You Are Viewtiful
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Statistically, there will definitely be at least one murderer among those 25,000. The problem is not with the refugees but the people who think that one bad refugee should be enough to judge the other 24,999.
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Canadian PoliGAF - 42nd Parliament: Sunny Ways in Trudeaupia
- Thread starter matthewwhatever
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Statistically, there will definitely be at least one murderer among those 25,000. The problem is not with the refugees but the people who think that one bad refugee should be enough to judge the other 24,999.
yes it is. And they're very vocal about it
Toronto nowhere near ready for refugees, citizenship judge says
Most of you guys know better than a citizenship judge though.
Most of you guys know better than a citizenship judge though.
Stumpokapow
listen to the mad man
I wonder if you would have posted this article if he didn't agree with your perspective.
Tell me all about my perspective.
And the article doesn't really coincide with my persepective that TCHC is perpetually underfunded and bursting at the seams but we still bring in more people. The article does refer to my statement that "I still haven't heard much about the overall plan". No one on this board is likely privy to the information that a citizenship judge is.
matthewwhatever
Member
*Retired* citizenship judge. So it's not like he's up to date on the plans either.
I think it depends on what that French person is saying. If Bernier goes full-on extreme libertarian -- which wouldn't be too hard, since that's what he is -- I could see that gaining traction out west. I think Bernier winning over Westerners is a lot more likely than Kenney winning over people east of Ontario.
I forgot about Mulcair already.
And I guess the social Conservatism is a shared link... although I wonder if people from the west hate French people out of principle. lol
I think it depends on what that French person is saying. If Bernier goes full-on extreme libertarian -- which wouldn't be too hard, since that's what he is -- I could see that gaining traction out west. I think Bernier winning over Westerners is a lot more likely than Kenney winning over people east of Ontario.
Stumpokapow
listen to the mad man
I'm utterly skeptical at the appeal to authority.
Authorities disagree with one another all the time, and it isn't because some of them are raving idiots, it's because reasonable people can disagree on the interpretation of evidence, and reasonable people can disagree on the relative weighting of different risks, etc. That a (retired) citizenship judge expresses an opinion does not suggest that the expert opinion is what he has suggested. Am I to understand that if other experts disagree, you will simply say "Now I don't know what to think"?
As one example, this is the second instalment in a series of discussions about what we ought do about Syrian refugees. You did not cite the first, a policy expert from Ryerson and a director of an NGO on this matter. His position was, unsurprisingly, the opposite of the one you cited: that we should not let perfect be the enemy of good, we should resettle them quickly, and that in past similar cases the predicted worst-case scenarios about preparedness did not come to fruition. Why did you not cite this? Did you just discover that the CBC existed this morning? I recommend you check out Republic of Doyle and Murdoch Mysteries. Hard-hitting stuff.
As a result, I don't think you sincerely believe in the expertise you're citing. I think you're citing the expertise because you perceive that it lends credence to the argument, which incidentally is the same argument that you yourself made earlier, hair-splitting about the exact words used notwithstanding. My flip tone is largely because I'm assuming you're acting in bad faith.
On the matter of the substance of the judge's argument:
It is highly unlikely the judge would comment on these issues or any matter of policy like this were he an active judge. Therefore, although he is likely to have experience on the kinds of preparations that need to be made to resettle refugees or the nuances of immigration law (and certainly with the lived experience of being a refugee!), he is not likely to be privy on the exact plan going forward. I think it may well be the case that the "end of the year" deadline is unrealistic and the process will extend beyond that. I think in general when government of any party gives a deadline, I typically take it as a target and ask "is this even in the ballpark". I don't think resettling 25,000 additional people takes 20 years or 10 or even 5. Maybe it takes 6 months, maybe it takes 3. That's less clear to me. But I think the plan is within the realm of sanity. I do not think it is the case that the federal government plans to resettle a bunch of people knowing they are not prepared for it. This may seem like a just-so argument, "if the government is doing it, they must clearly believe they can do it", but so too is the judge's argument "if I haven't seen the plan, there mustn't be one".
