duty. Your life is not more important than the election. This sounds like lazy, apathetic bum talk.

 

[Nerevar]

The answer for both of those is because people have the right to choose not to vote. The IRS doesn't share any information with other government agencies that would allow this to happen, and forcing people to choose a president is just wrong.

We don't track who you vote for. You can return a blank ballot if you object. I see where you're coming from, but I think at the very least people should be mandated to go to the polls.

Because forcing people to participate isnt part of our democratic process.

Here it's all about the choice of participating in the functions of your country's government, not being forced.

No offense, but I'm pretty damn sure the founding fathers would strongly disagree with you on that. To them, voting was probably the most important yearly event that required a lot of thought. I think America should be the same today. We would, at the very least, get leaders of a much higher caliber than we have now (referring to both presidential candidates)

 

[Willco]

No it’s not backwards it gets people thinking about politics.

I think it’s more backwards to
- Hold an election on a day when some people can’t attend
-Spend 1 billion dollars trying to get people to vote

I think we have more polling stations per person because every primary school becomes a polling station; there is normally at least one school per suburb maybe 2 or 3 so lines are very small and there is a polling station near everybody. It’s not too much to ask someone to spend NO more then 30 minutes once every four years (three in Australia).

All schools are polling stations here. Elementary, middle and high school. It's not like a lack of polling stations are the problem.

Voting should be mandatory and if you don't want to vote, you don't vote. But you should go.

 

[levious]

No it’s not backwards it gets people thinking about politics.

I think it’s more backwards to
- Hold an election on a day when some people can’t attend
-Spend 1 billion dollars trying to get people to vote

I think we have more polling stations per person because every primary school becomes a polling station; there is normally at least one school per suburb maybe 2 or 3 so lines are very small and there is a polling station near everybody. It’s not too much to ask someone to spend NO more then 30 minutes once every four years (three in Australia).

It's already been said, you're gauranteed time off to go vote, that's a non-issue.

Forcing people to vote is like forcing kids to say the pledge of allegience... it just wouldn't make sense and would sort of be a mockery of freedom.

I agree that registration should be more automated, do it at the DMV like some states do, and you should be able to register up to a much closer date than the actual election day. In Virginia the deadline was almost two months prior to election.

 

[Do The Mario]

All schools are polling stations here. Elementary, middle and high school. It's not like a lack of polling stations are the problem.

Voting should be mandatory and if you don't want to vote, you don't vote. But you should go.

Well judging by the participation rate and attitudes on this board I thought it must be incredibly hard to vote.

Still some people are so busy they can’t take the time to vote? Too busy posting of GAF?

 

[Willco]

Forcing people to vote is like forcing kids to say the pledge of allegience... it just wouldn't make sense and would sort of be a mockery of freedom.

That's a poor analogy. With the pledge of allegiance, you might not have to say it, but you've got to stand or stay there while everyone else is. It's not like you get to leave the room.

There's nothing wrong with going to a polling station and not voting, but people should go. Or - hell! - fill out an absentee ballot.

People are just lazy.

 

[Lhadatt]

Mandatary voting is unamerican. Our traditional freedoms dictate that we should have to choose to vote, not be strongarmed into it.

Also, for anyone thinking mandatory voting would automagically fix the system and remove the "vast Religious Right," you are dead wrong. The current voter population is largely the more intelligent segment of the people, although I'm not sure the current results prove that. If mandatory voting were enforced, there would be such stupidity the likes of which you will have never witnessed before.

 

[Phoenix]

No it’s not backwards it gets people thinking about politics.

I think it’s more backwards to
- Hold an election on a day when some people can’t attend

You can pretty much take the day off, say that you were at the polls all day and no one can tell you anything. No employer can make it impossible or even uncomfortable for their employees to vote. That is a high crime with both civil and criminal penalties.

-Spend 1 billion dollars trying to get people to vote

Instead we'd spend billions to open more polling stations and buy more equipment and have more police for traffic and security? Sorry, your pro on forcing peope to vote is not compelling.

It’s not too much to ask someone to spend NO more then 30 minutes once every four years (three in Australia).

If it wasn't too much to ask, more people would vote. Hell people could spend 0 minutes and fill out an absentee ballot if they wanted to, but its clear that they just don't want to participate in the process. If they don't want to participate in the process - what value is there in having them in the process? You'd end up with an even larger number of uninformed voters voting in the election than you do now. Sorry - that's just a bad move.

 

[Willco]

Well judging by the participation rate and attitudes on this board I thought it must be incredibly hard to vote.

It's incredibly easy to register and vote. They give all the schoolchildren off so the schools are used as polling stations. Hell, in Maryland, they have touch screen booths, they don't check for ID and at the MVA (car registration stuff) you can register. People are just lazy.