Beyond that, there is no argument at all. It's simply a pull-quote. Which is fine.
I agree with the premise that part of bringing in refugees is affording them education, job training, job prospects, integration into a community (ideally through existing resources for new Canadians and/or Syrian communities in existing cities). I don't think you'll find anyone to disagree with that. No one simply thinks you can plunk people down and then brush the dirt off your shoulder. It's clearly an ongoing process.
You conveniently forgot to include the the *retired* judge "grew up" in Syria. Surely that adds significant value to his opinion. And the point stands, a comprehensive plan hasn't been revealed.
I'm all for helping out and, so were clear, I'm not opposing the 25k Syrian refugees, but given the events that have transpired, a change in federal leadership, and the opinions of a *retired* citizenship judge, some clarity on the matter would be appreciated.
I'm sure NGOs wouldn't have any bias (toward this matter, or any they are involved with). I mean, their intent is noble, but they too are looking to pay the bills. Also, I absolutely couldn't care less about anything anyone associated with Ryerson says.
Social justice warriors love stuff like this. Gives them a chance to tear apart anyone with even a slightly differing opinion.
Stumpokapow
listen to the mad man
I feel this justifies my assumption of bad faith. I have nothing to say to anyone who uses the term "social justice warrior" unironically. I won't reply to you in the future.
The social justice hivemind is nonsense. Just dogpiles any discussion.
Morrigan Stark
Arrogant Smirk
Ironyalert.gif
killer rin
Member
Well, since it seems like its been nothing but bad news lately, here is something good. Justin Trudeau formally commits to lifting visa requirement for Mexicans
Its nice to see Justin continuing to promise to repeal horrible policies from Harper.
Its nice to see Justin continuing to promise to repeal horrible policies from Harper.
Silver Arrows
Banned
God I hope so
Yea the closest thing to proper Mexican food I've come across is Burrito Boyz lol
I'm probably not looking hard enough though.
Definitely not. Jane and Wilson area in Toronto has a large section of the hispanic community, you'll be able to find good authentic restaurants there, or if you're downtown in Kensington market there are some places that aren't Mexican but it can get Mexican food (us Latinos share a lot of the same dishes).
gutter_trash
Banned
I personally think that Trudeau is improvising too much on the refugees and is not communicating enough with Provinces and Cities.
for a government who claims to have a plan, they seem clueless on communication with Premiers and Mayors.
Liberals are great of domestic issues but they are off the retarded start on Foreign Affairs.
President Hollande all serious, President Obama all serious, President Putin all serious.... PM Trudeau taking selfies in hotel lobbies at G-20
I can't wait for Trudeau to come back to Ottawa in December because he too n00b to go around the world stuttering and mumbling.
January 1st is one month away..... still the gouvenremnt is unable to coordinate with cities and provinces ......... in freakin' winter
for a government who claims to have a plan, they seem clueless on communication with Premiers and Mayors.
Liberals are great of domestic issues but they are off the retarded start on Foreign Affairs.
President Hollande all serious, President Obama all serious, President Putin all serious.... PM Trudeau taking selfies in hotel lobbies at G-20
I can't wait for Trudeau to come back to Ottawa in December because he too n00b to go around the world stuttering and mumbling.
January 1st is one month away..... still the gouvenremnt is unable to coordinate with cities and provinces ......... in freakin' winter
There's two restaurants in Toronto named Mexico Lindo that are quite good. There's also Mex-I-Can in Hamilton.
/just suggestions
crimzonflame
Member
Im more excited about the women.
You do realize that we don't border Mexico, right?
Also, wth does this have to do with border control?
gutter_trash
Banned
as for Mexico, I am okay reverting back to pre-Harper era when Mexicans did not require a visa to travel to Canada.
Mexican people are good people, it is hypocritical of us to go freely travel to their sunny destinations without hassle but then impose visa restrictions on them wanting to come an do some ski here.
I went to Quebec City one week-end 15 years ago with my friends and had lovely conversations with three Mexican tourists after hours.
But you know the drill in groups of girls, there is always one party pooper in the trio that ruins it for her 2 other friends.
I welcome more Mexicans coming to vacation in our country. We are NAFTA buddies anyway
Mexican people are good people, it is hypocritical of us to go freely travel to their sunny destinations without hassle but then impose visa restrictions on them wanting to come an do some ski here.
I went to Quebec City one week-end 15 years ago with my friends and had lovely conversations with three Mexican tourists after hours.
But you know the drill in groups of girls, there is always one party pooper in the trio that ruins it for her 2 other friends.
I welcome more Mexicans coming to vacation in our country. We are NAFTA buddies anyway
Yea, I'll check those out when I'm in Toronto to pick up my Degree from UofT later this year.
Mississauga has some poor selection of knock-off Mexican food, but I bet there's some good places tucked away in some plaza somewhere.
crimzonflame
Member
Dont know if its Mexican but there is an amazing burrito joint on Keele and Wilson.
Even Edmonton has amazing Mexican food, and we're the largest "Northern" Canadian city.
IISANDERII
Member
Obama presses Canada for quick TPP approval
Eat a dick Obama. Even if you agree with this deal, this is so fucking unfair: "The deal would allow Japanese vehicles to enter Canada duty free within five years of the agreement coming into force. In contrast, the United States negotiated a 25 year timeline for phasing out similar tariffs."
Fuck off
Minister of International Trade is heading this and her twitter is: https://twitter.com/cafreeland?ref_src=twsrc^google|twcamp^serp|twgr^author
I've let her know how I feel
Eat a dick Obama. Even if you agree with this deal, this is so fucking unfair: "The deal would allow Japanese vehicles to enter Canada duty free within five years of the agreement coming into force. In contrast, the United States negotiated a 25 year timeline for phasing out similar tariffs."
Fuck off
Minister of International Trade is heading this and her twitter is: https://twitter.com/cafreeland?ref_src=twsrc^google|twcamp^serp|twgr^author
I've let her know how I feel
gutter_trash
Banned
can't they wait for Government to resume in December? seesh
I wouldn't say we have amazing, but it's pretty good and getting better.
People in this city are frustratingly afraid of spicy food. The peppers we get for much of the year that are grown in greenhouses barely have any heat to them.
PumpkinSpice
Banned
How many cars are even still made in Canada at this point? The Rusted Horseshoe ain't what it used to be.
I'd much rather have the ability to buy a well made Japanese car than the same model made in Mexico.
Vancouver home prices continue to soar while rest of Canada lags
Trudeau please help those two cities
Haha no politician is going to touch this with a thousand foot pole. Most voters are homeowners. Policies that would actually make housing "more affordable" would necessarily decrease the value of homeowners' homes. Political suicide.
The only way housing in Vancouver will substantially decrease in value is due to events outside of government control, a housing bubble popping and subsequent crash.
This isn't true at all.
Canada Mortgage and Housing corporation is a federal agency that insures Canadian Mortgages. It is used as a lever by the Federal government to manage the real estate market. Here's an article about all the actions that Flaherty did over the years.
Via the CMHC tax payers are well exposed to housing market. It will be painful if there is a 2008 style bursting of the bubble.
Additionally, a component of the high price of housing in Vancouver is speculation and policies that make homeownership an investment with benefits over other types of investments. The federal government could change those policies (they won't).
Lastly the federal government used to subsidize social housing. This ended under the Liberal governments of the 90s. What we've seen in BC is that the province has near zero interest in social housing, and by neglecting their responsibilities, has in practice dumped this responsibility on the cities that cannot afford to solve the homelessness problem. The result is what we see in Vancouver, where the city attempts to draw some amount of funding from rezoning developer contributions in an attempt to build a few social housing spaces.
Unfortunately in this last election no federal party suggested anything of real substance in housing. Trudeau announced funding for renovations and giveaways to developers to support rental housing. This will have no real impact on anything. The NDPs promises were vague enough that I had no idea what they were proposing but it didn't seem much different. Despite articles about affordable housing being in the papers every day in Vancouver, it never became an election issue.