 

[levious]

That's a poor analogy. With the pledge of allegiance, you might not have to say it, but you've got to stand or stay there while everyone else is. It's not like you get to leave the room.

There's nothing wrong with going to a polling station and not voting, but people should go. Or - hell! - fill out an absentee ballot.

People are just lazy.

I think it's a good analogy... we were not required to stand, and we were already in the room but why would you need to leave? I always stood though, just thought it was more respectful, despite my own issues with a pledge of allegiance, it wasn't worth making a fuss over.

edit: It is easy, but there should be later deadlines to register.

 

[Gregory]

What is this "register to vote thing" ? Where I come from, if you`re over 18, you are allowed to vote automatically.

And voting is entirely optional ofcourse.

 

[Willco]

I think it's a good analogy... we were not required to stand, and we were already in the room but why would you need to leave? I always stood though, just thought it was more respectful, despite my own issues with a pledge of allegiance, it wasn't worth making a fuss over.

In most states you're required to stand as by sitting you become a distraction. It depends where you live (the more liberal, the better!), but that was a bone of contention when everyone was debating if kids should be forced to say it. Hell, I was even sent out of the classroom for not standing once.

And it's a poor analogy because leaving the room and being completely absent while peopel are saying the pledge of allegiance is akin to not being a polling station. Being present for the pledge and not saying it is like going to a polling station and filling a blank ballot.

At any rate, I think we'll have mandatory voting in a few years.

 

[Willco]

Mandatary voting is unamerican. Our traditional freedoms dictate that we should have to choose to vote, not be strongarmed into it.

How are you strongarmed? Don't vote, just show up.

What is this "register to vote thing" ? Where I come from, if you`re over 18, you are allowed to vote automatically.

And voting is entirely optional ofcourse.

Where do you come from? Because it's not from the United States.

 

[jecclr2003]

What you're failing to realize is that the US had a record number of voters this year, regardless of the fact it is on a workday. It wouldn't matter what day of the week election day is on, if you're going to vote you'll be there.

It wouldn't have mattered at all if it were on the weekend, companies are obligated to give you ample time to do your civil duty. Like I said earlier, if you are going to vote you'll be there, no matter what day it is.

As for WHY Tuesday is the first Tuesday after the frst Monday in Nov.:

Why Tuesday?
Since most residents of rural America had to travel a significant distance to the county seat in order to vote, Monday was not considered reasonable since many people would need to begin travel on Sunday. This would, of course, have conflicted with Church services and Sunday worship.
Why the first Tuesday after the first Monday? Lawmakers wanted to prevent election day from falling on the first of November for two reasons. First, November 1st is All Saints Day, a Holy Day of Obligation for Roman Catholics. Second, most merchants were in the habit of doing their books from the preceding month on the 1st. Apparently, Congress was worried that the economic success or failure of the previous month might prove an undue influence on the vote!

 

[levious]

well, I went to elementary school in Virginia and Texas, only one teacher ever made a fuss about a student not standing, but that was an individual not a school policy.

The point of my analogy was only speaking generally to the idea of forcing participation, not specifically in reference to forcing someone to participate but not necessarily vote... I guess the confusion on both our parts means it was a bad analogy but I stand by it nonetheless.

 

[RevenantKioku]

I live in NY. I knew my vote wouldn't matter in the elections I had some knowledge about, and the others, well I don't know a damn thing, so I'm not voting in those.
I'm still not registered to vote.

 

[DarienA]

I'm not losing a weekend over election shit.

 

[Willco]

There was less than 9,000,000 more voters who went to polling stations this year than in 2000, so I don't think it's nearly the significant number to show that the system is working considering all the new registered voters.

System needs work and there will be reforms soon enough as the Democrats are going to try and do anything to help them, even if it means it might help the Republicans as well.

I live in NY. I knew my vote wouldn't matter in the elections I had some knowledge about, and the others, well I don't know a damn thing, so I'm not voting in those.
I'm still not registered to vote.

I know a lot of young people in Maryland felt the same, since it's such a Democratic state, but there are a lot of measures besides the Presidential election on the ballot. If you don't know "a damn thing" about them, you should go to a polling station and someone can inform you about whatever proposition is on the ballot. Get educated.

People are just lazy.

 

[Alcibiades]

so what if mandatory would get "more people thinking about politics"...

Looking at the massive audiences I see at MTV Spring Break and those Jaywalking on Tonight Show, there are some people that I DON'T WANT THINKING about politics...

I mean, why take the chance they don't know crap and show up and just vote on name-recognition alone...

 

[Alcibiades]

In fact, if you libbies in Australia think about it, John Howard had the upper hand cause name-recognition voting would probably help the incumbent...