Edit: I forgot what could possibly be a big one, which is control over foreign real estate investment and immigration. I'm not sure what aspects of this are under federal or provincial control, but the immigration part is certainly federal (with some exceptions for Quebec I believe). The Conservatives recently ended the millionaire immigration scheme which was, after study, revealed to be totally ineffective.
It remains to be seen how much of an impact foreign investment is having in Vancouver as there is no good data being collected but there have been some sparse indications that it could be a significant contributor. Collecting data is probably a thing the feds could help with as well.
Earthstrike
Member
I'm not nearly as opposed to the TPP as everyone else is. I'd love to be shown why I should be, but based on everything I've seen or read about it, there appear to be few substantial criticisms. I get that the U.S.A exporting out its copyright laws is bad, and we probably should add some additional exceptions for types of companies that can't sue governments. (any kind of smoking product manufacturer to future proof against companies that'll distribute marijuana and alcohol companies)
But the fact is this TPP seems to be a mutual agreement to by and large break down a lot of protectionist policies in all the countries that are party to this agreement. The net result of this is going to be a reduction in the CPI. This is something that tangibly benefits the middle and lower class, it just so happens to do so in exchange for jobs, something we can supplement with a stronger welfare program and education subsidization. (Or unversal basic income however long it takes us to get there in the future).
Eliminating the duty on japanese cars? Good, I have the option to buy a more reliable vehicle at a cheaper price. I can understand issues with one country voluntarily eliminating some of its protectionist policies, but the idea here is everyone negotiated down tariffs for eachother's industries meaning the counterbalance is our industries now being capable of being more competitive globally (or at least within the pacific rim).
But the fact is this TPP seems to be a mutual agreement to by and large break down a lot of protectionist policies in all the countries that are party to this agreement. The net result of this is going to be a reduction in the CPI. This is something that tangibly benefits the middle and lower class, it just so happens to do so in exchange for jobs, something we can supplement with a stronger welfare program and education subsidization. (Or unversal basic income however long it takes us to get there in the future).
Eliminating the duty on japanese cars? Good, I have the option to buy a more reliable vehicle at a cheaper price. I can understand issues with one country voluntarily eliminating some of its protectionist policies, but the idea here is everyone negotiated down tariffs for eachother's industries meaning the counterbalance is our industries now being capable of being more competitive globally (or at least within the pacific rim).
PumpkinSpice
Banned
I agree that I'd like to see the end of people buying homes and condos as "investments". It's a place for people to live, not your paycheque or retirement fund. I'd love to see actual apartment buildings being made here in Ottawa, instead of 100% condo buildings that may or may not have some units rented out by who knows who with zero accountability.
Outside of that mostly I think that changing mortgage rules nationwide to solve an affordability problem in two cities is stupid. Mortgages shouldn't become more affordable, that would just further drive up prices everywhere. They also shouldn't get more restrictive or expensive, as that just punishes everyone who doesn't live in Toronto or Vancouver for problems in those two cities.
Subsidized housing is good, but if not done properly you just end up with government run poor ghettoes. These sort of initiatives should absolutely be handheld either provincially or preferably municipally, since they are better at working locally on how to integrate subsidized residents with the broader community. There are some great examples in Vancouver of mixed new developments of subsidized + market price, sometimes coexisting in the same building and other times just sharing the same block. The federal government should be transferring way more cash down to those levels of government to make these initiatives more feasible.
Outside of that mostly I think that changing mortgage rules nationwide to solve an affordability problem in two cities is stupid. Mortgages shouldn't become more affordable, that would just further drive up prices everywhere. They also shouldn't get more restrictive or expensive, as that just punishes everyone who doesn't live in Toronto or Vancouver for problems in those two cities.
Subsidized housing is good, but if not done properly you just end up with government run poor ghettoes. These sort of initiatives should absolutely be handheld either provincially or preferably municipally, since they are better at working locally on how to integrate subsidized residents with the broader community. There are some great examples in Vancouver of mixed new developments of subsidized + market price, sometimes coexisting in the same building and other times just sharing the same block. The federal government should be transferring way more cash down to those levels of government to make these initiatives more feasible.