Weren't polls a lot closer going in then Howard came out ahead by a comfortable margin?

 

[slayn]

I don't want to show up to the polls at all and scerw you for wanting to control my life against my will.

 

[Willco]

I don't want to show up to the polls at all and scerw you for wanting to control my life against my will.

Then you shouldn't pay taxes, drive a car, serve jury duty...

... YOU SHOULD JUST MOVE.

 

[Do The Mario]

Mandatary voting is unamerican. Our traditional freedoms dictate that we should have to choose to vote, not be strongarmed into it.

Also, for anyone thinking mandatory voting would automagically fix the system and remove the "vast Religious Right," you are dead wrong. The current voter population is largely the more intelligent segment of the people, although I'm not sure the current results prove that. If mandatory voting were enforced, there would be such stupidity the likes of which you will have never witnessed before.

So if something is not a traditional freedom it’s not good?

Once again I stress you don’t have to vote just take 20 or 30 minutes to participate. There are so many Americans that feel there vote doesn’t count if they were obligated to participate maybe the wouldn’t feel this way?

I will also stress that it gets more people talking about politics and makes sure the government governs to all people just not loyal factions they can always depend on.

Just think about the amount of potential swing voters out there that could help make government more accountable.


EDIT

I would rather spend 1 billion dollars on more polling stations, because under mandatory participation people will have to participate in some form. There is no better way to get more people to vote.

If this is backwards then backward me up!

 

[RevenantKioku]

I know a lot of young people in Maryland felt the same, since it's such a Democratic state, but there are a lot of measures besides the Presidential election on the ballot. If you don't know "a damn thing" about them, you should go to a polling station and someone can inform you about whatever proposition is on the ballot. Get educated.

People are just lazy.

I work 20+ hours a week on top of 18+ hours of class, plus the required work for those classes. If its lazy to spend my few free moments as I please other than getting educated, then lazy I am.
I just don't fucking care. And you're not gonna hear me complaining about political stuff, and such, because its either out of my hands (presidential) or I'm just ignorant. And I'm content with that.

 

[Alcibiades]

Then you shouldn't pay taxes, drive a car, serve jury duty...

... YOU SHOULD JUST MOVE.

taxes and jury duty are responsibilities...

driving a car is a privilege...

voting is an option in a democracy, chose to go to the poll, or not...

 

[Willco]

I work 20+ hours a week on top of 18+ hours of class, plus the required work for those classes. If its lazy to spend my few free moments as I please other than getting educated, then lazy I am.
I just don't fucking care. And you're not gonna hear me complaining about political stuff, and such, because its either out of my hands (presidential) or I'm just ignorant. And I'm content with that.

Obviously, you're not that well educated if you feel the need to remain ignorant about the political process that will impact your life and - yes! - spending a few minutes to go to a poll and vote or not voting won't hurt. I'm a student. I've got similar hours to you and I voted. I woke up early and voted. I don't have much sympathy for you.

My friend is doing 16 credits and works 40 hours a week and he voted. Fill out an absentee ballot if you're that busy.

Lazy. Lazy. Lazy.

voting is an option in a democracy, chose to go to the poll, or not...

IT WOULD STILL BE AN OPTION. GO TO THE POLL, DON'T VOTE. C'MON.

 

[jecclr2003]

It's your right to vote, if do or don't thats up to you.

You can't force someone to vote for something either a) don't know enough about to make a descision or b) don't care enough to vote to begin with.

You tell me how "mandatory" voting would be enforced anyway. Are you trying to tell me that you'd JAIL people for not doing a civil duty?

Sorry making something mandatory doesn't mean the people would make any type of informed descision

 

[levious]

well, this argument is pointless, since it will never be mandatory to go to the polling place in this country.

 

[Do The Mario]

taxes and jury duty are responsibilities...

driving a car is a privilege...

voting is an option in a democracy, chose to go to the poll, or not...

So you are saying Australia is not a democracy?

What are we then?

 

[Willco]

It's your right to vote, if do or don't thats up to you.

You can't force someone to vote for something either a) don't know enough about to make a descision or b) don't care enough to vote to begin with.

WHAT PART OF VOTING OR NOT VOTING DO YOU PEOPLE NOT UNDERSTAND? FILL A BLANK BALLOT.

You tell me how "mandatory" voting would be enforced anyway. Are you trying to tell me that you'd JAIL people for not doing a civil duty?

Ever heard of jury duty?

Sorry making something mandatory doesn't mean the people would make any type of informed descision

THEN DON'T VOTE.

Your forced to participate, not vote.

well, this argument is pointless, since it will never be mandatory to go to the polling place in this country.

Never is a long time. It won't be this year or anything, but don't be surprised to see mandatory voter particpation legistration brought up.

 

[RevenantKioku]

Obviously, you're not that well educated if you feel the need to remain ignorant about the political process that will impact your life and - yes! - spending a few minutes to go to a poll and vote or not voting won't hurt. I'm a student. I've got similar hours to you and I voted. I woke up early and voted. I don't have much sympathy for you.

My friend is doing 16 credits and works 40 hours a week and he voted. Fill out an absentee ballot if you're that busy.

I don't feel the need to remain ignorant, I just don't care.
Of course they impact my life, no shit. But you know what, I don't care. I'm comfortable, and content with that.
Maybe something will kick me in the ass later in life and I'll start to give a damn. There's a valid chance of it. But it hasn't happened yet.

 

[slayn]

forcing me to go to the poll is no different than forcing me to vote. You want to control my life because you think it would be a good thing.

well I think you should be forced to go to the store to buy vitamins every week because they are good for you. Oh you don't have to eat them though.

 

[Cerebral Palsy]

Why is it held on a weekday? So the chances are lower that I won't have a hangover, and will get off my ass to vote.

 

[Phoenix]

So if something is not a traditional freedom it’s not good?

Once again I stress you don’t have to vote just take 20 or 30 minutes to participate. There are so many Americans that feel there vote doesn’t count if they were obligated to participate maybe the wouldn’t feel this way?

No. People only feel their vote counts when their candidate wins. People in the losing party generally feel that their vote didn't count and find a variety of reasons why it doesn't. There are some people out there who are just stupid enough to only want to 'back a winner'. These people are of no value to the process and I would be more inclined to bar them from voting than force them to vote

I voted for Kerry in Georgia - about as republican a state as you'll find in the south outside of like Mississippi or Alabama. My presidential candidate lost, but many others that I voted for won by fairly significant margins - so my voice was heard (something that simply escapes most of the non-voters... its not JUST a presidential election). In the end there were roughly 4 million people who voted against my candidate in the presidential election. You'd have to be a complete moron to say that because of this your vote didn't count. Some people just don't understand the fact that there will be people out there who just won't agree with your position and therefore you will lose - simple as that.

I will also stress that it gets more people talking about politics and makes sure the government governs to all people just not loyal factions they can always depend on.

Just think about the amount of potential swing voters out there that could help make government more accountable.

Let's cut through the crap here. If you want to keep government accountable there is one thing that you can do and must do - SUE THE GOVERNMENT when it goes against stated policy or concern. Just because you vote in an election does not mean that the government becomes more accountable. Hell people in Congress vote to give themselves pay raises - you think more poeple voting is going to make them more accountable? Accountability has nothing to do with voter turnout - it has to do with resolve AFTER the voting is over. The problem is that most people just sit and whine like little bitches when things go south. There are few activists in this country at this point. Everyone is waiting for 'someone else' to solve their problem. Keeping people informed and activism is what keeps government accountable - and yes, a lot of that has fallen on the 'liberal media' these days. I can count on my local Fox 5 news to do more investigative work of scandals in the local Atlanta area than I can count on my fellow citizens to even mention it at a community/town hall meeting.

When was the last time anyone here went to a town hall meeting in their local area? And yet people want to demand accountability... through voting. Please. That's nonsense. You want accountability, get off your ass, organize your peers and make people aware of things BETWEEN elections.

 

[levious]

Never is a long time. It won't be this year or anything, but don't be surprised to see mandatory voter particpation legistration brought up.

True, that's why I said never in reference specifically to this country. As long as we are the USA we will not require people to go to the polls. If that ever happens, I'll never vote again.

 

[Do The Mario]

It's your right to vote, if do or don't thats up to you.

You can't force someone to vote for something either a) don't know enough about to make a descision or b) don't care enough to vote to begin with.

You tell me how "mandatory" voting would be enforced anyway. Are you trying to tell me that you'd JAIL people for not doing a civil duty?

Sorry making something mandatory doesn't mean the people would make any type of informed descision

I point out several benefits of mandatory participation in my previous threads that you failed to address, if your refuse to vote in Australia and don’t have a good reason you get a $50 fine.

Like I said it’s possible for a government to only govern a sizable portion of the country as long as it’s big enough for them to get reelected. Mandatory participation like I said encourages governments to govern to the whole country.

Anyway thanks for explaining why the election was held on a weekday my friends and I thought it was very strange indeed.

 

[Alcibiades]

So you are saying Australia is not a democracy?

What are we then?

Well, you don't have to vote, haven't you guys been making that point...

I think the question is, do you force people to go to the polls...

I don't see people being any more informed by making them go to the polls...

why risk uninformed voting?

the onus should be on the candidates and system to get people to vote...

if a voter wants to remain ignorant on politics and policy, that should be as valid a method of US citizenship as someone who's a political junkie...