Hey, why not allow this? We are giving everything else away.
It's insane to me that anyone would buy a Japanese car after Obama had to force Toyota into a safety recall. Should have just banned them at that point. Not to mention, you look like a huge douche driving around in a fucking Yaris or Corolla (whatever the fuck that is). The reliability of cars varies model to model, so the Japanese reliability claims are always flawed at best. Not to mention that every time you buy a Toyota in Canada, you are essentially fucking someone out of a decent manufacturing job at GM.
The auto industry in Canada/North America ain't what it used to be as people no longer care to buy products from domestic manufacturers for insane reasons. Where I grew up, you would get laughed out of town for buying a Toyota.
It's not my job to subsidize your industry.
gutter_trash
Banned
your taxes actually subsidizes the Canadian video game industry and you like video-games
Japanese cars are fantastic, I own a Honda Civic Hybrid, which is a way better car than my old cars: Chevy Uplander, Crown Victoria and Chrysler 300.
Looking forward to a cheaper Toyota Camry, if TPP goes through.
The copyright laws in TPP are terrible though, and I hope out government neuters them, should they decide to ratify TPP.
Looking forward to a cheaper Toyota Camry, if TPP goes through.
The copyright laws in TPP are terrible though, and I hope out government neuters them, should they decide to ratify TPP.
It looks like a conservative senator in the senate is now a independent senator.
http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/new-brunswick/senator-john-wallace-conservative-1.3324683
http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/new-brunswick/senator-john-wallace-conservative-1.3324683
The reason why real estate is attractive is because paying down a mortgage is effectively the same as contributing towards an investment account over the same period of time. The only difference is that one scenario gets you a house upfront, but could also face the possibility of bankruptcy and loss of the home as well.
It's also attractive to governments because it's a physical asset that contributes to local economies, such as construction jobs and whatnot.
So it's your job to subsidize Japan then?
Ah, I love the good old Japanese auto industry measuring stick. Let me compare my 2015 Camry to a Model T.
pr0cs
Member
If their job is producing junk they deserve to be out of a job.
Industries now are sink or swim, especially for the auto industry
Well said.
Nope, if they produce a better product for my needs I'm buying it. Edit: I don't see how my purchase of a product I want is a subsidy. Can you elaborate?
I didn't begrudge anyone for not buying a BlackBerry (good Canadian company!) when I worked there. Should all airlines be forced to buy Bombardier planes? All telecoms companies should have only bought Nortel parts, etc, etc.
These trade deals are all or nothing, once ratified they can't selectively neuter them. Doing so opens the government up to lawsuits.
TheRealTalker
Banned
makes sense
Atlantic Canadians and the CPC have been gaining larger rift between each other
But objectively speaking, no one manufacturer's cars are all junk. Even GM, even Toyota. Every single manufacturer has flaws and issues. Else why would Toyota dealerships have repair / maintenance garages? It's a really stupid mentality to say that all Japanese cars are superior, especially since reliability will be different throughout models and years. Morons have just got it in their head that there is some non-domestic advantage. This is really quite odd because if you follow cars you will notice that many features that Toyota (and Lexus especially) market brand as new / cutting edge, are actually just ideas stolen from North American manufacturers. Anything Cadillac has new this year, Toyota (and more so Lexus) will have a few years down the road. It's tough to be first to market and innovative like GM though.
Edit: And if these industries are infact sink or swim, why would our government assist overseas companies? Doesn't seem like sink or swim to me.
That's a great example because in this instance Blackberry is objectively inferior for the average consumer when compared to a flagship Android or iPhone. I don't recall Blackberry's being manufactured in Ontario either, so not entirely the same. Toyota isn't to GM, what Apple is the Blackberry. Not even close by any measure.
To answer all your questions, where another product is not objectively and factually superior, citizens of Canada should make a serious effort to buy Canadian made products. It's really not rocket science.
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